Conference turris::womannotes-v3

    This ought to be good.
                              L.J.

    I have found in (my) experience that when I think they are my friends
    they are thinking different.  I never thought myself as neive (sp)
    but most of the time Iam to stun to think I didn't catch it. Now I
    really watch myself!!  It makes me feel real silly..
    
    
                                                                 

    
    
    I grew up with male friends dominating my scene.  In fact, I could only
    name about 2-3 female friends I had in high-school/college.  
    
    I find that I can relate much better with men in a friendship.  I don't
    feel the competition that I feel pressured with from a lot of women.  
    
    Sometimes it happens that one/both of us is romantically attracted to
    the other, but for the most part, those things are dealt with and the
    friendship is stronger because of it.
    
    I think I have a certain reservation about female-female friendships
    because of some things that happened to me growing up.....I rarely seem
    to give everything to a female-female friendship the way I give to a
    female-male friendship.
    
    
    Hummm...
    
    kath

     I have a handful of male friends/brothers. They are the people I
    really trust to give me the inside scoop on why men do what they do.
    And even when I HATE what I hear, I try to understand. My male friends
    have often said "'Ren, men are dogs. Face it." And they've given
    examples. And then I have to deal with the fact that they are
    *comfortable* with the way they interact with women, and they are up
    front about the fact that they date several women, and that its the
    definition of dog that is the clincher. Sometimes, dog just means a man
    who's not ready to settle down even though several women wish he
    would... and with them.  Dog doesn't always mean a liar or an evil
    person. Just someone who likes women, and doesn't steer clear of the
    ones who come his way.
    
    My male friends often let me flirt with them, and right now, that helps
    me a lot. I'm not taking this single stuff too well. They also are more
    "fun" oriented than some of my female friends. That, of course, is just
    a matter of how I pick my friends, and I tend to pick women whom I can
    talk to, rather than as people to have fun with.
    
    I don't usually tell my male friends "girl secrets". Its like a
    boundary that isn't crossed. They don't know intimate details of my sex
    life, and I don't know theirs. I made that mistake once and the guy
    stood up and announced in front of a huge party of friends that I had
    sex on X date, and wasn't hurting at all. Never again. They don't
    usually know how I really feel about a guy because many times the
    language of male-female relationships is not easy to bridge. They'll
    just make assumptions and I'll nod or decline. I don't tell most of my
    male friends when love has hurt me either. I don't like to come across
    as a sissy. I'd rather they saw anger than hurt.
    
    But as a whole, they give advice that I never got from my sisters. And
    they are warm and friendly and huggable in their male way, a little
    rougher and tougher. They are the ones who pick me up and throw me
    around. I used to return the favor... I have 5 male friends right now,
    4 in town and 1 in Maryland. I consider myself very fortunate to have
    them in my life and to know that I have a place in their hearts.

    
    
    	At this point in my life I think I have more close male
    	friends than female.  Which is kind of odd because for
    	the longest time I was terrified of men.  I had what I
    	call the 'ugly duckling syndrome'.  Through most of my
    	school years (from age 10-21) I've had headgear, retainers,
    	braces etc and then got hit with having to wear glasses
    	at the same time.  So the boys either ignored me or teased
    	me.  By my junior year in HS I got rid of the tinsel teeth
    	and got contacts and boys started paying attention to me.
    	Took me a long time to get used to it though.  But now I
    	find myself really comfortable with a lot of men.  Like
    	Kath, some of them have been attracted to me and vice versa
    	but we kept it under control and never let it go any further.
    	(I'm married)  Fortunately, my husband is very understanding
    	and not the jealous type so my having male friends doesn't 
    	bother him.  I find that I have more fun and laugh more with
    	some of my male friends than with some of my female ones.  I don't
    	tell them alot of my 'female' problems though as it sometimes
    	makes both of us uncomfortable.  But for the most part we can
    	tell each other just about anything and I wouldn't trade any
    	of them for the world.
    
    	FJJ
    
    

    As a child I never had boys as friends (with one exception who was my next
     door neighbor), but as an adult I've had a mix of male and female
    friends.  The only difference that I can think of between my male and
    female friends is that I have occasionally had sex with male friends,
    and I've never had sex with a female friend.  Other than that I don't
    think I could really characterize my friends by their gender.  I've
    confided just as many personal things to men as I have to women,
    laughed with as many women as men and had as much fun with either sex. 
    
    Lorna
    
      

    >>What is the difference between your
        male and female friends?
    
    Male friends proposition me and ruin the friendship. I don't worry
    about my female friends doing the same.  
    
    Kath

    Re .7: Is it that you don't expect your female friends to proposition
    you, or that you don't think it would ruin the friendship if they did?
    [I.e., possible male/female (or is it straight/lesbian?) differences in
    dealing with rejection from friends to whom they have made passes...]
    
    I tend to have few close friends at any one time; most of those have
    been women, for whatever reasons, but the men I've been friends with
    have been equally valued. I've occasionally had problems with friends
    who wanted something different from the friendship than I did -
    sometimes it was the friend wanting sex (or - gasp! - love) when I
    didn't, or me wanting it when they didn't (and in neither case did it
    ruin the friendships), but more often it was just the usual adjustments
    between people. How much time to spend together, are both parties doing
    their bit to maintain the friendship ("Why haven't you called?"), etc.
    
    The one thing I've noticed as a semi-chronic problem is that, since I'm
    something of a loner and tend not to ask or expect much from others, I
    am sometimes seen by my friends as being uninterested, cold, or
    distant. I don't mean to be; it's just that I tend to assume others
    want the same space that I do, and I've learned that's far from the
    truth. After 39 years of applied studies in personal relationships, I
    think I'm beginning to pick up on some of the cues that people use to
    indicate what they want in a friendship; maybe after another 39 years
    I'll actually get good at it. ;-)
    
    As for the topic, well, I haven't noticed that my male friends are much
    different, as a group, than my female friends; and I haven't noticed
    that I've learned different things from the men than from the women
    (again, as a group; what I've gotten from each individual varies
    tremendously). I do wonder what they think they've gotten from me...
    
    -b

    I had a problem believing sex and love could go together in the same
    relationships.  Sex was cruelty and power, love was kindness and
    sharing.  I imagine, it is for this reason that very few male 
    acquaintances were actually allowed to become just friends, because
    the risk that the sex half might be attempted was too great even when
    (and it usually is) it was minimal.  Men were for sex.  Women were
    for love/friendship, and they were mutually exclusive entities.
    
    Now, however, I find I can love some men very much, once the assurance
    of sexual intetion has been abolished.  They can be great.  Where
    female friends might find competition, male friends can offer more
    objective opinions.  Where male friends have ego threats, female
    friends can often offer cool insights.
    
    I got married when I finally found a man for whom I could handle
    both roles.  He, and my 270 pound bulk help assure that the
    overwhelming majority of sexual intetions are squashed.
    
    From that vantage point, I have a great time with just me,
    and the guys.
    
    Cindi