Conference tallis::celt

A very clear photograph of the RUC's new (and apparently dangerous) 
arrest technique can be seen at
http://ireland.iol.ie/andersonstown-news/Lead.html
(you'll have to hurry, because the online edition isn't archived)

Also, have a look at
http://www.irishnews.com/220696/news1.html

    Brendan, I couldn't load http://www.irishnews.com/220696/news1.html?
    Are you sure you spelled it correctly?
    
    /George

  Try http://194.46.0.250/220696/news1.html

  All the authoritative nameservers for irishnews.com now properly
  respond to an address resolution for www.irishnews.com.  I'd guess
  that bogus information is cached in one of our name servers.
  They were either in the middle of a move to a new network address
  or someone purposely broadcast bad RIP packets, to deny access to
  www.irishnews.com.

                            Mark

  
[Posted by WWW Notes gateway]

  >>I'd guess that bogus information is cached in one of our name servers.
    
    
    What! You've only just realised this ;^)
    
    Shaun.

    It is such bollocks, I wasn't even going to legitimise it by an
    acknowledgement, but, it's prompted a thought. Not something that
    Holohan will respond to, I realise, because it requires critical
    analysis and some original thoughts.
    
    Anyway, just what is this stuff supposed to acheive? It's highly
    emotive, and spinning so fast I can hardly read it. It's full of
    exaggerations, and bollocks about old ladies dying of cancer. There is
    little fact in there, and none of it is corroborated. so why bother
    with it? It *has* to be for propaganda purposes, and not to win over
    the hearts and minds of the waverers either. I believe it is put about
    by people who want to promote sectarian division, who want to
    perpetuate the conflict in NI, not resolve it. By people who are trying
    to discredit the other "side" for no other reason than to help maintain
    a hatred and mistrust of everyone else in NI. It is stuff like this
    that is the basis for my belief in the "diet of crap" that is fed to
    Americans, and it worries me greatly that this stuff is read and
    believed by people.
    
    Lastly, in view of the above, I believe it is against PP&P to post it
    in here. I have in mind what would happen if I were to post an RUC
    propaganda sheet debasing Irish Catholics in the way the RUC have been
    debased in the article, using stereotypical lies.
    
    Laurie.

    .3
    
    A big thank you to Mark Holohan for providing me the with the site that
    contained proof that the Catholics started the violence.
    
    
    http://194.46.0.250/220696/news1.html
    
    * LAW IN DISORDER ... police carry away sitdown demonstrators on the
    Cliftonville Road last night Picture: Hugh Russell 
    
    (hardly a new method of removing sit-down protesters)
    
    Riots erupt as Orange march is forced through 
    
    Police accused as protesters are dispersed 
    
    By Niall Blaney 
    
    VIOLENCE erupted last night as a controversial Orange parade passed
    through a nationalist area in north Belfast. 
    
    Dozens of petrol bombs were thrown and a van burned out at the junction
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    of the New Lodge and Antrim roads. 
    
    Riot police moved in to move hundreds of protesters from the parade
    route's first flashpoint at the corner of Clifton Park Avenue and the
    Cliftonville Road. 
    
    The demonstrators had organised a sitdown at the junction - to block
    the march which started from Clifton Street en route to the loyalist
    Tiger's Bay. 
    
    (Obviously, trying to interfere with the Orangemen's civil rights to
    walk anywhere they like)
    
    The protestors had campaigned to have the parade rerouted away from
    nationalist areas. 
    
    (See above)
    
    The organisers of the counter-demonstration appealed for calm as police
    Land Rovers approached the crowd, hemming it in to the side streets off
    the Cliftonville Road. 
    
    A marshal shouted through a megaphone: "Do not give the RUC an
    opportunity to provoke you ... stay calm, sit down and link arms." 
    
    However at 6.40pm the Land Rover line moved forward and trouble erupted
    as the RUC began to drag people off the road. 
    
    Missiles were thrown at police as they trailed protestors away one by
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    one. 
    
    However the counter-demonstration organisers hit out at the RUC for
    "laying into the crowd". 
    
    (awwww diddums, if you start trouble you must pay the consequences)
    
    Residents said a woman in her 80s had been knocked down by a Land
    Rover. 
    
    The woman - who is understood to have head injuries - was taken away by
    ambulance. 
    
    Two RUC officers were also injured. 
    
    At 8.20pm the parade arrived on the scene. As it approached the
    junction missiles were thrown at the marchers from behind houses on the
             ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    Cliftonville Road. 
    
    Several dozen Orange lodges and 20 bands marched onto the Antrim Road
    and into Duncairn Gardens. 
    
    British soldiers created a cordon sanitaire along part of the Antrim
    Road. Army lorries with giant metal screens blocked the view of the
    march from nationalist enclaves. 
    
    Bricks and bottles were thrown at police. 
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    
    Newly-elected Sinn Fein representative Gerry Kelly was dragged away by
    police. He was handcuffed and put into the back of a Land Rover. 
    
    Mr Kelly later escaped still handcuffed. It is unclear whether he had
    been arrested. He went to a nearby house where his handcuffs were
    removed with a grinder. 
    
    Speaking to the Irish News, Mr Kelly criticised the police tactics and
    said they had inflicted injuries on people who had intended to stage a
    peaceful demonstration. 
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    
    (So why were petrol bombs, missiles etc. thrown at the marchers?)
    
    SDLP councillor Martin Morgan also hit out at the RUC's actions. 
    
    He said: "I think the RUC have overplayed their hand this evening. I
    think they were wrong in the tactics that they used, I think the Orange
    Order was wrong in proceeding with this march through a Catholic area
    where it wasn't welcome. 
    
    (freedom of speech etc.)
    
    "In the future we have to have agreement between all the players
    involved in these marches. That includes government, police, the local
    community and the Orange Order, so that we do not have situations like
    this again." 
    
    Sinn Fein's northern chairman Gerry O hEara had earlier appealed to the
    Orange Order to voluntarily change the route. 
    
    He said the organisers could have altered the route to "take it away
    from an area where the residents stated unequivocally that they did not
    wish it to enter". 
    
    He had appealed to the order to respect the wishes of the people of the
    area and take the "courageous decision" to reroute. 
    
    "History has taught us that the Orange Order's insistence on parading
    through nationalist areas only serves to heighten tensions and leads to
    confrontation."
    
    
    CHARLEY$not_much_more_to_say_really
    

    They're all as bad as each other, aren't they? Each trying to provoke
    the other, neither really interested in a compromise. Bloody
    depressing...
    
    Laurie.

    Re: .8
    
    You've hit the nail on the head there Laurie.
    
    Tribal demonstration is a hallmark of grass-root body politic in 
    Northern Ireland. It happens every year. Republicans at Easter;
    Loyalists in July and August.
    
    It is nothing less than specious for anyone to assert that marching
    through the other side's ghetto is purely an exercise of Civil Rights.
    Such marches are triumphalist, and I don't think that the strictest
    ideological interpretation of Civil Rights in includes the right to
    incite.
    
    Civil Rights come with a responsibility to exercise them in such a way
    that other people's rights are respected and accomodated.
    
    John 

    

        (edited note .5)
    
    .0
    
        I was waiting for a note on this occurence to be entered.It was on the
        Television in England a while back. The Orange march route had been
        blocked by Catholics and when the RUC tried to move them, as usual the
        Catholics picked up any missile, brick, bottle they could lay their
        hands on.
    
        They started the trouble.
    
        .0 is just more propaganda based journalism.
    
    
    
        CHARLEY
    

    Like previous noters I'm getting fed up of the same thing every
    marching season. If I was in charge I would give both sides involved in
    these triumphalist marches a lollipop, a nappy and tell them to go on 
    their little walks. It beggars belief how either government can have
    any patience with either side in NI when this stuff happens annually....
    
    Ray....

    Agreed, but what can the Gummint do? If they ban it, they'd be accused
    of all sorts of things from dictatorship down to the infringement of
    free speech. If they pretend it isn't there, there'd be a blood-bath.
    When they police it, crap like .0 ensues... I think they should ban
    them, and take the short-term flak for the long-term fix.
    
    Laurie.

Re: .6

    It is such bollocks, I wasn't even going to legitimise it by an
    acknowledgement, but, it's prompted a thought. Not something that
    Holohan will respond to, I realise, because it requires critical
    analysis and some original thoughts.

[more of the same elided]

Could we please remain polite? It would also be useful if there
were some factual content in notes entered here (I realise there
is no factual content in *this* note, either;-) ).

    ::bdalton,
    
    I think you'll find that the remainder of my note, that is to say, all
    of it save the part you chose to extract, fully meets your requirement
    "factual content in notes" (Unlike your own, as you so observantly
    mentioned). Perhaps you have a comment on that part? No? Oh well.
    
    HtH, Laurie.

    RE: .6
    
    Laurie, do the pictures in the Andersonstown News lie?
    I agree that the An Phoblacht articles have a certain
    "spin" on them, indeed requiring extra scrutiny and
    corroboration, but I would hardly call them unfactual.
    
    90% of the 3000+ marches planned this year involve members
    of the Unionist Community, as reported in the Irish
    Emigrant newsletter. But I agree, let's ban all of
    them, and avoid all these unnecessary provocations...

    .15
    
    http://ireland.iol.ie/andersonstown-news/Lead.html
    
    >Two RUC men drag away a protestor while a third blocks his nose and
    >squeezes his neck
    
    Funnily enough, this is the quickest way to subdue a mad dog.
    
    The bloke in this picture, do you have proof that he was a peaceful
    demonstrator, how the hell do you know if this bloke has not just
    lobbed a petrol bomb at somebody or chucked a brick at an eight year
    old?
    
    I notice he is nowhere near the fabled "peaceful sit down" supporters.
    
    Don't talk to me about "spin".
    
    
    CHARLEY          

    >Funnily enough, this is the quickest way to subdue a mad dog.
    
    Well that about says it all, doesn't it?
    
    >The bloke in this picture, do you have proof that he was a peaceful
    >demonstrator, how the hell do you know if this bloke has not just
    >lobbed a petrol bomb at somebody or chucked a brick at an eight year
    >old?
    
    I'm assuming that the bloke was one of the sit-down demonstrators
    as described in the article. And no, I do not have absolute proof ->
    do you ask for proof when viewing photographs in the Sun or the
    Guardian or whatever newspaper you read? Just curious.
    
    George

    .17
    
    >do you ask for proof when viewing photographs in the Sun or the
    >Guardian or whatever newspaper you read? Just curious.
    
    Yes, as I believe little of what I see and read in the above two
    papers. Anyway, that's exactly the point I'm trying to make. There's a
    refusal of some noters in this conference to believe that the Unionist
    orientated "media" strays from the truth in just about every article that 
    finds its way into this conference. 
    
    >>Funnily enough, this is the quickest way to subdue a mad dog.
        
    >Well that about says it all, doesn't it?
    
    Says what?
    
    
    CHARLEY

Re .14

I'm afraid I was unable to find any factual content in .6,
although there was indeed plenty of opinion.

Perhaps you would be kind enough to extract the sentences
in question, Laurie?

Thanks a lot.



> Perhaps you have a comment on that part? No? Oh well.

I hope you'll avoid putting words into my mouth in future.
Thanks again.

    .19
    
    >I'm afraid I was unable to find any factual content in .6,
    >although there was indeed plenty of opinion.
    
    Mr Dalton, there is plenty of fact in .6. Why do you continue this 
    incessant refusal to believe what Laurie and many others have been
    saying for the last year or so? 
    
    
    CHARLEY

    Thanks Charley, my sentiments entirely.
    
    Laurie.

    Mr Dalton, there is plenty of fact in .6. Why do you continue this 
    incessant refusal to believe what Laurie and many others have been
    saying for the last year or so? 

I don't think I have made any such refusal here, and I certainly
haven't made it incessently. I'm sure much of 'what Laurie and many
others have been saying for the last year or so' is perfectly correct.
I simply asked Laurie if he would point out to me the facts in .6
that I was unable to find. This is hardly the same as 'incessant
refusal to believe what Laurie and many others have been saying 
for the last year or so', so I'd appreciate it if you wouldn't
put words into my mouth, Charley.

Thanks very much.

Laurie, I was saddened to see that you subscribe entirely to Charley's
sentiments on this.

    >I don't think I have made any such refusal here,
    
    Ahem! Mr Dalton, what Laurie writes in .6 is a pretty accurate picture
    of many Unionist media releases, it just serves to stir up hatred
    between the protagonists in the conflict. Why do you question its
    authenticity if you have made no refusal?
    
    As to your statement regarding Laurie and me, I find that a very
    arrogant assumption on your part. Myself and Laurie agree on a great
    many things and we also disagree on a great many things in this and
    other conferences. 
    
    
    CHARLEY

   Ahem! Mr Dalton, what Laurie writes in .6 is a pretty accurate picture
    of many Unionist media releases, it just serves to stir up hatred

Charley, that's twice you've mentioned Unionist media in this topic.
What has the unionist media got to do with this discussion? Are you
absolutely convinced that you know what you're talking about?

    between the protagonists in the conflict. Why do you question its
    authenticity if you have made no refusal?

I don't question its authenticity, Charley. I am sure it is Laurie's 
authentic opinion. Would it be rude to ask a third time for the facts
in .6?

    As to your statement regarding Laurie and me, I find that a very
    arrogant assumption on your part. Myself and Laurie agree on a great
    many things and we also disagree on a great many things in this and
    other conferences. 

It wasn't an assumption, arrogant or otherwise. It's what Laurie himself
said in .21

    .24
    
    >Charley, that's twice you've mentioned Unionist media in this topic.
    >What has the unionist media got to do with this discussion? Are you
    >absolutely convinced that you know what you're talking about?
    
    Yes, but it seems that you don't.
    
    >I don't question its authenticity, Charley. I am sure it is Laurie's 
    >authentic opinion. Would it be rude to ask a third time for the facts
    >in .6?
    
    It is not an opinion. It is mostly fact. Why do you incessantly refuse
    to believe it? Paranioa?
    
    .22
    
    >Laurie, I was saddened to see that you subscribe entirely to Charley's
    >sentiments on this.
    
    Does the truth hurt that much?
    
    
    CHARLEY

At the risk of being immensely boring, here are what I see as the facts from .6
(these are the exact quotes from .6)


1) it's prompted a thought
    
2) It's highly emotive

3) none of it is corroborated

4) I believe it is put about
    by people who want to promote sectarian division, who want to
    perpetuate the conflict in NI, not resolve it. By people who are trying
    to discredit the other "side" for no other reason than to help maintain
    a hatred and mistrust of everyone else in NI. 

5) It is stuff like this
    that is the basis for my belief in the "diet of crap" that is fed to
    Americans

6) it worries me greatly that this stuff is read and
    believed by people.
    
7) I believe it is against PP&P to post it
    in here. 


Now, whether you agree with what Laurie says is unimportant, but if he states
that he believes something we have to accept that it is a fact that he belives
it.

Does that answer the questions?

regards,
//alan

    Re .26
    
    "...a fact that he believes it.."  ..mmm...?
    
    What the difference between a fact and a belief then?
    

    >Charley, that's twice you've mentioned Unionist media in this topic.
    >What has the unionist media got to do with this discussion? Are you
    >absolutely convinced that you know what you're talking about?
    
    Yes, but it seems that you don't.

I must agree with you, Charley, I have absolutely no idea what
you're talking about here. Would you care to explain to me the link
between the Unionist media, and any other note posted in this topic?
This isn't a rhetorical question.

    .28
    
    <sigh>
    
    Since the beginning of time itself, or at least since I started noting
    in this conference, every now and again someone lobs a news report in
    that basically slags off anything that's associated with the U.K. and
    says what evil bastards everybody is except Unionists/Sinn Fein etc. 
    because compared to them, the Virgin Mary seems like Pol Pot.
    
    Every time one gets posted, myself, Laurie, Alan, Chris used to, Shaun
    or somebody points out the faults, lies, exagerrations that lie in it.
    Funnily enough this rarely gets acknowledged. All we do get is more
    news stories along the same lines.
    
    Recently when they have been posted, Laurie and myself have asked if 
    anybody can find an independant source for the story. Amazingly enough, 
    not one has been forthcoming. Can you explain why one media outlet
    knows of the story when all of the scores of others has not?
    
    Why do you believe something is gospel when many others tell you and
    prove to you that it isn't?  
    
    >I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about here. 
    
    Rather ironic that.
    
           
    CHARLEY

    I have a glimmer of a suspicion that you actually had intended to write
    'Republicans' as opposed to 'Unionists.....unless of course things have
    drasticaly changed in NI since I was there ;^)
    
    Shaun. 

    Oooooopppppssssss!
    
    Sorry, Shaun is correct.
    
    
    CHARLEY

    ...what IS unionist media?? (seriously)..
    
    mick

And there was me wondering why I couldn't follow the thread of this discussion.

Confused of SBP
(but not for much longer)

    Yup, sorry, complete brainstorm.
    
    
    CHARLEY

    Maybe this thread can get back to the point. It would certainly seem
    that in recent weeks that (part of?)the RUC is back to its old tricks.
    
    The Paisleyites have not succeeded in derailing the peace yet, there is
    still a strong desire to end the war amoung the mass of Protestants in
    NI, and the marches have not been very well supported. There have been
    campaigns against sectarian graffitti in EAST Belfast, and 
    opposition to the supremacist marching is growing. There is no sign of
    the mass opposition which met Sunningdale, which Paisley lead. On the
    other side the looney wing of the Republican movement is under pressure
    and there is some hope that Adams will outmanoevre them yet. 
    
    In this context, extremist Loyalist elements who want a return to war
    are 'reduced' to sectarian beatings and provocative policing. 
    
    Those British readers here who don't see this may wish to reflect that
    they pick up the tab for this nonsense. CHARLEY, you may reflect that
    describing Irish people as mad dogs could be understood as racist. Such
    sentiments have a very long history of rationalising British repression
    against Irish people, and if you don't believe that we have a history
    of such repression to deal with and that it is all holohanite
    propaganda, then you lack historical understanding.
    
    Kevin   

    I take my hat off to your courage and integrity, CHARLEY.
    
    John

>    "...a fact that he believes it.."  ..mmm...?
>    
>    What the difference between a fact and a belief then?

"Scotland should remain in the UK"  --  that is my belief

"Alan Potter believes that Scotland should remain in the UK" -- fact

Hope this helps
//atp

    The biggest single problem with SF/IRA continuing their terrorist
    activities is this: they have handed, on a plate, the moral high-ground
    to the likes of Mad Dog Paisley. It has allowed the Unionist extremists
    to hide their separatist extremism behind a mask of moral indignation,
    and allowed them free rein to work their nasty agenda behind the scenes
    (or, more correctly, behind a smoke-screen of SF/IRA atrocities).
    
    As each SF/IRA death squad action unfolds, so that smoke-screen becomes
    thicker. The supporters of SF/IRA and their methods should think long
    and hard about this as they push themselves further into the
    wilderness. They should also think long and hard about any mistaken
    ideas they may have about provoking the Unionist murdering scum into
    taking similar action so they can bleat about it, and take said moral
    high-ground themselves, and using it to justify further sating of
    their blood-lust. It ain't gonna happen, Mad Dog is having too
    much fun trying to get his own way whilst Gerry Adams is kicking his
    heels in limbo.
    
    Laurie.

    >CHARLEY, you may reflect that describing Irish people as mad dogs could 
    >be understood as racist.
    
    I wasn't meant that way. 
    
    People can read anything into anything if they really want to, but I
    think that you are intelligent enough to realise that I was not
    suggesting that all Irish people are mad dogs.
    
    i/ It was a photograph, can you be judge, jury and executioner because
    of that photograph? Do you know what happened 5 seconds before that was
    taken?
    
    ii/ Last week in Trafalgar Square there was a spot of bother with a few
    maggot English Football hooligans, no-one blamed the police for wading in 
    with batons, riot shields etc. yet on balance IMO, their behavior was a 
    little less violent than the Republican element at the march in question.
    Why the double standards?
    
    
    CHARLEY

    
    -1
    
    Do you honestly believe that the RUC can be compared to say the London 
    police...english police etc etc...like V like.
    
    Mick
    

    .40
    
    In this particular incident I believe so, yes.
    
    That doesn't mean to say it works that way across the board.
    
    
    CHARLEY

    A swift piece on the RUC and the background to its current makeup.
    
    After the Burntollet riot which in many quarters is regarded as the 
    start of the Troubles, the British Government had to bite the bullet
    (so to speak) and recognise that not only had the B-Specials been
    seen to act (that is, over-react) in a sectarian way, but that they
    were no longer acceptable as an ancilliary backup force for the RUC.
    If anything had contributed to that watershed, it was the worldwide
    TV coverage of the rise to prominence of the Civil Rights movement
    in Northern Ireland and the way it was policed: brutally.
    
    As the B-Specials were drawn exclusively from the Protestant section
    of the community (a Protestant Ulster for a Protestant people) the then
    Labour Government agreed that another force would replace the
    B-Specials, and that that this force would have to be recruited from
    all (both) sections of the community. And so the Ulster Defence
    Regiment came into being. The recruitment drive was massive. Sectarian
    bias was to be a thing of the past. Catholic were to have a fair crack
    of the whip (as opposed to, err.. cracks from a different sort of whip).
    
    However, in winning the argument that the B-Specials had to be
    disbanded and disarmed, the fact that not all of the weapons that they 
    held -- for the most part, in their homes where they were "handy" in 
    times of need -- were simply "lost", was something that the more even 
    handed Government had to, or decided to tolerate. The Protestants were 
    still heavily armed. This was significantly influential in the
    reforming of the IRA, which then drew heavily from various Catholic
    ex-servicemen's organisations.
    
    The UDR setup was justifiably credited with some success. Many
    Catholics did join up. Sadly, most of those were drummed out by
    pressure from the IRA, and so the balance of membership shifted markedly
    back towards the former Protestant exclusiveness of the makeup of the 
    B-Specials. Hence, the notion that bais was endemic in the RUC
    reasserted itself. A kind of self-fulfilling prophesy, in a way -- you
    can't really hide the spots on a leopard etc.. 
    
    That'll have to do for now. I have a lot to do this afternoon.
    
    But before I go, I'd like to see someone in here say that the British
    or the US police forces are free of bias in the way they deal with
    certain sections of their respective communities. They are not.
    
    You might start by asking yourself how women do in those forces,
    or how they deal with black people. If you're British, cast your mind
    back to the way that the British police forces were thrust into
    breaching civil rights during the 1984 Miners' Strike.
    
    There's more to be had in looking for the Biblical Ten Just Men.
    
    John
    
    
    
        

    Very good note John....totaly agree. I'm in the middle of reading Tim
    Pat Coogan's biography of Michael Collins. Irish police 'attitude' is
    quite well ingrained, going back to the days of the 'castle'. Then they
    were known as the Royal Irish Constabulary, the northern elements being
    far more oppresive than their southern counterparts. The
    'out-of-control' auxilaries and the vicious reputation aquired by the
    'Black and Tans' did nothing but further the anti-police phyche of the
    average citizen.
    
    With the creation of NI and the RUC it is not surprising that NI's catholic
    communities were suspicious of RUC bias. Their suspicions were
    unfortunately confirmed by the 'protestant state for a protestant
    people' attitude of the Stormont government who controlled the police.
    
    Various attempts have been made to make such forces less sectarian but
    pressure from within the force, coupled with pressure from the IRA, has
    effectively sustained the status-quo. Sometimes I find myself agreeing
    with Nationalist demands to disband the RUC and create an alternative.
    But such a task will, as history proves, be futile before a peace
    settlement is reached in NI.
    
    Shaun. 

    And the same to you Shaun. Absolutely on the button.
    
    All the best,
    
    John

    .42
    
    .43
    
    I cannot add to these.
    
    
    CHARLEY

Re .38
    [the IRA] have handed, on a plate, the moral high-ground
    to the likes of Mad Dog Paisley.

What is this? Libel-an-Irishman week or something?

First we have Charley describing an elderly, respectably-dressed
resident of the Ormeau Road as a mad dog, apparently for the
sole reason that he was photographed with three muscular young 
RUC men who were beating seven shades of shite out of him. 

Now we have Laurie (whose opinions I normally respect, even when 
I don't agree with them) describing Paisley as a mad dog. Dr. Paisley
may not be everybody's cup of tea, but he is by no means mad.

The continual repetition of such characterizations simply serve to 
confirm the view widespread in Britain that the Irish are crazy
and that therefore anything that they may do or say which deviates
from the British Government's position is also crazy. That the
British are the only island of reason, and in fact that there
is nothing that can be done in any case, because the protagonists
are quite mad anyway (an allied accusation is "sure they're
each as bad as the other" as in .8).

These characterisations are an excuse for laziness on the part of 
Britain in seeking a solution to this soluble problem. And what
do you do with mad dogs? Put them down, of course. Thus such
characterisations encourage people to turn a blind eye to violence
perpetrated by the state, or even encourage it (witness .16).

I realise, Laurie, that you didn't intend to make such characterisations
in general. I would simply ask you to be careful of what you write.

    Mr. Dalton, I'm 50% Irish, and I'm not even half-mad; it's just that I
    think the likes of Ian Paisley are feeding and encouraging the
    sectarian divide in NI, and sometimes, when I hear him speak, he
    sounds, to me, like a "mad dog". Sorry if I caused any offence, it was
    unintentional, and I'm the last person to slag off the Irish for being
    Irish.
    
    Anyway, (rhetorical question coming up), I wonder if the Republican
    News will be reporting the current stand-off and violence at Portadown
    at all, much less in the same way as the "piece" in .0...
    
    It's nice to see signs that these provocative marches are going to be
    curtailed, and perhaps even stopped.
    
    Cheers, Laurie.

    Well its not looking too good at the moment...potential for serious
    trouble at Drumcree..Body of a catholic has been found shot dead at
    Lurgen. With the main marching day for Loyalists next Friday its not
    a good place to be...
    
    Many roads in the six-counties are blocked by Orangemen protesters...
    RUC in a can't win situation.
    
    rgs,
    
    mick

    I think the RUC have to continue with the stand off. If the orange
    bigots win this one then they'll be cocky as hell afterwards. I think
    its about time that these no sad sectarian gits get hammered good and
    proper. They've got to start learning to respect their fellow
    communities, not inciting sectarian hate in them.
    
    Shaun.

I would go for a stand down after about a week. This would allow the RUC
to demonstrate rule of law and then let the heat out of the situation.
Particularly if they pick an early rain soaked morning to do it when there
aren't many people there.

Apparently SF are willing to negotiate a passage at the peace talks. There
does seem to be compromise in the air.

M  

    According to R4 this morning, the Loyalists are now threatening to
    withdraw from the so-called peace talks until the marches are allowed
    to continue. This complex mess becomes more complex by the minute...
    
    Laurie.

    RTw  07/08 2259  Protests erupt across N.Ireland over march ban

    Andrew Hill

    BELFAST, July 9 (Reuter) - The worst civil disturbances in years swept
    across Northern Ireland on Tuesday on a tide of Protestant anger at
    concessions to the Catholic minority.

    Roads, a key port, and whole towns were briefly blocked by blazing
    barricades erected by Protestants giving vent to months of anger over
    government treatment of Irish Republican Army guerrillas and their Sinn
    Fein political wing.

    A few inuries were reported in a carefully coordinated protest designed
    to cripple the province but a session of Anglo-Irish peace talks
    scheduled for Tuesday was a casualty.

    Several Catholic families in North Belfast said they decided to leave
    their homes when local Protestant youths directed their anger at them
    instead of at policemen and armoured jeeps.

    A Catholic was found shot dead in a taxi early on Monday in an incident
    that had all the hallmarks of a sectarian killing by Loyalist gunmen
    bent on terrorising the Catholic community.

    But police said they were keeping an open mind on the motive behind the
    murder. Spokesmen for Loyalist groups denied carrying out the killing
    and said they were abiding by a 22-month truce.

    If confirmed, it would be the first sectarian killing in Northern
    Ireland since August 1994 and would mark another step towards the
    return of a 27-year political and sectarian conflict after almost two
    years of rare peace.

    The province's mainstream Unionist parties, Protestant groups
    determined to keep Northern Ireland British, said they would not be
    attending Tueday's peace talks and blamed their British and Irish
    sponsors for the disturances.

    They accused Britain and Ireland of pandering to the outlawed IRA by
    banning a Protestant Orange Order parade through the Catholic area of
    Garvaghy Road at Portadown, the focal point of the protest entering its
    third day.

    David Trimble, head of the main Ulster Unionist Party, Martyn Smyth,
    Grand Master of the Orange Lodge, and Ian Paisley, leader of the
    hardline Democratic Unionist Party, met Britain's Northern Ireland
    secretary, Sir Patrick Mayhew on Monday night.

    No statement was made. Trimble said he hoped to meet British Prime
    Minister John Major on Tuesday to defuse a crisis he believes was
    caused by government weakeness towards the IRA, which resumed its war
    against British rule in February.

    Police banned the Garvaghy parade after Catholics complained that it
    would insult them. A similar ban last year caused a three-day standoff
    and riots until it was reversed and a token number of Orange supportes
    allowed to pass.

    Hundreds of police backed by British army troops held up one thousand
    Orange Order marchers at bay outside a church at Drumcree on the
    outskirts of Portadown, 25 miles (40 km) south of Belfast to block
    their planned route down the Gravaghy road.

    Across the province thousands of Protestants, called Loyalist because
    of their allegiance to Britain, demonstrated in sympathy as night fell,
    setting barricades ablaze.

    They vowed to continue the protest until police reverse the ban but the
    British army moved in to erect a huge barricade of stones to bar any
    attempt to break through police cordons.

    Larne port, on Northern Ireland's eastern coast, and all roads to
    Belfast international airport were closed. The centre of Belfast was
    ringed off by police and like a ghost town.

    Roads out of the province's second city, Londonderry, were sealed off
    by rioters. Police said as soon as they dismantled one barricade,
    another sprung up miles (km) away.

    Protests seemed set to last until July 12, the climax of the "marching
    season" by Orange supporters who yearly parade parade their British
    allegiance on the anniversary of a 300-year-old victory by a Protestant
    king over an invading Catholic monarch.

    REUTER

    RTw  07/09 2202  Unrest grips N. Ireland, more troops planned

    By Paul Mylrea

    BELFAST, July 9 (Reuter) - Britain is preparing to send more troops to
    Northern Ireland, where rioting and violence flared across the province
    the third night running.

    As the confrontation between police and pro-British Protestant
    "Loyalist" marchers which sparked the violence continued into Wednesday
    morning, towns across Northern Ireland and parts of Belfast were
    gripped by disturbances.

    Police reported a wave of petrol bomb attacks. Roads were blocked as
    mobs built barricades and set them on fire, and police said they had
    received reports of two shooting incidents, although there were no
    reports of any injuries.

    Violence continued through the early hours of the morning.

    Eyewitnesses reported several shops and cars on fire in Belfast. Police
    responded to stone throwing demonstrators with plastic bullets. A
    police spokesman described the scene across the province as "widespread
    disorder."

    As the trouble flared, a British army spokesman in London said the
    government was preparing to deploy two extra battalions of troops --
    around 1,000 men -- in Northern Ireland, adding that they could be in
    sent in by the end of the week if needed.

    If the battalions are deployed, it would be the first increase in troop
    numbers since the collapse of a truce by the outlawed Irish Republican
    Army in February this year.

    A police spokesman said that from the start of the violence on Sunday
    up until Tuesday night, there had been 51 arrests, 171 attacks on
    police, 25 officers hurt and 13 civilians injured.

    Nearly 250 road blockades had been logged, with many more taken down
    before police arrived.

    The unrest was sparked by the police decision to stop the exclusively
    Protestant Orange Order parading through the Catholic neighbourhood at
    Portadown, 25 miles (35 km) south of Belfast, to avoid sectarian
    confrontations.

    Late on Tuesday, scores of missile-throwing marchers tried to breach
    police lines blocking their progress on the outskirts of Portadown.
    Police firing plastic bullets drove them back.

    Bomb disposal experts also blew up a car near Portadown after reports
    that it contained a bomb. But police said the report turned out to be a
    hoax. Motorists across the province were advised by police to stay at
    home.

    As Belfast echoed to the sound of sirens and helicopters hovering
    overhead, the leader of the Unionist Party, David Trimble, said he
    hoped to meet representatives of the four main churches on Wednesday to
    discuss a way out of the impasse.

    A spokesman for the head of the Catholic church on the partitioned
    island said Cardinal Cahal Daly was abroad, although efforts were being
    made to contact him.

    Prime Minister John Minister warned on Tuesday the riots could put back
    the search for peace in Northern Ireland.

    Describing the unrest as "indefensible," he told parliament: "The
    search for peace in Northern Ireland will certainly not be assisted by
    such behaviour. It could well be put back."

    But Major told the main Protestant Unionist parties at a tense meeting
    in London on Tuesday that the province's chief police constable, Sir
    Hugh Annesley, had his full support.

    Unionist leaders have accused the police of making a serious
    misjudgment in their decision to block the march.

    Trimble said he saw no solution unless marchers were allowed along what
    they say is their traditional route. A similar ban last year caused
    riots and a three-day standoff until a token number of "Orangemen" were
    allowed to pass along the route.

    The province's mainstream Unionist parties, who are committed to
    keeping Northern Ireland British, blame the British and Irish
    governments for the unrest.

    The ban is seen by Unionists like as the latest example of appeasement
    by London of Irish republican militants like the IRA who want an end to
    British rule and a united Ireland.

    REUTER

>    Protests seemed set to last until July 12, the climax of the "marching
>    season" by Orange supporters who yearly parade parade their British
>    allegiance on the anniversary of a 300-year-old victory by a Protestant
>    king over an invading Catholic monarch.
>    REUTER

This isn't correct is it? Wasn't King James the legitimate Monarch at the
time? Wasn't it still Prince William at this point who was a foreigner
attempting to establish himself as the Monarch? If that's so then this
was an anti-British battle. 

M

    Re: .54
    
    Correct, Mark.
    
    John

    Well there you go, learn something new every day..... What nationality
    was old prince bill then ?
    
    Shaun.

    I'll answer my own question....he was dutch....and the national colour
    of Holland is Orange....hence William of Orange.
    
    Back to the history books....
    
    
    Shaun.

    This is obviously important: why did King Billy's enemies drink a toast
    to "the gentleman in black velvet?"

    I don't know....why did King Billy's enemies drink a toast to
    "the gentleman in black velvet?" ?
    
    Shaun.

    As I understand it, he died after falling off his horse, which stumbled
    after putting its foot in a mole hole. They were toasting the mole! 

    Cheers Kev.....last night I read that he was in fact the Anglo-Dutch
    king....yet I believe that he wasn't king of england, can someone
    explain as my history around these eras is not too good.
    
    Shaun.

I thought he became the King, i.e. that his campaign was successful 
[William and Mary?]. He was Prince William of Orange in Holland and was
so during his initial success in England. This is all the era of
the 'Glorious Revolution' which for some reason is not promoted as
much as other revolutions in British History.

I'm afraid I don't know the exact dates though.


I wrote in an earlier note that the 'Bill of Rights' was an outcome of this
era, I've subsequently learned it wasn't just of that era! It was
Prince William himself who presented what must have been a 'petition of rights'
to Parliament. I think it was after he became King that the London Parliament
adopted this and passed it as the 'Bill of Rights'. 

M 

    I extracted the following segment from the www,
    (http://www.rmplc.co.uk/eduweb/sites/wickham/topics/tudors/stuarts.html).
    What this extract does not go on to explain is that James raised an
    army and sailed to Ireland in 1689. King Willian landed at
    Carrickfergus in July 1690 and expelled the Jacobite army from Ireland.
    
                                 The Stuarts
     Monarch                                       Reigned
     James 1                          Stuart       1603-1625
     Charles 1                        Stuart       1625-1649 (executed)
     Oliver Cromwell (Lord Protector)              1653-1658
     Richard Cromwell (Lord Protector)             1658-1659
     Charles 11                       Stuart       1660-1685
     James 11                         Stuart       1685-1688 (deposed)
     William 111 (ruled jointly)      Stuart       1689-1702
     Mary 11 (ruled jointly)          Stuart       1689-1694
     Anne                             Stuart       1702-1714
----------------------------------------------------------------------------


James 11 came to the throne in 1685 at the age of fifty-six upon the death
of his brother, Charles 11. He was very unpopular because of his attempts to
restore Roman Catholicism to England. When his wife gave him a son the
powerful Protestant Lords unjustly claimed that the child was not a legal
heir to the throne.
In 1688 they invited William of Orange (Charles 1's grandson, born in
Holland) and his wife Mary (James' daughter by a previous marriage) to take
the throne in his place. William landed in England with his army and forced
James to flee to France without a fight. This was the beginning of today's
'constitutional monarchy' where the government rules in the name of the king
or queen.

    

    
                                                                  
    FRONT PAGE 
                                                  Thursday, July 11, 1996 
    
    
    
    North tension mounts as major confrontation feared
    
    By Dick Grogan, Northern Editor 
    
    
    Northern Ireland was stretched on a rack of tension and
    uncertainty as it faced the crucial Eve of Twelfth test today,
    with the Drumcree stand-off still deadlocked and road and rail
    traffic again paralysed overnight. Dick Grogan, Northern
    Editor reports 
    
    Belfast endured a third successive night of hijackings and
    burning of vehicles, barricaded streets and bridges,
    confrontations across police and British army lines, and
    incessant Orange parades in the north, south and east of the
    city.
    
    Belfast, which became virtually a ghost town when all
    city-centre businesses closed down after 4 p.m., was bracing
    itself for a further frenzy of civil unrest and destruction as
    darkness fell.
    
    Meanwhile, thousands of Orangemen from Tyrone, Belfast and
    Fermanagh were pouring into the almost medieval battlefield
    scene at Drumcree, near Portadown, Co Armagh. The
    impression was growing that this was a build-up for a major -
    and inevitably bloody - confrontation today with police and
    troops, who have sealed off the nationalist Garvaghy Road
    area.
    
    At Drumcree, fears were mounting late last night that an- other
    attempt would be made during the night to breach the RUC
    barbed-wire barricade around the Garvaghy Road area.
    
    During the afternoon a large mechanical digger was driven to
    the Orangemen's side of the barricade. Armour-plating was
    attached to the cab and a banner was placed on it bearing the
    message "No surrender 1996".
    
    As tension heightened across the North, the Catholic Primate,
    Cardinal Cahal Daly, commented: "The potential of this is really
    catastrophic."
    
    The first contingents of an additional two battalions of British
    troops assigned to the North to boost security arrived at Alder
    grove Airport late last night. The troops, from the 1st Battalion
    of the Parachute Regiment, will be joined shortly by an
    additional 650 soldiers.
    
    There was massive traffic disruption across the North again last
    night. Access routes to Belfast and scores of other major
    towns were sealed off by Orangemen.
    
    The A1 portion of the main Dublin-Belfast road was again
    blocked at Loughbrickland. Because of a security alert
    between Lurgan and Portadown, the Dublin-Belfast rail service
    ran only as far as Dundalk for most of the day, with passengers
    conveyed by bus for the rest of the journey.
    
    Access to the M3 and M5 motorways was blocked on the
    outskirts of Belfast. The rail service between Belfast and Derry
    was suspended. All of the towns and villages hit by blockades
    on Monday and Tuesday night were again cut off.
    
    In a surprise move, the UVF called on all those involved in
    burning and wrecking to desist immediately, but its demand had
    no apparent effect. The paramilitary organisation also reiterated
    that its ceasefire was still in place.
    
    The Belfast Fire Service said that the last 24 hours had
    stretched it to the limit and had been the busiest period for
    call-outs in the last 25 years.
    
    The RUC reported that there had been 87 arrests during
    disturbances since last Sunday. There had been more than 450
    attacks on police and about 330 plastic baton rounds had been
    fired.
    
    Up to 90 civilians and 50 police officers were reported injured
    in the three nights of disturbances. More than 100 incidents of
    intimidation were recorded, and that number was soaring last
    night.
    
                                 � Copyright: The Irish Times
                               Contact: [email protected] 
    
    

Latest...

2000 Orangemen allowed through at Drumcree in the last hour.

    
    
     Latest at 13:00 hours,
    
     Police/army allowed march through Drumcree after forcing local
    residents off the streets and blocking off all side-roads to keep
    the two factions apart. Locals incensed as they were NOT involved in
    discussions. Reports that police fired up to 100 rounds of plastic
    bullets at local protestors who retaliated with bricks, bottles and
    petrol bombs. No word as yet as to the scale of injuries. Looks like
    a massive climb down by the authorities. Expect repurcussions now from
    the nationalist community. 
    
     A news report on BBC this morning reported hundreds of foreign
    tourists leaving the country. Many business investors who were prepared
    to put up money and develop industry in NI are now reported to be having
    2nd thoughts following the escallation in violence. Sad days ahead
    methinks.
    
    Danny.

    Gawd...

    Stupid bloody RUC...they should've stood their ground...even on the eve
    of the 12th. I know that had the situation not been resolved before
    tomorrow there would've been massive clashes all across the north but
    the local community should've been fully involved in discussion and
    perhapps encouraged to reach an agreement like that of a year ago.
    
    If any loyalist starts trouble tomorrow then the RUC should use the 'we
    gave you chance and you spat in our faces so now we're going to kick
    ass!'
    
    Bloody stupid situation created by bloody bigoted people.
    
    Shaun.
    

That was the worst thing the authorities could have done. They will now be
reviled by the catholics for caving in to pressure from the orangemen; they 
will be reviled by the orangemen for stopping them marching in the first 
place; and the orangemen will be a hundred times more triumphalist than 
they were before. This was a chance to break the "tradition" of these 
bigotted marches. What will happen next year ?

There is a clear message to the orangemen here and that is "violence and
rioting works". They will definitely use this ploy again.
    

Drumcree drama

      ORANGEMEN paraded along Garvaghy Road today as police
      battled angry nationalist protesters amid scenes of fury and
      mayhem.
      Plastic bullets ripped though the air and bricks and bottles
      rained down on officers who forced residents back into side
      streets.
      Hundreds of grim-faced Orangemen paraded through the
      turbulent district in silence - and were given a hero's welcome
      by a thousand cheering supporters in Portadown town centre.
      The Orangemen were led by a lone RUC Land Rover and a
      band.
      Only a single drum beat sounded repeatedly as the loyalists
      filed through around 1pm.
      Locals screamed abuse and some broke through police ranks
      to hurl several missiles, none of which reached the
      Orangemen.
      Ulster Unionist leader David Trimble joined the march as it
      entered the centre of Portadown following a 20-minute
      procession through mainly Catholic areas of the town.
      District master Harold Gracey was embraced by ecstatic
      loyalists and the air became filled with the thunder of loyalist
      pipes and drums.
      Residents leader Breandan MacCionnaith angrily denounced
      the RUC.
      "This proves they are the military wing of the Unionist party," he
      stormed. "Nothing has changed since 1969." Police had came
      under a bombardment of bottles and rocks amid ugly scenes
      as officers prepared to clear the way for the parade.
      Plastic bullets were fired as protesters were beaten back into
      side streets and alleys in the Churchill estate.
      The move represents a humiliating U-turn by Chief Constable
      Sir Hugh Annesley, who had re-routed the parade last
      weekend.
      And it has sparked fears of a wave of nationalist violence
      similar to the four days of loyalist rioting and blockades that
      forced the RUC to reverse the decision.
      Soldiers had begun removing the concrete bollards and
      barbed wire which had blocked the bridge below Drumcree
      church shortly after noon.

      At 12.25pm, a tannoy announcement told Portadown
      Orangemen to form up to march.
      An announcer told them to march down the road "without any
      show of triumphalism" and to return to Carleton Street Orange
      hall "with dignity and pride".
      At the same time, police in full riot gear faced 400 people
      staging a sit-down protest on the Garvaghy Road. Injured
      protesters were seen being led away from the scene as hand-
      to-hand fighting raged.
      Angry Garvaghy Road residents accused the Chief Constable
      of caving in "in the teeth of loyalist aggression." Nationalists
      immediately called for support for protesters at a parade
      tomorrow in the flashpoint lower Ormeau, sparking fears of yet
      another day of confrontation.
      Orangemen plan to hold a Twelfth of July march through the
      district tomorrow, although police are still considering whether
      to give it the go-ahead.
      The Jesuit priests based at 'Iona' in the Garvaghy district said
      they were "dismayed".
      "This decision is a victory for might over right," they said.
      "It undermines yet again the prospects of building a new
      society in Northern Ireland based on mutual respect."
      Unionists, however, welcomed the move.
      Jeffrey Donaldson, assistant grand master of the Orange
      Order, said: ''We are relieved the parade is going to take
      place peacefully along the Garvaghy Road.
      "We want to thank everyone who has helped.'' Mr Donaldson
      rejected any suggestion the police were reacting to a
      campaign that erupted in unrest by some unruly elements.
      Ian Paisley Jnr said Sir Hugh Annesley must resign
      immediately.
      "He was wrong when he re-routed the parade - we said he
      was wrong when he made his decision - and today he has
      been proved to be wrong." 

      He added: "If there is a victory today it is one for common
      sense." The Chief Constable was at the scene in Portadown
      today and was expected to explain his decision at a press
      conference.
      Police moved after the prospect of a massive Twelfth
      demonstration at Drumcree tomorrow and the failure of last
      minute shuttle diplomacy by church leaders.
      A formula was put forward to enable the Orangemen to stage
      a last-minute, low-key parade down Garvaghy Road, but it
      failed to win agreement on all sides.
      A late night visit to the Garvaghy Road by Catholic Cardinal
      Cahal Daly fueled speculation that a deal was in the offing.


              
                                                      �1996 
                                               Belfast Telegraph 

    Hugh should resign, but not because he blocked the march but because he
    bloody well gave into violent pressure.....if only I could swear in
    this conference!
    
    Shaun.

      I know that we're supposed to be positive but it's a little difficult
    in the present circumstances. The poor bloody peace process never had a
    chance. First it was damaged when the British Government screwed around 
    with pre-conditions rather than getting SF engaged in talks, this gave
    the psycho's in the IRA the excuse to resume murdering, which mortally
    wounded it, now it's been finished off by the bloody minded bigots of
    the Orange order. Can anyone think of anything positive to say?
      
      I personally think that the only hope in N.I. is the emergence of
    leaders of stature who will lead rather than following the dictats of
    the extremists in their ranks, I wonder if Nelson Mandela could spare
    us a couple of months.
    
                           Dennis    

    It would take a Jesuit to coin the correct phrase "a victory of might 
    over right".  It is very sad.  The RUC had a great chance to break the
    tradition and drag certain people into the 20th Century.  Now the
    Unionists know that they still rule, they hold the power, and that the
    RUC and British will not stand in their way.  Sadly, popular support
    for the IRA and Sinn Fein can only increase as a result, and who can
    blame Catholics or Nationalists for their frustration?  Tragic.
    
    Regards, Ken Hanly

    I saw the BBC news last night, and watched the way the RUC behaved
    after they had caved into the Orange bigots and thugs. What a bloody
    disgrace! They were behaving like thugs. These provocative and
    confrontational marches should be banned immediately. As for the peace
    process, such as it was; it's dead and buried. It's a shameful day.
    
    Laurie.

    RTw  07/12 0055  Police shot as trouble flares in N.Ireland

    By Andrew Hill

    BELFAST, July 12 (Reuter) - Gunmen shot and wounded three policemen on
    Friday when violent Catholic protests swept Northern Ireland over the
    holding of Protestant Orange Order parades, police said.

    They said two officers were shot in the mainly Catholic, Irish
    nationalist Ardoyne area of the capital and a third was hit in the New
    Lodge area, another Catholic stronghold.

    Witnesses said they did not appear to be seriously injured and police
    said their wounds were not life-threatening. But the incidents raised
    tension hours before an Orange Parade close to the centre of Belfast on
    Friday morning.

    Gunshots were heard in several parts of the capital and police said
    youths hijacked vehicles and set them ablaze to protest against what
    they said was the trampling of their rights by the yearly Protestant
    parades.

    Church leaders and politicians from all sides of the community appealed
    for calm and restraint on the "Glorious 12th of July"  when Protestants
    celebrate, with bonfires and marches, a 300-year-old victory over
    Britain's last Catholic ruler, King James the Second.

    The three police were thought to be the first victims of sniper attacks
    in the province since IRA guerrillas called a truce in August 1994. No
    group claimed responsibity for the attacks and police did not apportion
    blame.

    A Catholic youth was in a serious condition after serious disturbances
    in Armagh, on the border with Ireland, police said. First reports said
    he was hit by a police vehicle in a riot.

    The violence erupted after police reversed a ban on an Orange Order
    parade through a Catholic section of Portadown, south of Belfast, on
    Thursday after five days of province-wide demonstrations by
    Protestants.

    Police backed by troops threw a security cordon around the Catholic
    Lower Ormeau Road in Belfast and barred anyone but residents from
    approaching the area, scene of previous clashes between pro-irish
    Catholics and pro-British Protestants.

    The shooting marked a serious turn in a rapidly worsening security
    situation which alarmed Church leaders, the United States and and the
    Irish government, Britain's partner in a quest for a lasting Northern
    Ireland settlement.

    "We are deeply concerned that violence and disturbances in Northern
    Ireland over the past several days have fanned the flames of very
    historic and very unreasonable animosities in those communities," White
    House spokesman Mike McCurry said.

    Northern Ireland has enjoyed an uneasy truce since the IRA called a
    truce to its war against British rule of Northern Ireland. Its truce
    was matched by ceasefire from Protestant Loyalists, who want the
    province to stay British.

    The IRA resumed its war in February but has not mounted any attacks in
    Northern Ireland itself where police chiefs have warned there would be
    instant retaliation from Loyalists who have killed hundreds of
    Catholics in two decades.

    A Belfast court dismissed an appeal by residents to reroute the parade
    on Thursday. Police said they had not yet made a decision about whether
    to allow it to go ahead as planned.

    Gerry Adams, head of Sinn Fein, the IRA's political wing, called on
    Catholics and Ormeau Road residents to exercise restraint and said the
    British government caused the unrest.

    Irish Prime Minister John Bruton, Britain's partner in efforts to find
    a lasting settlement to Northern Ireland's 27-year conflict, told
    British Prime Minister John Major by telephone he thought the Portadown
    decision was mistaken.

    "The Taioseach (Irish Prime Minister) told the Prime Minister that
    there was widespread anger and deep concern in Ireland about the
    decision to allow the Orange march down the Garvaghy Road, a decision
    on which there was no advance notice or consultation," a Dublin
    government the statement said.

    REUTER

http://www.army.mod.uk
[Posted by WWW Notes gateway]

    re .76
    
    They are still using the skis...
    
    Can anyone remember the Billy Connoly song about the Scottish para
    lying in hospital remembering how he joined the Barmy:
    
    The chorus went:
    
    Sergeant is this the adventure you meant, 
    when I put my name down on the line,
    You talked of computers and sunshine and skis,
    Well segeant I'm askin where's mine?
    
    One verse went:
    
    I've a brother in Partick wi long curly hair,
    When I joined up, he said I was daft,
    He said shooting strangers was just nae his game,
    That brother of mine, he's not soft
     

    Some of your personal ammunition.
    
                                    If you encounter the enemy you will
    soon find yourself
                                    without enough ammunition to protect
    yourself and your
                                    patrol. 
    
    I got this far on the USA invasion challenge :-)

The following article is extracted from today's edition of the Electronic 
Herald. It is reproduced here in part only. The full article can be read
at http://www.cims.co.uk/herald/NEWS/news1.html.


          ...To add to the strife and tensions on the streets of
          Northern Ireland, British and Irish Ministers were
          struggling to put relations back on track after a
          weekend of insults traded across the Irish Sea.

          Sources revealed that Mr Major was ''just incandescent
          with anger'' over Irish Premier John Bruton's
          extraordinary outburst on Friday night when he accused
          the British Government of breaching the three canons of
          democracy: never yielding to force; always being
          consistent; and always being impartial.

          Mr Major's fury means that an appeal from Mr Spring for
          a full meeting of the UK-Irish conference -- with
          Ministers and officials from both sides meeting formally
          -- will be rebuffed this week.

          The Prime Minister ''just feels that you have a
          relationship between two governments which should not be
          conducted by semaphore,'' one source said.

          But Irish government sources stressed that Mr Bruton was
          feeling bruised too, taking the view that Mr Major
          failed to respond satisfactorily to his protests about
          the Drumcree march ''U-turn'' last week.

          It means that when Sir Patrick rises in the Commons
          today he will have few concrete proposals to float about
          the way ahead. The Secretary of
          State is admitting privately that ''a pause for breath''
          is the only realistic tactic to deploy.

          Sir Patrick will, however, meet Mr Spring informally on
          the fringes of the all-party talks in Stormont which are
          due to take place tomorrow, Wednesday, and Thursday. But
          if Ministers on both sides of the Irish Sea were
          privately aggrieved, publicly there were appeals for the
          talking to resume.

          Mr Michael Ancram, Northern Ireland Minister of State,
          insisted there was no rift with Dublin.
	  ...
    

    Chances are that they won't admit it but the British Government has
    really cocked up this time. I do think it was involved with the RUC
    turn-around and it certainly knew about it.
    
    One of the saddest incidents was the knocking down of a protester by an
    RUC riot wagon. When an RUC officer went to try and resusitate the man,
    he was himself attacked with a bottle and needed 16 or 19 stitches. I
    can understand the protesters anger at the knocking down of a fellow
    but that does not justify attacking "the next thing in uniform". My
    sympathies go out to both their families.
    
    Shaun.

    RE: .79
    
    Yeah, I think Mr. Bruton has a point... Shame on HMG.
    
    Laurie.

    I vaguely heard a report on the radio this morning, that Someone on
    the ground in the RUC in Portadown had refused orders. That is to say,
    there is a suspicion of collusion between some RUC officers and Trimble
    to defy Annersley. Shades of the Curragh mutiny. 
    
    Did anyone else hear anything ?

    Well Kevin, it does seem odd that on 6 July, Sir Hugh made
    the statement below. (I got this from the RUC Web page
    at www.nics.gov.uk/ruc/ruchome.htm).
    

      STATEMENT BY SIR HUGH ANNESLEY, QPM



Referring to today's contentious Orange Order Parade in Portadown, 
the Chief  Constable of the RUC, Sir Hugh Annesley, said yesterday.

I greatly regret that despite all the efforts of the RUC, and many 
others, it has not proved possible to resolve the conflicting views, 
especially about the Orange Order Parade along the Garvaghy Road.

Following extensive consultation I have concluded that to allow the 
Orange Order Parade along the Garvaghy Road would be likely to 
occasion serious public disorder.  Accordingly, I have earlier this 
morning given directions that conditions are to be imposed on the 
organisers to prohibit this part of the proposed route.  Similar 
conditions have been imposed on the Garvaghy Road Residents' 
Coalition in respect of their proposed march into the centre of 
Portadown.

The decision I have made is under Article 4 of the 1987 Public Order 
legislation and I hope all those involved will peacefully comply with 
this legal requirement.  There are no winners in violence, only losers.

Even at this late stage, it is not too late for an accommodation to be 
reached.  For the well-being of all concerned, I sincerely encourage 
both sides to re-appraise their stance in pursuit of a peaceful 
resolution.

RUC Headquarters
6 July 1996

    Also, in the "community affairs" section of the RUC website,
    it states that the RUC
    
      "has particular responsibility for maintaining positive
       and constructive police contact with all sections of
       the community from differing cultural backgrounds."
    
    Do they need to rewrite that section?
    
    /George

    The whole thing is a bloody farce.....I just can't get it outa my skin.
    Even a ten year old could've done better. Whats the point of having a
    police force when they can't even police.
    
    Yours, pissed off, Shaun.

    Shaun,
    
    It is not that they can't, but that (part of them ?) didn't want to. 
    But is there any evidence. What George hat put here shows there was a
    complete chane of tack. But the qustion is, were Hugh Annersley,
    Patrick Mayhew and John Major on the phone planning one thing, and 
    giving explicit instructions, which were refused ? It seems
    inconcievable that Bruton, Hume, Spring all sat on their hands and did
    nothing. They were/are still trying to wangle a new ceasefire out of
    the IRA. John Major made a statement denouncing mob rule in the middle
    of things and now sees his strategy in ruins. Basically I read it that 
    Major went to great lengths to get Trimble to the talks and Trimble has
    now told Major to take a powder. Trimble hopes he will lose the
    election and he will have a weak Labour Government to deal with. 
    
    The bottom line is, as I have said all along, Trimble and Taylor are
    out to sabotage the peace. They need the IRA looney wing and spot on Q
    it seems that RSF came up with a bomb.  However, Dunce Trimble is not 
    home yet. The Protestant Community has a lot to lose from a return to
    war, there have been no strikes in support of Trimble. He has exposed
    himself completely, in contrast to Molyneaux, who pursued the same
    miserable policies with much more subtlety.   

It does seem that the events of the past few days couldn't have done a better
job of raising Nationalist fears and anger if it had been scripted to do 
exactly that.

regards,
//alan

    RE: .86
    
    You could be right. I said earlier somewhere else in here that SF/IRA
    had played right into Unionist hands by their return to violence, and
    handed control to them on a plate... Like you, I find the concept of
    this being cooked-up/approved by HMG and/or Ireland as "most unlikely".
    I think it was a local decision.
    
    Laurie.

    Did anyone catch Panarama on BBC last night, apparently it was based on
    the last weeks events in NI....was anything substantial revealed ??
    
    Shaun. 

    In answer to your question, Shaun, yes.
    
    Major denied getting involved because it was an "operational" matter
    for the head of the RUC.
    
    The head of the RUC denied getting any advice from senior politicians.
    
    Trimble admitted having a long discussion with senior Loyalist
    paramilitaries, at least one of whom had a terrorist conviction.
    
    Neither Trimble, nor leading organisers of the Orange march would 
    talk with the leader of the residents association because they said
    that he was not a resident of the estate, and that he had a terrorist
    conviction.
    
    My own personal view is that in this instance, they lied about
    government involvement. Although Major and the head of the RUC seem 
    to have been very well schooled in their answers, their body language 
    was somehow wrong.
    
    The RUC were reported by residents of the estate to have weighed in
    with batons against "peaceful sit-down protesters".
    
    John
     

    I agree John, HMG have been hawking anything in NI for the last couple
    of years...it is impossible that they were not aware of RUC intentions
    and thus could've interveened at any moment. If one stands idley by
    whilst another suffers then one is just as guilty.
    
    Shaun.

RE:         <<< Note 1592.90 by METSYS::BENNETT "Straight no chaser.." >>>
    
    I'm still unconvinced that Major was involved, or indeed, any of HMG.
    Their actions make no sense.
    
>>    The RUC were reported by residents of the estate to have weighed in
>>    with batons against "peaceful sit-down protesters".
    
    The pictures I saw on the BBC news showed at least one RUC officer
    baton-beating a bloke who was sitting down. What the circumstances were
    for the 60 seconds either side of the 30 second clip, I don't know, but
    it didn't look very nice, and the poor bastard was trying desperately
    to defend himself, and run away whilst sitting down.
    
    Cheers, Laurie.

    Re .92
    
    I saw that beating on the news too Laurie and I was appalled. The guy
    was sitting on the road and the orangeman in RUC uniform had him by the
    forearm while he was beating him repeatedly about the head and arms. If
    this guy had been involved in some sort of assault against the police
    just before the filming started then he should have been arrested. The
    RUC were not "officially" there to mete out punishment. They were
    supposed to be there for crowd control. I suspect that Sir Hugh
    Annesley let the march through because he couldn't trust his RUC
    officers to open fire on their brother orangemen.

    If
    this guy had been involved in some sort of assault against the police
    just before the filming started then he should have been arrested.

I think that this is a very fair sentence.  I have seen some of the distortion
that TV news reports can - and frequently deliberately do - use to make a story
more exciting.

Maybe the RUC officer was just trying to arrest the guy - they don't always 
come quietly.  

If it's the tape I'm thinking of, though, there was a chap on the ground who 
had "captive" another RUC officer, and the one administering the beating was
trying to free his colleague.  Different tape, perhaps?

regards,
//alan

>    If
>    this guy had been involved in some sort of assault against the police
>    just before the filming started then he should have been arrested.
>
>I think that this is a very fair sentence.  I have seen some of the distortion
>that TV news reports can - and frequently deliberately do - use to make a story
>more exciting.

I saw the full sequence on the local news (or at least, 
fuller than the sequence on the national news). Suffice 
it to say that the poor man in question had not been 
doing anything but peacefully sitting on the road
for some time before the assault upon him.


Re:
    Major denied getting involved because it was an "operational" matter
    for the head of the RUC.
    
    The head of the RUC denied getting any advice from senior politicians.
Today's Irish Times has this to say 
( http://www.irish-times.com/irish-times/paper/0718/opt4.html ) :

              The Prime Minister and Mayhew say the decision had nothing
              to do with them, and that the Chief Constable, Sir Hugh
              Annesley, dreamt it up all on his own. In fact - and it is a fact -
              Annesley had repeatedly been told by the British government
              that the march was unstoppable, and the sooner he let it go the
              better.

    I drove back from Dublin on the 14th July, (though this time I had to
    drive back thru Holyhead, my mother would have had a heart attack if I
    had driven thru Belfast, so I had a 350 mile drive rather than 150). I
    agree with what most of the noters have written here. I now have
    complete and utter contempt for Trimble, Paisley and the bigots of the
    Orange Order, (before I just had mild contempt), and I've lost any
    confidence that I had in the RUC. One new thing that I noticed while I
    was in Ireland is that a lot of people now say that they wouldn't want
    a united Ireland that included the likes of Trimble, Paisley et al.
    `Who would want them?' was a popular sentiment among my friends. I think 
    it's slowly getting thru to the Unionists that the British don't want 
    them either. It's obvious to this noter that the `Peace Process' is
    shot to hell, and I don't think I have any answers. If there is to be a
    solution in NI the UN or the EU will have to be involved. The RUC have
    lost the trust of both sides and, as has been said previously, no new
    Ulster police force could or would fare any better.
    
    Wouldn't it be great to have an Irish version of Nelson Mandela?. John
    Hume seems to have thrown the towel in, (and who could blame him?). The
    2 governments are (privately) at each other's throats. Gerry Adams and
    SF are still outsiders (though gaining support by the hour) and the
    Protestant ceasefire must be hanging by a thread, (that must be the
    only good thing to cling to at the moment). Are there any other chinks
    of light that I'm missing?...
    
    Ray....

    re .96
    
    Trimble and Taylor will have to be defeated politically before peace
    can be secured. It would seem to me that some of the Protestant
    community must have a lot to lose through a resumtion of full scale
    war. But they will have to be dumped by the tory party and Major is not
    able to do that now or his right wing would bring down the government,
    even if it meant losing the election. Also the fight against the orange
    tories will have to be won on the ground in NI. That will be made more
    difficult by the resumption of IRA violence. Adams looks to have lost
    the debate there, as the Munster command threatened to split off. Only
    the setbacks for the IRA in London and in Ireland with large arms dumps
    being found have delayed things, but another pair of units will be
    prepared and sent to England soon, I would guess.
    
    I fear we will have bombs all round again, but maybe the next time
    there are moves to peace, there will be less naivety about the nature
    of Trimble and Taylor.
    
    I don't think John Hume has given up, but he has to bide his time
    again...

From this week's IE:
- Over the seven days of disturbances the RUC and Army discharged a
  total of 6,002 plastic bullets, but it was noted by the nationalist
  community that only 339 rounds were fired on the first three days
  when loyalists were responsible for most of the violence.

We will see the real direction of peace come August 
in Derry/Londonderry. Maybe a defining point...

/George

    UK News Electronic Telegraph Wednesday July 24 1996

    Top loyalists held over taxi murder

    By Toby Harnden, Ireland Correspondent 

    LOYALISTS from Portadown, Co Armagh, were being questioned last night
    by detectives investigating the terrorist murder of Michael McGoldrick,
    the Roman Catholic taxi driver shot dead two weeks ago.

    The arrest of several suspected members of the Ulster Volunteer Force, 
    whose representatives in the Progressive Unionist Party shook hands
    with John Major at Downing Street this week, will severely embarrass
    the Prime Minister. It could also pose a threat to all-party talks on
    Northern Ireland.

    Those being held included the UVF's mid-Ulster brigade leader and two
    senior lieutenants. The brigade leader, known as King Rat, is suspected
    of having been responsible for dozens of sectarian killings before the
    loyalist ceasefire was declared in October 1994.

    The Royal Ulster Constabulary said: "A number of men were arrested in
    the Portadown area and are being questioned about serious crime in Co
    Armagh."

    It is believed that one of the bullets that killed Mr McGoldrick has
    been linked to a weapon used in UVF attacks. If the UVF, which denied
    murdering Mr McGoldrick, 31, is proved to have broken its ceasefire by
    carrying out the killing, the Progressive Unionist Party would be
    excluded from negotiations. With Sinn Fein already barred because of
    the IRA's continuing violence, the talks would almost certainly
    collapse.

    A senior Ulster Unionist Party member said: "No doubt the PUP will say
    that nobody gave anyone authorisation to kill Mr McGoldrick, just as
    the IRA denied responsibility when it killed people during the
    ceasefire.

    "It then comes down to whether the Government has the guts to refuse to
    accept that. On past evidence, it probably hasn't."

    Ian Paisley jnr, the justice spokesman for the Democratic Unionist
    Party, called for the PUP to be expelled from the talks if the UVF
    killed Mr McGoldrick.

    "While on the surface the PUP is a democratic party, it remains linked
    to a paramilitary organisation which is not above committing violent
    acts," he said. "We have never believed that the PUP leaders could
    deliver the hard men. Their grip has slipped."

    The maintenance of the loyalist ceasefire had been largely due to
    arguments put forward by leaders of the PUP and the Ulster Democratic
    Party, which is linked to the Ulster Defence Association, that
    loyalists stood to gain most from their continued inclusion in the
    talks.

    Security sources said that expulsion of the loyalist parties from the
    talks would inevitably lead to renewed and sustained violence from
    Protestant paramilitaries. The IRA would respond.

    David Trimble, the Ulster Unionist Party leader, would also come under
    increased pressure from nationalists if the UVF were proved to have had
    a hand in Mr McGoldrick's murder.

    "We have never believed that the PUP leaders could deliver the hard
    men. Their grip has slipped"

    Two days after the murder Mr Trimble had an hour-long meeting with
    Billy Wright, a mid-Ulster loyalist with a close understanding of
    paramilitary thinking, during the stand-off at Drumcree in Portadown
    after the RUC temporarily blocked an Orange march.

    Mr Trimble was castigated by nationalists, who accused him of double
    standards in talking to Mr Wright while refusing to discuss the route
    of the Orange march with Brendan McKenna, the chairman of the local
    residents' association, because he had an IRA conviction.

    The Ulster Unionist leader said the meeting with Mr Wright was
    necessary because of "exceptional circumstances" at the time. He had
    asked Mr Wright to use his influence with paramilitaries to help
    prevent violence. "To ignore his presence and impact on the situation
    would have been irresponsible and this is against a background where
    the loyalist paramilitaries are on a ceasefire."

    As a teenager, Mr Wright, 36, was jailed for six years on a hijacking
    and arms charge. Although not convicted as a paramilitary, he served
    his time in the UVF wing at the Maze prison. In 1982 he was remanded in
    custody for 10 months. However, charges of murder and attempted murder
    were dropped when a "supergrass", Clifford McKeown, retracted his
    evidence.

    Mr McGoldrick was found in his car near the village of Aghagallon, Co
    Armagh. He had been shot twice in the head. A caller who gave his name
    as Lavery had asked for a taxi to pick him up from Lurgan soon after
    midnight.

    Lavery was the name given when another Catholic taxi driver, Martin
    Byrne, was murdered by the UVF six years ago. Security sources said
    that Mr McGoldrick's death had all the marks of a "dial-a-Catholic"
    killing.

    The UVF issued a statement after the murder, saying that it had carried
    out an exhaustive investigation and concluded that its members were not
    responsible. However, the UVF is believed to have taken steps to
    discipline one of the men in the killing.

I don't know why journalists are so coy about naming
criminals, preferring instead to make up nicknames for
them. Thus we hear that "King Rat" is the boyo who is
suspected of dozens of sectarian killings, but it's
"Billy Wright" who gets to have a one hour meeting
with David Trimble in Drumcree. They are one and the
same. Reread the last note (.100) with this in mind.

    One of the questions on my mind is whether convicted Loyalist
    terrorists paid the going rate to have dinner with John Major.
    
    For our colleagues on the western side of the Atlantic, news reports
    in highly regarded British newspapers revealed at the weekend that
    in an effort to raise funds for the coming British General Election,
    wealthy businessmen, lobbyists and supporters of the Conservatives have 
    been given the opportunity to have dinner with Major twice a year for 
    the sum of 100,000 UK pounds. Senior Cabinet ministers warrant a
    donation of a mere 10K. So, sleaze is back on the menu, and Loyalist
    paramilitaries are on the guest list at 10, Downing Street.
    
    John

     Hi,
 
 In common with the vast majority of `ordinary' folk, I am saddened and 
 confused by the tragic situation in Northern Ireland.  I have never spent 
 more than two days in the North, so cannot attest to actual experience of 
 what it's like to live there.  My opinions therefore are based purely on 
 observations from afar, and the propaganda that is put-out by both sides.  
 
 I have however visited the South on many occasions, and count it as one of my 
 absolute favourite destinations.  Never have I met with any anti-British 
 sentiments, or received anything less than warmth and friendliness from the 
 folks I met.
 
 It amazes me that a nation with such an enthusiasm for the fabled `craic' - 
 and such a positive view on life, could be embroiled in the hideous scenario 
 it now finds itself in.  As there appears to be no sane reason for the 
 current shambles, I can only conclude that the so-called `leaders' on both 
 sides of the religious/sovereignty divide are so deeply ingrained in their 
 hate, and so full of their own self-import that they really do not want a 
 resolution.    
 
 Their ability to wreck every glimmer of hope for progress towards peace, 
 seems too contrived to be anything other than a deliberate attempt to ensure 
 the troubles continue.  In my view, both sides must share this blame, and 
 neither has any claim to the moral high ground. 
 
 I'm fortunate enough to be a recent British relocatee to the Boston area, and  
 I've been following with interest the discussion in this conference on how 
 the situation is being reported over here in the USA.  I have to say that to 
 date, my impression of the coverage in the local paper (Boston Globe), is 
 that it's been extremely even-handed and fair.  No overt favouritism shown to 
 either side, and some thoughtful suggestions on how to move the process of 
 reconciliation forward.
 
 Recently however, the following article appeared which infuriated me.  
 Admittedly it is written by one of those `provocative' columnists, and it is 
 apparent from previous articles that he favours the Nationalist view (which 
 he's perfectly entitled to do of course).  But this latest essay seems naive 
 at best, and deliberately offensive at worst.
 
 I'm a very infrequent noter, and have never before written to a newspaper ... 
 but the undercurrent of sweeping anti-British sentiment, and some of the 
 ludicrous comments made within the article made me put hand to keyboard and 
 write a reply, which I doubt will ever be published.
 
 What hope for a solution, when people on both sides of the divide apparently 
 have such an intractable view of the other, and continually dredge up their 
 selective view of past events in order to justify their current stance?  What 
 can be done to mediate between such divided camps?  
 
 I can only hope that someone emerges from somewhere, with the creativity, 
 vision and presence to guide the peace-hunt into a radically different 
 direction.  Wishful thinking I know, as I just cannot for the life of me see 
 any of the current political personalities having those qualities. 
 
 
 Regards,
 
 Andy Whitaker.  
 
 English - but with a very distant Irish family connection.  Heartily pi**ed- 
 off by it all ... no new ideas ... no revolutionary answers to the problem 
 ... just a fervent desire to see people cool-off, stop taking human life so 
 lightly, put the bl**dy batons/guns/bombs down, and find a way to resolve 
 this nonsensical situation.  Yep - it's been a bad day :-)
 
 
 Article follows:
 
 
 		REFUGEE FROM HATRED  MIKE BARNICLE  07/23/96
 
 He is 36 and illegal. He arrived three summers ago, landing at Logan a month 
 to the day he was released from a prison in Northern Ireland where he spent 
 10 months in a cell for the crime of being Catholic in a province where, it 
 seems, the only constant is the violence and deep integrity surrounding the 
 ancient quarrel between British and Irish.  ``Imagine if the Ku Klux Klan 
 insisted on marching through Roxbury,'' he was saying. ``Imagine if they said 
 they were going to have a big race-baiting parade and the police agreed 
 because they didn't want to offend the Grand Dragon or whatever.  `Well, 
 that's what happened at home.  That's what triggered the violence in 
 Portadown.  The Brits and the R.U.C. do not care about the Catholics.  They 
 think we are sub human.  And, believe me, the police in the North are not on 
 the level.''
 
 He was seated inside a Brighton restaurant talking about recent events that 
 have caused Northern Ireland to explode once more, creating depression among 
 those who dared think peace was both close as well as possible. It is the 
 ``Marching Season'' in Belfast, a small territory consumed with large 
 hatreds.  Bonfires scar the nights of the North as Protestants twitch in 
 delight recalling William of Orange's tremendous victory over popery in 1690.  
 Three centuries later, bigotry and stupidity survive side by side along 
 blocks and backroads where the true common denominator - a thirst for safety 
 and sanity - again seems outmatched by ignorance and bombs.
 
 Terrorism stains us today.  Whether its target is beneath the waters of Long 
 Island Sound or along the lush backroads of Armagh, the results are obscenely 
 similar:  innocents buried and survivors shattered while armed demons use the 
 corpses of noncombatants as punctuation marks for some political statement.  
 When the Royal Ulster Constabulary - the cops - caved into the villainous 
 wishes of Protestant marchers to parade past Catholic neighborhoods in 
 Portadown, the fuse simmered.  Then, predictably, it exploded in a blast that 
 gutted a hotel in Enniskillen, shattering tranquility and igniting fresh 
 fears that a fevered hate would again transform a lyric land into a 
 confederacy of blood ruled by the shadow of the gun.  
 
 ``You know, part of the problem is that the Irish in America have no 
 appreciation for how utterly cruel the Brits are,'' the man was saying.  
 ``Look at their history.  Wherever they have gone - Palestine, South Africa, 
 India, Northern Ireland - look what they do:  They use torture and terrorism 
 to cling to their fantasy of world power but in the end it does not work and 
 they have to leave.  And long before they leave, they are despised.  ``They 
 are a cruel, bloodless people.  And they have spent 30 years tossing our 
 arses into jail and getting away with it because the media act like paid 
 public relations agents for them and don't report enough of the truth.  It's 
 easier to blame the IRA than it is to blame Margaret Thatcher.''  
 
 His story:  At 20, he was imprisoned for three years when a gun was found in 
 his family's flat off the Falls Road in Belfast.  He remembers coming home 
 from a bar called the Bee Hive to see soldiers dragging his father and 
 brother into the back of an armored vehicle as his mother and three sisters 
 screamed on the stoop.  ``One of them smacked me sister so I jumped on him 
 and was beating the bollocks off him until they dragged me off with me pa and 
 me brother,'' he said, a soft laughter calling back the years.  ``Cost me 32 
 months to come home early.''  He is a precise reminder of his native land.  
 He has been picked up and detained on numerous occasions until, finally, he 
 fled in 1993.  Arriving in Boston, he got work roofing houses.  He was 33 and 
 marveled at the fact he had just earned his first legitimate paycheck after 
 years on the dole.
 
 His life is a simile of the North: In and out of a jail constructed with fear 
 on soil that has become a permanent prison for too many Catholics.  Allowed 
 to taste the fruit of peace and optimism and then - suddenly and chillingly - 
 tossed back behind bars built with old habits and ancient hatreds.  All of it 
 is sadly predictable and truly pathetic:  The threat of reprisal.  The empty 
 political rhetoric.  The renewed violence.  London's timidity and 
 Washington's reluctance to force the British toward peace and common sense, a 
 place where most residents of Northern Ireland arrived months ago; even those 
 living here, fugitives because of their faith.  
 
 This story ran on page B1 of the Boston Globe on 07/23/96

    Andy,
    
    the nutters are in charge. Only the people of NI can vote them out but 
    at the moment there aren't many saner options than the UUP-DUP-SF et al 
    to vote for....
    
    Ray....

    Mike Barnicle has been writing offensive anti-British propaganda for the 
    Boston Globe for years (at least he was when I was living in Boston, 
    1989-1991).  As with all propagandists, his 'facts' are selective and 
    his use of language very emotive. 
    
    John


Sinn F�in Chairperson commenting on the revelation that the RUC
located the stolen jeep used in the bombing of the Kilyshevlin Hotel
several days before the bombing incident said: 

``This revelation adds further to the suspicions about the architects of this
incident. The RUC now acknowledges that they located the vehicle in
advance of the bombing incident. Yet they did not follow their normal
procedures adopted in these situation. 

``The vehicle, which they knew to be stolen, was left unattended and
unobserved. 

``The area was not cordoned off, there was no public announcement advising
the public to stay clear of the area. In effect this stolen vehicle was located
by the RUC and then allowed to disappear. 

``The RUC then concealed this information for four days and only admitted
this to be true as a result of media enquiries. 

``The RUC statement provides more questions than answers in relation to
this incident and the associated bombing, particularly given that no claim of
responsibility for the incident has been made.'' 

  I suggest anyone interested in results of the RUC and British army
  actions over the last 3 weeks, take a look at 

    http://www.serve.com/rm/aprn/current/news/index.html   

  This is the Thursday issue of APRN.

                           MARK

    ....or any respectable independant newspaper (relatively speaking).
    
    Shaun.

    Any news on the Apprentice boys march this weekend. Last I heard is
    that Orange/Nationalist talks with John Hume had ended with no
    agreement ?
    
    Shaun.,

    The parade has been stopped from marching along the part of the City
    wall that borders the Nationalist estates. Barricades have been erected
    to stop clashes between the 2 sides.
    
    RUC/Mayhew were in a no-win situation here. Whichever way they went,
    there would have been one side that hated the decision.
    
    Personally, I think the Unionists are sowing the seeds which they
    planted at Drumcree. They may have won the battle there but, in the
    long haul, they may have sounded the death-knell of the marching
    season....
    
    Ray.... 

    "Won one, lost one" is the score for each side. It's a pity
    that a referee couldn't declare a draw and leave it at that.
    
    John

    It seems that the deputy RUC chief (note: Deputy) asked Mayhew to ban
    the march from the aforementioned wall area. Obviously governmental
    criticism seems to have worked.
    
    Shaun.

    I'm posting this in this notes string not for any particular reason,
    it's just because I can't think of anywhere else to put it. If there is
    a better forum for it then feel free to post it there. The reason that 
    I'm posting it is because it gives us all an opportunity to hear/read
    the words of ordinary people from NI, and what they thought of the recent
    events in the North. And it reminds us that NI is not completely filled
    with hatred and bigotry.
    
    It comes from today's Irish News, (an NI newspaper), and is posted here
    without permission.
    
    Ray....
    
Presbyterians ask for Drumcree 'forgiveness'
By Niall Blaney

PRESBYTERIAN Church members have asked Catholics for forgiveness following 
the "communal sin" of Drumcree.

In a letter to the Irish News, members from across the north said 
Protestants involved in last month's violent scenes did not speak for their 
Church.

And they paid tribute to the family of murdered taxi driver Michael McGoldrick,
shot dead on the outskirts of Lurgan during the Drumcree stand-off.

The letter was signed by 25 Presbyterians from 14 separate congregations.

It said: "As members of the Presbyterian Church in Ireland and as part of the 
Body of Christ on earth we warmly welcome the statement issued by the Church 
and government committee in relation to the tragic occurrences in the week 
leading up to 12 July.

"We trust that many of our Roman Catholic neighbours will have an opportunity 
to read the statement and will recognise that those who vociferously claim to 
represent the Protestant community do not represent the authentic voice of 
Presbyterianism.

"We would wish to go even further than the statement to which we refer and to 
confess with deep anguish, the sins of disobedience, rebellion, anger and 
sectarianism which were perpetrated on the whole community, in the supposed 
cause of civil and religious liberty," said the letter.

It was signed by on behalf of the Church members by Dr Kelvin McCracken from 
Lisburn.

He said the signatories had been happy with the response of the Church and 
government committee to the events surrounding Drumcree but felt the element 
of repentance was missing.

"A lot of people felt strongly along those lines but we felt our voice was not 
being heard among the political noise that was coming out.

"I certainly know that there are others who feel the same way. There are a lot 
of people who are associated with the Orange Order who where appalled, but who 
might hesitate to say it."

Dr McCracken said he understood the reasons why RUC Chief Constable Sir Hugh 
Annesley had taken his decisions on last month's controversial parades but was 
"angry" about the curfew imposed on the Ormeau Road.

"A lot of people felt that that was just unacceptable. I was exceedingly angry 
and understand how people feel."

He hoped that in some small way the letter would reach out to people.

It said: "We ask the forgiveness of our Almighty and Holy God and of our Roman 
Catholic neighbours, that members of our Church should have been directly 
involved and that all of us, by association, have been tainted by this 
communal sin."

The Church members referred to the parable of The Good Samaritan which 
demonstrated the loving attitude of Jesus throughout His life and ministry.

And they expressed "deep pain" for those who had suffered as a result of 
recent violence and prayed that God would "bring balm to their souls and 
healing to their wounds".

"We particularly commend the example of the McGoldrick family who demonstrated 
the Spirit of Christ in reflecting so powerfully the words of Jesus on the 
Cross: 'Father, forgive them, they know not what they are doing'."

The letter calls on people of goodwill to put the events of the past behind 
them.

Members of congregations in counties Donegal, Derry, Down and Antrim 
undersigned the letter.

According to yesterday's "The Herald" and "The Telegraph" newspapers
four RUC officers were suspended pending investigations into allegations
that they took part in an orange order march. Both stories say that 
although there is no restriction on RUC officers being members of
"Loyal" organisations they are prohibited from taking part in marches.