Conference 7.286::dcu

    You aren't totally out of the woods.
    
    DCU has signed up with POCKETBANK [the NH network].  POCKETBANK
    has now signed on to CIRRUS [the same as the Xpress-24s].
    
    When I have tried my card, it used to say "Ooop.  ACK!", to paraphrase.
    Now, it says my card is restricted at this terminal.  It seems that
    DCU is getting closer to Cirrus [while keeping Plus] but isn't there
    yet.

    I don't think that Cirrus permits its members to also belong to
    Plus.  ATM networks are now at the same state that bank credit cards
    were at a few years ago; remember when banks could be Visa or
    MasterCharge, but not both?
    
    This past weekend, I tried my DCU card at a POCKETBANK in Salem (next
    to Service Merchandising), and it refused my transaction.  A Cash
    Network machine up the road worked fine.  So I wonder if Pocketbank
    is switching allies, and whether the DCU card will continue to work
    with Pocketbank.  (Of course, my experience could just be due to
    some hardware glitches.)  
    
    Even if DCU were to switch to Cirrus, I doubt they would lift the
    transaction fee.  In general, every transaction by anyone at a given
    ATM results in a fee charged to the user's bank by the bank owning the
    ATM.  Many banks don't pass on these charges to their customers, since
    they can balance out overall (more or less).  However, since DCU
    doesn't have a large number of public ATMs, they don't make much money
    on transactions at DCU machines with cards from other banks.
    
       Gary 
           

    For what little it's worth, my other credit union made the decision
    to absorb BayBank's per-transaction fees for deposits, transfers,
    and balance inquiries, but to assess .50 per withdrawl.  It passes
    on the fees for transactions done at non-BayBank ATMs.  The credit
    union has no ATMs of its own.

    DCU not on a "Real" ATM network?
    
    In my travels around the country I have used my ATM card on the
    PLUS system in the following cities:
    
    	San Fransisco, CA
    	Washington, DC
        Atlanta, GA
        Seattle, WA
        Portland, OR
        New York, NY
    
    When Ever I have been on the road and needed cash, I could get it!!
    Maybe the fact you are looking in New England makes you a little
    near sited.  True, it cost me $ .75, but when you need cash it's
    there.
   
    -Kevin

                              <<<A T M>>>
    Also here in Puerto Rico DCU members are waiting the day when the
    union hooked up ATM'S service to any local bank in Puerto Rico.
    ATM is the best thing that have bank to make easy to customers make
    banking transactions.
    
    Ricardo

    True, The DCU does not have a "REAL" ATM, but some are around. 
    When I was in COlorado, an ATM was set up in the DIgital Facility.
    It provided you with all the functions you wanted, but you did NOT
    get charged for any transactions.
    
    Granted, in order to get to the ATM you had to go into work, but
    perhaps there was another motive for that?  8^)

    I'd be the first to grant that there are BIG regional differences in
    the quality of ATM network services.  In Massachusetts, the PLUS
    system maps to MONEC, which is highly variable in its availability.
    The dominant network here is CIRRUS, due entirely to the large number
    (nearly 2000) of BayBank Xpress-24 machines throughout the state.
    
    In Colorado, however, the roles are reversed.  MINIBANK is the major
    local network, and it's associated with the PLUS system.  The only
    CIRRUS affiliate I found a year ago was First Interstate Bank's
    Day/Night tellers; were are about 3 in Denver.
    
    It's hard to satisfy everyone if the national networks are mutually
    exclusive.  What I'd like to see is some evidence that DCU had all this
    in mind when it decided to provide ATM access in the first place. 

    I was talking with my friends at DCU about this today.  I guess
    BayBank is the real problem the Credit Union did not go with CIRRUS
    in the first place, as it is the regional CIRRUS connection.  From
    what I was able to learn, apparently CIRRUS is not very happy with
    BayBank either and both DCU and CIRRUS are talking directly with
    one another.
    
    	Personally, I'm VERY happy with PLUS, as I've always been around
    a machine which took my Card (except for last Mother's Day, which
    is a horror story MANY of us beat to death before DCU was accorded
    its own NOTESfile).
    
    I was also led to expect that joining CIRRUS may be possible while
    DCU is still a part of PLUS.

    For the Colorado system in Colorado Springs we can use any PLUS
    system machine.  If you use any other machine than the one located
    at the facility then DCU charges you $ .75 for each transaction.

Well, my DCU card did work at the Shawmut machine outside SPAGS - what 
more could you want (don't know which 'network' it was though)

	Elsewhere in this file I thought I read that DCU was no longer going
to allow transactions throught the PLUS network (I'm in Colorado where the
PLUS system is dominant). Today I talked to a teller (at our local DCU branch)
who said that CIRRUS was going to absorb the PLUS system and the DCU ATM cards
would then work with any CIRRUS or PLUS ATM.

Chuck

    Well, my old EasyCash24 works fine at a Cirrus ATM here in California.
    Sure surpised me that it worked!

    My ATM card stoped working in the MONEC machines sometime this
    summer.  I was told by DCU that they had to remove everyone
    from MONEC to allow access to PLUS and Pocketbank (My card
    USED to workin BOTH MONEC and PLUS).  IN my september statement
    there was a note from DCU saying that they were switching 
    from the PLUS system to the CIRRUS system, and that all members
    would be getting new cards mailed to them during September.
    Here it is, the end of October, and no new cards.  Now my card
    ONLY will work in the actual DCU ATM'S !  When I called and
    checked on it, they told me my card 'should' be working fine!
    Good thing I live near Maynard....
    
    

        re .13 - there's another note somewhere that says cards
        will be mailed in October, rather than September.  (Apparently
        the hold-up is with the company that makes the cards, or
        the plastic, or something.)
        
        My (old) card worked in non-DCU ATM just a week ago.
        The machine was in the DeMoulas supermarket in Tewksbury.
        
Jim Stratton
        

                I got my new card yesterday (saturday the 17th).
        Obviously I haven't tried it yet.
                
                /s/     Bob
                
 p.s. Since we are now on CIRRUS (which apparently includes TX according
        to the card), can I access my other banks stuff via their card
        on the DCU machines??

    I recieved my card of worthlessness last week. THe choice to go
    to cirrus may have been a good change for some but has not been
    for me. Here in the colorado springs area the plus system machines number
    300+ the cirrus 15 total. This has made my card worthless to me.
    When I contacted the headquarters in MA I was told "I guess you
    are SOL then" this change is for the better for *most* members.
    I dont know if plus is being absorbed by cirrus but today the plus
    system machine said " unknown account number".
    My plus card worked at 7-11,safeway,ski areas,shopping malls,ect
    the cirrus card has no value to me if I cannot use it in or very
    close to my present location. With plus the closest machine was
    a 3 minute walk from my home with cirrus the closest machine is
    a 20 min. drive. I find it difficult to belive this is a benefit to me.
    
    Up until this point I have held DCU with a high opinion that dropped
    to the bottom of the barrel and I'm now considering closing my account
    and moving my business to a bank that can offer services that are
    useful in MY area. I'm told that if I were in new england I would
    have them (ATM's) everywhere BUT I'M NOT IN NEW ENGLAND!!
             
    -j                                                                
    
    

    YOU TELL 'EM J !!!!!!
    
    
    
    JIM WEST
    COLORADO SPRINGS, COLORADO
    
    
    P.S. I only found one CIRRUS machine here in town...
    
    

    Re .16 and .17
    
    I will only do this once more, and then I will stop trying to defend
    DCU on this point.  The DCU would probably LOVE to have both PLUS
    AND CIRRUS available to their cards.  However, THOSE TWO SYSTEMS
    ARE BEING IRRATIONAL IN NOT ALLOWING CARD HOLDERS TO ACCESS BOTH.
     It is my understanding that both CIRRUS and PLUS have made a rule
    that their customers may ONLY HAVE ONE OR THE OTHER, NOT BOTH. 
    Thus, since the vast majority of members are in the CIRRUS locality,
    I guess that the logical choice was CIRRUS.  I am very sorry that
    these two networks are being so stupid.  PLUS is losing a great
    deal of business from our friends in Colorado and other places.
     It would appear to me that the PLUS system should change their
    policy.  Will they?  I doubt it unless they start to lose money.
    
    In any case, I don't believe DCU did this on purpose.  Are there
    any other networks available in Colorado?  Maybe DCU could latch
    onto that one.
    
    Ed..
    

    The main system in colorado is plus system the others are specific
    to a bank and only accept the cards of the banks members.
    DCU will lose business because they made a mindless decision that
    dident consider their customers in locations such as colorado.
    I could care less if plus and cirrus wont allow DCU to use both
    what I do care about is how this effects me and their apparent lack
    of effort to meet my needs. This point is further proven by the
    fact it takes DCU 3 weeks to approve a new car loan when I can walk
    into another credit union here in town and get the same loan in
    45 minutes.
    
    re.18 Why defend POOR SERVICE??? 
    
    -j

    Is the San Francisco Bay Area only Bank of America is on the Plus
    System.  But *NOT* all of there ATM are on PLUS, in fact only about 3%
    are.  This means about 30 or PLUS machines in the Bay area for about
    3-4 million people.  But Cirrus are ALL First interstate, Great
    Western, Pacific Bank, and many other ATMs; a number in the several
    hundreds. 
    
    Did you notice that DCU is on the AMEX CashNow Network?  I'd bet
    that where more than a few of those in the Springs.  In fact, I'll
    enter a list of them tomorrow.

    That would be nice to see a list since when I called their 1-800
    number I was told that there weren't any in the Springs....

        This Cirrus vs. The PLUS feud sounds kind of like the Ben&Jerry's
        vs. Haagen-Das feud.  It sounds VERY anticompetitive to me.
        But it's probably legal.  Sigh..
        
        Tom

    This is an official response by John Tilley of the DCU. The portion of
    that response, dated 5-January-1988, that applies to this topic note is
    included below. See note 2.22 for more information. 
    
    Whether you agree or disagree with the response from the DCU,
    *PLEASE* remember I'm just the MESSENGER.
    
    Carl Leeber
******************************************************************************
    CIRRUS & PLUS AT SAME BANK: There are banks in CT and CA (and probably
    other states) displaying both the CIRRUS and PLUS logos. However,
    they are for two different services. The PLUS machines are for ATM
    transactions and the CIRRUS machines are only for VISA credit card
    advances. Essentially the bank is a PLUS bank that coincidentally
    offers its VISA cardholders a fast cash advance outlet.
******************************************************************************

    This is an official response by John Tilley of the DCU. The portion of
    that response, dated 18-January-1988, that applies to this topic note is
    included below. See note 2.22 for more information. 
    
    Whether you agree or disagree with the response from the DCU,
    *PLEASE* remember I'm just the MESSENGER.
    
    Carl Leeber
******************************************************************************
    ATM LOCATION ADDITIONS:
    (with my appologies for the earlier omission)
    
    NASHUA, NH		Splitbrook Road (ZKO1)
    
    			Amherst St.	(DDD)
    			(Route 101A)
******************************************************************************

Being new to using DCU ATMs, I have found they have one feature (in common 
with Easytouch) that I view as a major flaw.  Whenever I'm checking balances, 
I check all of my account balances at once (I've got 4).  Easytouch makes me 
run thru each balance transaction from the top, which I always thought was bad 
enough.  Then I found that ATMs make you run thru the transactions from the 
top, but require me to access several different levels of menus to get all 4 
balances.  

It seems to me that it would be much simpler to present the user with a single 
transaction that provides all the account balances at once.  Would this be a 
major change to DCU's systems?  Or something easy to provide in the "next 
release?"

I'd be interested hearing a response from the DCU folks.

						     
							- JP

    Does anyone know if there's an ATM machine in St.Thomas
    US virgin islands that accepts the DCU card? I tried calling
    the 800 numbers on the packet the card comes in, but they
    say none exist in that area. I'll be down there the end of
    January and would like access to some of my money for
    SHOPPING. 
    
    Thanks for your help!
    
    pat

    RE: .26

    Hi Pat,

    We returned from St. Thomas a week ago.  Nice shopping!

    A thought to share with you...  

    All the reputable business establishments accept credit cards.  If you 
    purchase something, get home and there is a problem with the item, paying
    in cash and getting your money back can be a pain.  Paying with credit 
    cards give you an element of protection cash does not.

    Joe

    re:  .27
    
    Hi Joe,
    
    Thanks for tip about credit cards. I won't be able to do
    that, though cuz (insert embarrased look here) I'm just about
    at my limit on my visa card. I won't be taking an advanced
    vacation pay, so I was hoping to use some of that deposited
    money down there. Besides shopping, we want to ferry over
    to the other islands, rent a dinghy, etc. and the extra
    money would help. 
    
    Hope your trip was a good one! I CAN"T WAIT!!!!
    
    pat

    re: .28
    
    Use some of that money to pay off your credit card.  This will free
    up some of your credit line so that you can use it again, save you
    some interest charges, and to the extent that you make credit card
    purchases that are immediately charged against your credit limit,
    impose a healthy cap on the amount of spending you can do.
    
       Gary

    re:  .29
    
    I don't believe I asked for financial advice.....  8^)
    
    pat

    I'm sorry if I was patronizing.  I hope you still find the practical
    value, in terms of freeing up your credit card, helpful, whether
    or not you actually do so.  
    
    This reminds me of another option, namely contacting the issuer
    of your card and asking for an increased credit limit.  It's probably
    too late to get this in time for your trip, but it might be worth
    remembering for the future.
    
    No one wants to be caught without cash.  It's helpful to know a
    variety of options.
    
       Gary

    
    re: last few...
    
    The topic being discussed is ATM access, so please limit your comments
    to the question at hand.
    
    thanks,
    
    Your moderator.
    
    

    	My ATM card is cracking because I keep it in my wallet and sit
    on it all day. I called ATM and was told to turn my card in to a
    branch and they will order me a new one. It will take about 10 days
    to get the new card.
    	I think I will just continue to use the cracked one until it
    breaks in the ATM and jams up the works... or how would it be if
    they send me a new one without getting the old one first... or why
    do they need the cracked one anyway...
    	

	My guess would be that they want you to turn it in so that it won't
	get used to the point of breakage.  At least they don't charge for 
	new cards -- a bank I used to go through did that.

	Beverly

    	My concern is that I won't have a card for 10 days. I want them
    to send me a new card and then I will either destroy the old card
    or send the old card to them. If they are worried that I have 2
    cards .... so what!

.35> If they are worried that I have 2
.35>    cards .... so what!
    
    I think you've hit the nail on the head. They are paranoid about you
    having more than one card. I tried to get an extra, second card one
    time and they flatly refused. I don't know what their problem is - if I
    want a second card to keep in my files in case I lose the other one or
    if I want to give it to somebody else to use is my business.
    
    Any ideas why they have such a silly restriction?
    
    -Glenn-

    The obvious question: What if you lose your card?  (Or say you lost
    it?!)
    
    - Chris

    I believe the cards has sequential numbers on them appended to your
    account number. If you lose sequence #1 and report it and ask for a new
    one then sequence #1 is disabled won't work in ATM machines. Your new
    card number has your same account number but a new sequence number
    which the computer will accept.
    
    So if you lose your card, you lose the ATM service until you get the
    new card in the mail.
    
    -Glenn-

    Re <several>:
    
    I had the same problem with my BayBank ATM card.  They, too, insisted
    on invalidating the old card until a new one could be issued.  I guess
    this is a common practice in the industry.
    
    Once the old card has been invalidated, it doesn't matter much whether
    you're still sitting on it, have turned it in, or have destroyed it. 

        Why do they need the old one back if it won't work anymore?

    Re .40:
    
>   Why do they need the old one back if it won't work anymore?
    
    Never ask "why" of the tiny minds that seem so populous at financial
    institutions.  It does no good.

    I have a problem with access to the ATM in the CXN? building. I am a
    digital employee... but after normal business hours do not have access
    to the ATM machine due to the fact I do not have "key card" access to
    the building.
    
    WHY, is the ATM not accessable from the entry way of this building.
    There are no on site security folks to allow the door to remain
    unlocked. There is no way to get key card access unless you have an
    office at CXN.
    
    In my opinion, this was poor planning and a good example of the lack
    for customer concern the DCU folks show toward people west of Mass.!
    
    I use to live in Mass. and always had good service while there, from 
    the DCU personnel. I would always here these types of stories and
    wonder why people would say such things about such a caring
    orginization. Well, now I know... cause I'm getting a taste.
    
    If there is going to be a 24hr ATM, lets make it accessable to everyone
    on a 24 hour basis.
    
    

    
    RE: -.1
    
>    In my opinion, this was poor planning and a good example of the lack
>    for customer concern the DCU folks show toward people west of Mass.!
    
    This same situation exists in Marlboro (MR3).
    
    I guess sometimes the buildings that get machines just don't have a
    place in the lobby or accessible from outside the building.
    

The CXN/1 ATM is located in the south lobby of the building.  If you park in 
the west parling lot at the south end of the building, you can just walk into
the little vestibule and use the machine.  To gain entry to the building from 
the south lobby, you need a card key, but the card-key is inside the vestibule
beyond the ATM.

Maybe you are thinking of the CX01 ATM which is only accessible during working 
hours?

BobW

    Well, this notesfile is a great tool....
    
    I was led to beleave (by a DCU employee) that the ATM at CXN/1 was
    beyond the vestibule area, behind the card reader.
    
    Thank you for the information on the correct location of the machine.!
    
    Bob G.
    CXO3
    

    Another ATM issue which is beginning to bother me somewhat is the fact
    that the ATM in CXO3 has been "out of service" a great deal. They call
    in service people to work on the machine at least once per month.
    
    If this machine is in such bad shape, why don't they replace the thing
    with a machine that is operational.?
    
    When you pass several money machines on the way to work cause you know
    there is one in your building (save a buck), it's real disheartening to
    find the machine DOA when you step up to it.
    
    Oh well.., such is life.! I might even servive such a problem.!!
    
    Bob G.
    

    Well..., so soon I am back in here writing another entry about the ATM
    at CXO3.
    
    This machine now spends more time down... out of service ...then it
    does in operational condition.
    
    Being in this building, there is little else to do but to wait until
    the thing is fixed (last time it took only about 3 days (or so)). With
    short breaks and bad weather, it is nearly impossible to get down to
    CXO1 to the DCU there. 
    
    LET'S EITHER FIX THIS MACHINE OR GET IT REPLACED WITH SOMETHING THAT
    WORKS!!!! 
    
    It may be time to really start looking for a new place to do business.!
    
    Bob G.
    

    
    
      FWIW, I get in around 07:00 at CX03, and it's been up every
    morning, at least, for the last 2 months or so. 
    
       They do close the machine every day around 14:00 or so
    for balancing, retreiving deposits, and probably to put more
    cash in it.
    
       What time do you get to it?
    
    
    STeven
    
    

    Well, I get in at approximately 5:45am, so if I have business with the
    DCU, I try and do it then... BUT they usually turn the circuit to PKO
    over to run batch which is left like that 'til the DCU in CXO1 opens in
    the am (after 7:am). I've attempted to use the machine at various times
    throughout the day.... some times it's working, MOST times it's not, or
    it is down for (as you say) balancing.
    
    I can handle the balancing.... it's necessary.! What I can not handle
    is that the machine was down from 05:45 till about 13:45... then they
    deside to take it down for the balancing after that... SO.. it was down
    at least another 45 minutes. I leave work at 2:pm so... unless I want
    to stick around waiting for the balancing to finish, I either have to
    stop by CXO1, wait until the next day OR (if it's just cash I need) go
    to a "money machine" and pay the buck for the transaction.
    
    I've been able to work through the situations. My only point in
    entering this at all is that I'm beginning to feel as some others do
    about the fact that if you live west of Massachusetts, the DCU really
    doesn't react/respond to these problems as quickly as they should.
    
    If an ATM should fail in eastern Massachusetts (DCU ATM), that thing
    would be jumped upon in a heartbeat... to insure it was back in service
    quickly. When I lived in Massachusetts, I would think people here in CX
    were just crying.... I know now how they feel..!
    
    It's an eye opening experience.!
    

    
    Although I primarily use other cash machines for money, I would
    like to know if an ATM machine is slated for Bedford, mass?
    
    I work here at BUO and there is a branch of the DCU here...
    But the nearest DCU ATM is a good 20-30 minute drive from here.
    
    There is space in the lobby, and there is a 24 hour security guard.
    Also, there would be 24 hour access without the need for a keycard.
    
    If there is no ATM slated for here, then why???  There are a LOT
    of people that work here odd hours and would appreciate the convenience
    of being able to do banking business other than from 8-1,then 2-4.
    C.J. Mouton
    
    

I believe that another criteria is that Digital has to own the building, which,
in the case of Bedford, they do not.

    I'm considering moving my checking account to the DCU, but first I
    want to find out what ATM services (switches) they use.  Can I get
    money at an ATM that services YANKEE 24, NYSE, or what?  Or do I
    have to get to a credit union office to get cash?  

    According to the back of my card, the DCU Easy-Cash 24 card can be used
    in Cirrus and Yankee 24 machines.

But it costs you a buck per transaction. Go with a local bank that doesn't
charge for ATM services (whether they are the banks ATMs or not) and you'll
save a bundle...

-Glenn-

    
    	Could anybody provide some DCU ATM locations available for
    	both deposits and withdrawls near:
    
    	Lowell, MA
    	Worcester, MA (Actually Auburn)
    	Seabrook, NH
    	Bridgewater, NJ
    
    	Can I make a deposit at any network ATM that is not necessarily
    	DCU?  Somehow I don't trust making a deposit at a "foreign" ATM.
    
    	Joe Oppelt

    Boxborough (BXC) has an ATM, Littleton (TAY, LKG) and Nashua (ZKO,
    TTB and DDD?).  The only out of MA/NH area one I can think of is
    Colorado Springs.
    
    Good Luck!!
    
    Roberta

    
    there is one in Tewksbury (TWO ) 

There is also one in Hudson (HLO2?) and Marlboro (MRO3?).

Chuck

    
       And there is one at SHR3 in Shrewsbury, next to Worcester.
    
    	John
    

There was an announcement with this months statements that ATM's 
are being removed from 2-3 sites which have been sold/closed.

Are there any plans to install these ATM's at other DEC sites 
which do not currently have them? Like NIO?

daryll

An ATM is being installed here in NIO today!

thanks!

             <<< Note 16.60 by SALEM::DODA "Go Speed Racer, GO!" >>>

There was an announcement with this months statements that ATM's 
are being removed from 2-3 sites which have been sold/closed.

Are there any plans to install these ATM's at other DEC sites 
which do not currently have them? Like NIO?

daryll