Conference vmsnet::hunting$note:hunting

    
    Jerry,
    
              I'm not sure if the note is in this file or the FIREARMS file
    but this subject was discussed. When zeroing a variable powered scope
    you use the highest setting in this case 9x. I zero my rifles 2" high
    at 100 yards on 9x and have no problems what so ever.
    
                                                              Guy
    

                     <<< Note 813.1 by SALEM::PAPPALARDO >>>

Guy,

I'm not questioning my scope's setting.  What I am saying is that I
deceived myself into thinking that my target was closer than it actually
was because I was looking at a sight picture at 9x but unconsciously relating 
it to a sight picture at 4x.  If someone changes from a fixed to a variable, 
they should keep this in mind.  

Jerry

    	You didn't mention what you're shooting and the range.  Ballistics
    for 30-06 with 150 gr bullet put you dead on at 200 yards, 8+ inchs low
    at 300 when you've sighted in 2" high at 100.  If the deer where about
    300 yds, you had similar ballistics and you put the hairs just over his
    back, you should have nailed him.  You're maybe right in saying you
    misjudged the range because the deer appeared larger than you were
    used too.
    
    	I use a 1 1/2 X 4 variable on my deer rifle but most of my hunting
    is in thick cover in Maine - rarely get a long shot. I wouldn't be
    without my rig.
    
    Andy

    Re .1
    I've never heard that when using a vari-power scope one should
    zero on the highest power. Why is this? One of my hunting rigs
    has a 3X9 and if there's a better way, I'd love to know about it.
    
    Also, that same scope has a Bullet Drop Compensator on it. Does
    this have a bearing on the highest power issue?
    
    Thanks,
    Bill

>    I've never heard that when using a vari-power scope one should
>    zero on the highest power. Why is this? 

	I think that using the higher magnification you'll be more
	able to see any deviations in your sighting and be able
	to more accurately dial in your loads.

	I use 3X9s on my rifles for deer/elk/varmiting in Colorado.
	
	AA

    
    Being fairly new to scoped rifles (I'm an old iron-sighter
    from the dense brush of New England), I had put in a fair
    amount of time shooting my new elk rifle that I topped with
    a Leupold 3X9. I sighted the gun in at 9X and practiced with
    different settings, I figgered I was ready for anything.
    
    What I found was that in the shooting situations that presented
    themselves, I had virtually no time to change the scope setting.
    I shot my animals at 3X......I suppose it is nice to have to
    ability to change settings, but I might as well have had a 4X for
    this trip!
    
    DAP
    

    Trade your gun in on a .300 Mag, sight dead on at 300 yards and you
    will never have to worry about how much to hold over or under. If you
    can get the cross hairs on it you will hit it, unless you are one lousy
    shot. Then get a shotgun and don't shoot unless you see the whites of
    their eyes.
    
    Good luck.

    re:.7
    
    300 mag!! hell the guys already using a .338 mag, they don't come much
    better than that!
    
    300 mags are for sissy's ;^)
    
    Fra_who's_currently_building_a_300H&H 
    

    
    
    	What's the hold over, in a 300 Win Magnum, at 100 yards 
    	to achieve a zero point at 300 yards?  
    
    	My 'new' Winchester Magnum shoots 10 inches high at 100 yards 
    	using Remenington factory loads (150 grain).  It has a 4X12 
    	Tasco scope on it and is very accurate vertical wise.  I'm 
    	thinking that it was built to handle very long range targets.  
    
    	I'm planning to swap the wide angle 4X Redfield scope off my 
    	.222 and replace it with the 4X12 Tasco.  
    
    
    
    							Kelly
    
    	

    The trajectory for a 300 Win Mag should be no more than 3" (approx) 
    at 100 yards to achieve a 300 yard zero...  10" high???
    
    This is with the 180 grain pill.
    
    Fra
    

    Three inches at 100 yards sounds about right, I'll digg up the
    ballistic charts tonight and double check. I have a 3X9 Bushnel on my
    Model 70. I had a lower power scope on it before and found it hard to
    make those 300 to 400 yard shots with it. So it depends on how far you
    plan to shoot on the average. The 4X should be good enough up to 200
    yards on deer size targets. Personally I prefer the higher
    magnification.
    
    Les

    
    
    	Thanks for the replies!  
    
    	I'm thinking that a flat shooting rifle, such as the 300 Win 
    	magnum, or the 270 Win magnum, will not need the extra 
    	magnification of a varible scope because the killing zone 
    	will be impacted within pratical ranges up to +300 yards.  I'm 
    	also wondering how many hunters have the chance to adjust the 
    	scopes magnification before a lethal shot can be taken?  
    
    	Plus, varible scopes weigh more.  
    
    	What are the trade-offs?  
    
    							Kelly
    

    In the past I had run a 3X9 on the .06. This made for fun target
    practice at distant targets but was not real practical in the field.

    Now I run a 7X fixed mounted on see-thru mounts. Anything closer than
    75 yards gets the iron sights (sighted for 100 yards) lined up on its 
    chest. I use the scope (sighted for 200 yards) for the longer shots.


    This also raises the scope high enough off the gun to make it a
    good carrying handle as well.
    
    Doug.

    
    re .12
    
    I would say that if an animal is far enough off to warrant moving 
    the scope power up then you have the time.
    
    I use a 3x9 on my rifle and it is always set at 3, the only times I
    have needed it adjusted during hunting were on a trip to N. Carolina
    where I got longer shots (up to 300+ yds). I had plenty of time to
    adjust the scope as the deer were usually not moving or were just
    wandering around feeding.  If he is running you probably shouldn't
    take the long shots anyway.
    
    --Bob
    

    A fixed 4 power on a 300 yard flat shooting iron like a 300 mag, is 
    not my idea of the best optics setup... Course my eye sight ain't 
    what it used to be, I would be hard pressed to see a spike horn with a
    4 power at 300 yards....  Like Bob said, anything out at 300 gives you
    plenty of time to crank up the scope to 9 or 12 power to check out the
    horns.  Whenever still hunting I have mine cranked down to 3 power for
    any quick shooting.
    
    Irons sights are ok, but for quick shots at close range there too many 
    things to line up, with a low power scope 1.5 - 3 power, all you have
    to do is sight the deer in the crosshairs...
    
    Personally I don't like see thru mounts, the additional height makes it
    uncomfortable to shoulder and all but negates the use of a cheekpiece.
    
    FWIW,  Fra

    
    RE: .-1 
    
    >>Personally I don't like see thru mounts, the additional height makes it
    >>uncomfortable to shoulder and all but negates the use of a cheekpiece.
    
    This is true for scopes with small field of views. Try to avoid these. 
    
    I find the cheek position relatively unchanged when firing from either 
    site.
    
    Doug.

    
    
    	Doug, you have an interesting setup, but I'd be concerned with 
    	the scope losing accuracy.  My feeling is that the high mounted 
    	scope would be sensitive to shock and vibration that 'might' 
    	change the long range accuracy.  I'm looking for a scope rig 
    	that will deliver the proper medicine into the kill zone even 
    	if the rifle is abused.  
    
    	Fra, I think that a spotting scope or binoculars would 
    	be used to determine the target's legal identity.  ;-)  
    
    
    	With varible scopes; does the bullseye change as the magnification 
    	changes?  
    
    
    							Kelly
    

    re .15: quick shots at close range.
    
    Funny that - many (most?) big game hunters (of the Cape Buffalo etc
    type - ie were if you don't kill the game fast enough it kills you)
    still favour iron sights - usually of the simple Express type - because
    it is far faster than optical sights...
    
    /. Ian .\

    re:.17
    
    ya you could use binocs or a spotting scope... but should you happen to
    see one or more deer at 300 yards strolling along, it would be much
    easier and quicker with the scope.  There is also less chance of
    possibly shooting the wrong deer because in that split second it takes
    to drop the binocs and pick up the rifle and get back on them they could
    have changed positions...  stranger things have happened.
    
    Hey if your happy with a fixed 4 on a 300 mag, go for it! who am i to
    argue. BTW, I don't advocate scanning the woods or plains with the rifle
    and scope, if thats what you were eluding to.  I carry binocs, and as
    soon as I see a deer I scope him, i've had too many opportunities where
    I lost the deer between switching binocs to gun/scope.
    
    Ian, regarding iron sights and dangerous game.... thats a whole nuther
    ball of wax... but i would still prefer a 1.5 power over the irons, as
    many of the african hunters do use for less hazardous game.  Were 
    talking whitetails/elk and mulies, not cape buffalo... course then
    again we'd be using .416's and 500 nitros too ;^)
    
    Fra

    
    granted - incidentally for close range stuff I'd be interested in the
    reactions of experinced hunters to the sort of "natural vision" x1
    scopes that the military have been playing with (these have a natural
    field of view so that you are hardly aware of looking through them, but
    giv you a cross hairs for point of aim and of course correct your
    natural vision if you need it.
    
    anyway - see my sign in note for my own choice of scopes...
    
    /. Ian .\

    Ditto for me, I am thinking of getting the STEYR-AUG wich comes with a
    1.5 power scope. Anybody got any experience with it?
    
    LEs