Conference yukon::christian_v7

         Good topic, Pam
         
         I shall watch with interest as Wendy is just considering the 
         possibility of returning to work, albeit on a very part-time 
         basis, as our 4 year old will be starting full time school i.e. 
         normal school times - each day, in 2 terms time, after Easter.
         
         I may, or may not, extract the replies, depending on which way 
         they go! :-)
         
         Paul

>>
>>     I can do anything through Him who gives me strength. (ref. ?)
>>

PHILIPPIANS 4:13  I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.


/charly

    I am not a mother, but I am a wife and just with that responsibility I
    find working full-time hard enough.  I honestly don't know how working
    mom's do it - especially if the children are young (i.e. - not in
    school yet) - they have all the additional responsibility of getting
    them fed, dressed, etc. that an older child can do for themselves.  
    I feel I don't devote enough time to my husband and the household chores 
    now; I don't know how I would fit child-rearing into the equation at 
    this point in time.  I know many women do it - out of need or desire -
    but many can't help feeling that they are doing too many things and
    none of them well enough.  I think some of that is justified (those
    feelings may be God's way of saying you need to re-examine your
    priorities) but some of it is just "us" (women) putting pressure on
    ourselves to be perfect and think we can handle it all.  More and more
    we realize that we are not SUPERWOMAN!
    
    Both my husband (Steve) and I have been feeling the "pull" for me to
    stay home (or only work part-time) for quite a while - finances have not 
    permitted it to this point, but we are hoping (and planning) that I
    will be able to do so in the near future.
    
    With all of that said, the Word says that His grace is sufficient for
    us and we should only think about today - what does today require of us
    - because tomorrow will take care of itself (and there is no guarentee
    it will even come!)
    
    I'm trying to put that concept into practice myself, trying to live in
    the moment, day by day, appreciating what I have now and not worry
    about the future.  If live in the past or in the future, I have missed
    the present.
    
    Good topic, Pam.
    
    Karen
    

    My wife doesn't work outside the home, but Bill Gilham said something
    that I thought was appropriate.
    
    "When both people work outside the home, there's not women's work,
    there's just work".  
    
    We husbands need to be loving our wives and Christ loved the church.
    
    Bing

      Thanks Bing.  I've never had time for all I want to do --- even
      before I was married, when I was single and working to support
      myself.  Right now, I'm on semi weird side of the equation - 
      my husband was laid off from DEC in June, and I am now (temporarily)
      the one who is at work all day to support us.  I'm a "working Mom"
      only during a few weeks in the summer when my step children live
      with us.  I find myself under an incredible strain then, but its
      partly because its such an abrupt change and it takes a bit of time
      to adapt and make things work.  When we finally begin to work together
      as a family, the kids leave again :-(.  I find I am torn between wanting
      to do it all and wanting to do nothing, not contributing enough and 
      sometimes feeling my husband doesn't contribute enough, and everthing
      in between all these extremes.

      Here are a few things that I think help immensely:

      1) Keeping the importance of things in the proper perspective: not 
         letting something small claim more importance than it has, nor letting 
         something important get short-changed or side-stepped.
      2) balance - between work and pleasure, between social time and alone
         time, and so on
      3) a sense of humor
      4) the willingness to consider others first before yourself, but
         coupled with the recognition that you have limits and needs that are 
         also important and must be met if you are to continue without burnout.
      5) stopping to remember why you married and the good things about your
         marriage and spouse.
      6) spending time in prayer and reading the Word, giving thanks to God 
         in all things, asking Him to guide you and give you wisdom and strength

Leslie

>       <<< Note 547.0 by CSC32::P_SO "Get those shoes off your head!" >>>
>                -< Christian Working Moms - how do you do it? >-

    Pam,

    I can't help you with this one as Cathey has been a homemaker, mom,
    whatever term is currently correct, since Andrea was born.  This was a
    preplanned decision that we prayed about and felt was important for our
    family.  That is not meant to condemn anybody who has chosen otherwise.
    Each family must choose and decide what is best for them.  Because of
    that decision, we prepared as best we could, i.e., Cathey worked full
    time when we got married and she continued to work, we paid off some
    bills and got ourselves in a better financial position in order to
    allow Cathey to stay home.  I realize that this is not possible for
    everybody with today's economy.

    Recently, we learned of a full time secretarial position in the school
    district and considered whether Cathey should apply for it.  She
    currently works a few months out of the year for the school district
    doing hearing and vision screening.  But this is only a limited number
    of hours each week and she is home when Andrea leaves in the morning
    and when she gets home after school.  After discussion and prayer, we
    decided that it would not be a wise decision based on our original
    position of the importance of Andrea having a mom at home when she is
    there.  The additional money certainly could have helped, but not
    enough to offset our decision to ensure Andrea's well-being.

    However, in the case of a working mom, I would hope the husband would
    recognize the struggle that his wife has juggling this kind of schedule
    and do all that he can to assist in the household duties.  When Cathey
    worked, we shared all of the household duties.  In addition, since I
    got home well before she did, I always prepared dinner.  This
    arrangement worked well.  Now that she is a full time mom, she takes
    care of the household chores and such.  I pitch in when necessary and
    this has worked out perfectly for us.

    I have a question, and this is not directed at you, Pam.  It is simply
    a generic question posed to all working moms as well as the dads in a
    household.

    Do you work because you need the income to provide the basic
    necessities of life; food, clothing, utilities?  Or do you work to
    provide the added income necessary to provide other things; new car,
    fancy stereo, big house?  Perhaps a review of priorities is necessary?
    I'm not saying that these things are bad.  Perhaps the desire for these
    things is taking precedence over the _true_ needs of the family.

    I apologize if this comes across wrong.  Many times I fail to convey in
    words what is on my heart and in my brain.  Forgive me if this offends
    anyone.  It is not intended.

    Ron

    P.S.  The "mom" that stays home with the kids could easily be the
    "dad".  If the income level of the dad alone would not support the
    needs of the family but the income of the mom would, then perhaps the
    dad should be the one to stay home.

    Hi Pam... GREAT topic.
    
    I've struggled a lot with this very thing... and I'm a single Mom as
    well.  
    
    God spoke to me very personally about this recently and here is what it
    is... remember this was for *me*, so please read with that in mind. 
    This is not to imply that *you* [anyone] has the same direction from
    God.
    
    1.  I like to do everything... and I mean everything!
    2.  I have a heart for underprivileged/abused children.
    3.  I love the choir, can't get enough of it!
    4.  I love my sunday school class... it fills my soul with spiritual
        satisfaction.
    5.  I love my kids and want to be the best Mom in the whole world.
    6.  I love my home and want it to be immaculate.
    7.  I love my church and want to serve it daily.
    8.  I love my ex and want to be a good witness to him.
    9.  I love my roommates and want to see them accept Christ as Savior.
    10. I love my job, I have the best boss in the whole world and 
        want to always be a 1 performer for her.
    
    get the drift... Nancy pours herself into just about everything she
    takes on in her life.  I love [not like] all those callings that I
    have;
    
    Worker
    Mother
    Teacher       But what's the right order of priority?
    Friend
    Witness
    Soul Winner
    
    I struggled for years with this...
    
    
    

    	While I'm not officially a woman :^)  I think I quite thoroughly
    	understand my wife's position on this, and I would venture to
    	guess that were she writing this her words would closely parallel
    	mine.
    
    	We have chosen to remain a one-income family.  Actually, she has
    	chosen that, and I have supported her decision.  When we had our
    	first child (we had just bought our first house too) she decided
    	6 months into it that she wanted to stay at home.  At the time
    	she was an electro-optics engineer, making more money than I.
    	We scraped by qualifying for the mortgage we had using both
    	incomes, so the loss of the second income (or more accurately
    	the FIRST income) was quite a lifestyle change.
    
    	But we managed -- and in those first years also began tithing,
    	which to me seemed like financial suicide.  Yet we prospered,
    	adding three more children to our family.
    
    	We had to make a conscious decision to accept less in our lives,
    	and in return we believe our kids gain so much more in family
    	interaction.
    
    	Some things we have given up:  Cars.  I drive a 1980 datsun
    	junker, and Linda drives a 1986 station wagon with nearly 100,000
    	miles on it.  We wish we could have the nice minivan like alot
    	of our friends and neighbors do.  TV: We have only one TV, with
    	no cable -- just rabbit-ears, so we get just basic network
    	reception.   Entertainment:  Even a trip to McDonalds is a
    	rarity for us.  Of course that make such a trip a very special
    	event for the kids.  For the 6 of us to eat at McD's it costs
    	over $20.  A home-cooked meal is obviously way less.  And having
    	dinner at home affords us the opportunity for quality family
    	time.  We also RARELY go to movies.  More often we rent from
    	the local video store.  That means that it took the kids quite
    	a while to get to see Home Alone, for instance, while all their
    	friends had seen it several times.  If we do go to the theater
    	we NEVER pay full price (there is a $1.50/show cinema that shows
    	movies after they are no longer first-run).  The only time that
    	we go to a full-price theater is if someone else pays, for instance
    	my parents gave us passes to the theater as a gift.  
    
    	We have less of a house than we would like.  Very-worn furniture
    	that we would love to replace.
    
    	In short, we have decided to live with less to be able to 
    	have mom at home.  What helps us remain content with it is
    	reflecting back on what each of us (Linda and I) had as 
    	children.  Even with our austere lifestyle the "conditions" 
    	we live under today would have made us (and our parents) 
    	envious just 30 years ago.
    
    	From time to time we fall into despair and look for Linda to
    	bring in a second income.  Twice we tried, and both times
    	scrapped the efforts because of the changes they brought to
    	our family.  Those experiences helped us reinforce our resolve.

    
    This last note captured a part of the discussion I and my wife 
    had when preparing for our child.  A second paycheck was not 
    necessary for essentials.  We feel very fortunate that the Lord 
    has provided for us so well that we had a choice to live with 
    but one paycheck.
    
    Otto

    Worker
    Mother
    Teacher       But what's the right order of priority?
    Friend
    Witness
    Soul Winner
    
    Now to what God revealed to me.  If I succeed in all of the categories
    above except being a Mother, I've failed at the most important calling
    God has given me.
    
    If Wife were part of my list [which it isn't], that would be the number
    one calling, Mother clinging very close to it... but remember when the
    children are gone, you are still a wife. :-)
    
    God created the family as the single most important spiritual unit.  If
    you neglect your family for "church service", you're not in the will of
    God.  
    
    This is what God told me... 
    
    

    Update:
    
    Well, I was informed that someone here may be interested
    in switching part-time for full-time shifts.
    
    This would lift a heavy burden
    
    Please pray for me regarding this.
    
    Thank you all so much for your replies so far
    Pam

    
    I think the better question is "why do you do it?" rather than "how do
    you do it?"
    
    jeff

    Why has already been asked. :-) :-)
    
    Some of us *have* to... but many of us choose to... :-(

    Worker
    Mother
    Teacher       But what's the right order of priority?
    Friend
    Witness
    Soul Winner

"Seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness..."

We have the tendency to nod in agreement and then ask, so which of these
helps me to seek the kingdom?  Some of us don't even bother to ask; we simply
think we know that what we do in this area or that must be pleasing to God
because we do good things.

What is the greatest commandment?  "Love God with all..."  Our first priority
is to love God.  Nancy, you said it ealier in another note on relationships.
A couple is not only responsible to be faithful to each other, but also
responsible to be faithful to God, our first Love and the love that binds 
a couple into One Flesh.  This is the fulfillment of life: to love God and 
enjoy his presence forever.   

WHEN this priority is really, truly, and unquestionably first, the order
of worker, mother, teacher, friend, witness, soul winner will rise and
fall in prioirity as it is needed and will be used by the Lord according
to His will.  It is then that the "good things" that we do become good.
Until then, all the "good" things we do are second best.

Mark

Joe (.8)

You may have described us, although we did recently get rid of the old minivan
and finally bought a new one.  We lived for 15 years of marriage with one
"previously owned" after another.  We have some more means, but we still 
do not buy cable TV, go to movies, or similar decisions made by others.
And those who can and do make these choices should realize that they can
often have what others have, but it usually involved trade-off.

You make a good point about CHOICES.  What we choose to do with what we
have available as opportunities.  For some, the choices are severely limited,
such as the single mom with twice the home responsibility.

>    God created the family as the single most important spiritual unit.  If
>    you neglect your family for "church service", you're not in the will of
>    God.
>
>    This is what God told me...

I have thought about this, because I have heard it before.  In the wrong 
context, this can be used as an excuse not to follow Christ:

Matthew
 21  And another of his disciples said unto him, Lord, suffer me first to go
and bury my father.
 22  But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead.

What this disciple was saying was not to attend a funeral, but to wait 
until the time when he felt free from family obligations (in this case 
to his father).  Was Jesus being cruel?

We must stop thinking in terms of binary consequences.  That is, I must
discard or neglect my family, work, church, to follow Jesus, or I must
devote myself to family, work, church in order to follow Jesus.

Instead, as I alluded to in .14, we should be thinking in matters of
priority - and not which one should I put first, but which one should
I put second; the first is clear.  And the promise is that if the first
is in place, the others will fall into place.

Family is important, and it is perhaps the most important spiritual unit,
as Nancy says because the values of the parents are passed down through
the generations and are accepted or rejected based on the familial 
relationship.  But even family is not more important than devotion to God.

One sermon many years ago spoke about Abraham and Isaac, and the preacher
asked if the Lord had our "Isaacs".  I struggled with this.  What would
God want with my dear wife, the most precious thing in the world to me?
After all, wasn't it He who made us One Flesh?  The principle of putting
God first is a continuing process by which the order of all things are
made right - as we journey through life, replete with ups and downs, 
blessings *and* hardships.  In putting God first, I never neglected my
wife nor lost her nor neglected my familial responsibilities.  But if I
put any of these first, I most certainly would neglect the most important
thing, without meaning to, without desire to do so.  We can get so caught
up in running as fast as we can for the Lord that we neglect to see that
we're on a treadmill and going nowhere.  Stop and listen, and let me give
you *and me* a little more advice:

They that wait upon the Lord shall renew their strength;
They shall mount up on wings as eagles.
They shall run and not be weary.
They shall walk and not faint.
Teach me, Lord, to wait.

Mark

    
    Of course some *have* to work.  Those that *choose* to work outside the
    home for material gain or any other reason while children are in the home 
    are missing the mark and doing a great disservice to God, to
    themselves, to their family, and to our nation.
    
    jeff
    
    

    
    
    >Family is important, and it is perhaps the most important spiritual
    >unit, as Nancy says because the values of the parents are passed down 
    >through the generations and are accepted or rejected based on the familial
    >relationship.  
    
    >But even family is not more important than devotion to God.
     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    
    As my Pastor says, "When you have this relationship right, the rest
    falls into place!"  Which is also Mark what you said in your other
    note.
    
    But why is it I know so many who say they believe in Christ, but they
    don't live as though they love Him?
    
    Why is loving God so hard for so many?
    
    
    
    

    .16
    
    Amen Jeff!  You said it right.

    Well,

    We are in the process of "gearing down" our lifestyle. We have trimmed
    much of what would be considered excess. We are trying to sell my
    wife's minivan and buy something "previously owned" so as to bring the
    cost of ownership down...

    As for housework and such... We have teens, so it should be easier,
    right... wrong... We all get so busy that housework falls by the
    wayside. SO, we made a decision to not worry if the wash piles up a bit
    or the vacuuming is left for an extra day.. We also made a choice not
    to friends come by the house without some notice, or not worry if they
    should see the house in (what would seem) disarray....

    Peggy has worked outside the home for most of our married life. Though
    I fail at times, I try to help with some of the household chores such
    as washing, vacuuming, etc. I also do the cooking if I'm home first
    (which is most often the case).

    We continue to whittle away at the extra stuff that cost money and takes
    away from the basics of life. We still have cable TV, but are working
    to get away from that. 

    The toughest part of this process is getting the teens to change their
    lifestyle... When they are use to certain things, they are not always
    willing to do with less, at first... It takes some discussion (sometime
    heated) to turn their thinking around.

    If I might say one thing in support of "the working dad" here... That
    is for "the working mom" to not be overly critical of how dad/husband
    cooks dinner, cleans the cloths, vacuums the floors/rugs, etc... If you
    moms/wives are getting help with housework, done be critical of him
    when he doesn't do it "exactly your way"..... Peggy and I have come to
    this understanding and we find we get along better.

    We are working to get to a point where we only need one income to make
    the bills... We will still both work, but it will be for *extra* stuff
    (not necessarily extravagant stuff). Where our children are nearing the
    time they will be starting to support themselves (about 6 years), we
    are beginning to plan for those years...., keeping in mind that we
    still have them at home and we need to provide for them, first and
    foremost....
    
    It's a tough job, but the Lord will see us through it!
    
    Bob
    

>    But why is it I know so many who say they believe in Christ, but they
>    don't live as though they love Him?
>    
>    Why is loving God so hard for so many?

Immaturity is one answer. Hypocrisy is another answer.  Delusion is
yet another answer.

I'd like to respond to the immature Christian who has trouble with putting
God first, and leave the others for another time.  It is easy for us to see
a person grow through stages of maturity and we don't expect a two-year old
to do the right thing because it is right.  We expect a two-year old to
do the right thing based on reward or punishment, and self satisfaction.
We also know some people who have grown into adults but do act on the
emotional levels of children.  We know of children who act very adult, too.
And we see these emotional levels played out in varying degrees and in
varied circumstances.

The two-year old cannot operate on certain adult levels because it is 
immature (not simply acting immature; big difference).  Capability is a
major factor in how we judge what other people do (to us).  Even the
laws of our government recognises accountability as being a factor 
against the perpetrator of a crime.

Some people are not capable... yet.  A two year old will grow and test limits
and learn, and if guided properly ("in the way he should go") will grow
into a mature and maturely acting adult.  For the Christian who struggles
and fights the "war within my members" between flesh and spirit, there
will be natural "failures" in living.  Baptists should know this better
than others because this seems to be what they preach.  (And on the
other side, preaching the sinless lifestyle seems to set some people
up for a defeatist attitude; "I can't!")  But the reality is between these
two - that one can live a sinless lifestyle called holiness and sanctification,
and during this process have "failures" in living.  I don't want to go further
on this tangent, because it would take another 60 lines.

Some people are capable, but are immature [acting].  They know that God calls
them to higher living, but reject it as unnecessary because they believe
that they have met the Minimum Daily Requirements of Christainity: sometimes
expressed as growing up in a Christian home, other times as confession or
mere claims of knowing Jesus.  "Why struggle to improve or rise in wisdom,
compassion, the fruit of the spirit, or anything of God that might cause 
me discomfort when I've met the minimum requirements of confession that 
Jesus is my Lord and Savior?  I believe it as fervently as anyone."

A two-year old can dress up in big clothes and hop in the car, but with
tragic results.  "And what's wrong with remaining a two-year old, after all it
is still life."  What parent is not concerned when "normal" progress of 
growth is not happening to their child?  What happens when a child of 
five still looks like a child of two?  Something is tragically wrong, and 
everyone knows it.

Loving God requires the struggle for the Throne of one's heart; the struggle
of who will be king.  The seed of sin, disobedience and rebellion, is planted
within us and by our fleshly NATURE we are self-centered.  It is not easy to
give up sovereingty to another unless we recognize that we have made a mess
of it ourselves, or that someone else can manage it better, (and even then
is it ever easy?).  We still attempt to invent dual steering wheels so that
God can be our "Co-pilot" instead of our Authority.  It is sad to think that
Jesus does step off our thrones voluntarily, anytime we want it back.  He
allows us to take control again, you know.  And perhaps that's part of growing
up, too, seeing that we still make a mess of it when we think we're mature
enough to handle the situation.

Always keep the first thing first and the second thing will be second IN LIGHT
OF why and how the first thing is first.

Mark

    >    But why is it I know so many who say they believe in Christ, but they
    >    don't live as though they love Him?
    >    
    >    Why is loving God so hard for so many?
    
    I think another reason could be that the person hasn't fully
    assimilated God's love for them.  1 John 4:19 says that we love because
    He first loved us (we can't even love God without first receiving His
    love for us).  Paul prays for the Ephesians in Eph 4 that they may be
    strengthened with power through His Spirit.  Why?  So that they can
    understand the breadth and length and height and depth of His love for
    them (and you & I).  A friend of mine has a saying, "until we realize how
    deeply Christ loves us, we will never fully trust Him".
    
    Christianity can many times become a list of do's and don'ts.  It can
    become a very external thing.  If Christianity becomes JUST a set of
    principles it can become drudgery.  When our focus is on the external,
    instead of Christ who dwell within, we can easily lose our joy.  The church 
    at Ephesus had become that way.  They were doing lots of good things, but 
    they had lost their first love (Rev 2:1-4).  Christianity is based on 
    relationship and its only by abiding in Christ that we can experience
    the joy the Lord wants us to have.   Only when we rest in Him, can we
    know true rest.   When we focus in on Jesus, the things of the earth
    grow strangely dim.
    
    
    Love in Him,
    
    Bing

    Worker
    Father
    Teacher       But what's the right order of priority?
    Friend
    Witness
    Soul Winner

  When do I stop being a father to be a teacher, or stop being a husband to
  be a friend?  In truth, I am all these things at once and not one of
  these things at a given time.  To be sure, certain circumstances call for
  me to be one more than the other at times (priorities), but it is very
  important to note that we generally have the capacity for multiple traits
  coexisting within us.  We even can have a "mixture" of emotional
  responses to events; I prefer to think of them as coexisting, as opposed
  to a blending of responses (I can be angry and still love the person at
  whom I am angry).

  This is not unique to Christianity, but common to all humanity.
  Christianity is an added dimension to the coexistence of traits; a
  dimension that moderates and modifies the others because it is
  over-arching.  What I am affects what I do.  Doing is an expression;
  action is borne out of attitude.  Therefore, by >being< a Christian, I am
  a Christian father, Christian worker, Christian teacher, and so on.  All
  that I am is wrapped up in Christ.

Mark

    Mark,
    
    There is a time dimension to this.  I agree that the Lord is our #1
    priority.  If we abide in Him and listen to Him, Christ will show us
    where we need to be spending our time.
    
    I think what Nancy was referring to was that its wrong to have to be at
    the church everytime the doors are open and alienate your family at the
    same time (in other words church is not equal to God).  Many pastors have 
    been guilty of this, they neglect their family in order to run the church. 
    Its true that we wear different hats, but we wear them at different times.  
    How will my kids know that I love them, and allow the Lord to love them, if
    I don't spend time with them?  I have heard it said, that kids spell love-
    " T - I - M - E ".
    
    Love in Him,
    
    Bing

I am fully aware of the time factor.  My oldest daughter at fourteen and a 
half reminds me of it daily.

>    its wrong to have to be at
>    the church everytime the doors are open and alienate your family at the
>    same time (in other words church is not equal to God).

Correct: church is not equal to God.  And further correct, some pastors
have abused this with their families and with the congregation as well.

However, it is best when your family is part of the spiritual happenings.
It is not a binary situation where going to church will alienate your family
or not going to church will produce the quality time you need with your
family.  In fact, it is not as simple as combining the two, (on the surface).

Some people use "quality time" to excuse themself from church service.
And perhaps they should be excused because they have probably missed the
point of going.  Perhaps they are going out of habit, or brownie points,
or whatever - I've been accused of going to church at the expense of the
occasional get together with friends for just such things.  There is a
best purpose for going to church, and there is a best purpose for spending
time with your family, and there is a best purpose for everything we do
within the constraints of time.  When God is put first, it doesn't really
slow down the clock, does it?  (Actually for me, it speeds up because I
enjoy so much that I know I'm missing a lot - can't do it all in the amount
of time I have.)  I was careful to submit that Christianity is NOT about
doing BUT ABOUT BEING and out of this will come what is right to do, which
may include that quality time with the family... at church.  ;-)

Mark

    > I was careful to submit that Christianity is NOT about
    >doing BUT ABOUT BEING and out of this will come what is right to do,
    
    Absolutely!!  As Dr. Walker (of Mt. Paran Church) says, "Amen, Amen,
    and Amen!".
    
    Love in Christ,
    
    Bing
    

    re: last
    
    yes, this is how I understood Nancy's note also.
    
    As in all things, we need to find the balance; keeping in mind that
    what might be a balance for us (i.e. going to church 3x/week) may not 
    be for someone else (1x/week).  We need to do as we are each convicted
    in our hearts to do, by Him.  And if we are not doing as we should, He
    will deal with us in His way, in His time (although I do recognize
    situations where it would be appropriate for a member of the church to
    intervene/rebuke.)  He has given each of us different
    callings, different ways to minister.  I have run into people trying
    to put their "conviction" ("The Lord told ME....") on me, on the church 
    body, etc. - when in fact it was meant just for them.  Oh, that we 
    would stop worrying about the splinter in our brothers eye and take care 
    of the 2x4 in our own!
    
    Karen 

    my last entry (.26) was meant to reference .23 - a few people are
    quicker than me :-)
    
    Karen

    Well Bing, you hit the nail on the head for me.
    
    If my Sunday School Class kids get more of me than my own children,
    then what have I accomplished???
    
    I've failed.
    
    You see while I may spend "time" with my children... how often do I
    truly put on the "teacher" hat with them?  I've seen young girls lives
    changed as the Spirit of God used this poor vessel in teaching His
    Truths... and yet I have discipline problems with my kids.
    
    1.
    I need to be a "Spiritual Mom" before I'm a "Spiritual Teacher"...  God
    has given me my audience... my children.
    
    2.
    Teaching is not wrong, as along as the children's schedules are kept. 
    For instance, I don't sing in the choir except on special occasions
    because of the rehearsal time.  I WORK outside the home and spend
    enough time away from them.
    
    Therefore, the same follows suit now for teaching a Sunday School
    class.  My church now require that each teacher spend Saturday door
    knocking to their student's homes.
    
    As a WORKING outside-the-home Mom, who irons my kids clothes, who
    washes them and keeps the house clean????
    
    Who COOKS those special meal that create memories... who makes
    memorable moments.
    
    Being a CHRISTIAN mother entails more than just a "feeling" of
    spiritual euphoria.. it requires commitment;  of TIME, ENERGY and LOVE.
    
    
    

    Mark, you hit the nail on the head too!
    
    :-)
    
    How you might ask?
    
    Because it is important the your children also see you in SERVICE to
    God.  Anything that you can do to serve God, whether it be cook a meal
    for a needy family/person, babysit an hour for a young Christian couple
    who needs some special time together, or even do some yard work for an
    elderly church couple or neighbor will show to your children Christian
    acts of service.  Anything that your child can either do with you or be
    with you is an excellent way to serve God until they grow a little more
    and have their own "church activities". :-)
    
    Nancy

> Title:  Try Doing it All... it's difficult

No one... no one says you have to do it all.  The Bible tells us that
we *have to do >one< thing*: love God... and the rest falls into place.
If we've become so busy, don't ask "am I neglecting my kids, my free time,
my service to Mrs. Jones, etc."  Rather ask, "is what I am doing putting
God first, or do I just _think_ that by doing what I am doing, I am doing 
what God wants me to do?"  (And by the way, DO NOT answer this question 
for yourself.  Allow God to respond.  Perhaps if you've been too busy
doing this or that, God may say, "I was wondering when you'd slow down
for a moment to spend some time on our relationship."  Or He may say,
"What you are doing pleases Me, and I will give you strength to continue."
Or He may say, "I want you to continue doing what you're doing, but I
never asked you to do these other things."

You see, the danger for the Christian who is trying to do it all, or is
tired of some things, or whatever, is that it is used as an excuse to dismiss
that which God DOES want us to do and is pleased with.  Every one of us
has spiritualized some reason to do as we please, "because that's the way
I feel God wants it" and it is little more than rationalization.  It is
as if we have 10 tasks and can perform only 5, so we rationalize which
5 we ought to be doing instead of asking God which 5 we ought to be doing.

Mind you, I believe God has given us talents for a reason and that some
people will not be happy in teaching, but will be very happy in ushering.
What I am saying is that sometimes we are prone to give up or neglect
some things because they are no longer easy or comfortable.  It may be
time to move on, or it may be time to grow (shift gears).  How do you know
which, unless you ask the One who orders our lives?

When you say, "I don't have to do this to be a Christian" you may be 
perfectly right, but out of what spirit is this declaration made?
Why do you do the things you do?  Why do you go to church 1x or 3x 
a week?  Why do you teach a Sunday School class?  Why do you sing in 
the choir?  Why are you a Christian?

I think some of the initial answers are okay for initial Christians,
but sooner or later, the "why" will cause every Christian to examine
ourselves, our motives, and what we do, and we will squirm a bit
at the crossroads of Christian growth.

Mark

    
    Bob Grover,
    
    You are doing the right things.  I applaud your efforts!!!
    
    jeff

    >    But why is it I know so many who say they believe in Christ, but
    they
    >    don't live as though they love Him?
    >
    
    Even Satan believes in Christ...he just doesn't believe Him.
    
    Another something recently shared with me....
    
    If you are not attending church because you don't want to be surrounded
    by hypocrites...imagine what your eternity will be like.
    
    -s
    

    
    
    I just had a meeting with my manager and it looks like I
    will begin working part time this week.  The Lord as answered
    my prayers once again.  Praise God!  I will finally be able
    to help my family financially but also have the time, energy,
    and patience to be the kind of wife and mother He wants me 
    to be.
    
    He's so good to me!  Thank you Father!
    
    Pam

    Pam, Praise God!!! Hugs Sis, I hope that doesn't mean we'll see you
    less. :-(  
    
    Love ya,
    Nancy

    Probably won't be seeing a LOT less of me - I do have a terminal
    at home and log in every once in a while after Nathan goes to
    be and before J. gets home from work.  
    
    I'll still be around 4 hours a day.  This file is about the
    only thing that is keeping me from quitting outright! 
    Shhhh don't tell anyone I said that!

    Me too!  I will start working part-time (half days) starting on
    Monday the 12th.  This will enable me to spend more time with
    my children and to be more of a keeper of the home fires (if you
    understand what I mean?).  I have been trying to work something
    like this out for about a year (thinking of working at home,
    quitting work altogether, etc.) and it has finally come to 
    fruition -- in His time!  
    
    Sherril     
    

    Sherril (hope I spelled that right)
    
    Congratulations!  I feel so 'lucky' that we are able to get my with
    my check at 1/2 of what it was.  I will have to be a good steward
    with what I do have though.  Time to get serious about those
    coupons.
    
    I will not be spending more time with Nathan because he will
    be in school but when he comes home I will have had 1 1/2 hours
    to my self to spend on Bible study and prayer time.  I will
    be a different person that who I am now when he gets home from
    school.
    
    Have a wonderful time and rejoice in the Lord for supply
    all our needs!
    
    Pam

    Pam & Sherrill-
    
    Rejoicing with you in the blessings of our Father!
    
    Karen

    
    Marvelous!  God bless you!!!
    
    jeff