Conference turris::womannotes-v1

    I don't earn more than my husband (yet -- just wait till those
    best-sellers start rolling in!), but these rules seem to make sense
    from the simple perspective of equality.
    
    I know what I'd do if Neil suddenly decided that since he brings in
    more household income, he has a bigger vote on where were go for
    vacation!  Or that I had to do more chores 'cause I didn't earn as
    much! 
    
    I'd kill, that's what I'd do!
    
    I see no reason why a man in my position would feel any less abused.
    
    That kind of accounting might work for a business partnership, but
    a marriage is so much more than just a monetary balance.  Or a tradeoff
    of income for nurturing, as in the traditional model.
    
    I'm not sure I hold with the idea of putting everything into a joint
    account, though.  We use about the same system you do -- a fixed
    amount (more than what covers just expenses) into the joint fund,
    with some for each of us.  It helps to have money you can spend
    as frivously as you want without having the other person complain.

    whoa. half the message i get from this article is that if you're making
    more than "your man", you need to soothe his ruffled feathers (and
    bruised ego) by taking on extra feminine chores -- in other words,
    pretend to be a "traditional woman" to make him feel more like a man.
    YECH! The other half is that you should do "sensible" things. (I
    like the part about hiring household help if you're _both_ feeling
    too pressured to do it, for example.)
    
    Our arrangement is a "my money / your money / our money" one. We
    decided how much to contribute to a joint account (divided
    proportionately according to our salaries), and we each have a separate
    account. It's great. We use our personal accounts for personal stuff
    and for presents intended for the other person. I NEVER have to ask if
    it's ok to spend money on something for me (and R never has to ask
    either). We never feel compelled to criticize the other person for
    being frivolous. AND I never have to balance my own checkbook if I
    don't want to. 
    
    I don't know if this would work for you... The most important thing
    is to work something out where you both feel you're getting a good
    deal, and where you feel that neither one is take advantage of the
    other.
    
    good luck.
    liz

    I don't make that much more money than my husband (a few K) and
    he is surely "catching up" (which he loves to needle me playfully
    about) only because he is working 50 hours a week (good OT income).
    
    What has worked for us since we've been married (2 1/2 yrs) is to
    pay bills and virtually live off of my pay.  His pay gets deposited,
    less a small amount of spending money for himself, to build a savings.
    
    Because of my accounting background, I pay the bills, balance the
    checkbook, and if anything is left over I will either decide to
    spend it or add it to our savings.
    
    Before we built our house (moved in 12/87) anything that went into
    savings stayed there (guess what we were saving for?) and wasn't
    touched unless we were in dire straights.
                             
    We have never questioned who's money was who's and have never
    censored one another's spending, and I think we've done well 
    considering that when we got married, we didn't have a pot to *is*
    in.  Of course there have been times when I've wanted and needed
    things (clothes in particular) but have held back in the best
    interest for us both.
    
    When we lived in an apartment, I did most of the housework, but
    as soon as the extra money comes rolling in - DEFINITELY a cleaning
    person will take over.
    
    Now that we have the house, and a hefty mortgage payment, both of
    our pay goes towards living expenses and paying bills.  We do have
    a budget worked up for 1988, and hopefully we can stick to it (a
    necessity at this point).
    
    It has always been "Our Money" for us.        Pam
    
    

    re: 0
    
    I really don't agree with that silly article either...
    
    It would seem to me that each couple would work out their finances/
    household matters to their own satisfaction.
    
    I too, make considerably more than my SO.  We've been living together
    for a year, with separate checking accounts and little troubles
    from said arrangement.  The only time we pool our money is for the
    rent anyway.  That doesn't justify a combined account in our eyes.
    Even though we maintain separate accounts, if he's short I help
    him out or visa versa.  We have managed not to be stingy with "our"
    money this way.  I pay certain bills, according to what I earn and
    he does the same.  We both pay our own car notes and insurance.
    Maybe we'll change things when we marry... maybe not!
    
    Theresa.

    I saw about ten minutes of a television program, I think it was
    Jane Bryant Quinn's, where she was discussing a new book that analyzed
    "pooling" vs. "spliting" vs. combinations of them in managing a
    couple's income.  The author had apparently done quite a bit of
    research with actual cases.  Mumble discussion of credit histories,
    money as power, sharing as committment, etc.  If I could just remember
    either the author's name or the title of the book.....
    

    My husband and I have been married for about 8 months now but living
    together for about 1 year.  I make a considerable amount more than my
    husband in the same field even though I have only been out in the work
    force 6 months longer than he.  I have just been able to take advantage
    of some good opportunities that he hasn't had yet. 

    We tend to look at our individual salaries as one big salary. The more
    either of us makes, the better house we can buy, the more new furniture
    we can buy, the better honeymoon we can go on etc.  The way we look at
    it - it doesn't matter how much either of us makes because it all goes
    to the same place - we are shooting for the same goals. 
                                                          
    This is how we work out our finances: His checks go into a joint money
    market account from which we just pay our mortgage, this allows us to
    save a certain amount a month.  My check goes into a NOW account from
    which we write all our other bills, buy things for the house and buy
    things for ourselves.  Most of the time the amount we spend on
    ourselves is the same, but if there is an expensive item I want that is
    important to me my husband will give up a little of his spending for
    that week. This goes both ways. 

    We find this to be the best way - money is together - no one is made to
    feel the lessor just because they bring in less money.  If our life
    style were to change such as one of us staying home to take care of
    children, or he started to make more money than I, or if he decided to
    start his own business where the salary would be small at first etc the
    money made would still go towards our common goals and we still would
    spend equal amounts on ourselves. 

    This prevents one partners job from being deemed as the "important"
    job. Both of our careers and salaries are important to ourselves as
    well as each other.  We encourage each other to succeed and do well. If
    some one is staying home caring for children and bringing in no salary
    - the job is still important - and that person should not be penalized
    for making less or no money! 

    What works for us may not work for anyone else.  We are also very equal
    and sharing about house work.  The way we look at it - the more we
    share the work to be done around the house, the faster it gets done,
    thus the more time we have to spend just being together or doing more
    fun things.                                                
    
    ps

    And as far as trying to make your man feel more manly to make up for
    him feeling less manly just because you make more money - give me a
    break! When my mom made less than my dad he never baked her a pie
    to make her feel better and now that she makes more than him she
    doesn't bake him any either - they just go out to eat more.


    

    PPS
    
    I do highly recommend having both your names on any rental income
    or property, having your own credit cards etc.  This allows both
    of you to establish needed credit for yourself incase something
    happens to your union or to one another.

    I have been married for 3 months and also make a considerable amount
    more than my husband.  As previously stated, the key is agreement.
    Once you marry someone, there is an agreement for the family unit
    to go in a certain direction.  It should not matter who makes what
    or who contributes the most towards the goal.  The bottom line is
    to get from point A to point B TOGETHER.   I had a car and he didn't
    when we got married.  Now WE have a car.  Right now we have agreed
    to pay it off 2 years early by putting my husband's entire salary
    towards the car payments for 7 months.  All of our bills are
    paid immediately and other expenses are taken care of as the need
    arises.  We have a definite budget and extras are dispensed equally,
    (for the most part).  If I choose to spend my clothing allotment on 
    albums, then that is my perogative.  It works well for us because
    we recognize the fact that how much money one makes is not an indication
    of worth or of how hard s/he is working.   As for house work, we
    always share that responsibility.  We drive to and from work together
    so that no one is home first and should get dinner ready.  It usually
    works out that when I am in "slug mode", he does most of the house
    work and vice versa.  When we both are beat, then it just gets put
    off until another day (when you are newly married that's easy to
    do without any major reprocussions).  My husband's biggest hangup
    about not making more money (in general) is that if something
    were to happen and I couldn't work for a while, that it would be
    very difficult for him to support the household.  He feels that
    this is his duty.   This concern is valid but should not be reserved
    for the man of the house.  
    
    In a nutshell, we determine to attain our goals first, and then
    spend any extras (his or mine) on OURselves.  The proportions may
    be equal or unequal, depending on what WE decide. 
    
    D.
    (Excuse the randomness of my thoughts as they appear in this reply)

    For a contrary view, try "How I Found Freedom In An Unfree World"
    by Harry Browne. He recommends *total* separation of assets in a
    relationship. The book challenges a lot of assumptions that folks
    take for granted. 

Re < Note 729.9 by HEFTY::CHARBONND "What a pitcher!" >
                              -< adifferent view >-

>    For a contrary view, try "How I Found Freedom In An Unfree World"
>    by Harry Browne. He recommends *total* separation of assets in a
>    relationship. The book challenges a lot of assumptions that folks
>    take for granted. 

Can I assume that he is discussing two income relationships?  I think my wife,
who doesn't work, would be very upset if I separated our assets.  She might 
even demand that I repay her for putting me through school! :-)

/Mike

    The Mr. makes much more $ than I do, but it all goes toward one
    common goal.  I  manage all of it, since he discovered that
    this is not his forte'.  Any major purchases we plan for together.
    The small things we just buy as needed.  There's no question of
    how much of who's money is in the checking account.  We both maintain
    a small savings account individually for credit purchases, as well
    as a few credit cards.  But the bills all get paid for out of the
    same pot.   
    
    It seems to me that if you maintain all monetary accounts separately,
    how is it determined which salary goes toward the children? (if
    there are any)  The person who makes the most?
    
    As far as 'chores' go, my Mr. is a bit stereotyped when it comes
    to "womans work". (he does help out when I'm ill and the like) 
    He can't cook, and he has longer days than I do, and is too tired
    to clean.  I did the best thing for both of us, I hired a housekeeper.
    Now we can both go play on the weekends.
    
    This has worked fine for us for almost 8 years.  Someday I probably
    will make more money than my husband, but I don't see any reason
    that the system we now have should have to change.
    

    
    My spouse and I have 'yours/mine/ours'. Theoretically 50% of each
    of our pay-checks (she makes somewhat more than I) goes into joint
    checking, a specific dollar from each pay-check goes into joint
    savings and then whatever is left over goes into our own personal
    accounts in whatever manner we choose. I say theoretically, because
    we're a little too disorganized to actually figure out 50% and we
    also never set up a joint savings account. But that has actually
    turned out to be an advantage. Each of us has our own savings
    'approaches' (she's very conservative and I'm more of a speculator)
    and we have inadvertently ended up being rather nicely diversified.
    We have mostly separate credit cards (one or two joint ones); we
    also live in a community property state, so in a certain sense all
    these questions are moot.
    

    I prefer separate accounts. I wouldn't want all my money going into a
    joint pool. 
    
    My SO and I have been together for almost 8 years.  We both had our own
    checking accounts when we came into the relationship and we never
    considered a joint account until last year. 
    
    Then we decided it would be nice if there was an account for large,
    irregular expenditures, like heating fuel, vacations, furniture and the
    like.  We both sat down and figured out what we wanted to use the
    account for, and how much we should contribute to cover the expected
    withdrawals.  It just happened to turn out even. The joint account
    hasn't caused us any problems, but I do feel I have to keep Dave
    informed of any checks I write from it, even though I hold the only
    checkbook for that account.  I much prefer using my own checks. 
    
    We use our regular checking accounts to pay regular bills and expenses.
    He's responsible for mortgage and cars, and I'm responsible for
    groceries, credit cards, investments and just about everything else. He
    makes a good chunk more than me, but all decisions are 50/50 (except
    for gifts :-).  We've never argued about money, and rarely discuss it.
    We've also been lucky in never hitting hard times and deciding what we
    have to give up to get by. 
    
    As for housework, he handles the kitchen (cooking and cleaning) and
    half the clothes cleansing (he washes, I dry), and I clean the rest of
    the house when company comes over.  I think I'm getting off pretty
    light, so I'll do the dishes once in awhile too.  
    
    			Barbara b. 

    
        Many of the replies are excellent, and most even though
    different allude to a basic concept.  It doesn't matter how
    the money is saved, split, etc... so long as both parties sit
    down and discuss what needs to be done, and the best way to
    get there, and that both parties feel it is an equitable 
    arrangement and are happy with their decision.
    
        In my case, I make less, but that doesn't bother me.  Neither
    one of us uses money to control the relationship.  We both give
    freely to the whole relationship, including money.  We would
    have a joint checking to pay the household expenses (that way
    we both know what is being spent), a joint savings (mostly
    for contingency/dire emergencies), and then each would maintain
    and individual checking/savings account (with both names on
    each account, in case something happens), for personal
    expenditures (say you wanted to buy presents and wanted to
    surprise the other, otherwise as soon as the statement came
    in the other might guess something has been bought for them.)
    
      But the bottom line is to cover the joint expenses first, and
    then put whatever is left into your personal accounts, but even
    the money in the personal accounts is not a "you" or "I" situation.
    Its still our money if we need to use it, its just that we
    are individually responsible for what we do with it.  If I want
    to buy something or she wants to buy something, we discuss it and
    would make the appropriate $$ transfer to whose account a bill
    would come from.  That's enough rambling, the whole reply is
    actually in the first paragraph.
    

    I am in a similar situation where I make almost twice my husband's
    salary, and I doubt the situation will ever change much (though
    I'd love it to) because we have such different careers and
    opportunities. We've handled money in a few ways.  When we were
    living together and renting an apartment, we each put in the same
    amount per month into a joint account which I managed.  That money
    was used to pay all household expenses such as rent, utilities,
    heat and food.  Anything that we bought like furniture or kitchen
    things etc was purchased by one or the other because I didn't want
    to deal with trying to separate property bought together if we split
    up.
    
    When we got engaged and bought our first house, he started to give
    me his paycheck every week and we had all our money in a joint account
    with one exception.  He would keep every fourth paycheck which went
    into his account and was used to buy me presents and to buy his
    toys (motorcycle and sailboat stuff).  I always paid for everything
    else out of the joint account.
    
    Currently, we have just purchased a single family house and because
    of the larger mortgage and the fact that my husband was out of work
    for 9 months in the past 2 years while we were trying to save, we
    have adjusted his paycheck schedule so that he keeps one out of
    five checks.  The rest of his pay goes towards the mortgage. And
    my check still goes into the joint account and is used for savings
    and all the other expenses.
    
    I have always managed all the finances and make most of the financial
    decisions because I am better at it and he has little to no interest.
    Actually, I would love it if he would get more involved, but he
    has no inclination to do that.  So every time we go to make a major
    purchase, I give him the maximum number we can afford, and that's
    the limit.  
    
    This has worked for us, and I know that my husband is satisfied
    with it.  The nicest compliment I got was at Christmas where my
    husband's brother announced his engagement and said that he wants
    me to teach his fiancee how to do the finances because he wants
    the same arrangement that Mark and I have.  And Mark said he couldn't
    imagine doing our finances any other way because he could always
    get what he wanted because I always plan to have the money when
    it's needed and it's always there at the right time (this year's
    target is a sailboat in the spring).
    
    Cathy
     

    This has been quite an interesting discussion to read through as
    my SO and myself are currently selling up our seperate houses and
    buying a place together. We haven't actually discussed this question
    in detail yet, but I should think the way we will work it is to
    have a joint account to pay for the mortgage and bills, and to keep
    the rest of our money seperate. One good reason for having some
    money seperate is that we have quite seperate spending patterns,
    Steve has everything under control whereas I can usually only estimate
    my bank balance to the nearest 50 pounds or so. Even if one of us
    was the sole breadwinner, I think it would be important for us both
    to have a little money of our own, so that we could buy pressies
    for one another without getting charged the next week !
    
    As for housework, Steve lived on his own for 2 years before I came
    on the scene, so I don't think I need worry about being expected
    to do more than my fair share, in fact we've already had a good
    row because I'm too untidy for him. (I'm trying to be tidier, honest!)
    Recently though, Steve started employing someone to come in for
    2 hours on a Friday to give the house a quick dust and hoover and
    to do his ironing, it's a brilliant idea, for 2 hours a week it
    doesn't cost too much, but the house is clean for the weekend, and
    I can't wait till we've got our new house and then I will be able
    to afford to get my ironing done too !!!
    
    Sarah-who-hates-ironing.

    We have two checking accounts ours and hers. Hers are strictly for
    running her businesses out of though. We've always put all income
    into one account. For the first few years, my wife did the books.
    Then she started working for herself on and off and managing two
    sets of books (household and business) was more work then she wanted
    so I took over. Personally I rather not see the books and just get
    spending money but someone has to write the checks.
    
    Right now I make more then my wife but that has not always been
    the case. I do not expect to remain the major earner once her current
    business project gets rolling either. We never saw any need to have
    her money and my money (even when she was making more then I). I've
    read all these notes but I still don't understand why people want
    to keep the money separate. After all if your SO and you can't agree
    on how to spend your (joint) money doesn't that indicate other deeper
    problems? Just asking not judging.
    
    In general we discuss major purchases and use our own judgment
    on smaller ones. In 11 years I don't remember anyone purchase
    being sent back or vetoed. Discussed and decided not practical or
    delayed for reason but always by joint agreement.
    
    				Alfred

    I added up all the account we have, and it seems like a lot, but
    it works quite well (for us). All of them are in interest paying
    checking (actually NOW) account.
    
    General account: My paycheck gets deposited into here. All the major
    bills (1st and 2nd mortgages, etc.) and recurring expenses (gas, water,
    etc.) get paid from here. Big expenses such as vacations and veterinary
    bills also come from this account. Exceptional purchases are always
    by mutual consent.
    
    Household account: for groceries, dishes, gardening supplies, etc.
    A set amount is transferred into this account every week from the
    general fund. It sure is easy to budget this way.
    
    Art account: My wife is an artist. This is basically a business
    account. It pays for supplies, rent, licenses, etc. When my wife
    becomes famous, the profits will also go into the general account.
    
    My wife and I each get a set allowance weekly in cash. It's the
    same for both of us and what we do with it is completely up to the
    individual. This is the only money that is not joint.
    
    PK
    

    Right now my SO and I put a set amount into a joint account a week,
    which pays for all our joint bills (rent, electric, groceries, ect.)
    and leaves a little extra for whatever might come up.  The whatever 
    is left from our check goes into our own checking account and we pay 
    our personal bills (car payment, car ins., ect.) whatever is left 
    from there is ours to do whatever we want with.  This works out
    great for us, because we like to spend money on totally different
    things.  When he spends alot of money on something to build up his
    truck I don't question it because it's his, just as when I go out
    on a clothes shopping spree he doesn't question it because it's
    mine, even though we both think the other is crazy to spend that
    much on something.  This system works well since we both make approx.
    the same.
    
    We have discussed doing it different when we get married.  Since
    one of us will probably end up making more than the other we're
    just going to put everything into one account and then just discuss
    purchases over $50 instead of just going out and spending the money
    without consulting the other.  Hopefully this system will work out
    just as well as the one we have now.

    re: .18
    
    Alfred, one reason to have separate checking accounts is so you can
    surprise each other on gift-giving occasions.  Unless you go to quite
    devious lengths to hide it, the person who manages the books always
    winds up knowing ahead of time how much his or her gift cost.  For some
    people this is trivial, but it's quite important in our relationship. 
    
    Another reason is so that in case of death or divorce, you each
    have a separate credit history to keep the household going.  I've
    watched a friend who had a joint account through 11 years of marriage
    struggle to establish her own credit history now that she's widowed,
    and it hasn't been easy.
    
    In our case, it wasn't that we couldn't agree what to spend our money.
    Rather, we found that a gender-based inequity had developed:  I was
    asking him for permission to buy things and he was informing me of his
    decisions.  Both situations looked like discussion and agreement, in
    fact the dialogues were nearly identical, but it reached a point where
    it bothered us.
    
    Having some separate money for each of us was a convenient tool to make
    things more psychologically even.  But that's all it was -- a tool.
    There's nothing magical or moral about it, and I have no trouble
    understanding that the methods of handling money in a couple are as
    varied as the couples handling it. 
    
    --bonnnie

From bitter experiance I would suggest you keep seperate accounts and
agree a set amount each month you each get to "play" with.  This way you
keep your financial independance, if the amount is reasonable, you should find
that you can both save out of that amount (Once more seperatly), you can then
provide suprises for one another and yet feel independant.

    US News & World Report (March 7,1988) has an article on this issue,
    pages 68-69. Title : On the Delicate Subject of Money.
    Sub-titled : Who controls the purse strings in your house?
    

        We have a whole bunch of accounts and they are all "ours" not
        "hers" or "mine", EXCEPT four. There is one each for the boys
        and a fourth (currently unused due to a minor problem of deficit
        spending caused by having gone to just 1 wage earner) fr the
        general "children's" fund. Those accounts are not "our" money,
        and if we have to borrow from them we pay them back with
        interest. 
        
        When we were in college I supported her one summer when she
        couldn't find work. After we got married she supported me while
        I learned more about computers at various area colleges. Since
        Ian was about 8 months old I've been supporting her again. At
        all times all of the money has been ours jointly, regardless of
        how much there has been, and regardless of who earned it.
        
        Selma has for at least the last 10 years done all of the
        household book-keeping. She can add and subtract in the right
        radix reliably. I messed up the accounts a couple of times by
        adding in octal. I'm not allowed to do that any more. On the
        other hand, I'm much better at strategy and large scale problem
        solving than Selma, so every now and then, equipped with
        calculators, spread sheets, her records for the last few years
        and the like I attack the budget and take the major hand in
        setting some ofthe household fiscal policy. She, of course, has
        a big voice in this as she has the better hands on experience
        with our books.
        
        On the whole, major purchases are mutually agreed upon. We make
        sure we both agree on the need, that it fits my understanding of
        our budgetary strategy, and her understanding of the current
        cash-flow and available resources, and then we go broke
        together. Every now and then one of us will decide something on
        our own. She bought the microwave without consulting me, for
        instance. I agreed that her reason was solid and that it was the
        right thing to have done. 
        
        If I hadn't, I'd have said I thought it was a mistake, and then
        we'd've let it go at that. Next time something similar came up,
        she'd know why I had thought it's been a mistake and she'd
        factor it in. People make mistakes. Even a couple of hundred
        dollar mistake isn't worth fighting over. We only fight over
        small stupid things and things that can't be changed. I mean
        fighting is dumb, so you might as well only do it over the petty
        and the inevitable, right?
        
        From my point of view, the notion of "my money" and "your money"
        is antithetical to what marriage is all about, but we all know
        that I've got a pretty conservative, or at least old-fashioned,
        notion of marriage and the like. I suppose if it works for you
        it's OK. It just strikes me as very unwise, and likely to lead
        to problems, or at best hide them.
        
        JimB. 

    I've been budgeting for years because I have a passion for
    making numbers come out even:  I set aside a certain amount
    of each paycheck for clothes, car, gifts, etc.  When my (now)
    husband and I moved in together I was quite aware that his
    method of "budgeting" was to know at any given point in time
    about how much money was in his checking account, within a
    few hundred dollars, and he didn't make a record of his
    checks in the checkbook register.  I knew he would go crazy
    with the restrictive system I've developed for handling my
    money; I would've gone crazy with his laid-back style.

    We chose to create a third checking account for "joint"
    expenses such as rent and groceries.  We maintained separate
    checking accounts for personal use and managed those as
    suited us; I managed the joint account, since we agreed that
    it needed to be more tightly managed than he was willing to
    do.

    We've had three different methods of determining how much
    money we each put in the joint account:

	1) We each put in an amount proportional to our incomes.
	2) We each put in the same amount.
	3) We each got an "allowance" of the same amount with the
	   rest of our incomes going in the joint account.

    The third method is what we use now.  We "budget" in the joint
    account the same overly complicated way I do in my own:  some
    money set aside each month for furniture and household
    improvement, some for long-term savings, etc.  (The
    complication arises from the self-taught way I keep records,
    not in the fact of budgeting.)  The amount we set aside into
    each budgeting area in the joint account is a joint decision.
    I confess that it causes a good deal of stress for us when I
    perceive that we're spending more out of a given area than
    we're budgeting, and I bring up the problem of spending less
    in that area or budgeting more, which means getting it from
    somewhere other budgeting area...

    The only other stressful situation for us is our rather
    inequitable incomes (I make considerably more than he does),
    which is the main reason we've tried several different
    "apportionments" for how much goes in our joint account.  But
    by and large it all works pretty smoothly:  we have money for
    necessities such as the house payment, and we each have
    allowances to spend on books, music, and clothes.

    I'm not at all sure how well this separation of accounts
    would work in a family with children...

    -- Linda

    Interesting to see how many different styles there are. Obviously
    the principals (not to mention principles; both apply) involved
    are the most significant factor in what will or won't work.
    
    My wife and I have no joint accounts whatsoever - all our accounts
    are separate. She pays the bills, and bills me for my half of the
    common stuff (mortgage etc., but not her credit cards). I do the
    taxes, which involves a fairly complex spreadsheet to keep track of
    what percentage of the income and deductions each of us contributed
    to allow for an accurate split of the taxes owed. Purchases are
    either personal property for one or the other of us, or are split
    by one of us billing the other.
    
    Having no children is probably essential in a system like this
    working (as it has for over ten years). 

    Well, we have separate accounts, but as we never have any money
    in either of them, I really don't see that it matters. I start being
    in debt to my bank around the 5th of the month, then it gets steadily
    worse until the 25th (payday). My husband is never in debt to his
    bank because, being self-employed, his bank won't let him. He stops
    spending when he has a few francs left on his account. 
    
    As I have a steady income, I pay everything that has to be paid
    regularly: rent, taxes, insurances, reimbursement of loans, child support
    for his child from his first marriage, etc, until there is no money
    left at all. Then he takes over and pays everything else until he
    has no money left. Then we just wait until money comes in again,
    on his side or on my side. When vacation time comes, we go away
    if we have the money, if we don't we stay at home.
    
    For the children (his and ours), we have set up two saving accounts,
    plus two life insurance to be cashed in when they reach twenty.
    This is to allow them to keep on studying whatever our financial
    situation may be when they reach University. If they don't want
    to keep on studying, the money will be theirs absolutely.

    Now that may not be everybody's cup of tea but, as recent replies
    have mentioned that they weren't sure how to handle separate accounts
    once there were children, I thought it was worth mentioning! 
                                                                 
    Joana
    

    re: 25 and joint accounting with children --
    
    The fact that I had a child when we met helped determine our
    system -- when there wasn't enough money to cover everything we
    wanted, we shared and saved everything jointly, and now that
    there's some excess, we each get an 'allowance' out of our own
    income. The children's expenses are a monthly-fixed-obligation,
    just like the mortgage. 

    Of course there's no limit to how much a child costs -- a couple
    of them will absorb as much money as two CEO's could jointly pour
    into such an account! 
    
    --bonnie

RE: .0

"One in four working wives now outearns her husband"

How is this possible if the "women earn .62$ where men earn 1$"?  Does this
statistic no longer hold true?  Or are there a lot of statistical loopholes
in these statements?

The article sounds silly to me.  I feel that a person should be able to spend
the money they earn in ways that they choose.  If you and yours can agree on a
method, great, otherwise decide if that's really where you want to be.  It's
nice to have individual items explictly bought by one or the other in case
property squables come up later, but strict expenses should even out.

I was once living with a woman, when the time came to move.  She wanted a nicer
home then I could afford.  She wanted me to get a second job to pay half of the
expenses for more house then I wanted.  I told her that the only reason I would
consider getting a second job was to be able to own a home; there was no way I
wanted to slave my life away to just break even. 

She decided that she did not have sufficient trust to co-own a home with another
person; fine, that's her decision.  We looked around at various homes with the
idea of either her, or I buying.  What ended up was that neither one of us
seperately could afford a place big enough for both of us to suit her.  None of
the places I considered buying were suitable for her tastes.  She wanted to buy
a place, and have me pay half of the expenses, again more then I could afford,
necessitating a second job, without me gaining any of the benifits of owning
half of the property.  End of story - we were nolonger living together. 

Before we moved out, she did have the idea that I should do more homework then
her to compensate for my lower income...

I don't feel the need to 'have my ruffled feathers smoothed' if the female
makes more then I...

I feel that children should be expenses split between the parents.

Jim. 

Not so very long ago, I used to make more than my husband.  'Tis no
longer the case, but our dollars have always been shared.  

We've had a wonderful little arrangement for 10 1/2 years that has worked
just great for us:  What's his is mine and what's mine is mine and then I
share it ALL with him (just kidding, our money is OUR money except for our
piddly allowances).  We do have more than one account, which helps us in
our bookkeeping, and we are JOINT account holders for all of them.

When either of us wants to buy something, we BOTH go and buy it!  For
major purchases, we shop and compare together, and spend our money 
as a team.  There have been times when we've had to to "convince" the 
other of the justification of a desired (MAJOR) purchase, if we couldn't 
come up with a good enough justification, the purchase was put off until
a convincing arguement was come up with.  (He's still trying to figure
out how to convince me of the ROI of a bass tracker boat - when the nearest
"lake" is over 60 miles from our house here in Colorado Springs.)

Anyway, each "family" has it's own method of working out the finances, and
I believe there's no MOST CORRECT way to do it ... just the one that works 
for the family involved.

I have a friend who gives his wife an allowance each week and that's the only
money she ever sees, she doesn't know what bills are paid when or anything.
If anything were to happen to my friend, his wife "would be lost" (I para-
phrased him), but that's what makes him happy, she seems to be happy, so
for now, it works for them.  I just know it wouldn't work for my family.

Respectfully,

Elaine

    RE:.30
            Elaine,
                    My wife and I have handled our money exactly as
    you and yours for almost 19 years. I got a kick out of the ROI on
    a boat. My wife finally gave in when I said there was no way I could
    justify a sailboat but wanted it anyway. I've got my boat. Let him
    buy his, then someday when you can't justify something he will agree.
    I wonder what my wife wants. Hmmm.
                                               Bill

    Like a lot of people, we have tried different things, depending
    on what our financial goals at the time were.
    
    We have always had separate checking accounts and, for the most
    part, credit cards.  When I first moved in with Paul (into the
    apartment he had alone before that) before we were married, we
    each continued to pay our own bills.  He continued to pay the rent
    and, since I had no rent to pay anymore, I paid all our (very large)
    wedding bills.
    
    Now, we earns more than me and he gets paid twice a month.  So he
    pays the mortgage and all other bills, including unexpecteds; anything 
    left over is his.  I pay the daycare each week, supply the grocery
    money (he does the shopping), and put some into a joint savings
    account.  The left-over is mine.  We still maintain separate checking
    accounts.  It just seems a lot easier.  But we both feel like we
    are contributing what we can to what is a joint venture.  There
    will be times when I don't make any money and there will be times
    that I make more than him.  It doesn't matter.
    
    But again...you have to decide on what is most comfortable with you.
    mine.  
    
    -Tracy