Conference turris::cooks

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	The following are from the "Mickey Gilley's Texas Cookbook"
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			BARBED WIRE BARBECUE SAUCE

		"For a barbecue sauce with real bite, try this on 
		 your dish.  What a way to wake up flavor.  It's a
		 barbecue lover's dream"


		4 oz (1 stick) butter
		1 onion, chopped
		2 cloves garlic, chopped
		4 TBLS Worcestershire sauce
		Juice of 2 Lemons
		1/2 tsp black pepper
		  1 TBL  salt
		  2 TBLS paprika
		  1 8-oz can tomato sauce
		  1 whole tomato, diced
		  2 cups catsup
		  1 12-oz can beer

		1. Melt butter in large pot at medium heat
		2. Add onion, garlic, Worcestershire sauce, lemon juice,
		   black pepper, salt, and paprika
		3. Cook and stir constantly until onion is soft.
		4. Stir in remaining ingredients.  Simmer at low heat 
		   for 1 hour.  If sauce becomes too thick, add water
		   to desired consistency.

						Yields approx. 2 quarts (8 cups)
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			BUCKAROO BARBECUE SAUCE

	  "This sauce puts the spirit of Texas into every bite."


		1/4 cup butter
		1/2 onion, chopped
		1/4 cup vinegar
		1/4 cup catsup
		1/4 cup lemon juice
		1/4 cup Worcestershire sauce
		  1 tsp salt
		1/4 tsp garlic powder

		1. Melt butter in a saucepan and saut� onions.
		2. Add all other ingredients and bring to a slow boil.
		3. Reduce heat and simmer for about 20 minutes.  Serve warm

						Yields approx. 1 cup.

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			SWEET IRON STEAK BASTE

		"The best baste for bringing out the taste
		 of Texas in steaks"


		1/2 cup vegetable oil
		  1 small yellow onion, chopped
		  1 TBLS salt
		  1 TBLS black pepper
		  1 tsp  garlic salt
		1/2 cup Worcestershire sauce
		  4 TBLS parsley flakes
		  1 12-oz can beer, room temperature
		  1 12-oz can Coca-Cola, room temperature


		1. In a large saucepan heat oil and saut� onions and
		   seasonings at medium heat until onions are soft
		   (about 8 minutes).
		2. Slowly add beer and Coke, increase heat, and bring
		   to a boil for 3 minutes.
		3. Reduce heat and keep warm.
		4. To serve, dip steaks in baste before cooking over
		   hardwood charcoal fire.  Spoon baste over steaks
		   each time they are turned, and cook to taste.

						Yields approx. 3 cups.

    Good for chicken or ribs:
                              Change amounts of ingredients to your
                              liking,
                         
                              1 1/2 cup ketchup
                              3/4 cup molasses
                              1-2 tsp garlic powder or 3 cloves minced
                              fresh
                              1 tsp dryed mustard
                              1 tbl lemon juice
    you can substitute honey for the molasses if you prefer.
           
    ENJOY!

    On the sweet side.......BUT GOOD!
    
    Lrg Bottle of A1 sauce
    16 oz tomato sauce
    1/2 cup brown sugar
    2 tbsp honey
    
    Simmer and brush on.
    
    Great on top of Egg Noodles too!
    

                            -< Copied from 995.6 >-

    This is one of my family's favorite - a "sweet" style BBQ sauce.
    I've been using it for years on both chicken and ribs.


    Barbeque Sauce: 					Makes ~3 Cups
    --------------

    Ingredients:

	1 cup	molasses		2 tbsp	butter/oleo
	1 cup	catsup			6	whole cloves
	1 cup	chopped onion		1 tsp	Worcestershire
	2/3 cup	orange juice		1 tsp	prepared mustard
	1/2 cup	brown sugar		1/2 tsp	salt
	1 tbsp	orange peel		1/2 tsp pepper
	2 tbsp	vinegar			1/2 tsp	ginger
	2 tbsp	veg. oil		1/2 tsp tobasco
	2 tbsp	A1

    Combine all of the above (or what you happen to have at the time)
    in a sauce pot, bring to a boil, and simmer for 15 minutes.

    Notes:

	o good on chicken or spare ribs, also on or mixed-in hamburgers
	  (I use it instead of water when making Lipton's Onion Soup 
	   burgers for that 'cooked in' taste).

	o best if heated before applying to meat (that way the oils,
	  which tend to separate, mix more easily).

	o With this particular BBQ sauce, it's best to cook the meat 
          partially before applying. The tomato based sauce tends to
          burn easily if directly over an open flame, or exposed
          directly to high heat a long time. For example, I BBQ chicken
          for 30-40 minutes, and flip the pieces every 5 minutes. I
          don't start applying BBQ sauce until after the chicken has
          cooked 10-20 minutes, but then apply it LIBERALLY every time I
          flip. A 3-4 inch paint brush works well for application.

	o keeps VERY well in the fridge.

    this is the best sauce i have ever had on PORK.  it can't be used
    for anything else, (so i've found)...
    
    (measure by eye, for thickness and spices)
    
    catsup
    honey
    mustard
    oregano
    couple of cloves of garlic
    pepper
    onions (finely chopped)
    peppers (green, finely chopped)
    
    mix and dip spareribs in mixture.  baste occasionally.  absolutely
    wonderful.
    
    

    The following is the best recipe I've used for BBQ, and it works
    great with all meats:
    
    2 parts tomato based sauce 
    1 part grape jelly
    
    I start the two parts tomato with ketchup then add taco sauce, salsa,
    tomato paste, tomato sauce, spaghetti sauce, leftover bbq sauce,
    whatever I have, add the jelly, and any seasonings I want to add
    (thyme, basil, oregano, mustard, etc).  Mix together and cook on
    low until the jelly is easily mixed with the tomato. (This even
    microwaves easily!)  
    
    This recipes works great with meatballs too!
    
    Happy BBQing
    
    Deb
     

2 cups catsup, 3/4 cup dark brown sugar, 1/4 cup prepared mustard, 
2 tablespoons baked garlic puree.  Mix well and cook over low heat until
almost boiling. Thin this with apple cider vinegar if you like it thinner.
Use on beef or pork.

Baked garlic puree:

	bake whole garlic bulb, unpeeled and wrapped in foil, in a slow
	oven for approx. 1 and 1/2 hours until the bulb is soft when
	squeezed lightly.  snip the end of garlic cloves and squeeze
	the pulp out into small glass container and then float some
	olive oil over the top.  Store, covered, in fridge for weeks...
	but you won't keep it around that long - it's great!

    I have two favorites that I use all the time. 
    
    The first one I use all year, and it keep in the fridge for months.
    I'll either broil, grill or bake with it. Its easy and tasty.
    
    The second one is more of a marinade..and is best when used when
    cooking on the grill. (BBQ's) And I find it tastiest on PORK, but
    use it for chicken also....
    
    Hope you enjoy them.
    
    #1.........BBQ Sauce
    
    Lrg bottle A1 sauce, 1/2 cup brown sugar, 16 oz tomato sauce, 2
    tbsp of honey.
    
    Just boil together and use.
    
    
    #2.........BBQ Marinade
    
    2 cups Ketchup
    1/4 cup sherry (regular, not "cooking")
    10 oz bottle of soy sauce
    16 oz jar of honey
    1/4 cup garlic powder
    
    Mix together in pan and marinade meat for as long as you like.
    
    

    
    RE: 1233.5
    
     I forgot!!  On the second marinade I put in the last note, also
    add a small bottle of RED food coloring. It makes it look a little
    nicer. (Chinese BBQ sauce effect)
    
    Enjoy!
    

    THIS IS A RECIPE FOR A VERY SIMPLE BARBEQUE SAUCE THAT CAN BE MADE
    IN 10 MIN. AND IS EXTREAMLY TASTY ON RIBS OR STEAK ECT...
    
    
    1 8oz. can of tomato sauce
    1/4 cup of honey
    1/4 cup of orange juice
    1 Tbs of worshsteshire sauce (please forgive my spelling)
    1 Tbs of red wine vinegar 
    4 Tbs of minced onion
        
    Give it a try you'll love it!

TEXAS BBQ SAUCE

2-1/4 Cups 	catsup
2-1/4 Cups	water
2 tsp 		instant beef broth
1-1/4 tsp 	dry mustard
1 Tblsp		chili powder
1 tsp		black pepper
1/4 tsp		cayenne pepper
1/2 tsp		garlic powder
1/2 tsp		salt
2 tsp 		worcestershire sauce
2 shakes	Tabasco sauce
3 Tblsp		brown sugar
1/2 tsp		liquid smoke
1 Tblsp		lemon juice

Bring everything to a boil, reduce heat 
and simmer, stirring occasionally for
15 minutes.  Cool to room temperature.  
Makes one quart.

    i was reading the paper at lunch today and found this recipe to
    be quite interesting and was wondering if anyone has tried something
    like this before:
    
    2 T paprika
    2 t onion powder
    2 t garlic powder
    2 t dry mustard
    1 t salt
    1 t white pepper
    1 t black pepper
    3/4 t cayenne pepper
    3/4 t dried basil leaves
    1/2 t dried savory leaves
    1/2 t dried thyme leaves
    1/2 t ground cumin
    1/2 t ground bay leaves
    1/2 cup apple cider vinager
    
    in small bowl, thoroughly combine all ingredients except cider vinager.
    pour vinager in 2 T at a time and smear on chicken, pork, or beef.
    place in air tight container and refrigerate over night.  grill
    next day.
    
    kinda like cajun, isn't it?  i'm going to try it with something
    this weekend i think but i'm sure what.  
    
    carlajeanne
    

  Sounds delicious! Bear in mind that it's not too far from chili powder
  with a couple of herbs added (chili powder is basically garlic, cumin,
  red pepper, and usually a couple of other spices). We use a mixture
  pretty much like that when making barbecue sauce (add above to
  ketchup, plus a little beer and honey).

    
    This is like the barbacue "rubs" made in some areas of the south,
    which sometimes wet (like this one) or dry.  The same dry ingredients
    would work.  
    
    Chili powder is a convenience, but at a sacrifice.  Just like
    everything else, it's better if you do it yourself, it tastes better
    and you can adjust the seasonings to your liking.  God only knows
    how long a can of chili powder has been sitting on a market shelf,
    or in your cabinet before you use it.   The oils in the spices used
    to make chili powder are very volatile, and lose their potency quickly.
    
    DM

    This is a BBQ sauce I created by accident one day. It is quick and 
    easy to fix and use. Combine all ingredients into bowl, stir until
    well blended. Use with chicken, beef, pork, VEGGIE-K-BOBs.
       
    I found that store brand ingredients work best for this sauce!
    
    2 C		ketchup
    1 C		Italian salad dressing
    1/2 C	A1 steak sauce

	    For a "tangier" sauce, substitute Worscestershere sauce in
	    place of A1 sauce.

    I have used this marinade for swordfish(and similiars type), beef and
    chicken and had great comments.
    
    1/2 cup oil
    1/2 cup ketchup
    1/2 cup orange juice
    1/2 cup soy sauce
    2-3 cloves garlic
    2TBS parsley
    Optional - sliced onion
    --------------------------
    Just blend together and marinate for at least 6 hours.  If you wish 
    to make a sauce with it, just heat the marinade and add flour to it.
    
    Whereas I usually cook for two - I cut the recipe in half most of the
    time.
    
    dk
    

    I recently marinated about 45# of chicken and folks raved... but then
    there is a story that goes with this.
    
    1 cup olive oil
    1 cup ketchup
    1 - 12oz can concentrated OJ
    16 oz soy sauce
    1 - 12oz can whiskey
    
    The Story...... I asked my daughter to get the whiskey from the top
    shelf at camp, and fill the can.... What she pulled out, which I didn't
    realize was a bottle of Chevis Regal (sp?) Scotch..  Which I understand
    from hubby is to expensive to use as marinade for chicken.  "WE didn't
    know"  We don't drink the stuff, only cook with it.  Of course to top
    this off, we doubled the recipe.  But lets' face it.  Isn't it more
    important to have happy guest????????
    
    B

    Folks,
    
    This version of my BBQ sauce recipe came out so delicious I had to
    share it with you. I experimented with various changes to the basic
    recipe for the last two years. 
    
    Marshall
    
    
      Marshall Goldberg's version of Lester Waters' BBQ Sauce
  
 (Adapted from Kathie Chellel's printed version of Lester's recipe)

       2 - 8 oz. can Hunt's Tomato Sauce
       3 - 6 oz. can Tomato Paste
       1 1/3 cups cup White Wine (Use a medium dry fruity wine)
       1 cup Lea & Perrins Worcestershire Sauce
       6 Tbsp. red wine vinegar
       10 Tbsp. firmly packed brown sugar (Less to taste)   
       juice from 4 large fresh lemons
       juice from 2 or more limes to taste
       2 capfuls Wright's Liquid Smoke (Be careful!)
       1 Tbsp mustard powder
       2 medium onions, finely chopped (I use a food processor)
       Fresh ground black pepper to taste (I use 2 Tbsps.)
       1 Tbsp cumin (or more to taste)
       10 cloves
       3/4 bunch fresh cilantro finely minced.
       1/4 bunch fresh cilantro finely minced added as sauce is finished.
       Jalapeno sauce and Tabasco to taste. (I use Trappey's Chef-Magic
        Jalapeno sauce, Tabasco, Cajun Chef Louisiana Green Hot Sauce,
        and Billiard's Louisiana Hot Sauce. Of these, the Trappey's
	and Tobasco are most important.)
        
   PREPARING THE BBQ SAUCE:

   Mix all ingredients together in a saucepan over low heat except
   the cilantro and hot sauces. The mixture will be somewhat thin to 
   begin with. Simmer - DO NOT BOIL - slowly, uncovered, for about an hour
   and a half to two hours or more until the flavors mellow and mingle.
   The sauce will `set'; its texture thickens and color changes as
   it finishes.  Keep it just steaming while simmering. (TASTE the sauce
   as it cooks!) Add the Jalapeno sauce until you can taste the heat and
   flavor. Then add the Tabasco and other sauces to further heaten and
   flavor the cooking sauce. The simmering changes the sauce's hotness
   in such a way that the sauce doesn't burn in the mouth; don't worry 
   about using too much! When the sauce starts to set, add 3/4 bunch minced
   cilantro. Simmer another 10 minutes or so and add the remainder
   of the cilantro to finish the sauce. The sauce should be allowed
   to sit for about an hour uncovered before using.
   
   The lemon and lime is a  key  factor. Be generous with it in the 
   recipe -- it will only help!  The lemon/lime juice is key in 
   creating a crispy texture on whatever is being barbequed.  

   To make a sweeter sauce, just add a little more brown sugar.  For a   
   spicier sauce, add more Worcestershire and more Tabasco. 
   The resulting sauce is never very thick. For a thicker, milder sauce, 
   add another 6 oz. can of tomato paste. The sauce keeps about
   two weeks in the refrigerator and extra sauce can be 
   frozen for about 3 months.  

I notice that most of the recipies herein use tomato, in one form or another, as
a key ingredient in the sauce.  If you're interested in something quite
different, read on!

My family originates from South Carolina.  True SC barbeque sauce doesn't use a
tomato base, rather it relies on mustard and vinegar.  The recipie below is my
own but it's roots can be traced to family members who used a similar sauce in
there family owned barbeque barn.  I find when I serve it to my friends they
invariably ask for the recipie AND USE IT!  Many folks put it on the table as a
dip or condiment even when they're not serving barbeque.  It's sweet and hot.

Hope you enjoy it as much as we do.


1 Cup prepared yellow mustard
1/2 Cup sugar
1/4 Cup light brown sugar
3/4 Cup cider vinegar
1/4 Cup water
2 TBSP chili powder
1 tpsn black pepper
1 tspn white pepper
1/4 tspn cayenne
1/2 tspn soy sauce
2 TBSP butter
1 TBSN liquid smoke

Mix all except soy, butter and smoke. Simmer 20 minutes stirring frequently. 
Stir in remaining ingredients and simmer for 10 more minutes.

Vinegar taste will be very strong until completely cooled.  Refridgerating
overnight is best and allows flavors to blend.

Add a few drops of Louisiana Hot Sauce at the end if aditional heat is desired.

One problem with barbeque, especially when using tomato based sauces, is that it
tends to char excessively.  Here's my solution.  I developed the
marinade/basting sauce below after talking with old pro's I know down south. 
Use the sauce to marinade the ribs or chicken for at least two hours (the longer
the better) before cooking.  It seasons and tenderizes.  Slaver it on during
cooking as it keeps the meat from drying out (you can't baste too often).  Then
put on your favorite barbeque sauce 5-10 minutes before taking off the fire,
allowing just enough time for the sauce to bake on the meat.


2 Cups water
1 Cup white vinegar
1 Cup cider vinegar
1/2 Cup prepared yellow mustard
1/4 cup lemon juice
1 TBSP liquid smoke
1 tspn worcester sauce
1 TBSP dried onion flakes
1 tspn dried mustard
1 tspn salt
1 tspn black pepper
1/2 tspn cayenne (optional)
1 tspn celery salt
1 tspn mild chili powder


cheers,
david

    I tried the recipe in .20 and it was outstanding.  I add a little more
    cayenne but all those that like the heat loved the sauce.  Can't wait
    to try out .21.
    
    Thanks,
    
    Steve

    re:21
    
    > One problem with barbeque, especially when using tomato based sauces,
    > is that it tends to char excessively.  
    
    	One of the things that I've been doing for years to get around this
    problem is that I cook the meat directly on the flame first. This gives
    it the typical done-on-grill flavor. Then I put the meat on one side
    and light the burner on the other and bake the barbecue sauce on by
    closing the grill lid. Putting the meat on the top rack speeds up the
    process.
    
    	If you have too much meat so that you can't locate it all on the
    side opposite the lit burner, you can just light one side on low and
    when you turn the meat over to baste the other side, turn the other
    burner on low and turn off the one that was lit.
    
    	The barbecue sauce will bubble and carmelize onto the meat. I
    usually use Bulls-eye, but this works for any barbecue sauce. It is
    still possible to burn the sauce, but you really have to work at ;-)
    	
    	Ray

re .23

Yep, that method works as well.  But there are some things that I want to baste
while cooking (spare ribs, for example, ahve a tendency to dry out) but not have
the meat burn in the process.  The basting marinade I describe keeps the meat
moist, adds spicing during cooking and smells terrific (a significant part of
the process).

When I'm ready to put on the final sauce though, I usually do what you suggested.

cheers,
david

BTW -- If you use Bullseye, try the recipie is .20.  They're as different as
night and day.

RE: .24

Based on my own experience and on all that I've read, what you say is 
correct--when doing true, Southern-style barbecue, you must avoid 
using sauces that contain sugar, since the sugar will carmelize and 
char during the long cooking process.  Instead, you use a "mopping 
sauce", one that avoids the char-prone ingredients, to keep the meat 
moist.  .20 is an example of a mopping sauce.  When the barbecue is 
nearly done, you can put on the tomato- or sugar-containing sauce as 
a "finishing sauce", although barbecue purists insist that the sauce 
should be served on the side rather than applied to the meat, so that 
the diner can decide how much is appropriate.

--PSW

>a "finishing sauce", although barbecue purists insist that the sauce 
>should be served on the side rather than applied to the meat, so that 
>the diner can decide how much is appropriate.

While this always seemed rather intuitive to me, based on my lifetime's
experience of charred foods, I'd never seen that as a standard anywhere
in the Northeast. Last fall as I was vacationing in the Southeast, I was
surprised to find BBQ places in Tennesee and Alabama which served it
exactly like that. And, it was delicious. The norm was to serve the meat
at the table with a variety of sauces.

re: .24  Paul, the recipe in .20 calls for 1/2 cup of granulated sugar
and 1/4 cup of light brown sugar. Would you have to delete the sugar
to use that as a mopping sauce?

Since I bought my Weber with the side charcoal compartments and hinged
grill I've been doing more indirect (read: slow) grilling. My ribs now
are getting most of their flavor from the spices I sprinkle on right at
the beginning. To avoid the burned sugar effect I've held off applying
sauce until the last ten minutes of cooking. Can't help but think there'd
be a richer flavor if the sauce was on through most of the cooking,
though. 

It's a case of burned if you do and bland if you don't   B^)

Art

>It's a case of burned if you do and bland if you don't   B^)
    
     Isn't that what rubs are for?

RE: .27

Sorry, I meant .21, not .20.  .21 is a mopping sauce.  .20 is a 
finishing sauce.


RE: .26

This is part of the reason why barbecue purists say that most of what 
is passed off as "barbecue" in the Northeast isn't true barbecue.

--PSW

RE: .28

Right, that's what rubs are for.  Chris Schlessinger's THRILL OF THE 
GRILL has a whole section at the back devoted to true, Southern-style 
barbecue.  I heartily recommend it.  The method is to rub the meat 
first with a dry rub, then to very slowly cook it indirectly in the 
smoke from a wood fire (hickory, mesquite, or whatnot).  We're 
talking 3-4 hours for ribs, 10-12+ hours for pork shoulder or 
brisket.  I've had good success doing this in a smoker.  You need a 
mopping sauce of some sort (can be as simple as plain water or beer, 
or something more elaborate, as in .21) to keep the meat moist.

The meat picks up the intense, smoky flavor one associates with real 
barbecue, plus the flavors from the spice rub.

--PSW

         Ah, phooey on "barbeque purists"!  Where'd they get their degrees
    anyway?  :-)
    
         Sauce goes on in the last part of the cooking cycle.  It's gotta
    have time to penetrate.  If you serve the sauce separately, you may as
    well not serve it at all.  Sounds like some kinda yuppy fern-bar
    conspiracy to me.
    
                                      Greg
    
    {Highly decorated barbeque-ist, with gold hickory-chip clusters.
     Served in the Biloxi Baby-Back campaign, the Birmingham Brisket
     conflagration and the Montgomery Grilled Meat Melee}. 

>                      <<< Note 1233.31 by IMTDEV::BRUNO >>>
>                                 -< Say WHUT? >-
        ...
            
>    {Highly decorated barbeque-ist, with gold hickory-chip clusters.
>     Served in the Biloxi Baby-Back campaign, the Birmingham Brisket
>     conflagration and the Montgomery Grilled Meat Melee}. 
        
        We're not worthy! We're not worthy!  ;*)
        
        Andy
        

RE: .31

Well, I know some highly-decorated Texan barbecuists who will 
disagree with you on that.  It's hardly a yuppy fern-bar 
conspiracy.  But of course part of the joy of barbecue is that such 
fine points can be argued endlessly.

--PSW

re: .31

>         Sauce goes on in the last part of the cooking cycle.  It's gotta
>    have time to penetrate.  If you serve the sauce separately, you may as
>    well not serve it at all.  

If the sauce was the only flavoring I'd agree, but properly done you 
should use a dry rub or a marinade, as well as a mopping sauce during
cooking.  The serving sauce kind of serves the same sort of role as
catsup or salsa (both of which, ironically enough, mean "sauce" :-).

But in a similar vein as Paul in .33, it's the difference of opinion
that makes horse races. :-)

-Hal

    	I tend to agree with .31. The longer you can cook the sauce on, the
    more the flavor sinks into the meat. With slow cooking (as in a charcoal
    or electric smokers), you can put the sauce on right away since it never 
    reaches that high of a temperature. I've never been able to get them
    gooey this way though.
    
    	With a Weber charcoal grill, you could probably get the same effect
    I do by leaving an area without charcoal that you can move the ribs to
    to bake the BB sauce on. With the gas grill, it's even easier so long
    as you don't have so much meat that it covers both sides of the grill.
    
    	You can carmelize the sauce this way without burning it. It makes
    for a nice gooey, stick-to-your-ribs (and everything else) kind of rib
    (if that's what you like). The best part is that you can leave it
    unattended for quite a while without worrying if it's going to burn.
    
    	I've rarely had a problem with dry ribs. I usually sear the outside
    of them quickly first, on a high heat to start. As soon as this is done
    (about 15-20 min.) I turn the flame off on the side that has the ribs,
    turn the other side to low, and slather the sauce on one side of the ribs 
    and let them slow cook till the sauce starts to bubble (but not burn). 
    
    	Then I move the ribs to the flame side, turn on the other burner and 
    turn off the one the ribs are over, and slather more sauce on and slow
    cook that on. The whole process takes about an hour or less without 
    pre-cooking the ribs.
    
    	Ray

RE: .35

With all due respect, what you describe, although it tastes 
delicious, ain't real Southern-style barbecue.  It's grilled ribs 
with barbecue sauce on it.

--PSW

    >>With all due respect, what you describe... ain't real Southern-style 
    >>barbecue.
    
         ...in your humble opinion.
    
                                   Greg
                 

re: .37

>    >>With all due respect, what you describe... ain't real Southern-style 
>    >>barbecue.
>    
>         ...in your humble opinion.
    
Whether or not it's *good* is certainly a matter of opinion.  Whether
or not it's authentic southern-style barbecue is much less a matter of
opinion.


-Hal

Point of order, please -

Is anyone contending that "authentic" barbeque has to run the risk of
ending up charred? I'm open to any and all techniques that avoid a
charred endproduct. I haven't much interest in any that contribute
to same.

-Jack
   (who grew up watching his father burn the damn chicken EVERY week)

    >>Whether or not it's authentic southern-style barbecue is much less a 
    >>matter of opinion.
    
         Then, of course, someone would have to refer to the old and dusty
    hide-bound volume of the Jubilation T. Cornpone Encyclopedia of
    Southern Standards to verify what authentic southern-style barbeque is.
    My copy says they slap the sauce on in the last part of the cooking
    cycle.
    
                                      Greg


    

re: .40

>         Then, of course, someone would have to refer to the old and dusty
>    hide-bound volume of the Jubilation T. Cornpone Encyclopedia of
>    Southern Standards to verify what authentic southern-style barbeque is.
>    My copy says they slap the sauce on in the last part of the cooking
>    cycle.
    
Ah, but that's not what .35 said.  He put the sauce on during the whole
cooking period.

Of course, there isn't just one authentic method for southern-style
barbecue.  The south is a big place.

-Hal

RE: .41

It wasn't the sauce during the whole cooking process that 
disqualifies it as true barbecue (although that doesn't help, 
either).  It's the fact that it's cooked over a smokeless fire--coals 
or a gas grill.  What makes barbecue barbecue is the meat absorbing 
the smoke from a wood fire.  This recipe relies on smoky flavor from 
the sauce to be a poor man's substitute for the real thing.  You CAN 
cook real barbecue over coals or a gas grill, but you have to use 
wood chips to get the smoke necessary for the process.


re: .39

Authentic barbecue won't end up charred as long as you guard against 
flare-ups of the fire.  You cook it for hours over very low heat.  
The only problem is the risk of the meat drying out, which is why 
mopping sauces are used.

--PSW

>         Then, of course, someone would have to refer to the old and dusty
>    hide-bound volume of the Jubilation T. Cornpone Encyclopedia of
>    Southern Standards

I thought Al Capp had admitted that Dogpatch was actually somewhere in
Upstate New York?

Dogpatch was based on Seabrook, NH, actually.

--PSW

        re:41

    	Just a small nit, but I didn't say to put the barbecue sauce on
    right from the start (unless you're referring to my comments about a
    smoker). The "sear the meat first" is actually a key step in locking
    the juices into the meat. This is what tends to keep it from drying
    out.

    	In a smoker, this is accomplished by the smoke particles which coat 
    the meat. It gives the meat that dried look on the outside. Meat cooked 
    long enough using either method will be dry on the inside too. 

    	The reason I mentioned putting it on right from the start on a smoker 
    is that, for one, charcoal and electric smokers operate on such low heats 
    that you won't normally burn the sauce, and two, you lose a lot of heat 
    every time you lift the top off (i.e. for basting).

    FWIW - the smoke particles from the wood chips/chunks in a smoker are 
    carcinogenic. Although the food is tasty, it's not among the healthiest 
    ways to cook (not that this bothers *me* much ;-)

    	I never claimed that what I do is "authentic southern-style
    barbecue". I did claim that it tastes good (to me anyway) and it's a
    lot easier to do than putting the meat with the sauce right over the
    flame. It's especially good when you have company or it's raining and
    you just can't, or don't want to, be hovering around the grill. Your 
    mileage (and gas grill) may vary.

    	Ray

Since I seemed to have sparked the last twenty or so replies with my entries in
.20 and .21 I want to weigh in on this line of conversation.

Those recipies (modified by me over time) and methods of cooking go back
generations in my family, which operated barbeque barns from South Carolina to
Florida.  In the original barns the meat was cooked slowly over wood fires with
liberal use of a "mopping" sauce to prevent drying out.  The meat was then
served with the finishing sauce served on the side.  This wasn't the only way
you'd find barbeque in the south but it certainly was a popular method.

When I began modifying these methods for home use I decided that slow cooking
over a low fire using a mopping sauce worked fine. but I found myself in
agreement with some earlier comments in this thread in that I prefer to bake in
the additional flavor of my finishing sauce for 10 - 15 minutes before removing
the meat from the grill.  I find that the flavor imparted to the meat using this
method is different than when the sauce is added afterwards at the table, and to
me, tastier.

But the one thing rule employed by my family regarding barbeque (southern style
that is) that I still believe to be essential is, NO KETCHUP/TOMATO allowed.

cheers,
david

Well it's summer and I imagine we're all back to grilling/barbequing again. 
Appropriately enough Chile Pepper magazine's new issue has a whole section on
southern barbeque.  It discusses regoinal differences, a little bit of history
and has some terrific recipies thrown in as well.  There's a good bit of info
regarding the "eastern South Carolina" method of barbeque and sauces.  These are
the roots of my two entries in here (.20/.21).

If you like barbeque I heartily recommend this latest issue.

BTW - did you know that South Carolina is the only state that has a law on the
books concerning "truth in barbeque"?

cheers,
dave