Conference vmsnet::hunting$note:hunting

    Bushnell makes a few models (7x and 8x, black, camo) in the $60-$80
    range.  
    
    Mark.

    I have used a pair of 8x30 Bushnell rubber-armored binocs for 
    several seasons. They are tried-and-true companions. Fit into
    a camo-jacket pocket, dull green color, plenty of power. 
    Paid $75 for them. 
    
    Dana

    This notesfile is great!  I had forgotten to consider the fact of
    light gathering ability.  Since most of the time Iam going to be
    needing to use the binoculars with be at dawn or dusk, I had forgotten
    that very important fact.  So <10xsomething by Bushnell's seems
    to be what I need!?
    
    Thanks again,		Keith R>

    I also am in the market for some binoculars.  I have to admit that
    I am kind of niave about them however.  I was going to buy the 
    highest power available.  Could someone please post an informational
    note explaining the principals of binoculars (e.g. light gathering,
    what the power numbers mean, etc.).  My main requirement for the
    pair I buy is size, at this point.  I would like to buy one of the
    rubberized compacts as long as I can get a good performing pair.
    Thanks in advance,
    
    Dave                                           
    

    RE -1
    
    Whew! :-)
    
    I have always equated the first number to be the magnification
    and the second to be the field of view. Comparing a 7X25 to a
    7X50 would mean the same amount of magnification, with the 50s
    having a wider field of view.
    
    In any case, others have noted that its not so much the power
    for hunting, but the quality of the optics. Matter of fact, field
    of view is not so important for hunting as is light-gathering
    ability. 
    
    I recently read one article that gave a good tip on checking how
    good a brand's optics are. They said to sweep your eyeballs in
    the field of view from one end to another. You should not lose
    anything in the process...ie, the optics should be as clear at
    the edges as they are in the middle. This is important for hunting,
    as one should move the eyeballs when using binocs on stand rather
    than swiveling one's head around. 
    
    I have taken to using binocs more and more these past seasons. I
    use them on stand, of course. But more importantly, when still
    hunting it is great to be able to thoroughly check out an area
    before slogging through it. It is amazing how moving just a few
    feet changes your whole perspective on the woods! Having the binocs
    gives you the advantage of being able to look -through- the brush
    and under the trees.....in short, to be able to define whether
    that object is a branch or an antler. Before you go crashing around!
    
    I used to lug around a big pair of 7X50s. Switched to a pair of
    Bushnell 7X35 rubber-armored compacts. Much nicer to keep around
    yer neck all day! Only gripe I have is the focusing knob setup.
    I recently bought a set of Nikon 9X20 minis.....they have superb
    optics and are -very- bright. Cost around $90 or so. And I like
    the focusing arrangement better than the Bushnells. I also like
    the new Leupold minis. They have individual focus on each eyepiece
    that lock into place.
    
    All in all, I feel that a good set of binocs used properly will
    allow you to see more game than going "nekkid". I would buy the
    sbsolute best you can afford the first time, the resale value of
    optical goods (if you dont like them for whatever reason) is very
    low. A good set will last forever and will be an integral part of
    your hunting equipment.
    
    Dana
    

    There are two factors used to measure light gathering; exit pupil
    and brightness factor. exit pupil is arrived at by dividing thre]
    lens diameter by the power. for instance, a 7x35 glass yeilds
    an exit pupil of 5. A glass of 7x50 gives an exit pupil of 7.14.
    A 10x50 yeilds an exit pupil of 5. Since the average pupil can
    only dilate to 5mm, anything more is not too advantageous. 
    Brightness is arrived at by taking the square root of the product
    of lens diameter and power. A 7x35 glass has a brightness factor
    of just over 15. A 10x50 yeilds a brightness factor of 22+.
    Both have exit pupils of 5, but one gathers much more light.
    (As noted earlier, at a price of greeater bulk and weight.)
    A 10x25 glass has a brightness factor of almost 16, or slightly
    more than the 7x35, but an exit pupil of only 2.5 
    As elsewhere, a compromise. Adequate brightness *and* adequate
    exit pupil are both necessary. An 8x30 gives a brightness of
    15.5 and an exit pupil of 3.75 . This, or a 7x35 are probably best
    all around. 
    
    Dana

    Does anyone out there know who makes a reasonably priced compact
    rubber armored 7X35?  If so, who? how much? possibly where?
    
    Thanks,
    
    Keith R>

    Re .10
    
    Well, all the makers have compact rubber-armored models. The lesser
    priced of them would be the Tasco or Bushnell....followed by Bausch
    and Lomb and Simmons..followed by Leoupold and Redfield and Nikon...
    followed by Zeiss, etc. (prices roughly in ascending order).
    
    If, as you stated in .0, you want to spend less than $100, you should
    have plenty to choose from. I would first try to find an outfitter
    that stocks a lot of different brands and try them all out. Certain
    features are to be found in one line that may be done in a different
    manner than another....find the one that you like best. Figger out
    if you want roof-prisms or conventional design, too. In general,
    its a very crowded market these days, and there is a lot of technology
    wars being waged that bring the consumer "latest and greatest" at
    good prices.
    
    Once I figgered out which model I wanted, I would then mail-order
    them from a place like Spartan Supply or similar. There is a fair
    amount of markup in optical goods, and what is on the shelf for
    $110 can be bought mail-order for about $70-$80 or so. You can get
    more for your money that way. But again, you gotta find out which
    maker and model is the right one for -you-.
    
    If you need addresses/phone numbers, lemme know.
    
    DAP
    

    I'm looking for a pair too. Could you post those mail order addresses?
    
    
    				Lance 

    Please do post the addresses that you have.
    
    Thanks,
    
    Keith R>

    try Spartan Supply, Inc.
    
    800-251-3904
    
    or;
    
    Natchez Shooter's Supply
    
    800-251-7839
    
    you name it, they got it (within reason, of course :-). Lots of
    binocs and scopes.
    
    I would still recommend that you figger out which maker/model
    you want first.
    
    DAP
    

    
    	I'm presently going through a *binocular choosing* exercise.
    	How important is it to have waterproof binoculars?  I looked
    	through Cabelas, Gander Mountain, and Dunn's catalogs last
    	night and only found a few compacts that were advertised as
    	waterproof.  Should I worry about buying a pair that are
    	waterproof (this cuts my choices down considerably) or are
    	most of them adequately sealed against rain and snow?  I don't
    	plan on dunking my binocs in any beaver ponds or anything!  ;^)
    
    	Also, some advertised as being fog proof.  Does this mean I
    	don't have to worry about them fogging up when I look through
    	them when it's 20 degrees F.?  I was planning on using the stuff
    	I put on my eyeglasses, that keeps them from fogging, on the
    	binocs I buy anyway.
    
	One last thing.  What do you all prefer in the way of a focusing
    	mechanism?  
    
    	I too was going to go with 10X binocs until I read the replies
    	in here.  Sounds like 8X is the way to go for those cool mornings
    	when you're shaking from the cold and the adrenalin is pumping.
    
    	Clay

    Individual focus is supposedly better - set it and forget it -
    but those seem to be high $ items. Don't have any experience
    with the focus-free types. With eyeglasses try and get as much
    exit pupil as possible - you lose some due to being further
    away from the lenses. I use 8x42 Pentax, which are much better
    than the 8x30 Bushnell I have. (Hell, at 3 times the price
    they oughtta be :-) )
    
    re .waterproof - I find using binocs in rain to be an exercise in
    futility so it doesn't bother me. Most are well sealed. I recall
    reading that *only* individual-focus glasses were truly waterproof,
    but I've never had a problem.

    
    Talk about an exercise in futility!  I couldn't find ANY
    compacts that came close to having an exit pupil of 5.
    The best I could find was 3.57 but the power was only 7
    on these.  I'd like to have at least 8X magnification.
    It looks like the only way I can get an exit pupil of
    5 is if I go with the a non-compact type.  I sure hate
    to do this.  I was looking forward to only carrying 9-11
    ounces around my neck.  It looks like I'll have to go
    with something that weighs 22-28 ounces......unless somebody
    has a suggestion!  Maybe I should just quit being a weenie
    and buy a heavier pair of binoculars that gives me an exit
    pupil of 5! 
    
    Clay

    TANSTAAFL, amigo. But by way of consolation I'll present the 
    other side :-) How much and when do you use your binoculars
    most - early morning, midday, evening ? That 5mm exit pupil 
    makes for optimum brightness but is that your main concern ?
    If you're not going to glass 'til 8 AM anyway you don't really
    need the 5mm, because your pupils will already be contracted.
    Ditto late evening. A good pair of 8x25 compacts will serve 
    if you don't really plan to do much glassing in the dusk.

    You can learn to love the heavier glasses, tho - so much 
    easier on the eyes.

    
    OK.  I'll bite.  What does TANSTAAFL mean?
    
    I was going to question the 5mm exit pupil theory for the
    same reason!  Hell, my blue eyes are so sensitive to light
    that my pupils are probably 1 micro-inch when it's bright
    out  ;^).  All the compacts in GM, Dunn's, and Cabela's
    were either 7X or 10X.  Only two of the 7X gave an exit
    pupil of 3.57.  All the rest were 2-2.5.  
    
    BTW, I glass from shooting light til shooting light ends.
    Out here in Colorado, we've gotta count points.  Elk must
    have at least 4 on one side and bucks must have at least
    3 on one side.
    
    Oh well, I'll keep looking.........
    
    Clay

    	I swear by my Bushnell Custom Compacts.  They're
    superior (sharper) than my friend's Nikons.  They are 7 power
    and have rubber eye cups that you roll down if you wear glasses.
    Only problem is I haven't seen them anywhere lately.  Course
    I bought them nearly 20 years ago before Bausch & Lomb sucked
    up Bushnell and ruined their line.
    
    Andy

    I'm considering picking up a set of small field glasses, any updated
    comments to this note?
    
    -donmac

      I picked up (or actually got them for my birthday) a set of
    Bushnell 10x50 "InstaVision" binoculors.  I was happy with them
    up until Friday night while hunting in the rain.  The seal around
    the left lens must be bad, because they're been fogged up ever
    since.  I'm sending them back this week.  Looks like a "lifetime"
    warranty, but it will cost me $10 to send them back (shipping).
    
      As far as comments about them go, I like the "InstaVision"
    feature.  No focus is needed, and I have had no problems with
    that part.  The only drawback would be that objects close to
    you will appear somewhat blurry, however, far-away objects are
    nice and clear.  I'm an eye glass wearer, and these bino's have
    eye cups that can be folded back (easier to use with glasses).
    Nice carrying case (straps around your waist), and they come with
    a handstrap and a neck band.  If it wasn't for the fogging probelm,
    I'd love em...
    
    -Ron-
    
    p.s. Thru Cabela's, they are around $60 plus shipping/handling.

>>           <<< Note 241.21 by RANGER::MACINTYRE "Terminal Angler" >>>
>>                               -< new comments? >-
>>
>>    I'm considering picking up a set of small field glasses, any updated
>>    comments to this note?
    
I bought the Nikon Travelite III 7x20 binoculars for this year.  As I
just got back from a 5 day hunt, I feel qualified to comment on them.

I really liked them.  They are very small and light, and have very
good optics.  The light gathering abilities are ok, and the field
of view is adequate.  Also, my neck isn't hurting after carrying
them around all day long.  I could even put them in my coat pocket.

I don't know how they will perform in wet weather, as we had nothing
by dry weather.  However, they held up well to below freezing weather.

One of my hunting partners carried a pair of Bushnell 8x23 compacts,
and he liked them.

Hope this helps.

Jerry

P.S.  The Nikons cost about $75 on sale.

    
      As a follow-up to my previous note about the Bushnell
    binoculars, I was watching a field the other evening (bow
    hunting) and I thought I detected some movement on the far
    side of the field (approx 75 yds), but couldn't make out
    if there was anything there.  Put the bino's on it, and
    lo and behold, there were 4 deer.  Never would have seen 
    them if not for the bino's.  There was not enough light to 
    see them with the bare eye, but the bino's really picked up
    the little remaining light and made them stand right out.
    I was really impressed.
    
    -Ron-

    I recently purchased a pair of 8X30 Steiner's, the basic model, not the
    new Whitetail's. Paid a bit over $200.00. Fantastic optics, waterproof,
    lightweight, armored. Suggest spending as much as you can afford as
    with a scope on a rifle. They opearte very well in low light, are
    nitrogen filled thus fogging is not an issue. I don't plan on buying
    another pair of binos in my lifetime!
    Hope this helps.
    Keith