Conference turris::womannotes-v2

     First of all, an honest politician is as common as a two headed snake,
    and about as useful.
    
    Each politician starts off with good intentions. It is once he becomes
    accustomed to the power structure that he first goes through a period
    of depression and disillusionment. When he or she starts to see the
    absolute bullshit that occurs in the running of our country, he shakes
    his head. Then the rationalizations start. We'll if I'm to get what I
    want in this important (to me) issue, I'll have to sell a little of my
    soul (go for a shitty proposal on another issue) so I can get some
    votes. Thus a series of votes get traded, and the actual issue has much
    less to do with things than does the amount of outstanding markers.
    
    If you have ever actually sat and watched the government in action, it
    is extremely scary that so many issues are decided by groups of people
    who simply do not understand the issues before them. Oftentimes
    testimony is one-sided and self-serving; in this way phenomenally poor
    legislation gets passed.
    
    I guess what I am saying is that presidents are in no way corner the
    market on evasive answers. Most presidents tell more of the truth than
    their congressional counterparts.I don't think either side ever tells
    the whole truth. Too often, the country is not ready to hear it.
    
    The Doctah

       
    Oh, I see... we can't handle the truth, is that it?  Well if that
    is the standard being set, I guess that neither the government nor
    anyone else can "handle" the truth either.  Lets hear no more
    complaints about welfare cheating or any other kind of cheating
    for that matter.  
    
    The standards (the rules of the game of life) are set by the most
    powerful of us and the rest of us play accordingly.
    Buy up those assault rifles and stay out of Central Park.  Its every
    man for himself.  How much money will those who are out for themselves
    make dealing coke per year?  Can't you see where this kind of an
    attitude will lead our country?      
    
    Mary
                                   

    Well, since government officials can do anything they
    choose in the name of national security, it follows that
    we as individuals can do anything in the name of
    personal security.
    
    And speaking of national security/policy, I'd like to remind
    whoever suggested that Ameica would be 'greater' if individuals
    subjected themselves to the 'greater good of the state'
    (admitedly a bad paraphrase):  that's what all great
    and not-so-great totalitarian states require.`
    
    no thanks!
    
    /bruce

    
    This recent spate of notes is the most amusing I've seen in
    some time...
    
    When does 2 + 2 become 5...?
    
    You wouldn't want to know the truth. Trust me.

Re:  .5

>    When does 2 + 2 become 5...?

Doesn't it depend on the speed of the wind?

			--Q (Dick Wagman), a _Mathematical_Magpie_ lover

    
    Either the Chairman of the House Committee is lying for personal
    political gain, or either or both recent Presidents have been lying
    for similar reasons.
    
    Which politicians you believe to be lily-white and truthful, and
    which you perceive as lying rats tends to depend on which political
    party you offer voting-allegiance to. If you are a cynic you probably
    think they are all lying.
                      
    /. Ian .\
    

      
      re -1
    
      I guess if all of our politicians are out for their own self 
      interest, then we individuals had better do the same, eh?
      If one believes that most (if not all) politicians are the same,
      does that make one a cynic or a realist?
    
    >This recent spate of notes is the most amusing I've seen in
    >some time...
    >
    >When does 2 + 2 become 5...?
     
    Ask Bush and Reagan, ... their numbers never seem to add up these days
    either.  Even the two year MIT study mentioned that "the federal
    monetary policy that has eased the US trade deficit somewhat is
    only concealing, not curing, more fundamental problems"
    
    >You wouldn't want to know the truth. Trust me.
     
    Oh you liberals today... always expecting government to assume 
    responsibility for everything... even that role which government is least
    suited for - guardian of truth, caretaker of morality and integrity.
    
    Forgive me for not trusting you my friend.  If my tax money buys
    me nothing else... government owes me the truth.                        
  
      Mary_;-)
    

    
    Here is another example of how our present administration endangers our
    very survival by their refusal to be honest.  
    
    From the New York Times News Service
    
    "WASHINGTON - The White House's Office of Management and Budget has
    changed the scheduled congressional testimony of a top government
    scientist, *over his protests* to make his conclusions about the effects
    of global warming seem less serious and certain than he intended.
                                  
    The altered testimony had been prepared by Dr. James E. Hansen,
    director of NASA's Goddard Institute for Space Studies, for delivery
    tomorrow before the Senate subcommittee on Science, Technology
    and Space, congressional sources said.  Hansen confirmed that the
    testimony had been changed.
    
    In his original testimony, he said that computer projections of
    changes in climate caused by carbon dioxide and other gases released
    into the atmosphere would cause substantial increases in temperature,
    drought, severe storms and other stresses that will affect the earth's
    biological systems.
    
    But the text of his testimony was edited by the budget office to soften
    the conclusions and make the prospects of change in climate appear
    more uncertain, Hansen said.
    
    Sen. Albert Gore, D-Tenn., chairman of the subcommittee, said White
    House officials were attempting to change science to make it conform
    to their policy rather than base policy on accurate scientific data.
    
    "They are scared of the truth," Gore said"
                                            
    We should also be "scared" by the problem this administration has
    with telling the truth.
    
    Mary

2+2=5 for sufficiently large values of 2...

I guess I fall into the cynic category - I haven't known of any politicians
I trusted.  However, of the more recent ones, I guess on a range of 1 to
10 where 1 is habitual liar, my opinion is that they would rank as follows:

	George Bush	2	John Sununu	1
	Ronnie Reagan	1	Judd Gregg	3 or 4
	Mike Dukakis	2	Ted Kennedy	2
	Walter Mondale	? (I don't remember enough about him)
	Jimmy Carter	5	Gerry Ford	4
	Richard Nixon	2	Dan Quayle	Very Low

    Re .9:
    
    God, this is frightening.  Doesn't "Poppy" at least care enough
    about his _own_ grandchildren to face what we're doing to our environment?
                   

        The truth is often harsh and can hurt, it has no part in a kinder
    gentler America.
    
    ASP

    	I've  heard it said that the government doesn't think people
    	like to hear the truth. So, they give us a bunch of garbage.
    	Problem is, when the do do hits the fan, it comes as quite
    	a shock to many.
    
    	I rather have just the facts, please.
    
    	Scott

    From today's Telegram:   
    
    WASHINGTON (AP) - ...
    
    "Another government scientist, Dr. Jerry D. Mahlman of the National
    Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, said he had a similar
    experience with the budget office in congressional testimony he
    prepared in February.
    
    Mahlman said he successfully fought changes that would have been
    "embarrassing to me" in facing his fellow scientists, and told the
    senators, "If we do not have the right to be wrong, we have squelched
    the right to be creative.
                         

    
    And now,... a little something for our Japanese friends:
    
    New York Times News Service
    TOKYO - "The U.S. military's touchy relationship with Japan worsened
    yesterday with the disclosure that a hydrogen bomb, lost off an
    American aircraft carrier 24 years ago, remains on the ocean floor
    80 miles from a Japanese island....
    
    ... The admission was prompted by a report released by the
    environmental group Greenpeace and the Institute for Policy Studies,
    a Washington-based research group...
    
    ...Experts in Tokyo notes that the pressure of the water at that
    depth (16,000 feet) may crack the bomb's casings."

    Without permission from today's Boston Globe:
    
    Senators, scientists and environmentalists yesterday accused the
    Bush administration of reneging on its commitment to the environment
    by forcing a senior federal researcher to water down his testimony
    on global warming.
    
    James Hansen, head of the federal Goddard Institute for Space Studies,
    had planned to tell senators yesterday that global warming will
    raise temperatures and cause droughts - and to urge them to act now
    on solutions.  The White House's Office of Management and Budget,
    however, made him soften the warnings and proposals, saying proof
    is lacking.
    
    Hansen presented for the record the OMB-approved version, but then
    told senators he was forced to accept the changes even though they
    distorted his opinions.  As a government scientist, he added that
    he "should be able to say what my opinions are."

re: < Note 579.8 by 25520::STANLEY "What a long, strange trip its been" >
    
>                                                If my tax money buys
>    me nothing else... government owes me the truth.                        
  
You have my best wishes for any and all efforts you may put forth to
collect on this debt. Please be sure to let us know how you make out.

-Jack

  [ :^) ]

    Thanks for the good wishes Jack_:-)
    
    Mary
    p.s. You will be happy to know that I am not holding my breath_;-)