Conference vmsnet::hunting$note:hunting

138.0. "What is Hunting" by TWINS::CORTIS () Mon Mar 07 1988 11:23

This will be entered in both Firearms and hunting since people do not read
both and I would like to know everyone feeling.



Surprise is were I find myself when I asked myself a certain question just this
past week. You see, I've been a hunter nigh on 24 years now, and I'm only
32 years old. Yes, when all my friends were out playing tag, baseball and the
such, I was hunting rabbit and squirrel and pheasant and ..... mostly with
a Crossman pilot gun or a bow. By the age of 10 or eleven I was doing my own
skinning and tanning. All my hunting was done the old fashion way, work.. that
is, stalk, walk, stop, sit, listen and start all over again.

Now I have my own kids. My oldest will be nine this spring. What I have to deal
with is him coming home from school learning that hunting (what he called 
killing animals for sport) was wrong. This is what some schools teach our kids.
Now of course I have to set him straight, but on the positive side, such as what
he said is right when an animal is an endangered species, or poaching, etc etc.

Now my problem is this. My son and I were watching a hunting show on some 
network, (sorry I can't recall the channel). Bear hunting was today subject 
and there was a guide involved. 

This guide takes this fella through the woods, puts some food for the bear down
off a distance and then climbs a tree into a stand. There they sit, and just 
chew the fat. A bear comes along during all there gabbing and the guide says
well that looks like a good shot. Wherein the 'client' picks up his scoped rifle
and (after the camera get a real close up of the bear) and just picks him off.
The bear drops (thank goodness). 

Gentleman, I must say I felt VERY EMBARRASSED about what I do for sport. My
wife was there also who is anti hunting. There is no way I could say THAT was
sport.

I don't know what bothered me most. This guy who says he's gone hunting, were
in reality he paid a man to take him to a spot to shoot the shit till some bear
came along and he shot it.  The only thing that was not there is the beer!
Were is the challenge, were is the sport, were is the skill (other then his 
marksmanship). 

Think about the whole picture. You not only have two guys out there, one a paid
client and a guide, but the camera man AT LEAST, and maybe a sound guy and
possible a helper or two. There was a whole heard of people going out there,
not even skill of going out into the woods, they talked all the way.

If I was watching this with a group of bleeding heart liberals, there would be
know way that I could justify the killing of that great bear! Nor could I 
justify this to my son. I was ashamed.

I could not say, 'well there are to many bears around so we need to thin them
out a bit'. I could not say 'well this man spent days scouting out the area,
building a stand, baiting and days waiting for the bear to come'. I could not
say 'look at the skill this man has'. I could not say 'look at his tracking
abilities, that is what got him that bear'. I could not even say what he did 
was even a 'little bit hard to do'. The bear came, starting eating, and dropped 
with guide client, camera man and who know who else was there watching. All's he
had to do was show up, pay his money, point his gun and shoot. Money money money

I viewed it as a waste. It saddened me. I could now, for the first time see how
those dam anti's out there view us with such scorn. There was no trophy lying
there dead. A man got tired of shooting at targets and so paid another man 
to take him to a live animal target that was bought for a few hundred dollars.

So what am I trying to say? What am I against? Hunting? I love the SPORT. I will
fight to keep the sport alive! I don't know what I'm saying, I'm confused. Maybe
I'm against guides!? Maybe it's the guides that are giving us a bad name. After
seeing that show could not but the words 'sporting and hunting' along the side
of the word 'guide'. 

If this is what the anti's see and base there condemnation on us, then we have
no leg to stand on. All we (I) can do is say, I don't hunt that way or even call
that hunting.

I'm sorry for rambling on, I don't think I said what I wanted to say the way I
wanted to say it, but I hope you got my message. I'm for hunting, I'm for 
firearms. But I'm not into paying a man x about of dollars for a live target!

Barry_who_now_will_duck_as_the_flams_are_thrown

      You make alot of good points.  I think that there is a difference
    between "hunting" and just "killing".  The show you described did
    not show the entire hunt, it just showed the killing.  The hunt
    is what hapened before the cameras started rolling.  The guide had
    to scout the area, build a stand, place his baits, etc.  Alot of
    work goes into baiting bears.  You have to know what your doing,
    how to place the baits, where to place them, where to place the
    stand.  It isn't as cut and dried as it may have looked.  The client in 
    this case  didn't participate in the entire hunt, he just killed the 
    animal.  The show would have been alot better if it had shown all the 
    work that was done before they shot the bear.  I can't see paying big bucks
    just to pull the trigger.  I want to go out and feel like I've earned
    whatever chances I may get when hunting.  If all one wants to do
    is kill something then mayby this type of "hunt" is for them, but
    I'd rather feel like I worked for it.  
                                        
    Jeff

    I think "hunting" shows on TV are not good P.R. for the sport. 
    It's too difficult to capture the essence of the sport in a 
    half hour segment of film.  I remember watching a hunt for
    elk on TV a couple of years ago.  By the time they fit it into
    the allotted time slot, it gave a definite impression that they
    just strolled into the woods and shot an elk.  At the end they
    briefly mentioned that was a nice way to end 8 days of hunting...
    
    Mark,
    

      I have to agree with Jeffs reply that the whole hunt was not shown.
    I am a registered maine guide and guide bear hunters in the fall,
    it involves alot of work. more than any hunter who has never done
    it can imagine. especially when your putting out fifteen baits for
    hunters and building stands. alot of knowledge and hard work along
    with experience are what it boils down to. A TV show like this is
    what gives the anti hunters and anti gun people the wrong attitude
    about our sport. myself I live for deer hunting and baiting bear,
    there is nothing more enjoyable to me than being out there and testing
    my skills and knowledge against the wilderness. I guess thats the
    main reason I became a guide because I like it so much. the rest
    of the year I'm in DEC dreaming about the next year.
                                                         RICK

      My first impression is to side with the author of this note. 
    However, whats the diference between hiring a guide to lure game
    for you or having several friends "drive/push" game into you?  Now
    most of us don't hire guides because we can't afford them.  Myself...
    I couldn't justify the money nor give up my solitude which is
    a valued byproduct of hunting.  As far as "killing" films go it
    is my opinion that they are not sponsored by hunters to be viewed
    by hunters.  What you see is an extremely effective approach to
    develop more "antis".
    

    
     What is Hunting
                      It is an act of Conservation
    What is a Hunter
                       A CONSERVATIONIST