Conference tallis::celt

Copied without permission from The Sunday Independent 4 February 1996.

                        James.

++

Hurling: the unclouded gamble 

by Kevin Cashman

Punting can be - on rare, refulgent occasions - edifying.  It should 
always be educational.  That it is not is proven by the countless 
millions who cease not to pursue the crock of illusions at the end of 
the Lotto rainbow.

Through all the long lustrums after buoyant, bootless boyhood your 
correspondent learned to confine his punting to hurling and rugby: 
whether one's confidence in one's competence in those arenas was well 
of ill founded, one could always take for granted that no fix had been 
arranged - there were all trying all out.  The Garryowen/Dungannon 
double constituted a sweet highlight.  Now that rugby has entered the 
demi-monde of professionalism where the fix is injected as well as 
agreed, one will have no difficulty in curbing one's speculative 
instincts in that arena. (then again, and on the other hand, it should 
be remembered that the wheen of non-triers who embarrassed us, in 
Lansdowne Road a fortnight since, did not need the lure of lucre: 
they, with master faine/ant to show the non-way, had long before 
proven that they could non-try just as laggardly without "monetary
reward.")

If you fancy an unclouded gamble on a field sport, you're left with
hurling.  And, in 1996, you won't be stuck for choice.  A quick check
of two of the leading layers reveals a startling - for bookmakers -
divergence of conviction. 

Powers make Tipperary clear - and hot - favourites at 3/1.  Cashmans
have Tipp languishing as fourth fancy at 5/1, behind joint favs.
Offaly and Kilkenny at 4/1, and Galway at 9/2.  But Powers rate Galway
at 4/1, hotter than Offaly at 5/1 and Kilkenny 6/1. 

It may look - by comparison with rival bookmakers' long range 
ante-port betting on, say, a Derby or Gold Cup - untypically 
contrasting and even confusing.  But, clearly, in the matter of Tipp's 
prospects, each of the firms has its own quite plausible rationale.  
Powers obviously deem Tipp to have a soft run, past Waterford and 
Kerry, into the Munster final; a tough match there; another cakewalk 
past the Ulster champions on August 4; and, presto, with just on one 
serious bound Tipp are in the final.  Whereas Cashmans appear to be
casting a glacial eye on events of the past three years: wherein the
softer the draw Tipp got, the more undignified and embarrassing became
their plop into the midden of their own embarrassments. 

They have a sufficiency of competent hurlers in Tipperary, and
Nicholas English proved, last June, that he has a good championship 
or two left in him; yet somehow the process of sifting and tempering 
their raw materials seems not to be proceeding entirely in accordance 
with their hearts' desired.  And whoever emerges from the 
Limerick/Cork/Clare side of the Munster draw may be better tuned for 
combat on 7 July.

I say "may" because I find the casual and universal, dismissal of 
Waterford, by punters and bookmakers alike, incomprehensible: Cashmans 
have them at 50/1, 7/1 for Munster.  Powers, quite fittingly 
considering the provenance of the firm's name, show considerably more
respect: 20/1, along with Wexford and Antrim, for the All Ireland.  
Even if they get to the final, Waterford will hardly win it at the 
first time of asking.  But, if they shock Tipp, it will be no shock at 
all to a nonconformist few.

Cork get the same rating, 11/2, from each firm.  Some trepidation
about the capacity of The Dream Team to pull off miracles is evident
here: this price, about a singularly untried team that has to win five
matches, four of them pretty well assured to be close run affairs,
errs so far on the side of caution as to stray into unrealism. 

The real fascination comes with The Banner: Cashmans, in common with
millions all over the globe, have not quite recovered from the
confutation and refutation inflicted upon them by The Banner, and
quote a deferential 6/1.  Powers, who probably suffered less trauma in
'95, go 8/1. 

On New Year's Day, this writer pared his choice down to Clare, Offaly, 
and Tipp, and refuses to pare it further before May Day.  After their 
triumph, it seemed that some increment of penetration, polish and 
perhaps personnel in the forward line would suffice to make The Banner 
favourites to retain their crown.  Eamonn Taaffe will probably be fit 
to start most days in '96; young O'Hara is a terrific prospect; Alan 
Neville should be able to get back to where he left off, a few years 
since: that lot, plus an improvement that the mantle and confidence of 
champions will generate in the regulars should supply most of The 
Banner's deficiencies.  So, that they, who have a match less to play,
should be rated so inferior to Cork seems astonishing; and 8/1 seem
temptingly - or, at any rate, comparatively - generous. 

That the Leinster championship seems very much a two horse race is 
reflected by the bookmakers' assessments.  And the fact that Offaly 
are more settled - in personnel, whatever about spirit - probably 
justifies the hint of preference for them shown by Powers.

Seekers after long shots have a wide variety to stick their pins into. 
Both firms go 14/1 Limerick and 20/1 Wexford.  There all similarities 
end.  Cashmans' respect for Babs Keating is reflected in the quote of 
33/1 about Laois; Powers go 100/1.  Powers have Antrim at 20/1; 
Cashmans have them at 66/1, and the same Dublin.  It is virtually any 
price you want after that.

Jack Boothman wants Waterford or Wexford to be "the next county to 
make that elusive, long-awaited breakthrough." [JL: What about 
Limerick?]  (Note how securely the good old Dublin-Galway hurling 
border remains in place!)  You know, as long shots go, the sunny 
south-easterners represent as good value in '96 as The Banner did in 
'95.  But your corr. will stick with his short priced threesome.

     
    Good article..surprised he would works for the Indo.
    
    Some of those odds are good...Munster will be very open this year
     
    I wouldn't really rate Waterford but the one thing the seem to do
    consistently is manage to injure opponents..so thats a worry....
    
    Wexford seem to be dropping in esteem every year...remember those
    classic league matchs against Killkenny (the drawn one)..a few years
    ago. maybe after last years offaly match they are still dispondent.
    
    rgs,
    
    Tipp
    
    
    
    
    

>    I wouldn't really rate Waterford but the one thing the seem to do
>    consistently is manage to injure opponents..so thats a worry....
    
    
    
    I seem to remember you being badly injured by a Waterford friend in a
    certain city centre pub after a certain Hurling Match -)
    
    MBr 

>    I wouldn't really rate Waterford but the one thing the seem to do
>    consistently is manage to injure opponents..so thats a worry....

Any half the Tipp team seem to have problems keeping on the right side
of the law ;-).

    Well I think that Sunday Blueshirt article was a very cheap excuse for
    creating a new hurling base note! The discussion should have been left
    in the UP OFFALY string, it goes without saying.
    
    I feel this string has rightly identified some of the problems of the
    game, but as contributers are often known spitters, suspected dog
    killers, and Tipperary tramps, we cannot hope for much. It is really
    necessary to go back to the roots of the game to understand what the
    problem is.
    
    Hurling is really a bastardised version of cricket, that most noble of
    all games, which was introduced to many parts of the world during the
    golden age in order to try and spread it's civilising influence. There
    is also a touch of Rugby about it, which originated of course  at a
    fine English Public School. Unfortunately for a variety of reasons best
    left unsaid, the game has degenerated very much in recent years, even
    to the extent that last year Guinnesses Brewery took over the hallowed
    trophy.  
    
    There is one noble exception to all this. The men from County Offaly,
    fomerly Kings County, play a noble and skilled version of the game, and
    have done much to restore honour to the sport in recent years.
    Unfortunately due to a dreadful fluke, they did not win the trophy last
    year, but there is every reason to hope that the main prize will return
    to Tullamore this year, where it should remain  for many years to come.
    
    BIFFO  

Can I have some of what you're having Kev?  It must be powerful
stuff if you believe even 10% of what .5 is on about :-).

                       James.

    Don't know what you are talking about James. Who is that BIFFO chap.
    And what's a BIFFO??????
    
    Nothing to do with me. Load of old crap.
    
    Kevin

> BIFFO

Big Ignorant F78ker From Offaly!

    Umm,
    
    thats what they thought about J Dooley when he stepped up to take that
    free with 7 minutes to go .....
    
    There were Limerick lads with their toungues hangin out, using their
    hurleys as walking sticks, not watching points at all, suckers thinking
    he was going for a point, in short a load of BIFFL's thinkin they were
    going to make the big time...
    
    Easy meat!
    
    Kevin

    
    
    ...can't argue with that -)..wouldn't happen if it was Tipp, Cork or
    the yellow stripes...well maybe the yellows...
    
    anyone know where the Munster final is this year???..
    

    Since this game looks a bit like a cross between Lacrosse and Hockey
    (ice), I have a natural affinity to watch it.
    
    Having said that, now I would like to see a game in the flesh rather
    than on TSN, here in Canada.
    
    I'll be in the West Cork (Bantry-Glengarriff) area for the latter part
    of May and the beginning of June this year.
    
    Where would I go to see a match close by and is there a schedule for
    local teams?
    
    Please be gentle...
    
    Pat

>    I'll be in the West Cork (Bantry-Glengarriff) area for the latter part
>    of May and the beginning of June this year.

You might get the Cork-Limerick clash in!  This is one game 
I will be at FWIW!  The hair will fly in that one I can 
guarantee - even at this early stage of the year.  Limerick
will be dreaming of putting the "Dream Team" to sleep once
and for all :-).

                        James.

    Thanks James:
    
    Is there some sort of schedule, or do they just start whackin' whenever
    it suits them?
    
    Pat

Pat,

>    Is there some sort of schedule, or do they just start whackin' whenever
>    it suits them?

Far from it.  I estimate that the Cork-Limerick game will be on the second
last, or most probably, last Sunday of May in Cork!  More info as I get
it myself?

                             James. 

    
    >    Is there some sort of schedule, or do they just start whackin'
    whenever
    >    it suits them?
    
    There is what is called a throw in to start. In the good old days this
    would be done by some celebrity and I have a childhood memory of the
    then President of Ireland Eamonn de Valera throwing in the sliothar one
    day at Croke Park although he was quite blind at the time. There was a
    man on the field with him as a guide and the two had to scuttle off as
    the game got going around them. If you watch the Cork-Limerick game it
    should last 70 minutes but the Limerick team don't realise this and
    with 7 minutes to go they start to look around for a drink, so I
    believe pints of stout will be served on them during the game this year
    to try and keep them going. During this period Cork will probable run
    in 11 points and that will be it...
    
    
    There is also the possibility of watching the true version of the game
    by tuning to the test match cricket on Sky TV....
    
    BIFFO
    

>>Far from it.  I estimate that the Cork-Limerick game will be on the second
>>last, or most probably, last Sunday of May in Cork!  More info as I get
>>it myself?

James,
    
    Perfect!  So that'd be about 26 May, in Cork.
    
    Please do provide more info  as you get it.
    
    I haven't yet any loyalties, although the family comes from Cork, so...
    
    Pat
    

    
    .....Looks like leinster hurling is rolling down a steep hill after looking
    at the railway cup match..though does anybody really bother with those
    games....
    
    I see from an earlier note our limerick friend recalling from his early
    years the '73 Tipp limerick game..and he rejoiced at the final piece
    of action...This says alot about the upbringing ye got...If ye were
    taught to  celebrate Treachery...cheating....bribed umpires.....
    Safe to say ye won nothing since that...and limerick turned out to be
    the type of city is is... 
    
    
    Pat...yes maybe check out the Cork game...unfothun. Tipp will be already
    be in the final waiting for the winners by then so you won't see alot of 
    skill in cork...but at least you will see the bare essentials...though
    there could be a junior match somewhere in west cork at the time and 
    this would save you the time.....
    
    -) Mick
                            

    >>Pat...yes maybe check out the Cork game...unfothun. Tipp will be already
    >>be in the final waiting for the winners by then so you won't see alot of 
    >>skill in cork...but at least you will see the bare essentials...though
    >>there could be a junior match somewhere in west cork at the time and 
    >>this would save you the time.....
    
    Along with hurling, slagging Cork seems to be fare game too. ;^)
    
    I'll have a bit of time so's maybe I'll take in both.  The better to
    judge which was best, like.
    
    Pat

How does a dog from Cork bark ???



"Bow Wow Boy"


keVin
[Posted by WWW Notes gateway]

>>"Bow Wow Boy"
    
    That sounds almost like a Newfoundlander,
    "Stay where yer at, I'll come where yer to, boy."
    And the people of Newfoundland sound just like the dog, mind.

    
    No No....I wouldn't menton Newfies to Kevin..
    
    -) -)
    
    

    News item:
    
    The Barony of Askeaton in Limerick and the Barony of Oweny and Arra in
    Tipperary have been sold to overseas buyers. It is certainly to be
    hoped that the new Lords will have a civilising influence on the
    natives of those parts. I understand the ground rents due on the
    estates will be used to pay for hurling lessons to be given by Messrs
    Geoff Boycott and Ian Botham, in a sponsorship deal with Sky TV.
    Natives of those counties will also have to pay a special levy when
    attending GAA matches.
    
    BIFFO 

    
    Anyone have the league draw?...Tipp already through to semis despite
    losing to Kilkenny...Good game and they will probably meet again
    in the semis if Kilkenny beat laois....
    
    I hope Mr Power of kilkenny is given some treatment before he touchs
    a hurley again..the man is demented..probably should be put down..
    or sprayed...
    
    Clare beat Cork into the ground..so now am really worried about Cork
    for the championship... 
    
    
      

Taken from a recent Electronic Irish Times:

++
The campaign to implement the radical reform proposals of the hurling
development committee has received huge impetus from Monday night
meetings in Kilkenny and Wexford. Both counties had previously come
out strongly against the plan at their annual conventions. The
Kilkenny vote was exceptionally tight, 24-23, whereas in Wexford the
two-thirds majority needed to overturn the convention decision was
exceeded by six votes. In recent weeks, however, there has been a
discernible swing in favour of the reforms. Against a background of -
at best - uncertainty concerning the intentions of the traditional
hurling counties, the results have been unexpectedly positive.
++

It looks likely that something akin to this will be passed at the
convention to be held in London at the weekend.  Most hurlers - not
that they were consulted - are against such proposals.  They would
prefer to see an open draw with the retention of the Munster and
Leinster championships in their present form.

It seems that the losers of both Munster and Leinster finals will be
allowed back into the championship to play the Ulster and Connaught
champions at the Q-F stage, if the current proposals are passed.  It 
means that you could lose the provincial decider and still be there 
on the steps of the Hogan Stand come 5 PM on the first Sunday of 
September.

                          James.

Taken from a recent Electronic Irish Times:

++
The GAC has released details for the latter stages of the National
Leagues. The hurling quarter-finals, on April 14th, will be staged on
a double bill in Thurles. A fortnight later Tipperary's semi-final
against either Kilkenny or Laois will be at Nowlan Park and Galway's
meeting with the survivors of the other quarter-final is fixed for
Limerick.

As usual, the football semi-finals will be staged on a Croke Park
double bill, on April 21st. Donegal or Wicklow will play the winners
of Cork-Kerry and Derry or Cavan will face either Meath or Mayo. The
Railway Cup football final between Leinster and Munster, who
dethroned Ulster, the champions of the last six years, will take
place on April 14th at Newbridge.
++

                         James.

    
    An interesting days hurling yesterday with Offaly and Kilkenny out!...
    What were does odds again on laois?????...
    
    Should be a good league semi-final (Tipp and Laois)..and an interesting
    leinster Champtionship as well....  

Re .18

> If ye were
> taught to  celebrate Treachery...cheating....bribed umpires.....
> Safe to say ye won nothing since that...and limerick turned out to be
> the type of city is is... 

All I say is: get your own house in order before you start preaching
to others :-).

                       James.

Limerick are limbering up well for the big showdown in 
Cork on 26 May.  They have played four challenge matches
over the past three weeks and have won two and drawn two.

Reports of Houlihan getting his jaw fractured in two places
by a bullock are somewhat misplaced if reports from the
locals down that way are to believed.  It is more likely
that he had an altercation with an iron bar wielded by
a close relation.  Of course it's probably not true but I
thought I'd pass it on to give an indication of the
most upto date training methods being undertaken by the 
Limerick team in preparation for the match with Cork ;-).

                     James.

    
    Good to see the limerick folk back after their poor league showing
    They will have their work cut out against Cork...
    
    re the report Its ok..no need to explain...we understand fully:
    
   > Reports of Houlihan getting his jaw fractured in two places
   > by a bullock ........... It is more likely
   > that he had an altercation with an iron bar wielded by
   > a close relation.
    
    Same thing...reporter just missed the family resemblence..-)
    
                                                                

Well it's less than a week away and Limerick announced their team last
evening.  Limerick will be full strength, including Mike Houlihan (who
is fully recovered from the run-in with the iron bar - described in
gory detail in an earlier note) and Declan Nash (broken nose.) 

Hope are high in the Limerick camp that Cork can be beaten.  Cork have
shown little form in the past few months while Limerick are unbeaten
since before Christmas.  Limerick are training like "maniacs" and are
reported to be "very sharp".  I attended the recent challenge game
against Clare and came away very impressed with the sharpness and
hunger of Limerick. 

I am confident that Limerick will win on Sunday if their mental
approach is right and Cork aren't packing talent we don't know about
yet. 

Get your money down...

                          James.

    I can't resist this...
    
    Being substantially in profit this year I shall have a modest double
    figure investment in Cork, if it is only in honour of the magnificent
    Imperial Call, who brought the Cheltenham Gold Cup to the Leeside, 
     and ignoring entirely the shocking fact that the Cork
    Examiner ran a front page headline suggesting Irish beef is unsafe to
    eat. 
    
    What are the odds ?
    
    Kevin 

    
    ...Christ..betting on Cork...how low can a man get...
    
    ....Whats the odds anyway??..
    
    mick

Kev,

Given your current propensity for leaving money after you (re: canteen 
a week or so ago) I'm not surprised that you are going to bet on Cork.
In making your decision you seem not to have factored in the
incredible amount of slagging you will have to shift *when* Limerick
does the business from me (and Dermot O'S ;-) possibly).

mick,

I don't have Mulhollands' odds yet.  They said they would probably
post them Thursday.  When I get they I will post them here. 

                          James.

    James,
    
    I was making way for a nice young lady you guys had been rude to, but
    if I had realised what company I had been in I would have been more
    careful! Anyway the few scheckels I carry round is not what I call
    money when it comes to betting. BTW I can't understand why she wanted
    to sit with such a dodgy looking buncha scruffs.
    
    Mick , stop taking the Lord's name in vain. This is just a sign of
    nerves. I think Cork will do the business.
    
    Kevin

I have the odds for Cork ...



shlim & none



keVin
[Posted by WWW Notes gateway]

    >  ...Christ..betting on Cork...how low can a man get...
    
    Well, I once backed Cambridge to win the boat race and they sank. Cork
    started favourites, would you believe. I expect Clare to give Limerick
    more to do, but after yesterday I now understand why Offaly are only
    5/1 to win Liam again, which represents accumulated odds of 4/6 on each
    game! Given the Ballinasloe result this is not exactly good value.
    
    Kevin 

What more can I say other than that I will tell my children that I was
there that fateful day. 

The Reds were well and truly grilled by an incredibly hurgry and sharp
(I told ye, didn't I) Limerick side on Sunday.  Limerick were on top
in all sectors of the field and completely outgunned Cork in the
second half after only going in at half-time one point down, playing
against a gale force wind. 

We can and will improve and I don't see Clare stopping us, though that
game is three weeks time will be one for all to savour. 

Mick, I got Limerick at 6/5 to beat Cork on Saturday in Galway but
only had a Daniel O'Donnell on them at that price.  Limerick were 9/2
for Munster and 12/1 for the All-Ireland on Saturday too.  I'd
postulate that they are significantly less at this moment in time. 

Kev, How could you describe Limerick as only "middlin"?  Sour grapes,
maybe, at losing the last shirt you possess on a team that I told you
as much wouldn't win.  Another victim to the traditionalist view of
things and you from Offaly? 

What did you think of Cashman's article last Sunday?  I though he was 
a bit over the top in entitling the article the battle of the 
no-hopers.  I sincerely hope he will be eating crow/humble pie come 
1 September.

Still living in hope of seeing Limerick win an All-Ireland in my 
lifetime,

                          James.

    >Kev, How could you describe Limerick as only "middlin"?  Sour grapes,
    >maybe, at losing the last shirt you possess on a team that I told you
    >as much wouldn't win
    
    James, the trifle I had on Cork did not even eat into my casino
    profits, not to mention the Imperial Call coup, which yielded a proper
    wad. And since when have you been counting my shirts?
    
    Now on the matter of Limerick, I honestly was not that impressed. Cork
    were pathetic in the second half and in the latter part of the first
    half Limerick were hitting wides in their true style. I don't see
    Limerick getting past Clare, they will not have such a luxurious time,
    Clare will hustle them and the missed points will count.  Now I
    understand why Offaly are only 5/1, class will tell in this. There were
    one or two on the Cork team barely able to hop the ball. 
    
    Where is the Clare-Limerick game?
    
    Now as to whether you will live to see Limerick win a title here are my
    predictions for the next 100 years or so:-)
    
    Offaly
    Offaly
    Offaly
    Offaly 
    Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Clare
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly 
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly
        Offaly

Bring it on Lads, just bring it on !!  :-)

Congratulations Dermot !!

keVin
[Posted by WWW Notes gateway]

> Congratulations Dermot !!

What about me?

Sorry James .... I thought you were a Tipperary man !!   :-)

I got you confused with Mick  ;-)


keVin

[Posted by WWW Notes gateway]

    So the Bannerman missed the little dig hidden in .39. 
    
    Well let's look on the bright side of the Clare-Limerick game.
    
    We'll be rid of one of them anyway!

    okay guys, who are you tipping for Sunday? I nearly skinned Paddy Power
    last Saturday on the horses when the first two legs of a super yankee
    came in at 12/1 and 6/1, so I think I will have a small bet on Clare. I
    can't see them leaving their title behind them in Crowtown.
    
    Kevin

    
    
    ..umm will have to go for the Limerick men....been away so didn't
    see the last games..but Cork getting a thrashing in Cork means the 
    Limerick men must be dangerous...
    
    I hear it might be a grudge match..Limerick men sharpening the ends
    of the hurleys..both ends...Clare men with blades in their boots -)
    -)..stand by for a hectic opening in any case...
    
     What a good start to the summer!!!...Tipp in the driving seat
    ...Cork and Kilkenny (what SHAME at been beaten by the yellow-bellies) 
    ..and... Clare and Limerick about to skin each other....God bless
    sundays in June!!!...
    
    Limerick to win by 2 points!

Keyes: Your on MY list now !!!

I don't recall any such statments during your "visit" last week ..  :-)

Time Will Tell

Lord Have Mercy


keVin

[Posted by WWW Notes gateway]

    
    
    ...Oh I pray for Clare ok...pray...Did you meet the slippery one??
       what does the snake think...???
    
    hear its hard to get tickets for sunday...Good to see RTE are showing
    it Live..

    So Biddy Early is entering notes here, is she? A dangerous development,
    to be sure, but I wish her well. Will she be at the Horse Fair at the
    Cross of Spancil Hill?  

OK, where do I start?  I suppose I could start by saying that I have
three terrace tickets for Sunday :-).  But before you send me mail
asking for one of them, there is already a queue of about 10 people
(mostly relations) looking for them from me.  So, at least I'm in the
door come Sunday. 

The next thing is the odds.  Limerick are 10/11, Clare 1/1 and a draw 
is 14/1.  I've had a few quid with the bookies but would have probably
been better if I could have grigged a few Claremen (or women mostly)
into having straight bets with me.  At least with the bookies I'm
guaranteed my money, while at the same time donating 10% of the stake
to charity (the exchequer). 

The game!  WOW!  I can hardly wait.  The prospects of a classic clash
are ominous.  The history is known, the recent battles even more
so.  Limerick's demolition of Cork (any Cork team) is by now legendary
down in Crowtown.  Clare are All-Ireland champions.  Limerick's last
chance saloon - it's now or never possibly. 

Both teams are unchanged from their last championship encounter:
Limerick's team is the same as started against Cork, Clare's is the
same as started against the BIFFOs. 

I hear that Clare don't think much of Limerick's full forward line. I
wouldn't be so cocky if I were you, boyos.  Remember what happened to
Limerick last year? 

As to who I think will win.  I earnestly hope Limerick can do it. 
I've put the mortgage (and the baby food money too ;) for next month
on Limerick, so I'll be shouting for my fellow county men more vocally 
than usual.  Personally I think Clare are possibly not as sharp, or as
hungry, as they were last year; I don't think they'll have the same
luck this year as they had last year either.  Limerick, I think,
realise that this might be their last chance with this team and have a
score to settle with Clare. 

As mick said I'd be keeping my eyes on the ground level action for the
first 5 minutes of the match as I think there'll be more than a few
hurleys broken over various pieces of prime Clare beef to quieten them
down (enter Mick Houlihan, the beef executive). 

Jesus, I can hardly wait.

                          James.

P.S. And as for Mannerings and his betting patterns.  Given that you
seem to have won the majority of your money by pure chance (in the
casino) I suppose I can understand your behaviour when it comes to
hurling cf. Cork and Clare. 

James my boy'o ..........

Best of Luck !!!

(Your going to need it)

:-)

"SOUND BALLYVAUGHAN"

keVin

[Posted by WWW Notes gateway]

    ...Well James looks like your House and food for the kids is safe...
       Go on tell me your nerves are still in one piece after THAT last 4
    minutes -) -).
    
    Excellent match...Limerick winning by a point after been down 3 points 
    with 4 minutes to go. I was really sure Clare had it...But thats
    hurling for you. They must have been level 7 or 8 times over the
    full 70 minutes. Very hot day also which didn't make it easy
    
    What would Limerick do if Kirby was missing ( I hear John Leahy might
    invite him for a few pints before the Munster Final -). I don't know
    his final tally but is was pretty high..Clare missed alot of chances
    ..many wides..though Limerick also had quite a few misses.
                         
    Very very Clean game...despite what many folk predicted..Goof referee
    (from Tipp)...
    
    Roll on July 7..Tipp and limerick - Munster final...that will be
    another classic
    
    rgs,
    
    mick
    

                         
>    Very very Clean game...despite what many folk predicted..Goof referee
>    (from Tipp)...
 
    Mick I didn't think the ref was all that bad -) In fact I thought he
    had a reasonably good game - even if he was from Tipp.
    
    What a good close exiting game. Both teams are to be congratulated on
    that full blooded encounter. It made their professional comrades
    across the water look like a crowd of wimps.
    
    Clare, I felt, lost the match in the first half. Too much careless
    shooting from scorable positions - and unscorable ones when passing
    would have been a better option. Only 2 points up at the interval after
    being well on top for most of the half. 
    
    In the second half when Limerick were getting on top I could not
    understand why they kept driving in high balls on top of the Clare
    full back line. Brian Lohan revelled in that.
    
    In the last 10 minutes I thought the Clare half back line visibilt
    tired. Limerick - to their credit - did not drop the heads but kept the
    points coming. That Kieran Carey effort in extra time was a great bit
    of individual work.  
       
>    Roll on July 7..Tipp and limerick - Munster final...that will be
>    another classic
    
    Ah we need to go to Croker on Sunday first to see will Laois beat
    Offaly. I hear that Offally have brought back Dermot Healy to coach the
    team. What is up between Offaly and Eamonn Cregan?.
    
    The Dubs might even spring a surprise on Wexford - Who knows?
    
    MBr

    Well, it was like the Offaly Clare Final, I think Clare should have
    buried Limerick but they thought they had it won. I would say it is an
    advantage to have had a game played this year recently. Limerick must
    be worried that one man did most of the scoring. If he is closed down
    they will have a hard time. 
    
    As for the gambling: roulette is a game of skill. There is no such
    thing as a perfect random generator in the real world. Anyway, I am
    happy to report that when I went in the shop I found Offaly had gone
    out a point to 5/1 and so I invested the money there. I shall say no
    more against Limerick. It may be that they will again have the privelege
    of receiving a lesson from Offaly.. :-)
    
    Kevin  
               

    re .53
    
    I'm working the evening shift this week James, my voice, and my money
    are just fine thanks. It is SO nice to know that you are
    concerned about me though.
    
    Kevin

    
    ....Looks like the Munster final is all ticket affair. It will also be
    Live on TV over here. Its a pity the match is on in Limerick city as it
    means decent Tipperary folk having to take their lives in their hands
    ..keep the car windows rolled up tight when driving though...A few cans
    of CS gas wouldn't go astray either..especially as the ground isn't far
    from Clare..where the savages might want to venture down to see a real
    Hurling team in action....
    
    ..James (old buddy old pal)..any spare tickets going there....
      Kevin...whats odds did you get on laois???
    
    Mick
    

            
    Offaly 4-17         Laois 2-10.....
    
    a hammering...Sad to see the dubs bite the dust as well....Can't see
    Wexford stopping offaly...whatever about Galway in the semis...
    
    Any spare munster final tickets in offaly...Nice people in offaly
    ..always liked them...
                     
    rgs,
    
    mick                     

>    ..James (old buddy old pal)..any spare tickets going there....
>      Kevin...whats odds did you get on laois???

>    Any spare munster final tickets in offaly...Nice people in offaly
>    ..always liked them...

So, you'll sleep with anyone for a ticket mick?  No thank you :-).  No
sign of tickets yet for Sunday week but I'll keep you in mind.  OK?
Terrace tickets should be no problem - as was the case last Sunday
week.  Stand tickets are another matter though. 

The odds are out for the big game (the real thing unlike what happened
in Leinster at the weekend): both Limerick and Tipperary are 5/6 to
win Munster. FWIW: Limerick are great value at 7/2 for the
All-Ireland. 

Quigley will be OK for the Munster final.  I'm looking forward to the
"clash" of Leahy and Houlihan.  Absolutely no love is lost between
those two and given that Leahy is after "getting away" with slashing a 
Limerick man with a beer glass the tension should be higher than 
usual.

A long range prediction: Limerick to beat Tipperary in a good match.
Who'll beat against Limerick going the whole way after that?  I dare
to dream of 1 September 1996... 

Betting on Tipperary, Kevin?  You've been my talisman upto now so
don't let me down. 

                          James.

    
    ..Ok have given up on Limerick and offaly men for tickets and
    have bribed a roscommon chap...So thats politeness over for a while.
    ..and back to normal.. ok Savages???..Its Quigley on on Sunday...Hope
    he has nice strong shins...
    
    Hope we get some fair umpires THIS TIME around...no more last minute
    frees that are a mile wide and given as a point...Predicting  a narrow
    win for Tipp maybe 2 points...John leahy to be man of the match...
    
    rgs,
    
    mick-)
    

    Alright, Just to keep James happy I will tip Tip. But this is not a
    real tip.
    
    BIFFO

Tickets are as scarce as footballers in Kilkenny but I'm still going
and hoping to have a ticket before having to do battle with the touts
on the day. 

Limerick are favourites (4/5 to 5/6 with the bookies) in most people's
opinions, and rightly so as they have come from the harder end of the
draw (beating Cork and Clare) to Tipperary's (Kerry and Waterford). 

Limerick are playing an almost unchanged 15 (Quigley comes in for
Galligan) from the team that started against Clare while Tipperary
have gone for 5 positional switches and two personnel changes over the
team that started against Kerry.  Tipperary have also changed their
midfield partnership completely.  Not a good sign given the speciality
of the position. 

A full house is expected, though the day will probably not be as good
as it was the day Limerick and Clare played; it's been raining on and
off here on the west coast since late last week.  It will make the sod
quite greasy, the terraces in the Gaelic Grounds more so. 

Nicky English isn't fit after pulling a calf muscle.  He is a big loss
for the Tipp. men.  There are doubts over Kirby for Limerick too.  He
seems to have Achilles tendon trouble.  It would be a major blow to
Limerick if he wasn't to play up to his usual high (scoring) standard.

The game will be tough, but I think (and earnestly hope :) that
Limerick have the hunger, the desire and, of course, hurlers to carry
the day.  Hopefully we have exhausted our reservoir of luck beating
Clare three weeks ago. 

The game is essentially an All-Ireland semi-final as the winners will
meet the Ulster champions in the real semi-final.  No disrespect to
Ulster but they are going through a tough patch at the moment and
shouldn't trouble the Munster champions.  So the winners will play
either Galway/Offaly/Wexford on 1 September? 

What odds a replay of 1994?

                          James. 

     >Hopefully we have exhausted our reservoir of luck beating
     >Clare three weeks ago.
    
    I'll drink to that, Crowtown kid...
    
    BIFFO

    It seems the problem with this Limerick team is, they are too dumb to
    realise they are bet. Thats probably why Offaly let them think they had
    it won and then took it from under their noses.
    
    Two poor sides, Limerick for getting 10 pints behind,  Tipp for
    letting them catch up.
    
    BIFFO

    
    A draw!...
    
    Not for the faint hearted...Great match to watch..I was pretty
    sure Tipp had it at after the scored their first point in the second
    half. Was very sure Limerick had it when the equalised with 8 minutes
    to go..Was confident again when Tipp led by 2 points...Then with 3
    minutes played of injury time (and there was at least 3 due)...Great
    equalising point from the limerick men...
    
    I think Tipp went on the defensive too much in the second half. Great
    reflex safe from quaid at one point..and so close when that limerick
    shot came off the post at the other. Wind was a factor so will be 
    interesting to see what happens in Cork next Sunday .Hopefully it will be 
    calmer weather wise. 
    
    Just goes to show you where there is real hurling..Munster. 
    
    rgs,
    
    mick

I'm completely exhausted after yesterday's exertions.  I thought
I'd seen it all before yesterday, but was again proved wrong.

Limerick will not make the same mistakes in the replay!  Tipperary
left it behind them in Limerick last evening.

Thanks for the nice comments (.63) BIFFO!  I hope you had your money
on Tipperary to win Munster and not the game itself - a subtle
difference.

Much more larer.

                         James.

    Oh gawd, Limerick are 5/6 favorites to win Liam !
    
    I must say well done to Wexford, I only saw 10 minutes of the match in
    the evening as I was tramping across Achill Island when the games were on.
    During that time Wexford looked pretty good. Wexford are 100/30, Galway 2/1
    . Antrim are 20/1.   I would be betting 6/4 the three 
    
    I'm now tipping Antrim :-)
    
    By the way, the mountains of Achill have changed colour from heather
    blue to grey green, due to overgrazing to get the EC headage payments.

    
    ..The pain of it all...You wouldn't mind losing to a good team but when
    you beat yourselves..I gave up counting the wides that Tipp sent over.
    Then Cleary missing all those fress at the end...
    
    that said well done to the Limerick men..you can't but say they deserve
    some success..
    
    Wexford!..I think they surprised alot of folk...Looked like they won
    the all-ireland after the game..Good game though. Should be a good
    match between Galway and Wexford...yes nice good hurling!
    
    ah gawd!!!!!
    
    Mick
    

UP YE F*CKERS!

It gave me the greatest of pleasure to go into my local bookies
yesterday to collect on my myriad of bets struck during the past six
weeks.  Especially so to see the expression on the face of one
particular gent who nearly laughed in my face when I first placed my
money (and faith) on Limerick before the Cork match.  This pleasure
will be nothing to what it could (nay will) be when Limerick stride
onto the pitch for All-Ireland Final day on 1 September. 

Kev, I think you should stick to putting your money on the GGs.  Your
hurling predictions still leave an awful lot to be desired cf. Cork,
Clare, Tipperary, Offaly :-))))). 

mick, Tipperary's departure will give you lots of time to concentrate
on your DECUS presentation in Spain in September :-)))). 

This time we *will* make sure!  The only pity will be having to beat
Wexford (not Offaly) in the process. 

                          James.

    
    
    Wexford are good odds surely at 100/30..thats if they stop celebrating
    when is the semi. How are the galway lads feeling over there...
    
    will be strange next year...Tipp would be back in it again...Wouldn't
    be worth it for the slagging -) -) -)
    
    How can one look at a football match after the last couple of weeks?
    
    Mick
    
    

> How are the galway lads feeling over there...

I'll be on a spying mission for Tom Ryan at the weekend
out in my own backyard of Athenry, where Galway play
New York on Saturday evening.  New York seem to have a good 
team at the moment and should take a good bit of beating.

The force is with Limerick and it will take a team of 
super-humans to deny us this year.

Tipperary: the home of hurling - ha-ha-ha.
Limerick: the home of the Munster champions 1996 and hopefully 
more.

                     James.

Off the The Big Smoke on Sunday for the next instalment in The
Odyssey.  All is well in Limerick and hopes are at fever pitch that
this will be our year (as if you didn't already guess this from my
previous dispatches).  Limerick are raging favourites to take Liam
back, but your resident pundit isn't too enamoured with the odds on
his heroes at the moment. 

I'm waiting until after the semi-final and closer to the final before
laying off my wad.  I feel that Limerick's odds will drift out a
little coming upto the final for two reasons: the prevailing
impression that Limerick will bottle the final like they did in 1994
and the fact that Galway or Wexford are too well priced at the moment
for comfort. 

These facts will to deter Alec Bird here!

James (who will not rise to the cheap bait being offered by the token
BIFFO in this corner of Digital cyberspace). 

    Limerick v Wexford in the final....I hope that Wexford don't win as
    we'll NEVER hear the end of it. If you believed their supporters, you
    would think that they had a God-given right to be regular All-Ireland 
    champions every 2 or 3 years. So, for once in my life....COME ON
    LIMERICK!...(retch)....
    
    Ray....

And so it has come to pass: Limerick in the All-Ireland final.  Boy
did they make hard work of it though.  Saying that, I take solace out
of the fact that Limerick played quite poorly last Sunday in the
semi-final actually.  It means that there is genuine work to be done
to get the team into the right groove for the final itself.  If
Limerick had won by 20 points, or more, there wouldn't have been much
that could be worked upon in the weeks leading upto the final, would
there?  At least now there is real work to be done to try and get
those tossers we call forwards into some sort of better shape for the
big day. 

I really think the Limerick full-forward line will score goals against
their Wexford counterparts.  Galway scored three goals without really
threatening last Sunday.  At least two of the goals were the result of
downright poor defending by the Wexford rearguard.  This is something
that Tom Ryan will, no doubt, be emphasising very strongly over the
next few weeks in training.  With Kirby scoring almost every free
inside 70 yards, a healthy return can be expected from this sector
too, as Limerick's forwards will force Wexford's defenders into giving
away plenty of scoreable frees (given the right sort of referee). 

What would Galway have given to have Kirby taking their frees on
Sunday?  If Kirby had missed even one of the 6 easy chances Forde and
Co. missed on Sunday, he would have been deemed to have had a bad day.
Galway threw it away, thankfully, if you are a Limerick supporter, for
truly Galway would have posed a greater challenge than Wexford should
if they, Galway, have beaten Wexford. 

I believe we have seen the best of Wexford, but not of Limerick.  If
Storey, Dempsey and Murphy can be kept quiet, which I have no doubt
McDonagh, Clarke, Nashe and/or Foley can do, then Wexford's scores
aren't going to come from the rest of their crew.  The same could be
said of Kirby but I think the other forwards, notably, Quigley, will
flourish on the diet of low fast ball that will be fed to them from
the towering midfield duo of Houlihan and O'Neill (a close neighbour
at home). 

Limerick's experience in the final of 1994 will also stand them in
good stead.  Remember, 12 of the probable starting 15 will have tasted
the bitter, bitter pill of defeat before and will be in no mood to
taste it again.  Wexford, on the other hand, think they will do a 
Clare on it this year.  Limerick will not capitulate as easily as
Offaly last year did, however.  Wexford's turn will have to wait
another year.  It is truly unfortunate that Limerick and Wexford (they
being my next favourite county after Limerick and Clare) had to come
out of their respective provinces the same year.  I hope Wexford won't
begrudge us our turn in the sun too much.  We will have earned it the
hard way. 

Roll on 1 September.

                          James.

    
     >the fact that Limerick played quite poorly last Sunday
    
    They play poorly every bloody Sunday James. 
    
    I have had a nice double Wexford and Meath at 36/1. 
    
    The first part is looking good.
    
    BIFFO

It's offaly sad that Offaly aren't still in the championship to test
your theories.  Nice to see that you are still going against Limerick
(as like almost everyone else including Limerick's friend: blueshirt
Cashman).  It's brought us luck this year.  So the 6th best team in 
the country is going to win the championship this year - how sweet.

BIFFO, you truly must be a man made of money (and you say you are a
full-timer around here) if you think Meath and Wexford are going to do
the business.  It's got to be Tyrone and Limerick FWIW! 

I don't remember you putting any tips for last week's festival in
here?  I wonder why? 

                          James.

    > I wonder why?
    
    I wus on my back in Ennis General with a severe sinus infection but I'm
    right as rain now. 
    
    Limerick will come to a sticky end. Meath were good value at 8/1.
    Anyway, they bet the Jacks, which cheers up most of the country doesn't
    it.
    

> Limerick will come to a sticky end.

NOT THIS YEAR!

You really will deserve every single slag you will have to
endure after Limerick pick up the big one come 1 September.
I will personally administer the punishment, and take
great pleasure in dishing it out.

You will have no excuses.  Your bridges are burned BIFFO.

                     James.

    >>>You really will deserve every single slag you will have to
    endure after Limerick pick up the big one come 1 September.
    I will personally administer the punishment, and take
    great pleasure in dishing it out.
    
    This cuts both ways you know, boyo. I'm looking forward to the great
    GLOAT. I shall probably even descend to reading Cashman for pleasure,
    which is as low as I can think to sink, but his social analysis of the
    "Limerick plebians" and their misfortune in following such a crappy
    hurling team has some awful hold on me, nearly as bad as the dreaded Dunphy
    who is on the front of some tabloid today montaged as a rat...
    
    And BTW, Limerick did not bottle the 94 final, they were swept aside in
    a brilliant late rally after falling for Johnny Dooley's sucker punch. 
    Limerick are a moderate bunch, Wexford can take them.
    
    BIFFO

> And BTW, Limerick did not bottle the 94 final, they were swept aside
> in a brilliant late rally after falling for Johnny Dooley's sucker
> punch. 

Again you have taken Cashman to heart!  Offaly were lucky in 1994, as
Clare proved last year!  Limerick will not make the same mistake this
year.  We are guaranteed success if Cashman picks Wexford - which he
will do I presume if past history is anything to go by.  It would
round off a perfect year: Limerick wins the All-Ireland with Cashman
(and BIFFO too) having opposed them all year.  All I'm waiting for is
for Cashman to come out with the line that Limerick in 1996 were the
worst All-Ireland champions in modern times.  My arse! 

> Limerick are a moderate bunch, Wexford can take them. 

That's funny: I think the exact opposite.  We have seen the best of
Wexford, not of Limerick. 

Limerick cannot - will not - lose!  Mulhollands and Corals will have
to sell up and move away from Galway come 2 September. 

                          James.

    tut tut tut, Cashman won't have to write them off as the worst modern
    champions of recent times, because the antithesis of this will not
    happen. Enough said.  

RE: .73

> And so it has come to pass: Limerick in the All-Ireland final.  Boy
> did they make hard work of it though.  Saying that, I take solace out
> of the fact that Limerick played quite poorly last Sunday in the
> semi-final actually.


Why James, thank you for being so gracious in victory!!! Wasn't it nice 
of Antrim to turn up to give Limerick a training session, especially 
since the Glen's Men obviously aren't capable of holding a flame to the 
overwhelming superiority of Limerick......I don't think so!

> At least now there is real work to be done to try and get
> those tossers we call forwards into some sort of better shape for the
> big day. 

Again I suppose the Antrim backs didn't play well............the best and 
gutsiest display I have seen in a long time from Antrim, especially Eoin 
Colgan the Antrim full back who was my,unbiased :-), man of the match.


> 			With Kirby scoring almost every free
> inside 70 yards, a healthy return can be expected from this sector
> too, as Limerick's forwards will force Wexford's defenders into giving
> away plenty of scoreable frees (given the right sort of referee). 

I think you were certainly given the right sort of referee on Sunday. 
I don't want this to sound like sour grapes but I did feel that the 
referee (from that great hurling county of Carlow) really spoilt a 
super game of hurling, when with 10 minutes to go he didn't even talk
to Cleary after he slapped McCambridge with the stick. Then didn't award 
Antrim a free, allowed Limerick to proceed with their side line puck and 
didn't blow for a chest high tackle with the feet on Colgan and awarded 
Limerick the goal. Any neutals I know felt Antrim were very hard done by
to say the least. Maybe, Antrim wouldn't have won but I felt the 
refereeing was very inconsistent. The game died at this point and I don't 
believe that it was just because of the goal. Any comments James?

RE: Wexford's chances

I did feel they were a little fortunate that Galway's free-taking was so 
poor. They did look very well at times but should have won by a much 
larger margin. Didn't think the second game came close for entertainment.

Dermot
PS Some of these years Antrim will come good, I think they just need the 
correct mental attitude.

    > Limerick's forwards will force Wexford's defenders into giving
    > away plenty of scoreable frees (given the right sort of referee).
    
    That about sums up the Limerick 'strategy' alright. Act the goat and
    hope for frees from the 'right sort' of referee. It sucks. 
    
    Here is another prediction: when Limerick get their comeuppance, there
    will be moans about the ref.
    
    BIFFO
    

>    Here is another prediction: when Limerick get their comeuppance, there
>    will be moans about the ref.

If we are beaten, we are beaten.  What I do mind is what happened in 1994.

>    That about sums up the Limerick 'strategy' alright. Act the goat and
>    hope for frees from the 'right sort' of referee. It sucks. 

It's either give away a free or give away a score.

BIFFO, that cross looks to be getting very heavy.  Why don't you just cast
it off before it gets too much for you?

                        James.

    >>BIFFO, that cross looks to be getting very heavy.  Why don't you just
    >>cast it off before it gets too much for you ?
   
    Ah when tings get really bad, and depression sets in, and I can't take
    it any longer, I go comatose  and you'd think it would take a severe
    dose of the auld ect's to get me going at all ...
    
    All I need is reminding of the last 7 minutes of 94 and I pick up in a
    trice. But James, I tell you, it is going to happen AGAIN!!!

>    All I need is reminding of the last 7 minutes of 94 and I pick up in a
>    trice. But James, I tell you, it is going to happen AGAIN!!!

Jusus, there must be only one record in the whole of BIFFOland and I've
now heard it K's of times :-(.

                          James.

    Sorry boss

A Draw !!!

:-)

What are the odds ??

keVin

[Posted by WWW Notes gateway]

    about 12/1 is standard for a draw.

Don't waste your Monet/money keV!  We all know who will win :-).

    You're gettin bould again James. In .83 you were prepared to entertain
    the possibility of another bummer for the Limerick fans:
    
    >>If we are beaten, we are beaten.
    
    Let's face it, the ghost of '94 stalks the Limerick psyche, there will
    always be a nagging doubt, a little bit of uncertainty, that it will
    happen again. That's why you are so full of bluster now, you are trying
    to exorcise the ghost, but it's no good James. '94 wasn't a dream, it
    really happened, a five point lead, gone like the snow on a warm day in
    a few seconds. Face up to it now, for your own good. See the truth, see
    the light. Wexford will win.....
    
    BIFFO 
         

>    You're gettin bould again James. In .83 you were prepared to entertain
>    the possibility of another bummer for the Limerick fans:
>    
>    >>If we are beaten, we are beaten.

As one of my many personal names once said: "Only fools and fanatics 
are certain, the rest of us aren't sure".  I'm neither a fool (some 
say I am, but that's beside the point) or a fanatic (moot point: I'm a
Limerick Hurling fan) so some doubt will always have to be entertained. 
Saying that, I don't believe there is a team out there (there is, after 
all, only one left) that has the beating of Limerick this year.

My comment in .83 concerned the impact of the referee on the game.  We
have been a little lucky with some of the refereeing decisions upto
now.  Saying that, you have to be in the situation to take advantage
of them too, which we have been, thankfully. 

>    Let's face it, the ghost of '94 stalks the Limerick psyche, there will 
>    always be a nagging doubt, a little bit of uncertainty, that it will 
>    happen again. That's why you are so full of bluster now, you are trying 

I won't disagree with you, but we aren't playing Offaly, remember.  We
are playing a team who are very new to the All-Ireland scene.  They
are _more_ likely to freeze than we are on the day, given the relative
progress/success of both teams over the past 3 years.  I am confident
that Limerick will not stumble, primarily because what happened (neck
on the chopping block again) in 1994 will *not* ever happen again.   
Wexford of 1996 are not Offaly of 1994.

What are you going to do now, BIFFO, as this could be my last note
here for 3 weeks.  I'm going into a secret camp in preparation for the
1 September encounter.  I've been trying to coax the other Limerick
man whom I work with to contribute here but he is frightened of you
and your vicious anti-Limerick rhetoric ;-). 

                          James.

    vicious ???
    
    this is a variation on the begrudgery theme ...
    
    Let me say I feel motivated by the highest sporting sentiments. :-)
    Liam is a fine trophy, and it would be a pity if a mediocre team were
    to win it :-)
    
    Clare did not freeze on the day last year, so why should Wexford this
    year. They played well to beat Offaly, and they didn't let Galway
    hassle them. 
    
    We shall see.  I look forward to meeting you here on 2. September, that
    is if you ever dare to reemerge from your secret hideout :-)
    
    BIFFO

    
    
    Good to see Tipp will be in the minor match..means a rightous and
    proper team will grace the holy sod on sept 1. 
    
    I was shocked at the Thuggery of the limerick men against
    Antrim..A Poor referee. Great to see Wexford back though one felt sorry
    for Galway..(for the odd second or two...)
    
    Think Limerick will swing this one though..unless kirby has an off day.
    
    
    
     

     >>Think Limerick will swing this one though
    
    Oh no dey won't!
    
    I think it's wot you don't want to give up the fags Mick :-)
    
    I'll race you up Croagh Patrick if Wexford win!

    re: the right sort of referee for the crowtown kid, the GAA has done
    the decent thing and appointed an Offaly man :-)
    
    BIFFO

    Was on my way back from Waterford last Sunday evening. The road was
    blocked, with traffic, in Ballyhale in Kilkenny. There was a club
    hurling match on. As I could not get through I abandoned the car and
    went to the match.
    
    The hurling was rasonably good. However the highlight of the evening
    was a drunk who decided to streak onto the pitch. He did his best to
    get the referee to join him (streaking). Eventually to cheers and
    jeers from the crowd he was hemoved by officials.
    
    Anyway he decided to come back. This time he came to close to Christy
    Heffernan (Ex Kilkenny hurler). Christy obviously did not take kindly
    to the second interruption. There was a loud slap as hurley met bare
    flesh. I can still feel the pain of that!!!!!!!!!!!!.
    
    Our friend then went and put his clothes on and interrupted again. This
    time he was manhandled out of the ground - followed by about 500
    youngsters cheering and jeering.
    
    All together a most entertaining evening.
    
    MBr 

    >>However the highlight of the evening
    >was a drunk who decided to streak onto the pitch. He did his best
    >to get the referee to join him (streaking)
    
    It sounds like a Limerick man has broken out of that secret camp to me
    :-) We have heard all about their referee 'strategy' :-)

    >BIFFO, you truly must be a man made of money (and you say you are a
    >full-timer around here) if you think Meath and Wexford are going to do
    >the business.  It's got to be Tyrone and Limerick FWIW!
    
    Lest we forget, the Crowtown kid predicted a Tyrone win....I don't
    think he will emerge from his hiding place at all this year :-)
    
    BIFFO

http://www.guinness.ie/hurling/quiz/quiz.html



keVin

[Posted by WWW Notes gateway]

     
    > Test your knowledge of Hurling
      
    At pubs or the pitch?

I've just dropped in to give ye all an update on Sunday's final: all
systems are go down in Limerick.  We fully expect to do the business
over a cocky Wexford outfit.  I predict that Limerick will win by 5
points - 3-12 to 1-13. 

I don't have a ticket yet but will pay whatever it takes to get a
lower Cusack or Hogan.  The ticket situation seems to be very much a
case of the loaves and fishes, but as always the touts will have more
than enough tickets to do a brisk trade on Sunday morning.  I hope to
God I can pick up something before having to bargain with one of those
scumbags. 

I wish I had more time to go into the nitty-gritties of the game but
just don't have the time at the moment; There are two going away
parties I want to go to tonight.  Will the last person out of Digital
please turn off the light! 

Watch for me running onto the field after the final whistle (with my
clothes on - contrary to what BIFFO might have said ;-). 

                James (hopefully not tempting faith).

    
    ..It should be close...Most "neutrals" would favour the Wexford
    men..I always say you can get a ticket on the day...head up around
    MCgraths pub in Drumcondra and see whats happening...I wouldn't go
    looking for tickets early...Then again if you want to see some real
    hurling style you would want to go to the Minor game..beacuse Tipperary
    are playing...bringing a sense of respect to the whole proceedings
    
    Should be a good one.....
    
    Mick
    

    Mick,
    
    The words "Tipperary,respect and Hurling" do not compute. I am looking
    forward to a great game. It does not really matter who wins as Hurling
    will be the overall winner after a fantastic year.
    
    B.T.W. anyone know where the U21 Hurling is being played on Sunday week.
    Usually this is a great encounter also. 
    
    MBr  

    Morning folks,
    
    how are ye all today???  There is quite a lot to discuss isn't there
    ???
    
    See ya later
    
    BIFFO

    Official match report and analysis
    
    A pathetic Limerick side were pushed aside easily by Wexford yesterday.
    Noting how things were heading for a 20-40 point Wexford win, the ref
    tried to even things up by sending off a Wexford man before half-time.
    Playing 15-14 Wexford stayed in command to win comfortably by two
    points. Limerick flagged as usual in the second half as their impending
    defeat became more and more obvious.
    
    The remarkable thing is that some people seriously expected Limerick to
    win. BIFFO had heaps of abuse poured on him before the match, simply
    for pointing out the all too obvious Limerick weaknesses and betting on
    a Wexford Meath double at odds of 36/1, now down to 4/9 !! The capacity
    of the crowtown kid to delude himself seems infinite. I feel he has no
    real knowlege of the sport, and wouldn't even know what a google or a
    chinaman is, so lacking in respect for cricket as he is. 
    
    One positive thing is that Keyes must now give up smoking. It is
    doubtful whether a Tipperary trollop will have the will-power for this,
    but we shall see. 
    
    That fine and shrewd commentator Mr Cashman of course right predicted
    a Wexford victory. He also has been subject to abuse and hatemail from
    predictable quarters. 
    
    Munster hurling generally is the pits, Leinster is where it is played
    at the highest level.
    
    BIFFO the vindicated

when BIFFO comes down to commiserate with me over yesterday.

Will Limerick ever win Liam?  Maybe not in my lifetime.

A lengthy report will follow in due course detailing my pre- 
and post- match thoughts.  It will also detail my newspaper
and radio odysseys (did anyone hear me on Pat Kenny this 
morning or see my letter in the Limerick Leader last weekend?)

James.

    
    
    >(did anyone hear me on Pat Kenny this morning)
    
    ..Christ things must be really really bad...If ye Limerick folks are
     talking to Pat Kenny ye (a) Deserve to be beat and (b) Need serious help..
    
    I Thought it was an excellent days hurling...A Credit to the tradition
    of hurling .Excellent game with 2 very skillful teams....Either team
    could have won it at the end. Looking forward to the replay.
    
    re the second match...Tough on Limerick...Seems to be that they were
    carrying Kirby...Though looked like he got a finger injury early on..
    Wexford conceeded very few frees...Now Tipp were beaten By them I don't
    know. That said I can't for the like of me understand why Limericks
    goal was dissallowed. One of the highlights was the goalkeeping display
    some amazing saves...
    
    The sending off incident could have seen a Limerick man go
    also..Throwing the ball in on the 21 after that incident was bound to
    cause trouble..worse than smoking NEar a CHap THAts  T R Y ING very
    hard..Sad really to see such thuggery at this level..Come of think
    of it Wexford win the hurling with a Thug element..and Meath are....
    Interesting How an Offaly man would pick up on such tactics early
    ..must be in the blood...
    
    Wexford should be a Hot place for the next few weeks...Limerick must be
    wondering what happens now..I suppose they could ask Cregan to come and
    train them next year -) -) -) hehehehehheeh..  Pat kenny...Lord have
    mercy!
    
    slainte
    
    Mick
    
    
    
    
                                
    
    
    
    

    Now don't you say anything against the Kenny's you faggot. My
    grandmother was a Kenny from Athlone and her mother was a Kenny who
    married a Kenny. I believe yer man is a tenth cousin, removed 3
    times...

    ...nooooooo...  It gets worse..WESTMEATH blood surfacing...watery pink
    westmeath blood...
    
    mick
    
    (uh...married to a kenny)
    
     
    
    
    

    Who said anything about the West Meath side of town ? Get your
    geography right, for goodness sake man! It is easy enough to know where
    the boundary is.

    
    
    Wrong note but West of the Shannon is where Sam will reside for the
    next 12 months.
    
    Yes it's coming home to Mayo!
    
    Des.

    
    Des,
    
    lets get down to it.....Any tickets?...Are the Mayo folk hopeful?.
    Nothing would please me better than to see those leinster savages
    hammered...(with the exception of somebody sinking a large borehole
    around Tullamore and sucking in all of offaly)
    
    >Who said anything about the West Meath side of town ? 
    
    Surely your not ..no....saying you have clan on that side of
    the town..Isn't that why the built the by-pass???..So that we could
    drive without getting a spear of something through your head...Dangerous 
    place.
    
    Mick
    
    

    Well it would be great to see Sam come West, but the form is not good
    is it ? The Dubs hammered Leitrim last year didn't they? This is an
    important question for me as I am thinking of having a hefty saver on
    Mayo as I stand to win a nice bundle on Meath.  So is it your heart or
    your head speaking Des ?
    
    Kevin

    re.112
    
    Mick,
    
    Mayo folk are very hopeful and with good reason.
    The reasons to be cheerful are: 
    Meath will be favorites and that has to be good news.  
    The Mayo team are big, physical but fair, and are extremely fit(they have
    won most of their games in the last 10 minutes).
    Mayo have years of humiliation to live down and overcome and 
    we see this is the perfect oppertunity to do so and cheer up the whole 
    country at the same time by beating, probably narrowly, this pig ignorant
    Meath team.
    
    As regards tickets they are scarcer than hobby horses s&^t. But I'm banking
     on de brudder in Chicago to deliver the goods or the cousin in Rio de
    Janeiro. So it's not looking too good at the minute.
    
    Kevin,
    
    Congrats on your winnings so far but I strongly advise a saver cos I'd
    hate to see your hard earned gains go back into Paddy Powers pocket.
    Dublin did indeed do it to Leitrim last year but that was then.
    Galway dispached Leitrim with ease this year and were themselves sent on 
    their merry way in the Connacht final. Mayo have beaten Meath already this
    year in the League quarter final so they are well capable of doing it again.
    Mayo have lost only 1 yes 1 competitive match since John Maughan took
    over as manager a year ago. That was to Derry in the League semi final.
    So we have a team that hates to lose. 
    
    This Mayo team are young, eager, hungery and desperate to win and they
    will never get a better chance of bringing Sam over the Shannon..
    
    
    Des 
    

Comment by Mick McCarthy the Irish Soccer manager on yesterday's Hurling 
Final "I have just realised that I spent the last 20 years playing a 
game for patsies" He was there with Alan Evans and thoroughily enjoyed 
it.

Liam Griffin was in Kilkenny for a while on Friday night. The local 
smart-asses in the bar in Hotel Kilkenny presented him with a few hurleys. 
The joke was that they couldn't even make proper hurleys in Wexford. 
That joke has rebounded with a vengenance. 

Wexford managed to out psyche Limerick even before the throw in. 
Limerick lost whatever neutral support they had by breaking from the 
parade early. Wexford held their nerve and got a great cheer from the 
Hill for it. It showed very early on the discpline of this Wexford team.   
Even when they had a man sent off (in my opinion 2 should have walked) 
they held their nerve and completely tied up limerick in the second 
half.

Limerick's game plan all year depended on winning centre field, centre 
back and centre forward. With Liam Dunne playing a blinder at centre 
back and George O'Connor using his strength at centre field this plan 
was completely disrupted. Martin Storey held his own at centre forward 
agains Ciaran Carey so Limerick were straight away on the back pedal. What 
a hurley Liam Dunne is. He was, by a long shot, the finest exponent of the 
skills on display yesterday. I also enjoyed Adrian Fenlon's lovely crisp 
first-time hurling. Sean O'Neill made the mistake of trying to mix it with 
George O'Connor. Those of us who have watched Leinster hurling for as long as 
George played know not to do that. I would say he had his fingers badly 
smashed. Same for Eoin o Neill and John O'Connor. All things considered Wexford 
backs gave away very few frees so no free points for Gary Kirby.


RE: Minor match.

Tipp are very slow learners. The way to win in hurling is to build up a 
large lead - and hold on to it. Tipp seem to have learned the first part. 
Now all they need is a few years to learn the second bit.

Good minor final BTW. Better hurling than in the senior but that is 
often the way.

U21 is on in Thurles on Sunday. That should be another classic. Am 
looking forward to it.

MBr

    re Meath and Mayo, I am now thinking very hard about a saver on Mayo.
    Geez, they were 20/1 a few weeks ago. Still 7/4 is not bad. Maybe I
    will punt on the draw. Now I am curious to know what the crowtown kid
    thinks about this, it will help me make up my mind :-) So if you could
    dry your eyes and quit sulking James, what is your line on the
    football?
    
    BIFFO 

    
    What Philistine introduced football into a hurling node. That game is
    only played by BIFFOS and uncouth Dubs and Kerrymen.
    
    Mick Keyes -are you going to man the barricades and keep those unruly
    mobs out of Thurles on Sunday. Now thats a cause worth fighting for.
    
    MBr 

    
    ...Hard..its very hard to come to term with wexford folk and galway
    folk threading the fair lands of Tipp...I hope they get sprayed comming
    over the border..a bit of DDT down the back colar....
    
    Might make it...Should be Good..Thats galway in the U21, Minor (for a
    while)..and the Junior all-ireland finals...The last few U-21 finals
    have been classics...They should televise them...very skillfull.
    
    Only problem about going is there is a Football match been played also in 
    Thurles ..on the same pitch too. Thing is Cavan are in it. so we got a call
    from the neigbours below to help round up the cattle and sheep and move
    them up the mountains..
    
    rgs,
    
    mick
    the  
    
    

    Well, James has predicted the Royal county will win by ten points so
    that settles it, I'll be having a big bet on Mayo :-)
    
    As for dangerous places Mick, my great uncle John Kenny was part of the
    Athlone brigade which dumped a spy in a sack outside the barracks in
    Athlone, down by the river on the Connaught side. The spy had been
    seen coming out of the Bridewell and had confessed to informing.  Mind
    you at that time the Brits had a policy of executing volunteers so they
    had no choice. They gave him the last rites before shooting him. John
    spent time in Pentonville, Frongoch and Maidstone.  So be very careful
    what you say and where you go boy ....
    
    As for spraying DDT, will you please try and keep it organic.  I'm
    afraid your brain is completely addled from dipping sheep with dem
    organo-phosphates..
    
    I'm off to Leitrim for the weekend. Anyone for golf in Ballinamore ?
                                                                   
    
    Kevin

    
    Well its time for a bit of Hurling action. I was beginning to get cabin
    fever.
    
    Camross meet Athenry on Sunday in Thurles. This should be interesting -
    especially if the weather stays dry. I think I will take myself down to
    Thurles on Sunday and watch a few hurleys being broken.
    
    I havent seen Athenry for a few years. Camross on the other hand were
    going well before Xmas. Could be a tough one. As the saying goes there
    is lots of timber in Camross.

    
    Not much use for timber in camross after yesterday...Athenry gave them
    a hammering. maybe sign of things to come in leinster Hurling..
    Weather was horrible though....
    
    Good to see the clare boys still hanging in there...They need a good
    hammering
        
    rgs
    
    mick

    Yes,
    
    I was down at it. Semple Stadium resembled a paddy field. I do not know
    how anyone even held a hurley let alone played. I know I needed about 3
    Hot whiskeys jost to thay out. 
    
    Athenry were bigger and stronger. They also did whatever hurling was
    done. Camross would probably have been just about in it at half time
    (after playing against a gale) except for a freak goal. The ball was
    going wide bot the wind caught it and turned it back into the net. The
    goalie was outside the goal waving the ball wide -). That left camross
    9 points down instead of 6.
    
    
    In the second half Athenry took over complete control. In fact Camross
    only got 2 scores playing with the gale. On yesterday's performance
    Athenry will be hard to stop. This was a fine team splendidly
    marshalled from the half back line.  

    The cidonatown kid, aka the author of this basenote, reports that he
    was awoken in the night by rowdies outside his home in Athenry coming
    back from beating the Wolftones from Clare. Wus anyone at the game?
    
    BIFFO

    Yup,
    
    Athenry were by far the better team. However like all Galway teams they
    did not put the opposition away. Shooting 10 or 12 wides - many of them
    scorable was the root cause of this. 
    
    Nice young full forward in Clooney. You may remember he was the one who
    was blackguarded by the Tipp full back in last years minor All-Ireland.
    He scored over hal;f of Athenry's total, even though he was marked by
    Brian Lohan the Clare full back. Lohan resorted to use of the hurley
    butt but it didnt work.
    
    Well done Athenry a good win.

    
    Clooney a good player though a bit soft for inter county hurling.
    The Tipp players gave him a few taps ok in the all-ireland last year.
    
    ...nothing personal but the days when Silvie linanne was around
   are remembered down tipp way..and a few lessons still need to be
    exchanged now and a again
    
      time will tell with Galway this year...
    

    Saw that young blackguard full back from Tipp again yesterday. Willie
    Meagher is his name. This time he was full back in the colleges
    championship for St. Kierans College.
    
    He was badly beaten and had 2-4 scored against him. Those Wexford boys
    know how to deal with the likes of him-).
    
    Incidentally it was a superb colleges match played in ideal conditions
    in New Ross. New Ross won it by 3 points. 
    
    MBr  

    Clare led Offaly all the way on Sunday and won comfortably.
    Didn't get to the game as we hit it down to Kerry for the weekend.
    
    My feeling is that Ger Loughnane wants to bring liam back to Clare
    again, and he won't get fluked out of it by Limerick like last time.
    
    So my long rang forecast for the hurling is a semi final lineup of
    
    Clare Galway Offaly Antrim.  Is it Munster-Connaught Leinster-Ulster
    for the semis this year? 
    
    We could be in for another Clare-Offaly final.
    
    BIFFO
    
     
    
    

    
    ..I wouldn't be putting a bet on that semi-final line up..unless you
    are getting 500-1 or something similar...New rules this year so doubt
    if Antrim will make it...(losers of Munster and Leinster get back in.
    Not sure who they meet..or if its even possible to have an ALL munster
    final this year?)
    
    rgs
    
    mick

    So what are the new rules ??

    Loser in Munster final meets Galway.		A
    
    Loser in Leinster final meet Antrim.                B
    
    winner of A meets winner of Leinster Final
    
    Winner of B meets winner of Munster final.
    
    
    I think thats it but may have the first 2 matches in wrong order.
    
    
    
    

    Well, having checked out the home pages of Cork and Wexford,
     Ofally could face the downhill task of beating Kilkenny twice, 
    but we won't get it that easy, as Clare will stuff them in the semis.
    
    BIFFO 

    
    So we could have an All munster/all leinster final...Intersting hurling
    ahead..with the league qtr and semis also played during the
    championship. 
    
    What happened at the Grand national yesterday?..Looked to me like
    that 2nd placed horse won it.. ever hear of Harbour leader or high
    Society..chap told me they would win to-day??
    
    ahh..nice to keep this notes conference consistent...any greyhound
    news?
    
    Mick

    >>any greyhound
        news?
    
    me da used to have a dog called Lotties Ring, in fact he was at Catford
    watching her the day I was born. She was a license to print money till
    she broke her hock. 
    
    Don't care for them much myself.
    
    BIFFO

    
    Good wins yesterday for Tipperary, Kilkenny,Offaly and even limerick
    Good to see the Dubs on a good run also..
    
    Good be a good year for Tipp... A championship to win and Lowry
    to get booted out..(I never really considered Holycross part of
    Tipp anway 

    There is a photo on the wall here of Liam Cosgrave attending the
    opening of Digital in Galway and guess who the rookie td standing in
    the background is? Yer Tipp TD himself, the man who can't remember who
    paid for his home extension. But will de voters in Tipp do the job or
    not??>?
    
    BIFFO
    
    PS what was his position on divorce/contraception family values etc ?
    We should be told