Conference unifix::sailing

2100.0. "10,570 nm, Boston to SF" by SX4GTO::WANNOOR () Tue Nov 23 1993 20:46

    Winter in Boston, MA last year deposited dozens of inches of 
    snow on our decks and was one of the wildest in memory. We 
    purchased the Sea Star in December 1992 and sailing her to 
    Boston Harbour was a trial, because we had to chip ice off the 
    deck from Branford, CT up to The Race, off the tip of Long 
    Island! Then in spring we sailed from Boston to Maine to pick up 
    the Sea Star's salon table from the previous owner's summer 
    business, but we ran into an unforecast gale only 50 miles from 
    our destination, and had to opt for sea room P navigating amongst 
    all those little islands in a gale at night is no fun. As it turned
    out, we still have not had the time to fetch that table...
    
    There was one nice sail when we went out of Boston Harbour to 
    greet the Great American II (we had Pete Seuffert on board), 
    which sailed the world speed record 
    around the horn from San Francisco to Boston, beating the clipper 
    ship Northern Light Ts record; the spring weather was superb, and 
    we accompanied those intrepid navigators right up to their berth 
    next to the Boston Aquarium, surrounded by press boats, fire 
    boats spouting water in red, white and blue, and fellow mariners. 
    Incidentally, we were the only other sailboat in the harbour at the 
    time, as every other vessel was a motorboat...obviously, it was 
    still too early for sailors to have launched their boats. The season 
    there is a pathetic Memorial Day to Labor Day.
    
    So it is hardly surprising that we swore never to weather another 
    miserable winter in the frozen North East again, and decided to 
    move to San Francisco, where owning a boat is not a definition of 
    insanity. But how were we going to accomplish this? The answer, 
    of course, was to accomplish this trip by sail, so planning 
    commenced in earnest in March for a departure in early June.
    
    There were many things we did not have on board that would be 
    necessary for a 10,000 nautical mile cruise, such as alternative 
    power generation. After serious consideration, we decided upon a 
    wind generator, rather than a diesel or gas generator. Then there 
    was the issue of communications, and it was felt necessary to have 
    a marine/Ham SSB rig. As for navigation, convenience dictated a 
    GPS (considered a luxury by ex-deccie skipper Ray Thackeray, who 
    could navigate celestially, but I wanted the confidence level!). 
    
    Crew was a difficulty, and we advertised in three newspapers, on 
    the east and west coasts, and did not have many responses to 
    choose from. All those people who make up questionnaires and 
    match profiles of potential crew are living in a dream world, as far 
    as we could see. The best means of finding crew turned out to be 
    through electronic mail, using CompuServe, Internet and VAXnotes.
    
    Eventually, we found 8 people who joined and left at various 
    phases of the cruise, one being Haimo, a research high-
    energy physicist at CERN, Geneva!
    
    We planned to sail on June 4th, to arrive in San Francisco on 
    September 12th. Some might consider this to be an ambitious 
    schedule, but we were constrained by the amount of time I 
    could take for my leave of absence, amongst other considerations.
    
    The first leg was from Boston to Turks & Caicos Islands in the 
    Caribbean. We set off only two days late and, miraculously, 
    arrived on schedule, anchoring in the lee of West Caicos on June 
    20th. This was indeed remarkable, because we ran into a number 
    of problems, such as running into a gale off Cape Cod and losing 
    nearly all our diesel fuel overboard through a tank vent while 
    heeled; we decided afterwards that once the siphon action had 
    commenced, it continued until the tank was nearly emptied, 
    arguing the need for vent cocks and good anti-siphon loops! This 
    meant that we had almost no generation capability from the 
    alternator or propulsion during calms, and all this with $1,000 of 
    meat in the ice box! Fortunately, the two cubic feet of dry ice kept 
    most of it until we reached our destination; but in the meantime, 
    we had to sway up the wind generator, which we were not able to 
    install before setting off...
    
    This was done by Ray from the bosun's chair, under full sail in a 
    nasty swell, at 6 knots; it wasn't easy, because the Fourwinds unit 
    is heavy, and he had to drill four holes in the mizzen mast, line up 
    the bracket with the generator in situ (about 25 pounds), fit the 
    through bolts, and install electrics, brake and other ancillary 
    equipment. Once done, however, we were able to beat into the 
    wind (no swivel mounting was possible) and generate enough to 
    keep the refrigeration running a few hours per day.
    
    On June 15th, we saw a freighter cruising by, and hailed them for 
    a weather report. By this time, we had fried our batteries, and 
    were conserving all power for the lights. We did not have enough 
    energy for the SSB rig to listen frequently, but we thought weUd 
    risk a low-power transmission on the VHF. The Freighter RGood 
    FaithS replied, and gave us an excellent forecast, but even better, 
    their navigator Thomas asked us if there was anything we needed, 
    so we responded with a request to buy some #2 diesel oil from 
    them. As they were nearly hull-down over the horizon, I was not 
    very hopeful. Thomas immediately replied that they could not sell 
    us any fuel, but, RAs we are carrying 16,000 tons, we could see 
    our way to giving you some!S. Imagine our surprise when they 
    turned around to stop by the becalmed Sea Star and warped out a 
    life raft in which they had found, three weeks earlier, a Frenchman 
    after his boat went down! 
    
    The Good Faith is an old British ship, under German command 
    and with a Philippine crew, who serenaded us with guitars and 
    accordians as we filled our tanks with the 60 gallons of fuel from 
    the jerry cans they put into the liferaft, together with the can of 
    German cookies and chocolate! We sent the raft back with various 
    bottles of spirits and wines, with much gratitude, and were happy 
    to be back under way with power to our refrigerator and propeller 
    again.
    
    Just to let us know that we shouldn't get too cocky, however, the 
    very day we sighted the Caicos Islands we were alarmed to 
    discover huge billows of smoke from the engine room, convincing 
    everyone on board that we were on fire. It turned out to be the 
    engine controls wiring loom frying, which demanded a couple of 
    hours work before the engine could be started again, sans 
    alternator. This is when we ran out of fuel for the second time...
    
    There we were, anchored in the lee of an uninhabited island, faced 
    with an 18-mile sail directly into an easterly through a very 
    difficult 7 foot channel with coral heads all the way. Turks & 
    Caicos Island Police to the rescue! They came alongside in their 
    launch and passed us 12 gallons of fuel from a nearby dive boat, 
    and we were able to motor up to the Caicos Marina & Shipyard on 
    Providentiales, which had a stupendous array of equipment in an 
    old aircraft hangar, including dozens of lathes, drills, presses and 
    other machinery. All this, for an island with a population of just a 
    few thousand. It took us eight days to get our repairs made, then 
    on June 28th we departed for a four day trip through the 
    Windward Passage to Jamaica.
    
    We were accosted on VHF by a Coast Guard vessel at the 
    northern end of the Passage, but not boarded. They did, however, 
    want to know all our particulars, including registration numbers, 
    name, social security number, and birth date of the skipper! We 
    met another Coastie between Cuba and Jamaica, and it was 
    perhaps no surprise to note a Cuban gunboat on the other side of 
    us, at a three mile distance. They both shadowed us for a 
    morning, before we were well on our way to Montego Bay, which 
    we raised a day later.
    
    We docked at the Montego Bay Yacht Club, which must have 
    been a posh place at one time but now appears a little ramshackle; 
    the lobby had photos of the winners of the Miami to Montego Bay 
    Race, and we noticed Ted Turner's picture there. This is where we 
    met our friendly neighbourhood Autohelm service engineer, who 
    was sent to help us because we had burnt out our fifth course 
    computer in seven weeks! A configuration change solved the 
    problem, and the autopilot is working still. Once that was done, 
    after only four days, we set off for Panama.
    
    After a five day cruise through a sloppy sea, we arrived at 
    Cristobal Colon and proceeded to check in with the Canal 
    Authority and Port Captain, get the Sea Star admeasured, and after 
    two days were able to transit the canal for the 50 mile, 8-hour 
    motor through the three sets of locks. Plenty has been written 
    about the canal transit, so we won't go into details here; however, 
    it was most enjoyable and we experienced no problems. The canal 
    pilots we took on board were highly professional, and considering 
    everything else in Panama, did not hold out their hands for tips. In 
    fact, we were in a quandary over whether or not to tip them, but 
    they left in the launch happy and waving, even though we offered 
    nothing, except  breakfast , lunch and snacks. 
    
    In contrast, the Panama Customs and Immigration officials all 
    demanded 'beer money', for crying out loud. No finesse was 
    demonstrated by any of these bozos.
    
    A few more days at Balboa Yacht club repairing a few more things 
    that went wrong so far, such as bilge pumps (surprise, surprise), 
    and on July 16th the Sea Star set sail at midnight, through dozens of 
    anchored ships, out into the big scary Pacific for Hilo, Hawaii.
    I wasn't on this leg of the cruise.
    
    This leg of the cruise took much longer than anticipated. The 
    original plan was for five weeks, but the 5,800 nautical mile sail 
    took exactly eight weeks, due to the terrible trade wind conditions. 
    They had to motorsail to 2N before encountering the Southeast 
    trades south of the Inter-Tropical Convergence Zone, thereby 
    using up most of the fuel. Following the sailing directions in the 
    book 'World Cruising Routes' by Jimmy Cornell, which up to 
    this time had served us in good stead, they turned Northwest on the 
    Great Circle to Hilo once we reached 5N, 110W, again crossing 
    the ITCZ. This was the big mistake. In retrospect, better to have 
    continued in the Southeast trades, averaging 130nm per day, at 
    between 2 and 4N until about 130W and then turned up the 
    Hawaii. 
    
    They experienced truly horrible calms and light air most of the way 
    to Hawaii (150W) from 110W! They had many days of 
    wallowing, with a current taking them in any direction up to one and 
    a half knots. To punctuate this, there were three major hurricane 
    warnings, with Hurricane Fernanda passing by about 150nm to 
    the North on August 10th, with reported gusts up to 140 knots; 
    fortunately, they only experienced up to 37 knot gusts out of this, 
    which allowed them to sail for a short time, before being becalmed 
    again. Fernanda later went on the terrorize Hawaii on August 
    15th, just passing to the North with gusts up to 220 knots!
    
    Just as they were beginning to joke that they needed another 
    hurricane just to get them going again, it appeared in the form of 
    Hurricane Greg on August 20th, which passed 360nm to the 
    North. For some time, our projections on Universal Plotting 
    Charts put both Fernanda and Greg on direct collision courses 
    with the Sea Star, so they were understandably nervous; one of the 
    crew was convinced he was not going to live through the 
    experience, but he appeared to take it philosophically...what else 
    can you do 2,000 miles from anywhere?
    
    Reading Latitude 38 upon arrival in San Francisco, it is becoming 
    apparent that this is another El Nino year, a fact that escaped us at 
    the time the doldrums seemed to last forever, a total of about 
    three weeks during this eight week segment!
    
    The four on board at this time (Haimo, Tom, John and Ray 
    the skipper) were down to one meal and a single tea or coffee a 
    day for the last four weeks of rationing....the moral is to ensure 
    that you have extra contingency in canned meats, sauces, etc. 
    Although they arrived in Hilo with plenty of staples, such as pasta 
    and rice, they had no way of cooking it short of chopping up the 
    deck for firewood; we had one gallon of diesel, one pint of water 
    and no cooking fuel. Even the microwave was useless because the 
    inverter broke and they could not charge up the batteries sufficiently 
    to use it!
    
    When checking in with Hilo Customs, we got a big surprise... 
    although I am Malaysian and Ray is British, the Sea Star is 
    registered in Boston, MA and we are both permanent residents in 
    the US; therefore we always flew the Stars & Stripes. However, 
    US Customs informed us that the vessel takes on the nationality of 
    the owners; so in this case, we found that we now have to fly the 
    Union Jack and get a cruising permit every year to sail around the 
    US, which all seems a little silly considering we live here and pay 
    taxes like everyone else. Oh well, it's a good excuse to sail to 
    Mexico or Canada every year...and the Union Jack is pretty!
    
    Anyway, after two weeks in Hawaii sailing to Lahaina, Maui and 
    Honolulu, Oahu, we were ready for the final leg to San Francisco. 
    For those who wish to refuel, try the fuel dock at the Ala Wai 
    Yacht Basin, which sold us three hundred gallons at only $1.05 a 
    gallon, the best price we had seen anywhere.
    
    As for navigation, we had heard from various sources, many 
    books and some local people, that the bast route is to beat 
    Northeast or North until reaching the North Pacific High and the 
    Westerlies, then broad reach or run East to San Francisco. We 
    ignored this advice and decided to sail the great circle route, which 
    turned out to be the best decision of the entire cruise. The decision 
    was easier because we can motorsail for 1,000 out of the 2,300 
    miles assuming no engine or fuel problems.
    
    This assumption was the risky one, because we had seen our 
    share of bad fuel and algae in the tanks, but since Boston we had 
    gone through four refuellings, ten fuel filters and about 600 
    gallons. And with three complete changes of fuel filters left, it was 
    worth the risk.
    
    The sailing was nothing short of miraculous. We left Ala Wai on 
    September 27th and experienced five days of SE or ESE winds 
    wafting at a perfect 15-20 knots, then after a tropical depression 
    and gusts up to 31 knots, another five days of S or ESE winds, 
    putting us on beam- or broad-reach sailing. At 32N to 36N, we 
    had variable winds 8-15 knots which boxed the compass, then for 
    the last two days at about 37N, 126W, we ran into a moderate 
    gale with NNW winds that took us into the Gulf of the Farallones, 
    allowing us to drop anchor off Alameda on 17th October in 
    perfectly calm weather.
    
    It's hard to describe the feeling of exaltation upon seeing the 
    Golden Gate Bridge, then sailing underneath, to motor into the 
    Bay in crystal clear calm, then dropping the anchor at midnight, 
    after a total distance of 10,570 nautical miles!
    
    As for things we would have done differently, the most important 
    would have been to install extra forms of alternative energy 
    generation. Our wind generator, on a non-rotating mount, was 
    insufficient and could well have been supplemented by a few big 
    solar cells. Also, an extra high-current alternator on the engine 
    would have been a boon, because the one we have is only a 60 
    amp unit. Of course, one of these fine days we will mount the 
    wind generator on a swivel on top of the mizzen mast. We'd also 
    like to install an alternator on the propeller shaft, if someone could 
    show us how to do it.
    
    And next time, we will plan at least a month at each landfall, to 
    allow time to cruise the islands and simply drop the hook and 
    relax. Extra time available to do repairs would have been great, 
    because we found ourselves running around like crazy trying to 
    find parts, etc. to stay on schedule. We took 16 weeks to complete 
    the entire cruise from Boston.
    
    Finally, don't forget to pack enough booze. And tell your crew to 
    bring their own, or your supply will be gone half-way there!
    
    Ashikin

    A daunting list of equipment failure...
    
    Great story, something I always wanted to do.  But the electrical stuff
    just kept burning, blowing up, failing.  There's got to be a better
    way.
    
    

    Some of the renowed world sailors (Tristan Jones for one) are convinced
    that 'fancy equipment' (alternators, engines, batteries, electronics)
    are SO prone to failure at sea (as your experiences so aptly
    demonstrated) that one is better off to rely on the wind (not engines)
    and hand (sextant) navigation.  Granted, that is an extremist point of
    view but those with that point of view DO have some valid points.
    
    It sounds to me as if you had a more or less routine trip.  Really, I
    mean that.  Glad you made it safely.
    
    Jeff
    

    This is from a power boat owner.  I am curious as why there is so many
    equiptment failures (the 'fancy' stuff) on sail boats?  Not just this
    passage.  This notes file is full of engine, equiptment and electronics
    failure stories.  What is different on a sail boat that makes the 
    equiptment fail at such a high rate? 
    
    Thanks KC
    
      
    
    
    
    

    Maybe its a biased sample.  i.e. Do power boaters tend to go on such
    long off shore trips compared to sailboats?  That is, comparing size
    to size.  i.e. how many 40 foot power boats make a Boston to L.A.
    trip compared to 40 foot sailboats?  
    
    Jeff

Boat electronics fail a lot because many of the installations are not up
to the rather rigorous standards needed to ensure reliability in a salty
marine environment. Keeping electrical and electronic equipment alive in salt
air is inherently difficult, because most of the materials involved (e.g.
copper) corrode very quickly just from exposure to the salt air. Add to this
long hours on the water, operation at various angles of heel, and continuous
diesel engine vibration, and you've got a recipe for failure.

When I went to Bermuda with Jeff Gardiner, we didn't have a fridge, so we
didn't really need electricity for anything. We only had 30 gallons of fuel,
so there wasn't any point in running the motor, except to recharge the
batteries to offset the power we used for running lights and radios. We used
a windvane for steering, so no power was burned to drive an autopilot.
Strangely, we had NO electrical failures :-). Of course, we did have some
trouble with the windvane...

FWIW, I spent some time on the Sea Star last winter, and I'd guess that many
of the problems Ashikin and Ray experienced are the result of less-than-perfect
construction, compounded by a few years of neglect by her prior owner. A long
cruise has a way of making all these shortcomings apparent in a very short
period of time!

Congrats, Ashikin and Ray, for actually doing what many of us just dream about!

--RS

    re: previous 
    
    I recently read a story in Sea magazine about a couple (plus crew) who
    circumnavigated in a large motor yacht (60 or 70 feet) over a three
    year period.  They claimed to have one equipment failure, a cabin air
    conditioning unit gave out about half way around.  Granted this was a
    new custom built yacht, but the question about motor vs. sail boat
    equipment failures is an interesting one.  Another possibility is that
    sailboats are designed to be wet, eg. they are low on the water and can
    generally take a lot of water over the hull and cabin, where motor
    boats are not as likley to get as wet.
    
        Howard

    
    	You're all missing a biggie here. Sails do NOT turn 100A
    alternators. Cat Lehmans, Fords, Detroit Diesels of the multihundred HP
    variety can crank out pretty much whatever you want.
    
    	Power boats can go as far as a tank of fuel will take them.
    Sailboats don't have this restriction. And wind has not yet been taxed!
    
    	I'll agree with the exposuer bit- how many pilothose sailboats are
    out there? And a big boxy powerboat is something else to handle in a
    big seaway. You don't see the large-volume planing hulls scooting out
    on overcast blustery days. Less taxing on the steering units.
    
    	I'm just saying that more sailboats in the under-50-foot range can
    be found offshore, so of course things are getting busted.
    
    	A better question is, why can't they make a indestructable
    autopilot?
    
    	Time to charge the batteries...
    
    	Scott.

    There's even more to the consideration.  First 6knts verses 16knts or
    even 26knts.  Equates to time at sea (or lake).  The average PB run to
    Put-in-Bay is 60min.  That's 31mi!  If the wind is SSE (the rhumbline)
    you can guess how long (31 x 1.4 / 6) sailpower takes.  Why do sailors 
    do it this way...the trip means more than the arrival.
    
    Secondly, a lot of good a small craft warning does when posted for this
    afternoon when you are 26mi out.  So you take the 40knt winds, your
    boat takes it too and both get beat up pretty good.  Only you heal and
    it can only heel.  Most 30+ PB skippers would (wisely) take it in with
    dispatch.  We do too.  Just takes a while....
    
    Thirdly, many skippers consider the electronics as devices.  This is
    subtly incorrect.  It is implies constant usefulness, sort of like
    silverware.  It is a resource instead.  Of finite capacity.  Each use
    degrades the level of performance and time remaining on the MTF. (mean
    time to failure).  Seen in this light, stuff gets used only when there
    is no practical choice, and gets preventitive service at every
    opportunity.  (bet I'm one of the few whose Loran went to Skipper
    Marine every other year for inspection/calibration).
    
    Finally, complexity.  Think of all the forces at work.  4000# of lead
    keel leveraging the hull upright.  Half that pushing the spar to
    leeward, 5000# of tension on the weather rigging to counter this, 2000#
    on the sheets and so on.  All to generate about 30# of thrust.  Hand
    built by temporary help at minumum wages and often design by consortium
    where acceptable is good enough.  
    
    The last is toughest to deal with in my opinion.  My '88 Soverel spent
    its first four months coming unbolted.  Mostly workmanship problems
    from the dealer but some from the builder (Tartan).  The latest being
    just last week, when I "discovered" a loose battery mount platform that
    was threatening to invade the cabin by smashing through the liner after
    detaching itself from the three #10 wood screws and single layer of GRP
    cloth on the aft edge.  This thing mounts two 165 amp/hr monsters that
    weigh about 80# apiece.  Three wood screws, geez.
    
    I won't relate the main halyard wrapped around the masthead electrical
    harness, or the lack of a hoseclamp on the shaft packing gland, or the
    lack of Gibb stops on the running backstays or the missing fuel stop
    return spring on the Yanmar (always on fuel stop) or.........you get
    the idea.
    
    /bob
    
    

    We still own a powerboat (for sale!) in Rhode Island, and can speak
    from both sail and power experiences. The powerboat was built in 1978,
    the Sea Star in 1982. The powerboat has probably not been underway more
    than a total of 1,000 hours, the Sea Star for 2,000 hours SINCE JUNE
    1993! This may give some insight into why sailors prefer low-tech,
    simple solutions rather than "devices".
    
    To look at the failures we had in the cruise:
    
    Autopilot
    
    This was originally installed in May. The five course computers blown
    out were due to Autohelm specifying that it could drive a type 3
    reversing hydraulic pump, when it couldn't. They were asking the
    customer to be the test bed. When we had the traditional
    constant-running pump installed, the autopilot ran from Jamaica to San
    Francisco (when we had the energy to run it...).
    
    Engine wiring harness
    
    This was due to an ammeter being led to the cockpit with the other
    instruments instead of a voltmeter and not being fused. A short blew
    the ammeter wire and all the other wires too. Bad original installation
    of the diesel, fixed by putting in a voltmeter and new harness.
    
    Batteries fried
    
    Due to not enough alternative power generation and too much reliance on
    refrigerator, SSB, radar, lights etc. (remember, we sailed all day AND
    all night, something stinkpotters almost never do).
    
    While at the Montego Bay Yacht Club, we had the Opel C, which is a
    bigger sistership to the famous Octopussy, dock next to us. Because
    they asked us to move over from a comfortable dock space, the captain
    took us out for the night for drinks. They had just cruised in from the
    Med., about 2,500nm, and his engineer had to work full time to keep all
    systems working properly, and they had a major failure of a generator
    during this time. This, on a multi-million dollar yacht!
    
    So, we had our failures.
    
    But that was only natural for such an arduous cruise, on a minimally
    maintained 10 year old sailboat.
    
    Our Bayliner can only go for 150 miles before it needs refuelling....
    And in the last two years we've had to rebuild the stern drive, replace
    the engine, replace a bilge pump, head and innumerate other things, 
    including a dead CB and Loran-C that can't seem to take the alternator 
    noise. 
    
    Take your pick!
    
    Ashikin

    In my case, I am less reliant on electronics than I would like to be
    simply because of the power drain.  I expect "errant" behaviour from my
    Loran/VHF etc because these guys are supplied batteries that are seldom
    fully charged and only get one to 2 hours per week in summer of
    charging.  At the low voltages these guys will break down or act up
    more often.
    
    What is the best solution to this ?  I wonder about Solar Cells but
    most would think me mad if I put those on my boat given that we can go
    months without sun!  Wind generators are another possibility but
    clutter up the deck, chop people's heads off and also (in my
    experience) set up a vibration in the boat that is uncomfortable.  
    Another alternative would be a small generator .....gas or diesel.
    
    What works best .... ?

re .10:

The various battery charging options have been extensively discussed in 
other notes (see Note 3.19 for a list). 

In my experience, a high-output alternator with a sophisticated
regulator (eg, Ample Power) significantly improves batttery charging,
albeit at a not insignificant but quite worthwhile cost. 

Alan

    One of the reasons I like the Furuno gear so much is because it is
    designed to operate at 10vdc.  Anything over that is reduced to 10vdc. 
    When your battery gets to 10v it is DEAD.  The worst I have ever seen
    is 10.6v  The LC90 was beeping at me to say that auto shutdown was
    imminent but never gave up the fix on the last mark.
    
    We finished the race at 3am, got the outboard up from below and began
    the recharge on the 15mi run home.  (1986 Perry race)
    
    /bob
      

    re .3
    
        Next time it is blowing like stink out there with a storm offshore,
    scan the seas to see who is out there. Not too many powerboats. All
    those guys with the 50 foot danzis making waves on windless days seem
    to disappear when it is them who have to take the lumping.
    
        When I came down from Maine Memorial day Weekend and got clobbered
    the entire 100+ mile run, the only power boats I saw were:
    
    A. Lobster boats
    B. Coast Guard boats
    C. Commerial Sight seeing boats (heading in).                          
    
       I did see one Egg Harbor type blasting about off Manchester by the
    sea, but not the normal volume. Now I know there were probably others
    out there, but those guys have more horsepower than my Jeep and my VW
    together. They can beat a storm in. but how often do you see them
    heading out in the middle of blow. 
    
       so the answer is us rag hangers dream about days most power boater
    rather not think about. As such, we beat up equipment more. try sitting
    below decks in 8-12 foot seas beating to weather and think about the 
    strains that poor boat is enduring.
    
       the insight one non-boater once said while a bunch of us were
    trading tales is "If things are so bad, and you keep breaking
    equipment, why do you do this"
    
       "cause it's fun!"               Right????
    
    john