Conference turris::womannotes-v3

    *major applause*
    
    Thank you for starting this one D!
    
    Some of that problem can be augmented by the format here --
    personalities are difficult to transmit electronically, and after
    a note is entered, I'm sure that many of us get the telephone_is_
    back_on_the_hook_did_I_really_mean_it_to_sound_like_that? syndrome.
    
    It's too damn easy to take simple things that people say out of
    context and extrapolate an entire person from one misconnception.
     Not exactly fair since none of us are in person here to make things
    clear.
    
    Something everyone could think about.
    
    thanks again,
    
    daniel

    D, sometimes I feel as if the people that reply in on note are totally
    different individuals then those who reply to another note. This is so
    even though I see the same names over and over again. My personal take
    on this is that they are replying to a specific topic and that is the
    face we see at that point. We see a new face on another topic. The
    style of writing depends on whether the person agrees with what the
    current line of discussion is or not. If this has something to do with
    what a persons difference is, be it race, sexual preference, personal
    lifestyle or whatever is what seems to shine through. A person writes
    about what She or he is most comfortable writing about or what may set
    off a hot button. Knowledge of the subject may have nothing to do with
    it. Look at my notes to see why that is so. If a person regularly
    brings up their difference then they may feel that that is relevant to
    the topic at hand. That it may not be has nothing to do with it. 
    
    All this rambling just leads me to say that it isn't unusual to think
    of a person by their difference if you only know them through notes.
    I try to picture a person when I'm reading a reply and if a difference
    is mentioned then that will stand out. Hopefully in an In-person
    dealing other facets of their personality will come out and I'll see
    this person as a well rounded individual with a variety of oppinions on
    a variety of topics and that I'll be able to appreciate them for that.
    
    I guess I'm trying to say that NOTES is limiting in that you only can
    get a small piece of the person at a time.
    
    Phil

    
    What an interesting thought. But what about the other side?
    
    Don't I, as a person entering a comment or reply, have some part of the
    responsibility to make sure that I am not seen as 'my cause'? Don't I
    create a situation where it is hard for people to see me behind my
    'message'?
    
    This was brought home to me at the recent [wonderful...wonderful] =wn=
    party...several people were [seemingly] astounded that I was who I
    was...or looked like who I was. Why? Because of the tenor of my notes.
    Obviously, I was not conveying with any accuracy who I was under all
    that verbage. 
    
    Yes, I know that this case has to do with appearances and the base 
    note has to do with something much less surface-level, but my point is
    that *all* communication is two-way. *I* have an equal responsibility
    as the presentor to *yours* as the listener.
    
    To the point, I am not sure that I would immediately look to myself as
    the 'offending' [sic] party when I start not seeing noters as 'people'.
    I think *they* have an equal onus to portray opinions in a light that
    reflects the many facets that we all have that go into forming an
    opinion.
    
    For instance, If I typed:
    
    	You know, when I am not too busy chasing the darn critters
    	out of the hen house, or fetching their kittens from behind
    	the refrigerator...
    
    You would see a person who is exasperated but maintaining a sense
    of balance and humor and would most likely get support and
    offers of advice.
    
    If on the the other hand I typed:
    
    	If I ever catch another filthy feline in the hen house I will
    	drown every kitten I ever find...
    
    I am gonna get 'killed' by the cat lovers in the crowd, marked as
    reactionary by the moderates, ignored by the politically astute...
    
    Yet, I am probably the same person; feeling the same way. In the first
    instance, I am venting my frustration while still managing to convey my
    fallibility and admitting that life is, afterall, one prat fall after
    another. In the second I am out of control...and what the reader sees
    is the message with none of the 'humanity' attached.
    
    Now, my question is...is that your fault or mine? My thought is, that
    it is at least as much mine as yours....takes two to do anything right
    that's worthwhile...[or fun {grin}]
    
    Melinda
            

    I agree, D!.
    
    And it kind of defeats the whole purpose, I mean valuing the difference
    but not mentioning the sameness. 
    
    Kate

    I'm a little confused here...I don't really see why "being male"
    or "being female" needs to enter into the matter.  There are women
    who support issues considered traditionally "masculine" and men
    who support issues considered traditionally "feminine."  I like
    to think of gender as something that is socialized.  WE are born
    either female or male, but we learn to act in either a feminine
    or masculine way.
    
    Maybe valuing difference *and* people would be helped if there weren't
    a tendency to gender speicfy both positions and people. "Oh, she's
    a woman, sounds liek a feminist she won't understand what it is really
     like to hunt" or "oh, he's a man, sounds like he enjoys blowing
    away little furry things."  Stuff like that can really stand in
    the way of understanding someone as a *person*
    
    Maybe things would be easier if there weren't a tendency to gender
    specify what a person says -- we all cross those lines, so why have
    them at all?
    
    Mama and Papa raised me to see *people* not genders,
    
    daniel

    re .5 & .6, and I got most of my animal rights ideas from my *father*,
    who grew up on a farm in Nova Scotia and had very little knowledge of
    feminism, but did love animals a lot! :-)   (how about that, Eagle?)
    
    Lorna
    

    I bought a book of poems on friends last night. It's called Forever
    Friends. I forget the compiler. I bought it in a Hallmark store in
    Nashua. One of the poems made me think of this Note. Not sure if it
    answers anything here, but I thought I'd post it anyway. 
    
    Keep in mind
    That each of us is special
    Because we are different
    we have come together
    In this friendship
    
    Because we have our differences
    To bring to each other
    So listen to me 
    As i listen to you
    We will hear ourselves
    grow into the realization
    Of expanding mutual respect
    
    Diane Westlake
    
    
    If it needs to be moved to the poetry string that's OK. I thought it
    was approiate for this string.
    
    Phil