| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 662.1 | | EVETPU::CANTOR | This is not all rock and roll, dude. | Fri May 05 1989 06:25 | 8 |
| Re .0
> People lie .... past lay
> Hens lay .... past laid
Also people lie .... past lied
Dave C.
|
| 662.2 | minding the gutter... | POOL::TRUMPLER | aborted illogical link | Fri May 05 1989 18:01 | 4 |
| Re .0:
I want to know who he laid, and if she enjoyed it.
>M
|
| 662.3 | Eddie Bauer does it? | SKIVT::ROGERS | Damnadorum Multitudo. | Fri May 05 1989 20:29 | 3 |
| I can lay down beside you... but only when I'm plucking a goose.
L.
|
| 662.4 | does Pope tell the lay to lie? | COOKIE::DEVINE | Bob Devine, CXN | Fri May 05 1989 20:40 | 29 |
| Re .0
> People lie .... past lay
> Hens lay .... past laid
Re .1
> Also people lie .... past lied
These words cause more trouble than they are worth! What's
the difference between "laying around the house" and "lying
around the house"? Or, as Ollie North found out, "lying to
the House". [old joke: my wife is so fat that when she lays
around the house, she lays *around* the house...]
What people put down can be either "lie" or "lay". If it themselves,
then they "lie down" but if it is a book then it is "lay down".
But what about when someone else forces you down? Does that
person "lay" or "lie" you down? On a headstone why is it
"Here Lies _____" instead of "Here Lays _____"?
As people can both lay and lie, so too can hens lie (on their
nest) and lay (lay eggs). What about the fox at the henhouse?
Is he "lying in wait" or "laying in wait"? If you think that
is obvious (answer == lay, I think) then what about the case
of two layers, one on top of the other. Can the bottom layer
be correctly said to "underlay" or "underlie" the upper?
To my ear "underlay" sounds better. But reverse it and
"lies under" sounds better than "lays under".
This confusion is a wart on English. And that's no lie...
|
| 662.5 | Was in dagam Herodes gudja naman... | MINAR::BISHOP | | Fri May 05 1989 21:36 | 16 |
| Based on my memory of Proto-Germanic grammar and vocabulary,
the etymology of the confusion is:
Lie/lay is from "legan", to be at rest on a flat surface.
lay/laid is from "legjan", the causative of "legan", to cause
to be at rest on a flat surface.
lie/lied is from "lugjan", to tell a lie.
A similiar case is:
sit/sat from "sedan", be upright.
set/set from "sedjan", causative of "sedan", cause to be upright.
-John Bishop
|
| 662.6 | | KAOFS::S_BROOK | Here today and here again tomorrow | Fri May 05 1989 23:59 | 4 |
| well that explains EVERYTHING!
especially on a Friday afternoon!
|
| 662.7 | | VOGON::JOHNSTON | | Mon May 08 1989 21:32 | 24 |
|
Simple, really.
"Lay" is transitive (lay something) and a weak (regular) verb
"Lie" is intransitive, and a strong (irregular) verb.
Cf. current German
"Legen" (transitive, weak)
"Liegen" (intransitive, strong).
You find a number of these pairs in Germanic languages - the transitive form
is weak, and the intransitive form is strong, eg
set/sit
fell/fall
(I'm sure there are others in English, but I can't remember offhand)
and lots more in German (senken/sinken, ertr�nken/ertrinken, etc etc)
Ian
|
| 662.8 | "Roll me over lay me down and do it again" | IOSG::GARDNER | Eugene Gardner | Tue May 09 1989 14:27 | 3 |
| The regularity is irrelivant I think. Except in nautical jargon, the
intransitive use of 'lay' is "now only illiterate" (OED).
|
| 662.9 | Curioser and curioser | VOGON::JOHNSTON | | Tue May 09 1989 16:42 | 5 |
|
Yeah, the irregularity is irrelevant. Just a linguistic curiosity...
Ian
|
| 662.10 | | RAVEN1::MKENNEDY | Eschew sesquipedalianism! | Fri May 12 1989 19:25 | 1 |
| I wish he had laid a day of vacation on my time card.
|
| 662.11 | ... Or is that like "Who's on first ..."? | LESCOM::KALLIS | Anger's no replacement for reason. | Tue May 16 1989 21:33 | 7 |
| Re .2 (>M):
>I want to know who he laid, and if she enjoyed it.
whom.
Steve Kallis, Jr.
|
| 662.12 | 'sleight | TKOV51::DIAMOND | This note is illegal tender. | Wed Jun 06 1990 08:04 | 9 |
| While lawyers are wiling, do you say:
liars are LYING in wait in their lair,
or:
liars are LAYING in wait in their lair?
(P.S. When porting from a VAX to a PDP-11, remember that a
large virtual address space is not available, so you have to
construct overlies, right?)
|
| 662.13 | and a fan of alliteration | TLE::RANDALL | living on another planet | Wed Jun 06 1990 15:38 | 4 |
| Ever one to advocate reducing word count, I'd say the lying
lawyers lurk in their lair.
--bonnie
|