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Conference taveng::bagels

Title:BAGELS and other things of Jewish interest
Notice:1.0 policy, 280.0 directory, 32.0 registration
Moderator:SMURF::FENSTER
Created:Mon Feb 03 1986
Last Modified:Thu Jun 05 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:1524
Total number of notes:18709

708.0. "Soviet Emigration Policies" by ABE::STARIN (A Travelling Man) Tue May 30 1989 10:59

    I saw an article in the newspaper this morning concerning how the
    Soviet Union is filling Jewish emigration slots with Pentacostal
    Christians (the Soviets are glad to be rid of both groups BTW).
    
    The Russian Pentacostal Christians seem to be settling in the West
    Springfield, MA area incidentally.
    
    How is this affecting Jewish emigration? I would think that for
    every Pentacostal the Soviets send off to the West there is one
    Jew who can't emigrate to Israel?
    
    Can anyone shed any light on this?
    
    Thanks.
    
    Mark
T.RTitleUserPersonal
Name		DateLines
708.1LDYBUG::ALLISTERAlex DTN 223-3154 MLO21-3/E87Tue May 30 1989 18:3512
    re .0
    
>   (the Soviets are glad to be rid of both groups BTW).
    
    Mark:
    
    If this was true, there would be no quotas. How do you support
    this statement?
    
    Also, most Jews leaving USSR do not ascend [just to be criptic].
    
    Alex
708.2A ClarificationABE::STARINA Travelling ManWed May 31 1989 09:4518
    Re .1:
    
    I presumed there were quotas which is why I expressed concern. As
    I mentioned, if there are only a certain number of emigration slots
    anyway and a small percentage of those are for Jews, then if the
    Soviets fill those slots with Pentacostals, where does that leave
    Jews who want to emigrate to Israel?
    
    Soviet policy is still officially atheistic. The Jews and the
    Pentacostals have incurred Soviet wrath because they stubbornly
    refuse to recognize this policy like "good" Soviet citizens should.
    Since consigning people to the Gulag doesn't go as unnoticed as
    it used to, the Soviets are glad to send members of both groups
    into exile.
    
    Hope that clarifies my point.
    
    Mark
708.3Minor corrective addendumSUTRA::LEHKYI'm phlegmatic, and that's cool.Wed May 31 1989 09:539
    Mark,
    
    The problem is that most Jewish emigrants from the USSR want to leave
    the USSR, but do not want to emigrate to Israel. Once they're out
    (whilst they had applied for emigration to Israel, initially), they
    "change" their mind and either apply for an immigration visum to the US
    of A or Canada.
    
    Just to put things into perspective.
708.4A Minor Memory DumpABE::STARINA Travelling ManWed May 31 1989 10:548
    Re .3:
    
    Thanks. I had heard about the "change" of mind that occurs some
    times but it slipped my mind when I wrote the note.
    
    Thanks for the memory refresh.
    
    Mark
708.5Problems all aroundUSACSB::SCHORRWed May 31 1989 11:3619
    There is a problem on the American side.  There are a limited number
    of imigration slots available.  Currently the number of imigrants
    that the Soviets are letting out has increased dramatically catching
    the U.S. by surprise.  The U.S. imigration laws leave quotas on
    the number of imigrants from each country and the Soviets have used
    up their slots.  The U.S. is in the postion of having to take slots
    away from other groups especially Asians to keep up with the flow
    of Soviets emigrees.  This can lead to pitting one group against
    another for the limited number of slots.  
    
    I can not fault a person for saying they want to imigrate to Israel
    and then changing their mind when the only way to imigrate is to
    say you want to go to Israel.  I know there are those who believe
    that Israel needs the people and I don't doubt them but forcing
    someone to go to only one place violates my belief in freedom of
    imigration.
    
    WS
708.6NOTIME::SACKSGerald Sacks ZKO2-3/N30 DTN:381-2085Wed May 31 1989 11:488
    I saw something in the Globe the other day that mentioned the Pentacostals
    going to Israel.  I assume that this was an error, given the Globe's
    tradition of excellent journalism (insert ironical smily face here).

    re .-1:
    In the US, there's no free immigration, hence the quotas.  Israel
    has free immigration for all Jews.  The real problem is that the
    Soviet bloc doesn't have free *emigration*.
708.7Nasty situation developingDECSIM::GROSSI need a short slogan that won't overflow the space availableWed May 31 1989 16:0016
There seems to be a tremendous problem with USA immigration. We do not grant
refugee status to Russian Jews automatically. Each case is treated on an
individual basis. The backlog for making these reviews is about 1 year now
and climbing rapidly.

The irony is that the better off a Russian Jew was in Russia, the more he/she
left behind, the more likely USA immigration is to reject the applicant because
he/she was not obviously an oppressed refugee.

At the waiting camps in Italy, Russian Jewish refugees are greeted by Jews for
Jesus representatives (among others).

My information comes to me from a report given by a group from my synagogue who
visited Italy this year to check out the situation.

Dave