Conference turris::womannotes-v1

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Note 469.14                       Hysterectomy?                         14 of 16
TELCOM::MAHLER "Don't touch me. I'm all slimy!"      14 lines   8-SEP-1987 14:28
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    	Although I agree with CALLME::'s intent, his facts
    	are a little askew.  Regardless, the examination
    	which is stereotypified by the phrase "Turn your head..."
    	is an examination of the testes and associated muscular
    	support and contraction.  The prostate examination involves
    	the insertion of the examining doctors finger into the
    	rectum and probing along the prostate with steady pressure
    	feeling for and abnormalities.  
    
    
    
    	

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Note 469.15                       Hysterectomy?                         15 of 16
TELCOM::MAHLER "Don't touch me. I'm all slimy!"      17 lines   8-SEP-1987 14:37
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    	RE:.12
    
    	The amount of 'male bashing' in this file is only
    	surpassed by the lack of unbiased moderation.
    
    	Your comment regarding 'male equipment' was, not only
    	tactless, but immature as well.  That comment is surpassed
    	only by the 'safe organ' comment in another topic.
    
    	I've had two female doctors and found their rectal exam
    	not only painful but rude, what with their long nails and
    	such.  Inconsiderate?  No.  Just ingorant of what it's
    	like to be a man.  Suspect the same is true in your
    	case of the 'oven mit' equipped stirrup.
    
    	RE: .14 Should have read 'any' not 'and' in the previous note.

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Note 473.0            Explanantion for deletion of notes...           No replies
TELCOM::MAHLER "Don't touch me. I'm all slimy!"      12 lines   8-SEP-1987 14:45
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    	Where did 469.13-.Last go?
    
    	Why weren't the authors notified by mail?
    
    	More importantly, why was .12 allowed to stay?
    
  	The mind boggles at the thought of getting a reply
    	to this note.
    
    

    Michael, had you read the placeholder response I left at the end of
    469, or even waited a few moments, you would not have needed to ask the
    question.
    						=maggie 

    	How does one take a simple statement like "turn your head and
    	cough" and turn it into an indictment of the entire file and
    	all of us?
    
    	I think you guys (Mr_Callme and Mr. Mahler) are reading far
    	too much into the author's words.
    
    							Suzanne...

    
    
    	My apologies to those who were/are offended.  I'm referring
    	to .12's reply to the note from whence this one came.
    
    	While i'm here, i'd just like to say that I don't for a minute
    	think that EVERYONE in this file is a blatantly sexist as some
    	of the people i've replied to in this file, and, in fact,
    	many of the people in this file are more open minded than
    	many people i've met.  In fact, this is one of those
    	files that has such a vast range of readers, you have to be
    	careful of how you phrase things.  It just 'bothers' me when
    	you see reverse-sexism and no one acknowledges it.  It's clich�.
    	Really.  A woman in the file says something that 'if it
    	were said by a man' the guys nads would be zapped.  But of course
    	it's covered by statements like "I thought it was just risqu�!".
    
    	Risqu� [sp?] my tuchus.  It's sexism condoned by the moderators.
    
    

    do you mean risque?

    
    I see nothing wrong with men telling women in this file when they
    feel something is offensive to them as men.  I suspect that you (men)
    will be listened to more openly if you simply say how the words made
    you feel than if you immediately attack the moderators' politics.
    After all, how seriously do expect to be taken if you claim that
    there's a "conspiracy" going on?  Everybody else knows that it's
    not true.  ;-)  
                                 
    Justine

    
    
    	RE: .7's nit.  
    
    	Borrow or rent a 200 series terminal.
    
    

    As for subtle reverse sexism in =womannotes, how about the regular
    old sexism in mennotes (check out "I'm a girlwatcher" for an example).
    
    	-Ellen

    I didn't mean to start a major controversy.  And insofar as women's
    exams go - we too are prodded up the rectum for similar reasons
    - to see if we're okay on the other side of the wall too.  I am
    sorry you misread me as bashing, I did not intend too, but after
    going in once or twice a year to be lain on a table, and have cold
    metal speculums (speculii) placed inside, being searched and pushed
    and prodded and swabbed, as well as what I mentioned above, I was
    noting that perhaps men do not understand how gentle to be with
    women because they've never been through a thorough female checkup.
    
    And add to this the fact that many women are modest about their
    lower parts, and it takes a pretty gentle politician to put women
    at ease in such an uncomfortable situation.  

    If you would like to describe what a male exam includes beyond what
    I've already read - I'm ready to sympathize.  Also I'd like to know
    how often an adult male needs such a checkup - for me I've been
    told to go in twice a year, although some women only go once a year.
   
    If you feel the need to bash me some more - go ahead - get it off
    your chests if it makes you feel better.  I admit I was curt and
    hasty in my description of the male checkup - but that was not meant
    to be the central focus to my response....the focus was meant to
    be placed on the fact that I wished male GYN's could experience
    what it is like to be a woman having a "thorough" exam so they would
    be more understanding and more gentle.
    
    peace?
    
    -Jody
    
    

    Gad, "thorough exam"?  *SCRRRRRRAAAAPE* (hear pitiful wimper in
    background, perhaps indignant yell if I'm feeling self-confident).
    
    I'm sorry you have to go twice a year, Jody -- so do I and it sucks
    the big wazoo.
    
    BTW I heard the Cambridge Women's Health Center uses plastic speculums
    and wooden stirrups (vicious rumor).  
    
    Lee
    

    
    All doctors, male or female, should keep their nails trimmed if they're
    going to be probing inside any orifices.  I'm not the best at speaking
    up when I'm not pleased, but as a patient you are buying a service!
    Yes, I expect doctors to think of all the nice little things that
    will make me comfortable during a consultation, but not all doctors
    always do that.  Ask your doctor to warm up the speculum or trim
    his/her nails.  And if his/her people skills make you feel like just 
    another hunk of meat, tell him/her so.
    
    I'm not too familiar with what-gets-checked-out-how-frequently on
    the male body.  Perhaps some of you men out there will be willing
    to enlighten me?
                                                        
    CQ

    Get my oil changed every 3000 miles.  Sorry.  No resistance.

    Well, most men should get a physical [complete] every year.
    However, new research has shown [4 out of 5 doctors recommend]
    that men over 40 should be checked for prostate cancer every
    6 months and cholesterol levels every year.  Blood pressure
    should be checked every week if possible and every day if it's  
    a chronic problem.

    I've got no problem/fears about seeing the doctor, except
    for the prostate exam.  Most doctors don't realize how embarrasing
    it is.  I'm not too uncomfortable with the Ol' Nad Squeeze since
    i'm kind of used to it, but a man grabbing the jewels
    still sets me on edge.  Especially if he smiles.  ;-}
    I'll tell you though, when men get their testicals check for 
    testicular cancer, and the doctor squeeze's a nerve in a vein,
    it is similiar to the dentist hitting a vein.  You just want
    to hawl off and belt him.  

    Maybe this is a better topic for MARX::MEDICAL.

    as for fingernails, supposedly these people should be wearing (sorry
    for the graphic nature here) lubricated gloves when they do these
    "intimate" examinations.  I think sharp nails would cut right through,
    and thus should be construed as medically harmful/unsound/whatever.
    
    The one thing that makes it all worthwhile is after the exam, when
    I often hear the words "You're Just Fine".  What a relief.
    
    -Jody
    

    re .14
    
    I missed a lot of slang growing up with no brothers, I guess.
    
    I was glad Christina asked exactly what you were talking about,
    because I wondered as well.  But after reading your explanation,
    I had no clearer idea.  I don't know the slang.
    
    Do most of the other women in this file know these terms?  Michael,
    I'm not criticizing, by the way, I'm just curious.
    
    Holly

    Must be my New Yahk accent getting in the way again.

    You can send me mail if you like?

Well, I just had one of these exams yesterday.  The testicular exam
consists of the doctor gently palpating (squeezing) the testicles to
determine if there are any lumps.  I suspect there is also a visual
examination of the genitals to check for herpes or similar sores.

The prostrate exam consists of the doctor palpating the prostrate
by inserting a lubricated (and latex glove protected) finger in
the anus.  To quote my doctor: it's the least pleasant part of 
the exam for both the patient and doctor.  The doctor then uses
a Hemoclyt test to check for internal bleeding -- an indication of
hemmorroids, ulcers or intestinal cancer.

In the Aids era, I would be very suprised if any medical professional
came near a possible bleeding site without gloves: HCHP even uses
gloves when drawing blood samples.

Martin.

PS: thanks for the explanation of the oven mitts: I had thought they
were padding in case someone bumped into the examination table.

    
    Thanks, Martin.
    
    Good title, too, by the way.
    
    CQ
    

    This isn't exactly an example of suffering but I'll enter it anyway.
    Once a few years back, I had a bad urinary infection.  I was in the
    hospital for some tests.  My doctor said that a urologist would be
    around to see me.  He came in accompanied by a young woman.  He told 
    me to stand up and drop my pants. Then he and the young woman knelt down 
    and started poking around.  He was speaking in medicalese to the woman
    and the woman was trying to look invisible while examining me at the
    same time.  I was a little puzzled by this until I saw the button
    she wore.  It said "Apprentice Plumber".  I realized that she hadn't
    been doing this kind of thing for very long.  When they were done I told
    the woman I liked her button.  She smiled said that one day she would have
    one that said "Master Plumber".  Doctor-types sometimes have a strange
    sense of humor.

    Mike

    That's cute.  Thanks, Mike, for sharing that!
    
              Carol