Conference vicki::boats

    .0�    Is it me, or does anyone else notice that boats, like cars are starting
    .0�    to look a lot alike?  Maybe computer aided design or maybe just copycat
    
    	Case in point..Bayliner!
    
    B.A._sorry_chris!
    

    Don, tell me more.  I'm currently restoring a 1965 wooden Century
    Resorter inboard ski boat so I've already been thru alot of the pain 
    of locating parts, re-doing the upholstery, etc.  I've been working on
    it for 4 years and it's only been wet for 3 months during that time.
    Of course being wood has alot to do with.  I did start with a boat that
    had just had the engine totally rebuilt by the prior owner so I had a
    good start point.  I don't claim to be an expert on fiberglass
    construction so I'll leave what to look for in hull soundness up to
    some of the other guys.  I can tell you some things about the mechanics
    of what you have there if you can answer some questions.  Also, how
    much is this guy asking?  If you decide not to take it, I might be
    interested.
    Questions:
    1) Who "marinized" the engine?  Probably Interceptor but I'll need to
    know that for the sake of parts availability.  Is it a four or two 
    barrel carb (maybe even some type of side draft carb)?  The 292 engine
    lasted in Mercury's and Edsel's up to 1962 but in auto form they were
    down to 170 HP by then (they were up to 212 HP in the mid-fifties and
    you can locate speed parts if you have the need to go faster.)
    Do you have any idea of the conditon of the engine prior to being
    dis-assembled?  Obviously you can't do a compression test now but a
    good mechanic should be able to look at the bits and pieces and tell
    you if the engine is salvageable. Look at the distributor and tell me
    what you see stamped on the serial tag so that I can determine if it
    is right or left hand rotation.  Reverse (left hand) rotation engine
    parts are sometimes much harder to find.
    2) What type of tranny does the boat have?  Assuming that it is a 
    Warner direct drive model 71C (or Model 10-17), then you will have no
    problems getting it rebuilt if needed.  I just had one done for $250.
    If it is a Paragon or something else, Marine Gear can still rebuild it
    but you may want to convert to a Warner.  If it is an Eaton (marked 
    Dearborn Machine) you will want to convert to a Warner even if it
    doesn't need to be rebuilt unless you don't plan on water skiing with
    it.  BTW, the Warner Model 71C is still being used in ski boats today
    unchanged from 30 years ago!
    3) Some others things that can add up fast if not fixable:
       -gas tank
       -prop
       -prop shaft
       -gauges
       -any electrical stuff on the engine especially if it is reverse
        rotation
    
    
    Some of the early Glastrons are rapidly becoming collectors items.
    There is an outboard Glastron runabout which I can't remember the name
    of which is rapidly appreciating in value at this time.
    
    I would be interested in looking at this boat with you if it is
    somewhere in the central New England area.  I live in Brookline, NH
    and work in Salem, NH.
    
    Good luck.  This may be a real collector's item.  
    One more thought.  You might try calling Boyd Mefferd at Boyd's
    Boatyard in Canton, Conn. (203-693-4811).  He is mostly into wooden
    runabouts but he seems to know everything about old boats.  He may be
    able to tell you if it's worth the work.  If he says that he's
    interested in buying it then it's worth something.  He's very honest.
    He told me he doesn't like Century's and would prefer not to sell them.
    Last time I talked to him, he had a complete 292 engine with Warner
    tranny good for parts for $250.  Not a bad deal if you have to replace
    some external engine parts.
    Wayne

    Not sure whether this is a note about styling or restoration but I
    too was wondering what this "Euro" styling is all about!  Looks to me
    like it includes such things as:
    
    1) Rake angles everywhere so acute that boat winds up with "lots" of
    unusable nooks and crannies.
    
    2) Low profile - yielding cabin headroom of 3'11" or such.
    
    3) Ubiquitous "sun loungers" - let's see - put a 8' long lounger
    forward of the transom, and then make the whole foredeck bigger so
    you can make an even bigger sunlounger out of it, and voila! Your
    29' boot is now reduced to a 6' cockpit.  (And would you want to be in
    any of these places on a moving boat?)
    
    It is an insult to the Europeans to pretend that this impracticality 
    was invented by them.  Not that every boat should look like a tugboat,
    but "Euro" styling seems to me to have so many disadvantages as to
    negate any so-called sexy look it might bring along...
    
    Europeans so impractical as to 

I think that any product is a product of its time. Sure there will always be one
or two that are ahead, or behind, the times, thus looking unique in comtemporary
or historical viewpoints, but for the most part I think products tend to look 
more alike than different in a given time period. Look too different and no one
will buy it, not different enough and no one will recognize it. People living in
the time period seem to be senstive to the differences.

A `54 Ford looks a lot more like a `54 Chevy than it does a `41 or `91 Ford.
A `77 Sea Ray looks a lot more like a `77 Wellcraft than it does a `91 Sea Ray.

john

    re .1  Picking on poor Bayliner again eh?  I guess that when you are
           #1, everybody wants to take a shot at you...  Knocking Bayliner
           is tantamount to knocking Chevrolet or Coleman, etc.  They don't
           build the best products from a quality or reliabilty standpoint
           but please give them credit for bringing good value to the masses.
           If it weren't for companys like them, a lot of people could not
           afford to pursue their dreams.  And, correct me if I'm wrong, but
           wasn't it Bayliner who invented "Euro" Styling with their Capri
           line of boats back in 1982?  If indeed they did, then doesn't
           that mean that everyone else is jumping on their bandwagon?
           I can think of some premium boatbuilders like Correct Craft and
           Sea Ray and a host of others who have exploited this new styling
           sensation.  Like you said in .4 John the market dictates styling
           to a large degree.  When someone as large as Bayliner scores a
           "styling coup"(in Madison avenue terms) then naturaly everyone
           else wants a piece of the action.  Jim, you are right in sticking
           up for the Europeans, this thing has gone way overboard to the
           point of wretched excess, and "Euro" should no longer be attatched
           in my opinion.  I think that the "Euro" designation came about
           after some unnamed stylists did a little copying(or shall we say
           "were inspired") by certain Italian offshore racing craft.  At
           any rate, the whole thing is getting a little tedious and I for
           one am looking forward to some fresh styling ideas, or at least
           some differences between manufacturers.  Well Wayne, what can I
           tell you besides the truth?  Which is:  I don't really have any
           answers to your questions, but, I want to thank you for your
           stimulation.  I have not yet seen the engine or the transmission,
           but I will try to do so soon.  The rest of the boat appears to
           be all there, but I only took a precursory look.  The owner was
           on his way out and he caught me and two of my sons gawking at
           his prize, which was fairly well hidden from casual glance.  He
           is a friendly enough chap and he did tell me that the boat was
           "goin nowhere".  He also mentioned the fact that he could be
           persuaded to sell the boat, and he did mention a price, but I am
           not at liberty to give you that information at this time, because
           there are other parties(my sons, brother, and brother-in-law) who
           are all interested in this boat but who are standing down until
           I make a decision.  I will try to see him this weekend, and maybe
           visit dad up on Winni as an excuse to get near the antique boat
           show to see just what I can find out about this boat.  I will
           let you know what I dig up either from the owner, and, or, from
           others.
    
                 Don

    
    >       I can think of some premium boatbuilders like Correct Craft and
    >       Sea Ray and a host of others who have exploited this new styling
    >       sensation.  Like you said in .4 John the market dictates styling
    
    		Correct Craft, Euro styling? I guess I must have missed
    	that model.... :-)
    	
    	Rick

re <<< Note 881.6 by KAHALA::SUTER "We dun't need no stinkin' skis, (sometimes)" >>>
>                              -< Euro Nautique? >-

    
>    >       I can think of some premium boatbuilders like Correct Craft and
>    >       Sea Ray and a host of others who have exploited this new styling
>    >       sensation.  Like you said in .4 John the market dictates styling
    
>    		Correct Craft, Euro styling? I guess I must have missed
>    	that model.... :-)
    	
>    	Rick


	Yeah;  Like, 

its gotta pointy front end....  
and the back end is kinda blunt....
and there's a windshield....
and the driver's seat faces forward....
and the prop pushes it along from the rear....
its just like a Bayliner with euro styling, right ?


	Reg	{I know Rick,  You and I can see the differences, but 
			we're the cog_ni_scent_i}

    Don, I'll be at the show on Saturday.  I'll be wearing a black L.A.
    Raiders hat.  Maybe I'll see you there.
    Wayne

    So what is American styling ? Is it fat front Maine boats or sleek
    Calif.ski boats. I remember my uncle's 1963 30'Owens. It also looked
    like the rest of the boats of the time. I don't want to start any
    pi__in contest but this has me thinkin. What is American styling?

    What goes around comes around.    Been a lot of ads for neo-trawler
    type designs in the mags.  They actually look good to me.  You know,
    the cabin's like a *real* room.  And a radical design idea called a
    displacement hull allows a 25' boat to be powered by a 150hp diesel and
    make 15kt at 5(!)gph.   Get there slow, don't spend a lot on fuel, and
    never have to stoop.  Ridiculous!