Conference thebay::joyoflex

Medi�val?  Co�rdinate?  Nonsense, too hard to spell.  Besides, if we
can't even agree on how to pronounce "!" ("screamer") how can anyone 
expect us to make sense of such arcane squiggles?

	HRB

Diphthongs aren't squiggles.  Perhaps the ligatures of the digraphs used
in days of yore to represent the diphthongs are squiggles, but the diphthongs 
themselves are not.  It is not at all arcane to use digraphs.  

Yes, bring back the diphthongs.

Does anyone remember what is the special name for two consonants used to make 
a single consonantal sound, like the 'sh' in 'shelf?'


Dave C.

The OAD defines "digraph" as "a pair of letters expressing one sound, as SH 
or EA" - but I'd wager that Dave is looking for more...

There are, or have been, several commonly used ligated consonantal digraphs
in English - `fi' is often printed with the upper serif of the `i' joined to
the crossline of the `f', and the dot of the `i' is combined with the top of
the `f'.  In the 18th Century, `ct' was generally printed with a small swooping
curve connecting the serif of the `c' with the top of the `t'.  In ye olde
English, that `y' wasn't a `y' at all - it was a thorn, which was shaped some-
thing like a `b' and a `p' printed in the same space, and it represented the
soft `th' sound.  Hence, `ye olde gyfte shoppe' is really `the old gift shop,'
and who wants to buy old gifts...?

If digression to German is permissible, `ss' is represented by a lovely curvy
digraph that looks like a munged `B'.

I like Dave's comment that diphthongs aren't arcane.  But I fear that because
the tendency is to reduce language to the lowest common denominator they soon
will be so.  That tendency is shown by the progression from the highly 
inflected ancient languages to our modern, relatively uninflected ones.  It's
too bad...


Cheers,
Dick

Right, Dick.  I'm looking for something more.  I'm looking for the term
that is to a consonant as a diphthong is to a vowel.  The word 'diphthong'
has three of them.

The thorn has become a wye because of corruption.  A thorn sort of looks like
a wye, and has been rendered as such lately (lately being a couple of hundred
years, I guess).

Dave C.

As .2 demonstrates to those who have 8-bit terminals, the DEC multinational
(8-bit) character set (available on VT200 series, Pro, and others) implements
a few ligatures.  These are available not so much because people want to use
them in English, but because various European languages use them extensively.
All manner of accented characters and special characters are in the same
character set.

I would give examples, but:
- if you have a 7-bit terminal, they wouldn't do you much good
- if you have an 8-bit terminal, you can provide your own examples

				David Larrick

The Old English "thorn" character was represented by 'y' because
the first English printers were using typefaces cut in Germany
which lacked "thorn" so they took an unused (?) letter that was
close enough.  See the Encyclopaedia Brittanica (11th Edition)
for more details.

Martin.

  re .2

  In linguistics, the sound of 'sh' isn't made up of two consonants; it is
  one consonant, rendered by two letters.  'sh' is a sibilant, if memory
  serves.  An 'affricate' is the result of combining two consonants, 
  specifically a stop and a fricative, for example, 't' and 'sh' make 'ch' 
  as in 'church'.  (In German, the 'sh' sound is rendered by three letters: 
  'sch', so the same affricate is 'tsch' as in 'Deutsch'.)

--Simon

While dipthongs may have fallen out of the orthography of the 
language, they remain in the phonology.  The 'i' sound in "high," the 
'oy' sound in "boy," and the 'ow' sound in "cow" are all pronounced as 
dipthongs.

MM

Argghhhhh    diphthongs  !
                ^
                |

Dave C.

I thought he was referring to the practice of testing the ocean
temperature with your sandals on...

- dave

Now you really know why I wanted to collect personal 
dictionaries . . . .

MM

Re:  4, Dave -

  I asked my linguistics professor about this, and he says that he has no
memory of there being a specific term for this, the consonant's version of
the diphthong, although he said that if he were to run across it again, he
would then be aware of it.  That is to say that there may be a term for it.
I remember when I took a printing course that the type we used had such
characters, two consonants on one piece of type, therefore the term that
you are looking for may be a printer's term, not a linguistic term.  Does
anyone out there have any idea where to look.  Maybe if we find that term we
can determine whether or not that it is the term for which we are looking.