Conference vicki::boats

My guess is that the motor is worth about $300, maybe $400 tops.  It's
old enough so that reliability and obtaining parts may be a problem,
but not old enough to be in demand by collectors or restorers.

Based on that, I would suggest you try getting it going yourself, because
a dealer will surely soak you for something close to the value of the
motor just to get in working order.  How much work and parts the motor
requires will depend on how it was prepared for storage and where it was 
stored.

Here are some of the things I would do before starting:
- Remove the spark plugs, and pour a small amount of Mystery oil into each  
  cylinder.  Lay the motor down so that the pistons are facing straight up.
  Slowly pull the starter to allow the oil to work into the rings and lube
  the cylinder walls.
- While the plugs are out, connect them to plug wires and touch the plug 
  against the block.  Pull the starter again and check each plug for a good 
  spark.  If the spark looks good the ignition system is probably ok for now.
  (If not, it's time to pull the flywheel and replace the points, and possibly
  condenser and magneto).
- Now toss the old spark plugs and install new ones.
- Replace the water pump impeller.  You could take your chances and try running
  with the original, but you're risking damage to the motor by doing so.  These
  rubber impellers don't last long anyway, and after 20 years the original is 
  ready to crumble.
- Change the lower end oil.  Use fresh gaskets on the fill and drain plugs.
- Lube all throttle, shift, and spark advance linkage.
- Attach a water supply source or place the motor in a barrel of water.  Don't
  run it dry, even just to see if it'll start.  The rubber impeller can melt or
  become scored in a matter of seconds.
- Attach a supply of fresh gas with a 25:1 mixture.  Once the motor's been run 
  for a while, you can switch to 50:1.  You may find a sticker on the motor
  specifying 25:1, but that was because of the inferior oils of the time.

Things to check after starting:
- Check for a proper flow of water from the cooling system, even if you've
  replace the impeller.  The flow should be steady, and should warm up as the 
  motor comes up to temperature.
- Check for gas leaks around the carb.  If there are leaks or the motor runs 
  poorly the carb may have to be rebuilt due to dried gaskets and varnish 
  deposits.  Adjust mixture screws for a proper idle if necessary.
- Check plug wires for signs or arcing or opens.
- Run the motor thru forward and reverse, checking operation and allowing lower
  end oil to circulate.
- Attach it to a boat and go have fun!

Rick W.

    Dear 681.0,
    
    If the engine is in good running condition (before or after tune
    up) you could probably get an easy $200 for it. If it really has
    been sitting for 20 years you should at least replace:
    o Lower End Gear Oil and plug seals.
    o Carb. rebuilding kit (replace dried filters and gaskets) not
      mandatory but nice. Do this last, it may not need it.
    o Spark Plug
    o Points and condensor definately, points are probably rust spots
      now. You will need a gear puller (flywheel) for this (rent one).
    o Coil if you don't get spark, but they should be fine with only
      8 hours use.
     
    It may sound like a lot of work but if you purchase a service manual
    ($24.00) you can fly right thru the job. 
     $50.00 in parts, for $100 (max) and time invested you should have a "new"
     engine when you are done.         
    
    Marine Mechanics charge about $50.00 per hour, they will charge
    you at least 2 hours labor for the tune up, probably more. The manual
    will pay for itself after one or two jobs.
    
    Hope it helps - I do small engine repair if you need assistance.
    
    TB
                                                           

    
    Before you spin the engine over inspect the cylinder walls for rust.
    If there is anything more than surface rust do not spin the motor.
    Break it down, remove the rust, (you might replace the rings while
    your in there), hone and reassemble. While it is apart lubricate
    all bearings and surfaces.
    
    Use a light weight oil and don't be stingy with it. A little smoke
    at first startup is a small price to pay for a new engine.
    
    Good luck!
    
    Doug.

    
      All of the replies so far have good info in them, but I have one
    suggestion I hope you take *before* the others; before you take
    ANY part of the engine apart, make *SURE* you can get replacement
    parts/gaskets. A few years ago OMC reduced their inventory of older
    engine parts (to reduce costs), and now some parts - even basic
    ones like gaskets - can be hard to get. You can be sure that you
    will not be able to re-use any gaskets on that motor. If you plan
    to take something on it apart, it would be a good idea to get
    replacement gaskets, etc. *first*.
    
 
					Kenny   

    I had an Evinrude that sat for a couple of years, and the main seal
    on the crankshaft gave up the ghost.  This seal is rubber, and it
    will tend to stick to the crankshaft if it sits for too long; result
    is that the first pull wipes out the seal.  I don't believe there
    is anything you can do to prevent this, if it's gonna happen, it's
    gonna happen.  The tip off will be if the sparkplug(s) foul with
    water.  
    
    Carl

    In 1984 I picked up a 1962 or 63 Evinrude 6 hp.  It belonged to a guy
    that used to be a clammer in Florida.  In the mid 70s he got into
    making surf board and the sail boards.  I was in his shop one day and
    saw this 6hp sitting under a pile of fiberglass dust.  I mean the
    outboard was laying on its back and was almost buried.  I bought it
    off of him for $100.
    
    I took it home and cleaned it up.  I replaced the plugs, water pump,
    the lube in the lower unit and checked the cylinders.  Everything
    looked fine so I stuck in a trashcan full of water and gave a pull.
    That little sucker jumped to life on the second pull.  
    
    It still didn't pump water though.  Perplexed, I finally discovered
    that it didn't pump water because the {make your guess here} 
    thermostat corroded.  Nobody needs a thermostat for the warm water in
    Florida, so I chucked it :-)  I sold the motor when I moved to MA in 85
    to a guy for $300 (only because he was begging for my motor....biggest
    mistake I EVER made)  Talked to him last year and he said it runs great
    every weekend and he just puts gas in it and changes the plug and lube.
    
    My two cents:
    
    1) check your thermostat for corrosion.
    
    2) don't crank those helicoils to tight in the lower yuint :-(
    
    3) You can't kill small Johnson/Evinrudes
    
    4) Manual?  What's that?
    
    5) If you lived in Washington, I'd be trying to talk you out of that
       little beauty
    
    Good luck
    
    /brett  

    
      This is great!!!
      Thankyou all for your imputs!!  I won't be able to start this project
      til July. This conference is great! If I run into problems I'll
      respond back to this note. Thanks once again!
     
      Frank,
    
    

    
    
    Before you try to start - make sure that you have spark- One set of
    points is always open on those old OMC's with the dual magnetos and the
    one that is open is sure to be corroded. I was given a 1927 evinrude
    3 HP because the owner couldn't get it running- claned up the points
    and away she went.That was about ten years ago- I start it a cuple of
    times a year to keep it going. 
    
     

    A 1927 Evinrude?
    
    Hmmm....
    
    That begs the questions:
    
    What year did Evinrude get into the business?
    
    Who made the first outboard and when?
    
    /brett

    I read an article in Boating Mag. awhile ago.
    
    It claimed that many people associate "Ole" as the father of the
    outboard, it had already been invented in Japan before his
    time.
    
    Jim.

    Hi,
    
    	Mr moderator, let me know if this does not belong here and I
    will give it a note of its own. I could not find any other note
    here on old outbords so here goes....
    
    	I recently came across an Evinrude LarkV electro-shift I have
    been told that it is a 35HP. I was also told that it was a 1969
    I cannot verify either on the engine. Anyone out there venture a
    guess how to identify it. The prvious owner also had it rebuilt
    and never used it again. So it seems to be in excellent condition.
    	    
    			Evinrude LarkV	2 Cylinder electric start
    					W/controls
    		 	model # 40363D
            		serial# E01068    Maybe a 1968? by the last 2 numbers
    	Also anyone know of someone who still services Evinrudes?	        
       
    	Thanks in advance,
    	
    	PL
    

    
      I believe the Larks are 40 HP. If I saw it I could tell you for
    sure - the 40's (and up) of the 60's have what OMC called a "quiet
    hood" around the upper part of the the drive unit. It runs from
    about 5" above the cavitation plate to the motor cover. It is fairly
    distinctive because it makes the motor look fairly fat through this
    area. I also don't think that Evinrude made a 35 in the late sixties.
    
    					Kenny

    
    Call any boatyard yard and give the parts department the model number.
    They can tell you exactly what it is.
    
    It does sound like a 40HP unit though (I just sold a 1963 LarkV which
    was a 40hp unit) They are strong little buggers ...
    
    Doug.

RE: Note 681.11
>>   Also anyone know of someone who still services Evinrudes?

I ass-u-me you're referring to shops which still service *old* Evinrudes?
There are thousands of dealers who service Evinrudes, but not many of them
will touch a motor of that vintage.  And even fewer will work on the electric
shift lower unit.

You didn't say whether you've bought the motor or not.  If you're still in
the "looking" stage, check the operation of electric shift lower unit VERY
carefully before buying.  They're almost impossible to get parts or service 
for, and in most cases the motors are just thrown away when the lower unit 
goes.  A friend of mine paid big dollars several years ago to have one fixed.
It broke again a week later, and the mechanic just told him "sorry, there's
no guarantee on these things and I'm not touching it again".  He never did 
find anyone else who would work on it and ended up selling the boat.

I wouldn't go as far as to say you shouldn't buy this motor, just don't pay
too much money for it.  Go easy on the lower unit, don't hit anything, and 
keep it away from salt water (the electric shift solenoids don't like salt).
And if/when the lower unit goes, plan on replacing the motor.

Now if you can find a "mechanical shift" 40hp motor, go for it.  These things
are workhorses that'll go forever.  I just sold a '61 40hp two years ago that
ran like a charm, and the friend mentioned above is still running a '62 model.

Rick W.

One other thing I forgot to mention, my guess is that the motor is a 
1963 40 hp.  The serial number generally does not give that info, it
just increases incrementally with each one built.  As someone else
mentioned, any Evinrude dealer can decipher it for you.

    		 	model # 40363D    serial# E01068
                                ^^ ^^
                                 |  |--  1963
                                 |-----  40 hp

I believe that 1963 is around the time they switched to the electric 
shift "feature".  My friend's 1962 is mechanical shift, and another 
friend had a '64 that was electric. 

Rick W.

    I have a shop manual which deciphers the model and serial. I will post
    the info for you later today. We just got an older 40 hp running with
    minimal effort and it's a great motor. LARKV
    ...Larry

    
    The electric shift lower units are easy to work on. The hard (and
    expensive) part is finding the electric (chinese finger) coils
    for the older units as they are no longer manufactured. 
    
    You can find lots of part motors in boatyards with these electric
    shifts and a whole parts motor will cost you much less than 1
    coil will.
    
    If you change the lubricant on schedule (There is a special lubricant
    for electric shifts) they are as dependable as any manual shift.
    If you put standard lower end lub in an electric shift lower end
    then you will run into trouble in short order.
    
    Doug.

    
    		WOW! Never figured I would get this kind of response.
    To answer a couple of questions...The price was very right $0.
    It appears to have been cared for throughout its life. I was given
    the whole boat/motor/trailer and about the only thing worth keeping
    was the outboard (even spelled it right :'}) I am still kind of
    looking an el-cheapo boat to go along with it to use as a work/dive
    boat.
    
    	If the person with manual finds the info I would really appreciate
    the model and or serial translation being posted here!
    
    	Once again, Thanks all.

    They did make selectric shifts in '62.  I had a 75 hp Evinrude with
    one...what a workhorse.
    FWIW
    Doug

RE: Note 681.17 
>>    The electric shift lower units are easy to work on.

Either they made different versions of the electric shift, or you're 
a better mechanic than I am!  I saw one apart from a later model 50hp
once, and all the kings horses and all the kings men couldn't have put 
that sucker back together.  The guy who took it apart gave up on it,
and was having a hard time giving it away.


RE: Note 681.19 
>>    They did make selectric shifts in '62.  I had a 75 hp Evinrude with
>>    one...what a workhorse.

I think the bigger motors got the electric shift first.  My friends '62 40hp
has mechanical shift.

Don't get me wrong, the electric shift is fine *when it works*.  But the 
day the thing gives up, in *my opinion* it's time for the average Joe to 
look for another motor.  For the unbeatable price of $0, it's definitely
worth using the motor for as long as it lasts.

Rick

    
    OMC made both electric and mechanivcal shift motors in the 60's and
    70's- my 74 245 HP I/o is an electric shift- they work great!
    
     I've had bith kinds apart- the lectric shift is no big eal - if it
    goes south- pick up a parts motor and it's pretty easy ro convert if
    you have the lower unit and some of the mechanical linkages
    
    
    the 35 HP was available in mechanical shift only- th e40Hop was a
    similar,
    but different motor all the way through. el shift came in 40,
    50,55,60,65.75 and 90 Hp motors and I susprect soem others in the
    higher HP range.
    
    
    
     They are pretty simple- but not as simple as the mechanical shift-
    but in my estimation, a lot less troble prone IF-- you use th e correct
    lubicant (type C) and don't get salt water in the lower unit
    
     The lark V 40 hp is a good motor- the early 40's were made with a cast
    Iron crankshaft that had a nasty habit of breaking in two- the later
    ones (61/62 and newer) were steel forged cranks that were toygh as
    H****
    
     Thos eold 40's will run forever- they are also notorious for being
    thirsty . I replaced a 1960 40 HP Johnson- (same as Evinrude- different
    color) with a 72 85 hp Chrysler- and ended up using less fuel!
    
     That motor , if given reasinable care, is pretyy tough to kill- a lot
    more rugged than the vewer ones in my estimation!
    
    
    
    Dick
    
           
    

	Seems like this is getting into an 'old engine' conversation so I thought 
I would put in a plug for an old evinrude I had til last year.

It was a 1964, Evinrude sport four (v four powerhead) with a heavy duty 
lower unit. What a beast!!! The engine had umpteen million hours on it 
and it pured like a kitten. (Your right about thirsty!!! this bad boy loved
gas!)

What amased me most was to see the #'s of them still pushing hulls around! 
It was incredible when I was on Winni to see all these engines out there. As
a result, I could get any part I needed and it was IN STOCK! I also bought
a shop manual and parts catalog direct from OMC. They had to go to there 
archive and make copies of the parts catelog 8^)  

I still see the engine out there in quinsig on the same boat (which was 
a 16' duo with a serious Hooked hull) I would have (if I had'nt bought
a new boat) put the engine on a different hull. It was a gem for sure!

I traded the boat motor and trailer to get my electrical service in my house 
upgraded from 60 amp and fuses to 200 amp circuit breaker service.

such a deal !!! (for me 8^)

Roger_who_admires_old_OMC_products!

btw: today they fit 200 hp into the same size this 60hp is... unreal!

    
    I've decided to re-build a '75/76 Evinrude 135. This engine has not
    been run for 8 years. It was put up in an enclosed garage at the end of
    the season in '84 with minimal winterizing. I plan to follow most steps 
    outlined in replies 1-5. This is on an '81 Regal 1650 Vhull.
    
    My question is, can a topend rebuild be accomplished with, other than a
    stepladdder ;*), the engine on the boat? I know it will be easier to 
    work on with a stand, but how about some input on
    experiences/observations-
    
    Thanks! 
                       
    Kim
    
                     

    Assuming you're talking about a full rebuild, the answer is no.
    In order to split the crankcase and pull it apart, the powerhead
    has to be removed from the tower assembly.
    
    If it could be done on the boat, you'd be better off removing
    the powerhead and working on a bench anyway.  I don't know
    whether your motor has loose needle bearing or they're enclosed
    in cages. If they're loose, they'd be everywhere if you tried
    a rebuild on the boat.
    
    My question - why do you plan to do a rebuild?  Unless the motor
    was already beat, or has frozen up (rusted) while stored, you 
    should be able to get it running well with a good tuneup, cleanup,
    and a little lubrication.  Have you tried this yet, or do you know 
    of some other reason it needs to be rebuilt?
    
    Rick

    
    Thanks, Rick, for the reponse. I was considering rebuilding because the 
    first 7-8 years the engine was exposed to 10 month ski seasons, pulling
    double barefooters, tricks and mostly WAO operation. Then boom!-put up
    one October and never cranked again. I felt this a good time to tear it
    down and go over everything and avoid problems later. Maybe I should
    remove the cylinder heads and check for rust on the walls and if not
    too bad, go the Mystery Oil/move things slow route? How about replacing
    the water pump impeller? 
    This engine is completely original-only plugs and a couple of
    power-packs were ever replaced and it has lived in central Florida in
    fresh water only. As you may have guessed, the boat and I are about 600
    miles apart and I am posing some preliminary questions.  
    I guess my dilemma is: spend ~500 bucks to rebuild or go for it with
    crossed fingers and know I can always rebuild.
    Hmmm-
    
    Thanks for the input!
      

    I recently picked up a 2HP air-cooled Suzuki outboard for my kids to
    use on my inflatable (actually, given the problem I'm having getting my
    real boat in the water, I might even keep it :-).  This engine has had
    little use but was delivered to me with a tankful of 2-3 yr old gas! 
    Not wanting to dump the gas illegally (and not knowing how to dispose
    of it legally, and it was such a beautiful day yesterday...), I decided
    to try to start the engine and use it.   It indeed started and ran more
    or less fine.
    
    Was this a dumb idea?  I know gas deteriorates with time, but the only
    problems I saw were
    
     (1) The engine would stall easily at minimum throttle (there is no
    shifter, it's always in gear).
    
     (2) It ran best, even when warm, about 1/3 to 1/2 choked.  (In fact it
    was impossible to warmstart with an open choke).
    
    Are the above symptoms of old gas?   Will they go away with clean gas?
    Is there an additive you can use to clean out gum/varnish?
    
    p.s. (I pulled the plug and it looked practically unused.  Any point in
    changing it?)

    I don't think it was a dumb idea, but I probebly would have dumped it
    out and added it to the gas tank of one of my cars, well diluted with
    hi-test.
    
    Yes, there is an addititive that will (help) remove gum and varnish.
    It is called "GUMOUT". Get the can that is meant to be added to the
    gas, not the spray can that is for spraying on carbs.
    
    I regularly burn my year-end outboard gas in the cars. The 2% oil
    content is not enough to cause problems - and if it is diluted 10:1,
    it becomes only 0.2% oil.
    
    Bill
    

    
      It is a little better not to use it in your outboard if it is old.
    The reason is that the oil also deteriorates as does the gas. What that
    means is that the oil will not be lubricating as well as it would when
    it was new, once it has been mixed for a while. You can use the gas in
    your car, but it may be a little better to use it someplace like a lawn
    mower or some other motor that does not have fuel injection or a
    catalytic converter, both of which *could* (But probably not) be
    clogged or otherwise damaged a bit by the oil and or gum in the old
    fuel.
    
    				Kenny

    I agree that you should have used it in your car, or at the least mix
    the old gas in with a fresh oil/gas mix.  I had the exact same symptoms
    with my 25 HP Johnson last year with a tank of gas that had sat only
    over the Winter in a capped tank.
    The symptoms you describe are consistent with old gas.
    
    Jeff