| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 1934.1 | Like 3N/3S | MPGS::COHEN | Bob Cohen | Sat Feb 22 1997 07:42 | 34 |
| Strong NT, IMPs, team game
Partner opens 1N, and RHO overcalls 2H, natural. Playing Lebensohl,
what do you think the best bid is, holding xx-Qx-KQT8xx-Qxx?
3D showed values (I didn't go through 2N) and 3S showed a 5-card major.
Now I'm stuck. Should I bid 3N anyways, letting partner know that
I might have some heart help, but would have bid 2N-3N if I had a
full stopper?
I assume that 3D was lebensohl style, i.e. values but not forcing?
You didn't state the vul. 3D is conservative no matter what it was and very
conservative if vul. Also, without that information its hard to know what, if
anything, to make of the 2H call. Certainly not vul vs vul, I wouldn't take it
too seriously.
In any case, you have appeared to "survive" the 3D call in that partner has
taken another call. I'm not as convinced as you are that partner has 5 spades,
for example wouldn't that call make sense on AKJx, xx, Axx, Axxx? Hands like
that might play very well in 4-3 fits.
I think that 3N/3S stands out. Partner is unlikley to sit without something
that looks like a heart stopper and a diamond fit. Also, with as little as Txx
you might make. Partner might have A(K/x)xxx, Txx, Axx, A(x/K) and opening
leader has AKxxx or AKxxxx.
Another way of looking at it is that the only way to give partner the
opportunity to play 3N if it's right is for you to bid it now. From your hand,
you have some significant reason to believe that 3N is correct. Partner is
still there to make the final decision.
FWIW, I would have bid 3H over 2H if vul against not. I would have bid 3D
without the HQ.
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| 1934.2 | As seen from here | BULMER::KABLESHKOV | | Mon Feb 24 1997 06:26 | 6 |
| Bidding such hands is a commonplace if "all natural":
1S-(2H)-3D-(P)-3N or
-3H-3N
I wonder what's the rational to bid 1N when having 5CM headed
by AJT. Perhaps strong NT dictates it for rebid-reasons.
|
| 1934.3 | Don't see why 3S is five either... | GAAS::BRAUCHER | Champagne Supernova | Mon Feb 24 1997 08:00 | 7 |
|
I also dislike the 1NT opening. Why do I want to do this ?
I agree with 3D, but would then bid 3NT over 3S, figuring I've covered
myself. If partner has no shred of a heart stopper, that's his problem.
bb
|
| 1934.4 | (from Craig Zastera) | MOIRA::FAIMAN | Wandrer, du M�der, du bist zu Haus | Mon Feb 24 1997 09:06 | 13 |
| Bob,
I'm mightily confused by your remarks about the 3D response holding
xx-Qx-KQT8xx-Qxx after 1N-2H.
My understanding of how "Lebensohl" works here is that the 3D bid is
100% forcing. With only invitational values (and diamonds), responder
would start with 2N and correct opener's forced 3C to 3D. In general,
immediate 3 level suit bids after 2 level interference are 100% forcing
until at least 3N (or 4 of a suit) is reached. When responder's suit
can still be shown at the 2 level (e.g. 1N-2H and responder has spades),
the two level bid is purely competitive (i.e. not even invitational),
while the relay through 2N remains invitational and the direct 3 level
bid forcing. Isn't this how most of you play this or am I confused?
CraigZa
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| 1934.5 | Anyone got the definitive answer on Lebensohl auctions? | DAVIDB::DMILLER | This bug fix broke what??????? | Mon Feb 24 1997 14:30 | 20 |
| My understanding of Lebensohl is similar to Craig's:
After 1N-(2H)-?
Direct 2S bid = weak, to play
Direct 3x bid = values for game and therefore forcing.
Direct cuebid = GF Stayman with no stopper
Direct 3N bid = game values, balanced hand, no stopper
Delayed 3D bid = weak, to play
Delayed cuebid = Stayman with a stopper
Delayed 3S bid = Invitational with 5+ spades
Delayed 3N bid = game values with a stopper
So 3H, as Bob suggests in .1 does not make sense. Also, I would have
used one of the Stayman varieties if I had a 4-card major, so partner's
spade bid is likely a 5-card suit. The offer to play in a 4-3 fit
sounds interesting, but I still could have used one of the Stayman
varieties if I was interested in that.
-Dave
|
| 1934.6 | Counter argument to one of my thoughts | DAVIDB::DMILLER | This bug fix broke what??????? | Mon Feb 24 1997 14:33 | 6 |
| > The offer to play in a 4-3 fit
> sounds interesting, but I still could have used one of the Stayman
> varieties if I was interested in that.
Figured that one out. I can't ask with only 3. I have to have
four so partner can choose to play the 4-3 fit with 3. Right?
|
| 1934.7 | Correcting my error in .1 | MPGS::COHEN | Bob Cohen | Fri Feb 28 1997 07:54 | 4 |
| re .4 and .5
Of course you are both correct. 3 level bids are game forcing. Thanks for
correcting.
|
| 1934.8 | don't like 1NT-2 something-3NT to show no stopper... | GAAS::BRAUCHER | Champagne Supernova | Fri Feb 28 1997 09:05 | 16 |
|
By the way, I personally do not like lebensohl 'sass' (slow action
shows stoppers), preferring 'fass', as Rick and I play. Thus we go
1NT-2S-3S as Stayman with a stopper, and 1NT-2H-3NT WITH a heart stopper.
If we go through the 2NT regamole, it alerts partner to the stopper problem.
Thus here, it WOULD be acceptable to go 2NT, 3NT except that this may be
a partial stopper problem opposite H-Jxx. Thus, I'll go along with 3D.
If we have no heart stopper at all, a 4-3 spade fit might be fine. In
that case, I may be overbidding as HQ is not full value, but what can I do ?
Lebensohl doesn't do a good job with invitations. Here, I only think you
can do an invitation if you have spades (2NT, then 3S rebid is an invite,
since 2S immediately was available for weakness). So over 3S, I plan to
bid 3NT hoping partner will diagnose my problem.
bb
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