[Search for users] [Overall Top Noters] [List of all Conferences] [Download this site]

Conference unifix::sailing

Title:SAILING
Notice:Please read Note 2.* before participating in this conference
Moderator:UNIFIX::BERENS
Created:Wed Jul 01 1992
Last Modified:Mon Jun 02 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:2299
Total number of notes:20724

1210.0. "Liability for passengers" by CHRCHL::GERMAIN (Down to the Sea in Ships) Thu May 18 1989 12:01

    If this issue appears in another note, sorry in advance.
    
     A friend of mine asked me if I'd be willing to allow his social
    services group to "raffle" off a daysail on my boat. The winner
    gets a day on DEFIANT with appropriate "rain dates" etc.
    
     I said I might be interested, but I want to look into the liability
    issue.
    
     I'm concerned about liability in case the "winner" gets hurt. Which
    brings up the general question of liability of all guests on board.
    
     I have signed waivers of responsibility before - what protection
    do they actually give the owner? What are the issues concerning
    passengers?
    
    	Gregg

T.RTitleUserPersonal
Name
DateLines
1210.1How many sea lawyers can dance at your trial?CSSE::COUTUREAbandon shoreThu May 18 1989 13:148
    Because of the raffle, you would actually be taking out passengers
    "for hire" even though you didn't actually receive any money.  As long
    as they put up the bucks, your boat would be "for hire" and submit
    you to some very interesting liability.  To begin with, you'd need a
    minimum of a six-pack CG license, a commercial inspection, and
    commercial insurance.  Maybe a nice donation to the social services
    group would be easier.

1210.2ask your insurance companyHYDRA::SCHUMANNGoing INSEINThu May 18 1989 14:0210
I think it's unlikely you would get in trouble with the Coast Guard, unless
you do this more than once. 

However, the liability issue is a real concern. You could send a letter to
your insurer, asking them to confirm that you will be covered under these
circumstances. If they answer affirmatively, keep their letter so you can prove
their consent later, if necessary. 

--RS

1210.3clarification?CDR::SPENCERJohn SpencerThu May 18 1989 15:2024
RE: .1,

>>>    Because of the raffle, you would actually be taking out passengers
>>>    "for hire" even though you didn't actually receive any money.  

Interesting...I used to donate a couple daysails aboard PUFFIN to the 
WGBHCh 2 auction, and had understood that so long as I wasn't taking *any* 
compensation (food, expenses, fuel, gifts, etc), it was kosher.  
Technically those aboard were my guests, and no more.  Has this changed, 
or was my interpretation not correct?

>>>    ...you'd need a minimum of a six-pack CG license, a commercial 
>>>    inspection, and commercial insurance.  

Yes, you may be right in saying a license is necessary, of any size or
scope; the "six-pack" is the lowest level and most restricted scope.  But
I sailed as an uninspected craft, which was fine as long as I was taking
no more than 6 passengers (despite a license to carry an unlimited number,
as long as it's on an appropriately qualified vessel.)  Commercial
insurance was not required, according to my insurer (the Allen Agency,
Camden Maine.) 

J.

1210.4WAIVERVIA::RUDYFri May 19 1989 03:449
    	Waivers of responsibility
    
    	Generally these are a false sense of security.  These waiver can
    not absolve the owners of negligence.  If an unfortunate circumstance
    did occurr and you were found to be negligent (which doesn't take
    much) the parties could get it easily thrown out.
    
    

1210.5donating time insteadCHRCHL::GERMAINDown to the Sea in ShipsFri May 19 1989 16:3310
    Well, judging from the replies, here, I think I'll offer my time
    to the cause instead.........
    
     I take it that your liabilities are minimal (or non-existent?)
    if you have friends aboard for a cruise?
    
    Thanks,
    
    	Gregg