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Conference turris::fortran

Title:Digital Fortran
Notice:Read notes 1.* for important information
Moderator:QUARK::LIONEL
Created:Thu Jun 01 1995
Last Modified:Fri Jun 06 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:1333
Total number of notes:6734

1331.0. "Fortran 4.0 and DU 4.0 CPU time changes" by VAXSPO::TOME (Marcos A. Tome Machado/Pre-Sales) Wed Jun 04 1997 19:07

      Hi,
 
      I'm in a BID to sell some Alphastations 255/300. My customer said that
      his Alphastation is strange in comparison to another vendors.

      He has a Fortran program that define a matrix 100x100 or 200x200 or
      300x300 or 400x400 and so on, but as a input data he can define the
      dimension to program run by now. For example 40x40.

      Compilation: # f77 program.f -O3 -o program (the same to everybody).

      In anothers vendors(SUN and IBM) the CPU time was the SAME to any 
      matrix(100x100 or 200x200 or 300x300 or 400x400) with input data
      40x40. But in our machine AS255/300 the CPU time changes.

      Example:

      Machine/Vendor    Dimension     Input data     CPU time(seconds)

      255/300 Digital   200x200       40x40          92 
      255/300 Digital   300x300       40x40          123
      255/300 Digital   400x400       40x40          120
      255/300 Digital   500x500       40x40          126

      3CT IBM           200x200       40x40          34
      3CT IBM           300x300       40x40          35
      3CT IBM           400x400       40x40          35
      3CT IBM           500x500       40x40          34

      Ultra1 SUN        200x200       40x40          120
      Ultra1 SUN        300x300       40x40          121
      Ultra1 SUN        400x400       40x40          121
      Ultra1 SUN        500x500       40x40          122

      As you can see, our machine changes the CPU time and the customer told me
      that he can't estimate his job time on our machine.
      Of course, when run the real and bigger job, and then he can't buy our
      machine.

      Can anybody explain me this question ???
      Thanks a lot,
      Marcos Tome

T.RTitleUserPersonal
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1331.1lots of questionsWIBBIN::NOYCEPulling weeds, pickin' stonesThu Jun 05 1997 16:1624
Can you post the program here?
Does it use a single array, or several?
What datatype (real, double precision, other) does it use?
What operations doe sit perform on the array?

I'm sure the "problem" is related to the relatively small
16KB direct-mapped cache, backed by significantly slower
off-chip cache, of the EV45 processor in the Alphastation 255,
but making some plausible assumptions about the anwers to
the above question I can't see an obvious cause.

Have you considered bidding a more modern system, such as a
PWS 433au?

Is there any reason you specify -O3 (reducing optimization
below the default for Digital Fortran)?  Can you get the
customer to just leave off the -O option for us?

If this example doesn't represent the "real and bigger job",
then why does it matter how this example performs?  How does
the real job perform?

Do you want an explanation, or do you want advice on how
to improve the situation?
1331.2Customer answers...VAXSPO::TOMEMarcos A. Tome Machado/Pre-SalesFri Jun 06 1997 10:1870
re .1
Hello. Firstly, thank you for your fast reply...


>Can you post the program here?
No. My customer told me that this program is owned by several teachers.



Follow below the customer responses:

> Does it use a single array, or several?
There are several arrays. Is is important to say that the program
used, which reproduced the table sent before, was the same in all
machines tested.
> What datatype (real, double precision, other) does it use?
All double precision.
> What operations doe sit perform on the array?
The greatest cpu time consuming is to solve for 12000 times the
following equation:
A^{-1}B=C
this equation means an inversion of a matrix followed by a multiplication 
by another matrix. As I said, this is carried out, in the present test,
12000 times. Afterwards few calculations, not expressive, are done.
> 
> 
> Is there any reason you specify -O3 (reducing optimization
> below the default for Digital Fortran)?  Can you get the
> customer to just leave off the -O option for us?
There is no reason for using -O3 option. However, this was done in the
other machines as well. In addtion, -O option was used and no changes at all
were observed. 


> If this example doesn't represent the "real and bigger job",
> then why does it matter how this example performs?  How does
> the real job perform?
The test that we carried out was set (input) for a simple and fast
calculation. The program used is our main research line and usually
it takes several days of cpu time. For example, we are studying a
system and the calculations are being carried out on risc/6000 model
3CT/IBM and it has not finished. It started three months ago. Our
reserach concerns mainly in quantum scatterig calculations with
rotational state resolved.





>I'm sure the "problem" is related to the relatively small
>16KB direct-mapped cache, backed by significantly slower
>off-chip cache, of the EV45 processor in the Alphastation 255,
>but making some plausible assumptions about the anwers to
>the above question I can't see an obvious cause.

>Have you considered bidding a more modern system, such as a
>PWS 433au?
No. I can't consider another machine by now.



>Do you want an explanation, or do you want advice on how
>to improve the situation?
Please. I'd like an explanation, but if you can send some hints to improve
the performance I will be very happy.

Thank you very much for your attention.
Best regards,
Marcos Tome