Conference vmsnet::hunting$note:hunting

    
    The $475 is just the license right? What about the rest? Is this
    through some sort of outfitter, or is it a bunch of guys drive/fly
    out there, meetup and hike into the mountains?
    
    Just lookign for some guess on total $$$$$, sounds tempting either
    way!
    
    --Bob
    

    Since I haven't heard from anyone else, I'm sending the applications in
    tomorrow at noon.  Only way to get on board is to call prior to noon
    EST.  I've deleted all the other replies, except the two that were not
    mine.  sort of like cleaning house, what?
    
    After tomorrow this one goes also.
    

    I have just received my license from montana!! Hurray!!!!!!
    I have hunted in Montana Twice and have done well One elk and 4 deer.
    If you are selected you can apply for special hunts. I always do.
    Farmers in Montana like you to come and ask permision to hunt.  In the 
    Northern part of the state there are lots of area's ofBLM land to hunt.
    I love to hunt in the glasgow area.  I hunt geese (millions of em),
    pheasant, Sharp tail, ducks, White tail deer, There are also Mule Deer
    to be had in fort peck area.  A special hunt for Elk in and arount the
    Fort Peck Wildlife refuge is also worth the effort.  It getts
    realllllly cold so dress warm.
    Joe 

    me too..........
    
    guess mike hohwy and i are going afterall
    
    yahoo!
    

    I'm jealous.  I wanted to go so bad.  Just couldn't make it though. 
    Perhaps next year?  Take plenty of pictures, guys.  I got the hunting
    photo album with recent photos in it.  Who needs it next?  
    
    bob
    

    Where are you going to hunt and when...
    I am working on locations,  I am going with a guy from here and one
    from wisconson...  maybe we will see each other in the state...
    joe

    we have big game combo's that start the 23rd of Oct.  We plan for the
    wilderness area and have not decided between Cabinets or Bob Marshall
    Wilderness reserve.  It might be neat to join up if you are planning
    this area or time.
    
    

    dont forget to apply for antlerless bow hunts in sept.
    They are well worth the extra bucks..
    I plan to by an over the counter antelope (antlerless) tag for $50.00
    There are millions of em running all over the state.
    I have also put in for Antlerless Mule deer tags.
    I will be able to buy a B tag for white tail antlerless over the
    counter for 50.00..
    
    If you have goose decoys bring em.  The numbers of birds in montana are
    so high its ammazing...
    
    Also I think that Pheasant and Sharptail will be in season during your
    hunt.
    
    JOe

    Just a reminder...
    Special hunt tags must be in the mail to be in Billings on June 1st.
    I sent out for doe tags for deer and cow tags for elk.
    If you need the paperwork, you will have to call montana dept of
    wildlife.  The price was $9.00 for the application for these tags.
    Joe "Im tuning the bow for the show" Melendez

    Joe, enter your "date's and places"  we might be in the saem vicinity". 
    so far we are still vacillating in a spot in the Bob Marshall
    Wilderness around 10/5 and the Cabinet's about two weeks later.
    
    Regards,
    

    WE ARE PLANNING TO GO TO MONTANA IS SEPT. FOR BOW SEASON.
    WE WILL HUNT THE WISDOM AREA N/W MONTANTA FOR ELK...
    WE WILL RETURN IN OCT. FOR RIFLE SEASON. MAYBE INTO THE FT. PECK
    AREA N/E MONTANA... THERE ARE A LARGE NUMBER OF ANTELOPE IN THIS AREA
    AND THERE ARE LOTS OF DOE TAGS FOR $40 BUCKS.  WE HAVE APPLIED FOR
    SPECIAL HUNTS IN THE FOLLOWING AREAS.
    ZONE632-03 ELK EITHER SEX FORT PECK AREA
    ZONE 321 ELK EITHER SEX WISDOME
    ZONE 329 ELK EITHER SEX NORTH OF YELLOWSTONE 
    FOR DEER WE HAVE ASKED FOR SPECIAL TAGS IN ONE OF THE FOLLOWING:
    ZONE 632 FORT PECK (THERE ARE LODES OF DEER HERE)
    ZONE 630 FORT PECK (SAME THING)
    ZONE 631 FORT PECK (SAME THING) FORT PECK IS A NATIONAL WILDLIFE REF.
    THE COST TO APPLY IS $3.00 FOR THE DEER TAGS AND $6.00 FOR THE ELK
    TAGS. 
    I WILL KNOW BETTER WHEN WE WILL BE GOING AS WE GET CLOSER TO THE
    SEASON.  THE MORE SNOW THE BETTER. WATCH THE WEATHER CHANNEL.  ALSO AS
    A HAM I CARRY WEFAX EQUIPMENT OUT TO THE FIELD SO I CAN GET UPTODATE
    WEATHER INFO WHILE IM HUNTING.  THIS HAS BEEN USED TO MOVE TO A
    LOCATION WHERE THE HUNTING MIGHT BE BETER DUE TO BAD WEATHER...
    JOE

    I have just recieved a tag for Elk Either sex in the Fort Peck Wildlife
    Refuge... It is for Archery Only but what a break, am going to try for
    the rut and see what I can get..
    
    Good hunting
    Joe

    Two steps from the truck begins the climb.  This caught me by surprise
    and left me behind the curve on the oxygen budget.  We are at 7500ft at
    4am on the last morning in the Gallatins.  I have seen one Elk all week
    ant that was a cow. Thursday's Mule deer tempered my remorse, but it
    was elk I was after and why I was here. At 4am, in 10deg weather,
    facing the hunt's most fearsome climb.
    
    Grandpa's rock is on the windward side of the mountain. The resident
    herd crosses the windswept slope from left to right on their way to
    daytime bedding.  They do this about 8000ft, just above the tree line
    and for only about 40min just after dawn.  You cannot get at them from
    below.  The wind sweeps up the slope and therefore puts you upwind in
    your approach.  The only way is to climb the leeward slope and go over
    the top.  You drop downslope from the ridgeline (8750) about 50yds to
    the rock which justs out from the 50deg slope like a turret on a
    castle. Quite a snipers perch.  And two and a half hours away. 
    Shooting light starts at 6:40am.
    
    Friday had been a complete bust.  10deg weather and 60mph winds. 
    Nothing moving anywhere.  Too bad.  Thursdays change in weather had
    finally driven the herds down to altitudes you could reach and still
    get back at night.  The lions had come too.  Saw two tracks on the
    morning I got my Muley buck.  One was five inches across.  Big, big
    cat.
    
    I am hurting now.  We have ceased the sidehill work and are attacking
    the slope head on.  So much for being in shape.  Guess running 3-4
    miles a day at 630ft isn't going to get it.  I stop and doff the jacket
    and the quilted flannel shirt.  That goes in the backpack and the
    jacket get tied around the waist.  My super light TCR defies physics by
    gaining in weight as we go up.  It now weights 26lbs. I would bet on it.
    
    I fall again. It is the third time in as many steps. The left thigh is
    gone.  Won't take the weight anymore. This lights the flame of anger
    and I let that feed on the adrenaline dumped in. I jump up and stride
    up the hill in fury.  The rush passes and I realize its time to stop. 
    To my amazement and theirs, I have just passed both guides. Mike (the
    leader) is showing Larry (the newbie) the way.  That's why I have two
    guides for one hunter. 
    
    Mike asks, "What time?". Larry answers, "6am." Can that be true? have
    we been on this infernal slope for two hours?  It seems that this would
    be a Montanan version of hell.  To climb an unending slope forever.  But
    two hours? I'm whipped but it seems like forty minutes max. 
    
    We push on. I do mean push.  I am using my arms to augment my thigh
    muscles by pushing down on my knees to leverage up each new step. The
    guides do not want to stop but they do.  I sense time is getting away
    from us, because of me.  I am not climbing this damn mountain to let
    teh Elk go to bed before I get there, so I dig deep and find all that's
    left.  Each time they stop I hoarsely whisper, "Go ahead." We keep on
    climbing. The sweat has run of my head and has formed icicles hanging
    from my hair. My shirt is wringing wet and I am steaming like a hard
    run horse but we finally do get there.
    
    Just short of the ridge line, I stop and open the pack.  I doffed the
    wet shirt and change into the dry one stowed earlier and then put my
    jacket back on. And the head gear, after removing the icicles. I check
    the barrel and remove the snow from the brake. Load up and on safe. We
    are ready and dawn is just breaking when we step out on the rock.
    
    We cannot see a thing. Fifty yards away the world ends and then its ten
    yards.  A snow squall.  Despair flares brightly, could this be hell
    after all.  I cannot think of the climb down right now.  I relax in
    mindless exhaustion.  The wind is in my face at 10-12 knots and snow is
    falling every where. Silence abounds.
    
    Oooouuueeeeiiiittt! What in hell was that?  Sounded like a damn whale
    call.  Further away it is repeated.  Mike leans my way and whispers,
    "Cow call."  They are here! The the back edge of the squall sweeps over
    us and we can see 1/2 mile.  The next squall is headed in and we have
    about five minutes of visibility.  There are elk everwhere.
    
    more in part 2
    

    The lead cow eyeballs us from 200yds down slope.  We are nervous but
    are pretty sure she cannot see us.  Four more cows come into her
    clearing then two spikes. A raghorn is visible bhind this group and
    then another ten-fiftenn cows and....wow! there is a big four point.
    
    The next squall sweeps in and covers it all.  We cannot see beyond
    twenty or thirty years.  Now the calls come from all around us. 
    Perhaps eight or nine cow elks talking back and forth.  It is quite
    eerie.  This cannot be the resident herd. That herd numbers only 600
    animals in the entire basin.  We have about 120 Elk in front of us and
    such a concentration would be unheard of.  It can only be the advance
    group of the migration from Yellowstone.  Yesterday's weather drove
    them out. It has to be this. That means 10,000 more on the way in the
    next few days.  
    
    The squall passes.  The elk are still with us.  The four point is not
    visible, but the raghorn still is.  I do not have a shot. I would have
    to stand up to clear the stone in front of me and I'm not about to do
    that. The Spike's are overlapped on some cows. Cannot take that shot.
    The .416 would surely pass through. Mike nudges me.  "five point!"
    There he is about 330yd down slope.  A large four point just in front. 
    Just as I sight the next squall seeps over them blocking them from view. 
    Soon it covers us as well. But the clearing periods are longer and the
    squalls are shorter.
    
    Within a few minutes, it clears again.  The Four point is still there
    and there is a large animal directly behind him with his head down,
    feeding. I swing the rifle to the left and line up behind the shoulder. 
    "Is that the five point?", I ask Mike.  "Wait til he lifts." Mike
    replies. The Elk feeds forever. This is the shot that justifies the
    .416. A Barnes 325gr X bullet at 300+yds will do the job without a
    doubt. "I can take the four point.", I whisper to Mike. "Wait." is his
    reply.
    
    Another squall sweeps in and they are gone from view again. In a few
    minutes it clears again but my quarry is gone.  Both the five and four
    point bulls are no longer in sight. "They are coming left to right.
    they are likely to show up below us." , Mike offers.  I sense his
    regret.  If this week had taught us anything, it is that you get one
    chance. Don't blow it.  The raghorn proves this rule by being the
    exception.
    
    He steps out between two pines 250yds directly below us. He is
    broadside on.  In my 4x scope he looks like a bison.  This is one big
    animal. I decide and look at Mike. He nods. It is done.  I set the
    trigger, center the crosshair just behind the shoulder, down a little
    (3.4" high on a 45deg down shot.) and caress the trigger. The TCR slams
    back as the big 325gr bullet is launched. The bulls head comes up with
    a snap....and......and.......nothing!
    
    I missed! Not possible! Not at this range. Not on a target as big as a
    damn house. I dig for the second round in my right pocket. Load up and
    set the trigger. Same point of aim. Again....BOOMMM! The bull continues
    to stare up the hill as if nothing had happened.  I look to Mike, "Can
    you see fall of shot?" He shakes his head. I am in shock. I go to the
    left pocket and remove both rounds giving one to Mike and loading the
    second. I am rattled now.  I squeeze the set trigger and think I have a
    misfire. Break the action again and figure it out. then set the trigger
    again and decide "High or low?" Well the Tasco scope did have a tendancy
    to jump high when adjusting. So aim low. I sight with the horizontal
    crosshair just below the belly and touch it off. BOOOMM! Yes! the bull
    turns and dashes downhill about 20yds and stops. Hit? Can't tell.
    
    Mike says, "Hit him again." I ask if he is carrying. He says no. I tell
    him he is holding my last shot. "What! You only brought four?" I don't
    bother to explain that I thought four of anything in .416 was three
    more than you might ever need. Today I have been very wrong about that.
    I am faced with a choice. Shoot again and lose all chance of finishing a
    wounded bull. Or don't shoot and lose out completely.  
    
    I did not shoot. The bull joined up with the herd and the group trotted
    off. We did not find any blood. We tracked the herd for 1/2 mile to be
    sure.  I missed completely. On the way back and while angling down the
    hill (Larry went down the far side to bring around the rig.), we did
    find my three shots in an eight inch pine about 350yds downslope.  Two
    about three inches apart and one about forty inches lower.  Definately
    the rifle is not shooting where it is pointed.
    
    So I get three of the four shots our entire hunting party had at
    standing Elk all week and blow it. A test at the ranch finds my .416
    hitting nine inches high and three left at 100yd.  The scope has failed
    to retain zero.  The Lesson? Equipment, Equipment, Equipment.
    
    When it counts, money talks.  No $100 scope is worth betting a $4000 elk
    hunt on.  Either the recoil from the deer taken on Thursday or one of
    my thirty odd falls up the mountain did it and me in. Am I sad. No! No
    way! It was a great hunt and I had the perfect shot.  I know that Elk
    was mine.  And I learned the lesson.  Count on it!
      

    You have a much better disposition than I have.
    
    Ken

    I would ship the scope back to Tasco with 10lbs of dog s$&*t.
    
    
    Loved the story though.
    
    Wess

    Everybody tells me to ship it back. But I decided the garbage truck was
    the best place.  You see, if they fixed it, my Scot heritage would
    insist that I could not dispose of a perfectly good scope.  And then
    any rifle I took out hunting would so undermine my confidence....You
    can see the logic right?
    
    Better its dead and buried as is.  I will never forget the view through
    the scope in Montana.  I can just look forward to the time when It will
    be repeated.  And it will.
    
    You know the TASCO on my 45/70 Contender is a fine piece.  It goes
    where you direct, and stays there afterward forever.  MY guide and I
    were busting cans with that monster after the hunt was over. We went
    out to 100yds and could still do it.  But it is a $200 PRO Class scope.
    I guess TASCO puts the good stuff in those and puts junk in the junk.
    
    Joel even shot a better group with the Burris 2-7x posilock.  In fact
    his group with that was smaller than the group he shot with Mike
    Hohwy's mod70 270 that Corky accurized. That's on my 6.5JDJ.  I knew I
    made a hit with that when he tore off the group from the target and
    folded it up in his wallet with the comment, "Aint no one gonna believe
    this."
    
    Glad you like the story.  I almost gave up on that hill.  But I doubt I
    would ever consider doing so again. (giving up) The real reward for
    perserverance was greater than the one I imagined to keep me going. How
    many times does that happen in life.
    
    

    	You oughta at least write them a letter telling them what
    	you think of their scope and show them where you disposed
    	of it.
    
    	They can't make things better if they think everyone is
    	satisfied.
    
    	Scott

    I thought about that for a while.  But a bitch letter without the scope
    for them to look at is not fair play.  And really, how could we expect
    them to make it "better" and keep the price where it was ($94).  Nope,
    I got what I paid for.  The error is all mine. And that is the lesson.
    
    Don't put a cheap scope on a magnum rifle. Don't put a cheap scope on a
    long range (more than 100yd) firearm. For expensive guided hunts, take
    only the best possible stuff. Every bit of my kit is top notch, except
    that scope.  Sort of like a chain.....weak link theory?
    
    When the Leupold died on the .416, I send it back and raised hell (but
    that was $450 scope). Same when the Burris Compact caved in. Both
    companies really came through.  Burris even upgraded their QA program
    by increasing the force on the recoil machine to equal a .416 and then
    ran my scope through 2000 cycles before pronouncing it fit.  The letter
    they sent back specifically said "tested and approved for .416 Rem
    Mag."
    
    The Burris was on my 7mmSTW and the .416 was supposed to be a back up. 
    But a MAJOR chamber problem on the 7mmSTW that evidenced just five days
    before Montana time killed the primary.  I did not have time to switch
    scopes and sight in (at least I told myself that).
    
                                                           

Ahhh Gi'day...�

    Well, I  don't  like  spending  a  lot  of money on scopes that I would
    rather spend on another toy, but I learnt about Tascos a long time ago.

    I couldn't keep them zero'd on a Mini-30 let alone an anti-tank weapon.

    Read the new Guns&ammo articles on large bore magnums. Seems scoping is
    a bit of problem for everyone. Professionals too! One guy shot at a
    lion and the scope flew off.  Then the lion charged! O boy.
    
    Another shot at ram hit and the ewe next to her.  

    Still another told a story of a deal of a scope that just never stays
    put.  Sounds exactly mine.  All recommended at least 100 rounds through
    befor trusting the optics to a hunt.
    

    should have bought a Weatherby its right on every time...
    joe

    Time to get those Montana Tags is comming up soon.
    I will be hunting in the western part of the state near MONIDA.
    Two years ago, there were many deer, and elk here, Apply for a cow tag
    and you will get ELK.
    
    If the rummers are true that the tag is going to go up to $860.00
    I plan to take a picture of my exposed rump to be mailed to the
    Director of the Fish and Wild life department.
    A caption of Bite me who do you think i am kevin Kosner

    The Wife tells me that the Montana Regs are out for 1997 season.
    Have em at the house now.  Looking forward to the pick, I have
    preference since I didnt get picked last year.
    I can smell the Elk in MonIda, fevers up.
    Any North American Hunting Club members, The Convetion is in Las Vegas
    next week, see you there! 
    Joe"noseem"but i know hes there!  

    Hi gang,
    I have sent out my request for tags for Montana,
    Just a note, New REGS dont let you hunt mule deer in the 
    whole state, no the tags are issued by zones.
    I will be hunting in area 6 20 miles east of MONIDA.
    $475 for ELk and deer.
    Cant Wait
    Joe

    Dont Forget to get your Montana request for tags in the Mail the
    date is March 15 for the drawing, time is running out.
    Call (406) 444 2950 for information on getting a fax of the forms
    or having them mailed to you..
    See Ya there
    Joe

    Have the tags in my wifes hands, deer'l be elk to pay in montana this
    year anyone else going to montan this year?
    Joe