Conference trucks::football;1

    
    To add the French note to the discussion on the previous topic about 
    those who are not selected, we could see at the last friendly in France
    an enormous flag with only "MADAR = CANTONA ?" written on (Mardar is
    the one who has been selected in place of Cantona).
    
    PYV
    
    

    Well I'm going to see the French vs Spain game at Elland Road... it
    would have been "interesting" to see what kind of reception the French
    team would have got with Cantona playing.... 
    
    Cheers,
    
    	Rick.

    Italian TV ran a story yesterday about ticket sales in Leeds being
    right down (only the France-Spain fixture looks to be a sellout).
    Rather than apathy on the part of the locals, they were attributing
    this so the economic difficulties of Rumanian and Bulgarian fans, very
    few of whom can seriously consider the idea of following their teams
    abroad.
    
    Mind you, can anyone see even a remote possibility of an Eastern
    European country ever getting to stage a major tournament? 
    
    Dom

    France - Romania tonight.
    
    These 2 teams probably are the most unpredictable ones. 
    Romania was brilliant at the last WC as well as during the qualif.....
    but was defeated home by France 3:1. 
    France is at the same level that at the last EC where they came in
    Sweden after 19 matches without defeat, and were eventually more than 
    average. Now they are at 23 matches without defeat, but never convinced
    me. France's weaknesses probably lay in the forwards (as usual). The only 
    class player in the forward line is Djorkaeff.
    Midfield combines a class player, Zidane, with other who never
    convinced me such as Angloma or Guerin.
    Defense is good, although Blanc still is a better attacker than
    defender.
    
    After the yesterday's result, i.e.  Spain - Bulgaria 1:1, which was an
    excellent match, with 2 well prepared team, I believe that this group
    is the death group, with 4 teams more or less at the same (high) level.
    
    France has another pb to solve: more than half of the team signed for 
    foreign Clubs and are a bit destabilized by very hard move discussions:
    Zidane (Juve), Djorkaeff (Inter), Dugarry (Milan AC), Thuram (Inter),
    Lizarazu (Bilbao), Martins (La Corugna), Blanc (Barcelona)...
    
    Let's see if this mosaic can play as a team.
    
    PYV     
     
    
    

Yes, this could be a great game - as you say, completely unpredictable. But I 
have to disagree with Spain-Bulgaria - I thought it was awful! Ball control 
and passing were terrible,both teams looked really nervous. It got more 
exciting towards the end, but apart from Stoichkov and Letchkov, it looked like 
a second division game.

grahame

    Grahame,
    >> but apart from Stoichkov and Letchkov, it looked like
    a second division game.
    
    What about Michailov? He made some blinding saves! Sorry to be so brief
    (we have had no systems most of the day) This was one of the better
    games IMHO esp the second half of this game. If Spain exercise a little
    more control they could win this group.
    
    
    			Stretch.

    
    Apart from the constent violence which generated deserved cards, the match
    was very entertaining, with many good actions, both teams continuously
    trying to score (to be compared with the other games).
    
    The Stoichkov millimeter pass which drove to the penalty was a beauty.
    Sincerely, I'd like to see many 2nd divisions matches like that one. 
    
    Well, I expect a other good match tonight.
    
    PYV

Only saw the second half of this, and the goal (24 minute, approx). Very 
open, entertaining, too many fouls. France looked very compact and organised, 
but didn't actually create many chances (memories of PSG). Dugarry scored when 
the Romanian keeper made a suicidal decision to come for a long high ball 
right at the edge of the box, leaving the Frenchman with an open goal to head 
into.

grahame

    Not a brilliant game. Loko could have done more damage if he had come on
    earlier. The goal was the result of a complete cock-up by the Romanian
    keeper. Too much stop/start about the game, with the ball going out of
    play too often for such "quality" side. 
    
    The ref was a bit more relaxed than previous games (35 yellow cards
    already) which was surprising given his record in the Bundesliga
    (60 odd yellow and double figure red cards in 18 games!!!). I am sure I
    heard a comment about German refs being paid approx �1000 per game! How
    much?
    
    
    			Stretch.

    .9
    
    It was �1,000 a season not per game.
    
    .8
    
    I agree too many fouls, mostly by the French. I thought they were a
    pretty dirty team on the whole. 
    
    Very fortunate goal, coming off the back of the defenders head but
    agian what was the keeper thinking of?
    
    
    CHARLEY

    >> It was �1,000 a season not per game.
    
    The person I watched it with still seems sure it was per game because
    the rest of the the comment was to do with the fact that the refs are
    only getting �200-ish per game during this championship.
    
    If he (the ref last night) did get �1000 per season he gets just �55
    per game. 
    
    
    			Stretch.  

    The refs are getting �400 for the Euro championships. I think 6 games
    is the most they can do.
    
    
    CHARLEY

    Apparently Romania are to officially protest to UEFA regarding last
    night's game, presumably in the hope of getting it replayed?
    
    Paul

Hopefully with the result that dubious decisions will be 
in future reviewed by a third ref. using TV.

What a travisty. The goal was clearly over the line but Romania
are out of the competition due to a bad decision

I'd say Romania are out of the competition because of a curiously lacklustre 
second half performance last night. They lost almost every 50-50 ball, they 
showed little or no fight in midfield, and their finishing was non-existent. I 
really wondered if they cared.

g

    
    I'd add  that they're out because they also lost to France,
    disappointing though the result was, one match doesn't make a
    tournament.
    
    Ian

True one match doesn't make a tournament but Romania still 
have a game to go against Spain. Bulgaria still have to play
France and are less likely to win.
In addition Romania now have little else to play for other than
pride whereas if lasts night's game was a draw they would still be 
playing for a quarter final place and who's to say that they wouldn't 
have lifted their game against Spain in order to qualify.
Is it less fair that Spain will now be playing a team who won't be 
as fired up as they might have been ? 
No matter what you say it is wrong for a team to win , lose or draw
when a mistake is made which is so blatent and avoidable.
You can bet that when money rather than nationalism starts to ride on 
these games things will change.
I wonder whether Romania could sue the Ref or UEFA for loss of earnings
due to the incompetence of their organization.

    and the score was?

    
    1-0 to Bulgaria. Stoitschkow scored after 2 1/2 mins
    
    P

    you can also try www.euro96.com.
    
    Paul

    .19 thanks for the score
    
    .20 the access from here in the U.S is so slow to either euro96 or
        eurosoccer 
    
    regards
    
    Andrew.D.Wicks

Andrew,

From the US use either 

http://www.yahoo.com/text/Recreation/Sports/Soccer/Competition/Euro_96

which gives you the Reuters feed and pointers to lots of other euro soccer sites, 
and is usually only 20 mins behind actual, or

http://www.soccernet.com/euro96/results.html

which is the Daily Mail feed and quite fast.

Gerry

    Landlord
    
    Thanks that's much faster than the original websites.
    
    Regards
    
    Andrew.D.Wicks

    france drew 1-1 with spain on saturday so they are level with Bulgaria
    on 4 points and they play then on Tuesday - should be a good game for
    those going [right Jon?] as the loser will leave themselves vunerable
    to be leapfrogged (no pun intended) for runners-up if spain beat the
    disappointing romanians.
    
    Interesting question since they both have 1-1 draws and 1-0 wins is who
    wins the group if they draw with each other?
    
    regards
    
    Andrew.D.Wicks

>    Interesting question since they both have 1-1 draws and 1-0 wins is who
>    wins the group if they draw with each other?
    
I think the answer to this is something like: whoever has the better points per 
game from matches played during the qualifying for the last 3 competitions
(Sweden, USA, England). Incredibly. 

grahame

    
    	If France and Bulgaria finish at the same level, France is 
    	qualified du to the UEFA coeficient.
    
    	PYV
    	

    It's early on a Monday morning so could you explain what a UEFA
    coeficient is?
    
    andrew.d.wicks

See .-3 (he said helpfully)

g

    
    UEFA established a ranking for all european national teams regarding
    many criteria including the last qualification phases, but also
    friendlies. Of course, the validity of these criteria is matter to
    discussion to say the least. 
    
    May be some colleagues do have some precisions on how this ranking has
    been calculated this time. 
    
    Pierre-Yves

    
    	Some comments about France - Spain
    
    France had the control of the match except the last 10 minutes of each
    half, which eventually caused the Spanish equalizer.
    
    As French, I strongly differ from the too enthousiastic media about the 
    French team. OK, they control the ball, have a good passing, etc...
    but this is at the expenses of creativity. These too rigorous Jacquet's
    tactics are not really made for the french nature. 
    A guy like Zidane for instance performs well under his level, as well
    as Djorkaeff, although this one could show once his class on the French
    goal.  
    Hope that this team will really show its potential at the next match
    otherwise it will be the same scenario as the last Euro Cup. 
    
    To-morrow they need at least a draw versus Bulgaria, their "black
    beast", and try to erase a small part of the deception caused by the
    World Cup's last second elimination (versus Bulgaria).
    I took a day off to watch, as the match is 4:30 PM in France.
    
    PYV  
     

    Phew coeficients eh no wonder I failed Maths - I really hope it doesn't
    come down to that even penalties would be fairer. My memory doesn't
    stretch back to Sweden but surely Bulgaria should be better since they
    did at least qualify for WC 94 and did quite well in it I remember.
    
    What next - number of shots on goal per team over the last decade.
    
    I hope the DIGITAL PCs calculating the coeficients don't have any of
    those dodgy pentiums in them.
    
    Regards
    
    Andrew.D.Wicks

    Well France beat Bulgaria 3-1 to take the group and bulgaria go home
    because Spain took second place after beating Romania 2-1 with a late
    goal.
    
    France finished on 7pts, Spain on 5, bulgaria on 4 and romania 0
    
    Regards
    
    Andrew.D.Wicks

    I thought that the Romanian goal was the best goal in the tournament so
    far, the ball hardly left the ground all the way from the Romanian
    goal-line to the Spanish goal....
    
    Ray....

    France - Bulgaria
    
    I can't say that France dominated. The field occupation was shared with
    a very good Bulgaria start and France for once finishing better. 
    The difference was made by a good header from Blanc who opened the
    score in the first half, while both teams missed 2 very good occasions.
    Same scenario in the second half with Bulgaria attacking a bit more.
    Blanc made again the difference when he provoked an own goal from a 
    Bulgarian defender. 
    Then Stoichkov put a superb free kick from the 25 yards.
    This was not enough, and France took the revenge after 1993 by scoring
    a third one at the last minute by Loko. 
    Once again France proved to be a solid team, but with a "seriousness"
    dramatically restricting its creativity. Zidane was a bit better, but
    very far from his actual level (he had a car accident 3 days before the
    Euro), Djorkaeff was average. The good points will go to Blanc, Lama,
    Dessailly, Thuram and Karembeu. 
    
    Well, France plays Holland next Saturday.
    No doubt that the Dutch will not make the same mistakes as they did
    versus England, missing everything in front (Bergamp in particular),
    and leaving boulevards in defense. 
    
    PYV