Conference taveng::bagels

    Please supply a translation to this story for those of us who don't
    know Yiddish.  It's such a funny story.  Funniest in Yiddish, funny
    in English, and not all that funny if you're not Jewish.
    
    I don't know Yiddish, but remember, about 3 years back, some one
    brought this story to Thanksgiving at our house (we get about 30
    or so people together for this).  It was really funny watching the
    reactions to this story:
    
    	The grandparents were almost literally rolling on the floor
    	because it is such a funny story in Yiddish.
    
    	The parents were laughing, but not as hard. They understood
    	most of the story, but not all of it.
    
    	The kids kept asking "what's so funny, what's so funny" because
    	they didn't understand any of it (except for maybe a word or
    	here and there).
    
    I thought it was interesting, though kind of sad.
    
    					Michael

    	Actually, it's not really in Yiddish, but in that mixture of
    English and Yiddish that Leo Rosten calls "Yinglish" in _The_
    _Joy_of_Yiddish_.  I can't carry on a conversation in Yiddish, but
    I have no trouble reading this.
    
    	Thanks for typing it in, Don.  Even though I feel that I've
    heard it before, I'm still laughing.
    
    			David

>>                         -< A request and an anecdote >-
>>
>>    Please supply a translation to this story for those of us who don't
>>    know Yiddish.  It's such a funny story.  Funniest in Yiddish, funny
>>    in English, and not all that funny if you're not Jewish.
    
	Yes, I think your anecdote is sad, too. It's difficult to
	translate humor between any two languages, but "from Yiddish to
	..." must be the hardest! :-)

	To the readers of the translation, a warning!  Most Yiddish
	humor (including this story) has a very high "background-culture-
	assumption" content. Therefore, something which is absolultely 
	"hysterical" in the original may not even be funny in translation.
	In translation, a number of things happen, as alluded to above.
	Here are just two:

		- It's not that funny if you're not Jewish, because you
			don't have the built-in/learned-in cultural
			bias and prejudice, foibles, knowledge of customs, etc.
			More, you've never "experienced" the stereotypical
			personality types (and the reasons for them!) and
			the resulting (stereotypical) personality
			interplay which, which form the basis for much 
			of the humor.

		- It's not that funny in English, because one of the
			pleasures of the humor is at another level, that
			is, word play (puns).  ["Fiddler on the Roof" has
			a level of this which is delicious to Yiddish-
			speaking audiences...Example: the names of the 
			characters. But it leaves non-Yiddish speakers "cold".]


	Well, anyway.  The tranlsation is below. I've translated it
	deliberately in places into poor English to try to keep some
	of the flavor of the Yiddish.

/don feinberg
====================================================================
For you first a glossary you need a little....(of somewhat untranslatable
words)

A "yenta" is a matchmaker. "Yenta" has also come to mean the extreme form
of the slow-witted, loud, busybody woman. Knows everybody's business
but her own.

A "bucher" is the first-born son. He's the "prize"!

A "Ganze Macher" is the big-shot of the bigshots. No one can compete.

"Schvartz-fuss"  means "black feet" exactly literally. It has no
sense of anything but dirty feet.

"Tzimmes" is typically a dish of vegetables (sweet potatoes, prunes,
carrots, ...) cooked until you can't tell whether anything in it
was ever alive or not. [OK, OK, if done nicely it's delicious!  :-)]

A "schmo" is a dumb person, always has the wrong answer.

A "schlemiel" is a never-do-well, always wrong, always in trouble.

To "schecht" is to kill an animal (for food) in accordance with the
Jewish dietary laws, i. e., to kill a Kosher animal in a Kosher way.

"Milchedige" means "dairy" in the sense of the Jewish dietary laws.  You
never combine milk and meat in any way at a given meal, and you have
separate utensils, complete -- plates, cutlery, cookingware, etc. -- for
milk and for meat.  To use the wrong utensil renders the utensil useless
and the food useless (not fit to eat or use).
========================================================================

			A Mini Legend

There were living three Indians: the father Gernowitz, the mother
Pocayenta, and the daughter Minnie-Horowitz.  One time, Minnie-Horowitz
came home and said to Pocayenta, "Mama, I'm going to get married".

Said Pocayenta, "Good, it's about time.  You've been telling me 'another
month' for seven years now.  Where is the bucher?"

Said Minnie-Horowitz, "Oy, Mama, have I found for myself a bucher! Hale and
hearty, and so handsome!"

"And what's his name?"

"They call him 'Sitting Bull'"

"And what kind of family has he?"

"Oy, he has a great family.  His father, Michuggene Ferd (=Crazy Horse)
is the Ganze Macher of the Black-foot  tribe."

Said Pocayenta, "Good, we'll have a big wedding ... er, uh, OH NO!"

"What's the matter?"

"We have a problem."

"So what's the problem?"

"The Teepee is not big enough to hold all the guests for the wedding.
All the Black-feet, and the Schmohawks, and the whole big extended
family."

Screamed Pocayenta to Geronwitz, "Geronowitz, stay home from the shop, and
go out and kill for me a buffalo."

Said Geronowitz, "For what do you want a buffalo?"

"With the meat of the buffalo, can I make a delicious buffalo tzimmes! And
with the skins, can I make this teepee bigger, and then we can invite the
whole world to the wedding."

So out went Geronowitz.  One hour passed, two hours, three hours, and no
Gernowitz.  A little later comes home Geronowitz with nothing in
his hand.

"Shelimiel!  So where's my buffalo?" Pocayenta screamed at him.

"You and your buffalo tzimmes"

"What's the problem?"

"The first time, have I seen a buffalo -- not good enough for your tzimmes,
not big enough for the teepee.  The second time, have I seen another buffalo,
big enough but not a good pelt - I've seen better.  Finally, have I found
a buffalo -- beautiful, fat, big. A perfect buffalo".

"And so? What then?"

"What then?  I went out to shecht the buffalo. I cooked it in my kitchen,
and you know what? Just what you'd think! I had brought with me only
the milchedige tomahawk".

  	It's really nice to hear (read) some Yiddish. I was amazed at
    how much I remember, even though I did read the story over the phone 
    to my mother for help. We both enjoyed it.

    	I couldn't carry on a conversation myself either, but I always 
    understood when my Grandparents talked Yiddish. 
    
    		Brings back memories. Thanks,
    						Linda

  

    Ok, NOW I get it!

    You owe me another cup of coffe, I just spit this one up.

    I loved it.  Thanks, Don.
    
      Ben
    

You should only excuse me for being so presumptuous as to question your
translation, but I think the last paragraph goes like this:


>        "Vuden?  Ich hab gegangen tzu schocten der buffalo, Ich hub  gekkukt
>    in  mein  tasch, und du vaist vus?  Nahr vus Ich bin -- chub genemin mit
>    mir die milchedige tomahawk".

"What then?  I went to slaughter the buffalo.  I looked in my pocket,  and 
you  know  what?   Fool that I am  --  I only brought with me my 
milchedige tomahawk."


S'iz a gitte shpas (It's a good joke). My mother-in-law was in stitches.


Dick Rosenberg

Funny coincidence, MY mother-in-law was in stitches too !
    
    She pointed out that another error in the translation.  "tug" means
    DAY, not HOUR, so it should be,
    
    	On the first day....on the second day...
    
    not "...the first hour"
    
    /Eric

re:  .-1, .-2

Corrections accepted!

I typed that thing in quickly, and I wasn't really thinking.

Of course, "tug"  (like Dutch or German "Tag"), a day.

I must have thought "tisch" (table), not "tasch" (pocket).

sorry.

don

    I'd like to add a nice liddle (song), not related, funny and which
    has one of the nicest "hassidic" melodies I ever heard; but more
    than that, has a very special Yiddish taste...
    
    In a shtetl vait fun danen, ay, ay, ay, ay,
    is a rebbele faranen, ay, ay, ay,
    lernen tomid mit hassidim, ay ay, ay,
    mit meshorsim un talmidim, ay, ay, ay ....
                             
    [every line ends with ay, ay, ay - I won't type it!]
    
    Is a mol a nes geshen,
    m'hot dem Rebben's zun derze'en,
    mit a shikse tzvishn boimer,
    on a shames un on a shoimer, ay, ay, ay...
    
    S'iz der Rebbe bald gelofn
    mit a shtekn zei bashtrofn
    dem zun der poishe hot er fartribn -
    un iz mit der shiksele geblibn, ay, ay, ay ....
    
    Oif dem zogn di hasidim, ay, ay, ay,
    di meshorsim un talmidim, ay, ay, ay,
    dem rebn's shikse hot zibn mailes, ay, ay, ay,
    zi pasknt shoin afile shailes, ay, ay, ay...
    
    
    ===============================================================
    
    Translation (forgive my English, I think Spanish and speak Hebrew):
    
    In a shtetl (small town) far away from here,
    there was a Rabbi
    who'd always study with his hassidim (followers),
    with his assistants and students.
    
    Once happened a miracle:
    someone saw the Rabbi's son,
    with a non-jewish girl, in the woods,
    without any assistant or guardian!
    
    The Rabbi run immediately
    to punish them with a branch (piece of wood?)
    he expelled his son, the sinner...
    and kept the girl with him...
    
    The hassidim say,
    the assistants and students comment:
    The Rabbi's shikse (girl) has seven degrees
    she can now even settle halachic arguments!
    
    [This was tongue in cheek, even a bit late, my Purim contribution!]
    
    Juan-Carlos Kiel
    

    You're correct, Dick; that is the better of the two translations.
    

    Don,

    Great story.  Another translation point.

    'Sitting Bullvon' translates as 'Sitting Barbarian' so the pun
    got lost in simply translating to 'Sitting Bull'.

    I am also owed a cup of coffee.

    L'hit,
    Gavriel