Conference taveng::bagels

    O.K., I'm not ashamed to show my ignorance.
    
    What is the "Lavi" project?
    
       Alan
    

    RE .1

>    O.K., I'm not ashamed to show my ignorance.
>    
>    What is the "Lavi" project?
>    

    Boker Tov Alan,

    The "Lavi" was a project to develop a new fighter plane in Israel.
    Work was being done by I.A.I. (Israel Aircraft Industries?).  Paid for
    by the government.  It was very controversial since the development
    costs on such things are quite high.  The alternative to the "Lavi"
    is to continue buying American fighters.

    L'hit
    Gavriel

    Gavriel, thank you for your information. I remember reading/hearing
    about the development of the aircraft - and its cancellation. I
    forgot the specific name of the project.
    
    A Happy and Healthy New Year to you and yours.
    
      Alan
    

    The American Press stated that it was funded by American dollars
    that that heavy American pressure was put on Israel to cancel the
    project.
    
    L'Shana Tova
    
    WS  

    One thing is for sure, Dov Zakheim is not a favourite person in
    Israel.  Zakheim is (was?) an Asst. Sec. of Defence who was responsible
    for doing the feasibility study on the Lavi, as such he was the
    American responsible for scuttling the project.
    
    Zakheim is an American official who also happens to be an Orthodox
    Jew, holds degrees from Harvard, London School of Economics.  He
    also speaks Hebrew fluently, and has many relatives in Israel. 
    With all this proceeding him you'd think he'd would have had contrary
    opinions, but not so.
    
    I remember reading an article about him in Maariv a few months ago,
    it wasn't too complimentary, describing his lush home and surroundings
    in a subub of D.C., and also mocking his wife's Ashkenazic
    pronounciations.
    
    David

    Lavi: (Lion? - Successor to the 'kfir'?)
    
    	This is what I have gathered from the papers (no! I do not have
    the clippings! %*})
    
    The Lavi was an ambitious project to develop a new fighter that
    would incorporate the latest avionics and reduce Israel's dependance
    on foreign (friend or foe!) aircraft purchases. A few prototypes
    had been developed and they proved technically exciting. 
    	The project was heavily funded by the US; and feasibility studies
    showed that the Lavi, though it may be superior to other fighters,
    would be extremely expensive. As such, the US pressured Israel to
    cancel the project. I also believe that a few (many?) military
    leaders were against the project since it was draining scare resources
    away from other needed military projects.
    	To make the act less bitter, the US promised Israel that US
    aircraft manufacturers would be convinced to sign buy-back projects
    with the IAI thus reducing the possibility of heavy layoffs.
    	Faced with a hobson's choice of a superb fighter and heavy
    economic damage or a injury to a project that had contributed heavily
    not only to the development of high-tech but also to a swelling
    of national pride, the Likud and Labor fought over it. But finally
    economics seemed to have won and the project was scuttled.
    	Moshe Aren, himself an aeronautical expert, and a minister in
    the cabinet, resigned after the decision.
    
    Enlighten me if I have goofed up!
    
    -parthi

    As I recall it...
    
    The Lavi was designed specifically for Israel's unique needs.. an
    airplane that could do excellent ground support in close quarters.
    The US planes Israel is buying (specifically the F-16) is used for
    air to air combat. This is less of a problem for Israel. Most of
    their air support is needed for ground fighting.
    
    The Lavi, from the start, was jointly funded by US and Israeli funds.
    This was known by the US, and in fact took special permission from
    congress. The US gains some jobs, since the Israelis were going
    to buy US built GE engines, as well as other components. The Israelis
    gained by having a plane unique to their needs, rather than having
    to extensively modify US planes as they do now, and also could
    potentially sell the planes to other countries.
    
    The unique part of the Lavi is the full system integration between the
    on board avionics, the plane, and the pilot. It is the most avionically
    advanced plane available because of its extensive use of decision
    support systems. The theory was that most modern pilots do not have
    time to react to existing conditions because too much information is
    given to them at once and they are not capable of digesting it all
    quickly enough. The Lavi systems were manufactured to only present the
    most needed data to the pilot by processing all of the factors needed
    to make a decision. This would, in theory, give the pilot a significant
    advantage and make the plane far superior to the competition. 
    
    The discussions centered within Israel on whether or not to kill the
    plane due to budget constraints. Several prototypes were built, and
    functioned beyond expectations. Even the Americans agreed to that. The
    problem was that the military men in Israel, certainly with the help of
    the American aircraft industry lobbyists, were concerned that if they
    built the plane, they would not have enough budget left for some of the
    more basic weapons. They were therefore worried that they were trading
    off a better plane for inferior positioning of the other forces. I
    think this is what finally did it in. The decision was to sub-optimise
    the plane for the benefit of the other weapon systems. Of course, I do
    not want to under emphasize the high pressure role the US played in
    canceling the project. They certainly had a lot to do with it. I think
    the Boeings and Lockheeds did not want Israel selling a plane in
    competition to them, and they certainly did not want to loose such a
    good customer. 
    
    I also understand that many of the avionics systems were unique
    to the Lavi, and were part and parcel of the design. They are not
    easily adaptable to other planes, and therefore cannot be simply
    placed into the US planes that Israel buys.
    
    Sorry to be so long winded, but I believe this is a basically accurate
    picture of what the Lavi was and why the Lavi was canceled.
    
    By the way, IAI is still making an earlier generation plane, the
    Kfir, based on a copy of the French Mirage. The Lavi was to be the
    successor.
    
    Jack

    I seem to recall that if successful, there was some prospect of
    selling the Lavi to the USAF.
    
    As described earlier, the avionics would have made the Lavi the
    most advanced fighter in the air. It was terminated because of the
    drain on the rest of the military budget.
    
    Interesting to speculate on how the Lavi would stack up against
    our current efforts to develop new aircraft. I read the other day
    that a US program to develop surveillance drones is way over budget
    and failed a series of performance tests. Meantime, the Israelis
    build and flies drones which were very effectively used throughout
    the 1980s.
    
    - Richard