| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 1490.1 | AMF | TINCUP::AGUE | DTN-592-4939, 719-598-3498(SSL) | Fri Jul 28 1995 00:17 | 3 |
| So Ian, did the door hit your butt on the way out?
-- Jim
|
| 1490.2 | | SUFRNG::REESE_K | tore down, I'm almost level with the ground | Tue Aug 01 1995 18:54 | 10 |
| Ian,
Many of us were excited to find this conference thinking we could
learn more about our Celtic heritage, only to find that the conf-
erence has descended primarily into diatribes (for the most part)
about the "troubles" in NI :-(
I hoped to learn more about my Welsh heritage, but info about the
Welsh has been few and far between.
|
| 1490.3 | WWW links to Welsh info | IRNBRU::PHILLIPS | | Wed Aug 02 1995 06:53 | 14 |
|
Here are a few WWW links for Wales (there are loads more floating around
on the net).
http://www.yahoo.com/Regional_information/Countries/United_Kingdom/Wales/
http://www.ihi.aber.ac.uk/Wales/wales.html
http://www.data-wales.co/uk/
http://cs6400.mcc.ac.uk/genuki/big/wal/
http://www.comlab.ox.ac.uk/oucl/users/geraint.jones/cwrs-cymraeg/welsh.html
Trevor.
|
| 1490.4 | non-celt's point of view | VARESE::FRANZONI | loose, chippings 20 mph | Wed Aug 02 1995 09:34 | 20 |
| .2> Many of us were excited to find this conference thinking we could
.2> learn more about our Celtic heritage, only to find that the conf-
.2> erence has descended primarily into diatribes (for the most part)
.2> about the "troubles" in NI :-(
I agree the name for this conference is probably wrong and "Ireland"
would be more apropriate... but indeed that was exactly was I looked
for just before my first access here.
I have no Celtic heritage (who knows ! Italy has been occupied by so
many cultures - and after my first sip of that dark thing I felt so
`at home' ;-) and I don't mean to hurt any Celt, yet it's Ireland the
country I love.
And, UNFORTUNATELY, NI's troubles _are_ part of Ireland. And Ireland is
a Celt country.
And, all in all, you can find many many more (and more celtic) things here.
mf
|
| 1490.5 | celt view point | KERNEL::BARTHUR | | Wed Aug 02 1995 10:23 | 11 |
|
Well I think anybody who lives in the Uk or Ireland or who is related
to one or the other, ought to have a great deal of interest in what
this conference does. You don't have to agree with anybody or anything
that's said and often in here, it's the things that remain not said
which are the most important!
The conference content would of course be different if there wasn't a
civil war going on in NI!
IMHO
Bill
|
| 1490.6 | In other words, give others equal time :-) | SUFRNG::REESE_K | tore down, I'm almost level with the ground | Wed Aug 02 1995 19:09 | 20 |
| I've tried to make this point before; I don't have a problem with
the NI situation being discussed in here, but couldn't that particular
discussion be confined to a few topics? That way, those of us who
are not interested in that situation could save wear and tear on our
NEXT UNSEEN key!!
I mentioned it some time back that I referred a co-worker to this
conference because she was looking for some specific info on obtaining
information for Gaelic inscriptions for wedding bands. She came back
and said she gave up because all she could find was topic after topic
with endless postings on the British/NI problem.
Other conferences confine discussions on specific topics to specific
notes; why can't that be attempted here?
It has nothing to do with agreement or disagreement on the NI
situation; I just don't see the need for that topic to dominate a
conference that initially was supposed to be dedicated to topics of
interest of to ALL good people of varied Celtic heritage.
|
| 1490.7 | | GYRO::HOLOHAN | | Thu Aug 03 1995 09:26 | 10 |
| >It has nothing to do with agreement or disagreement on the NI
>situation; I just don't see the need for that topic to dominate a
>conference that initially was supposed to be dedicated to topics of
>interest of to ALL good people of varied Celtic heritage.
>
Could you please use an existing topic complaining about this, so
I can more easily hit next unseen to skip it.
Thanks,
Mark
|
| 1490.8 | Hmmm | TALLIS::DARCY | Alpha Migration Tools | Thu Aug 03 1995 10:49 | 23 |
| RE: .6
Hi (Karen is it?),
If you do a "DIR LAST-1", you will find the majority of base topics are
not NI related. As of the past year, noters are generally doing a
relatively good job of placing notes of related interest into the
appropriate base notes.
If your friend wants to find a note of particular topic, all she
has to do is "DIR/TITLE=GAELIC" for example.
I don't have the time to heavily regulate this conference. The only
thing I ask of noters is no foul language or personal name calling.
And besides, I don't want it going the way of some of the other
conferences, where every Northern Ireland topic (whatever it may be)
gets relegated to one base note, in effect, hidden under the carpet.
There is much more to Northern Ireland (and Ireland and the greater
Celt community) than the conflict in NI. But I cannot dictate people's
interests.
George
|
| 1490.9 | | TALLIS::DARCY | Alpha Migration Tools | Thu Aug 03 1995 10:56 | 106 |
| * NI Related
...in this particular sampling 19 out of 91 base notes refer to NI.
It is a significant percentage, though not overwhelming or
surprising, given the realities of the conflict...
/George
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Celt Notefile
Created: 19-FEB-1986 18:27 1491 topics Updated: 3-AUG-1995 09:49
Topic Author Date Repl Title
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* 1491 TALLIS::DARCY 31-JUL-1995 0 More money for NI
* 1490 FABSIX::I_GOLDIE 27-JUL-1995 8 ignorance and bigotry.
1489 STOWOA::COADY 25-JUL-1995 0 Oscar Wilde (some of his many quotes)
1488 MROA::NADAMS 25-JUL-1995 7 Win a country cottage in Ireland
1487 QUARK::LIONEL 23-JUL-1995 8 Barrys Gold Blend tea source?
* 1486 TAGART::EDDIE 21-JUL-1995 10 UN takles Britain over civil rights
1485 SIOG::OSULLIVAN_D 3-JUL-1995 1 Gordon Wilson
1484 SIOG::BRENNAN_M 29-JUN-1995 1 New Viking Site discovered
* 1483 GYRO::HOLOHAN 28-JUN-1995 0 South African inquiry on arms for loyalists
* 1482 KERNEL::BARTHUR 28-JUN-1995 2 disarming agreement
1481 FUTURS::DUGGAN 28-JUN-1995 4 Festivals '95
1480 MAIL1::GLENNON 7-JUN-1995 0 Wolfstone
1479 BONKIN::BOYLE 5-JUN-1995 6 Goodbye
1478 CTHQ::ROGERS 2-JUN-1995 13 Traveling Around by Public Transportation
1477 CTHQ::COADY 31-MAY-1995 3 Gaelic Football boots vs. Soccer Boots !
1476 CBHVAX::CBH 31-MAY-1995 4 Inhabitants of the ancient kingdoms
1475 24-MAY-1995 12 Shannon to Dublin
* 1474 GYRO::HOLOHAN 16-MAY-1995 21 Good news U.S. aid tied to code of non-discrimination
1473 XSTACY::JLUNDON 27-APR-1995 1 Irish stereotypes
1472 CTHQ::COADY 19-APR-1995 17 Irish Pub in Stow MA.
1471 MKOTS3::SEIFERT 13-APR-1995 2 Boston/Dublin
1470 PEKING::SULLIVAND 6-APR-1995 33 Irish immigrants' life-expectancy
1469 DBC146::ROELS 4-APR-1995 7 Ireland - Bed and Breakfast
1468 XSTACY::JLUNDON 4-APR-1995 2 Ernest Gebler
1467 TAGART::EDDIE 4-APR-1995 14 BBC is banned in Scotland
1466 CTHQ::COADY 3-APR-1995 13 Riverdance questions!
1465 CTHQ::COADY 29-MAR-1995 7 Glasgow info (late Aug/early Sept)
1464 TALLIS::DARCY 28-MAR-1995 7 Take yer lumpers...
1463 DBC146::ROELS 22-MAR-1995 7 Irish Pubs
1462 XSTACY::JLUNDON 13-MAR-1995 9 Anti-Gaelic article
1461 LANDO::ODONNELL 9-MAR-1995 2 St. Pat's Day in Worcester, Mass.
1460 MKOTS3::SEIFERT 7-MAR-1995 13 St. Patricks Day in Boston
1459 FUTURS::DUGGAN 28-FEB-1995 4 Tipperary Grave ?
* 1458 YUPPY::MCGETTRICKS 23-FEB-1995 1 Framework document
1457 DDIF::VONSUCK 22-FEB-1995 0 Cherish the Ladies, 3/17/95
1456 MROA::DUPUIS 20-FEB-1995 7 Looking for someone in Ireland who can help me....
1455 45807::SULLIVAND 17-FEB-1995 1 Scottish placename derivations
* 1454 KOALA::HOLOHAN 6-FEB-1995 26 War criminal to be honored by Boston College
* 1453 KOALA::HOLOHAN 2-FEB-1995 17 Report predicts move to a united Ireland
1452 TALLIS::DARCY 1-FEB-1995 6 Noel Henry
1451 POLAR::RUSHTON 31-JAN-1995 0 St. James Church Destroyed
1450 impero::Isabello 25-JAN-1995 3 Dec agreement
* 1449 KOALA::HOLOHAN 24-JAN-1995 11 Policing the police
* 1448 KERNEL::BARTHUR 24-JAN-1995 7 MP's Demand Release Of Para
1447 CTHQ::COADY 9-JAN-1995 1 Secret World of Irish Male !; any details ?
1446 CTHQ::COADY 3-JAN-1995 1 Phone/Fax # required
1445 ESSB::PBUTLER 28-DEC-1994 9 The real issues
1444 MSGAXP::MORGAN 12-DEC-1994 6 Celtic Music
1443 AYOV10::KKEARY 6-DEC-1994 17 Train from Dublin to Galway
1442 PAKORA::AMCGREGOR 1-DEC-1994 1 A Buckfast ballad
1441 TALLIS::DARCY 1-DEC-1994 3 tele tax
1440 SISDA::HURLEY 1-DEC-1994 6 Poques Christmas Song?
1439 BELFST::MCCOMB 30-NOV-1994 2 1/2 price Booze !
1438 ESSB::DMCHUGH 29-NOV-1994 0 A Wet Weekend in the West of Ireland...........
1437 EXPDEC::JHUSSEY 28-NOV-1994 5 Celtic Music Week in Glasgow
1436 TALLIS::DARCY 28-NOV-1994 7 Maggie's Coat of Arms (couldn't resist :v))
1435 BELFST::MCCOMB 25-NOV-1994 6 Celt HAMRADIO anyone?
1434 BELFST::MCCOMB 24-NOV-1994 8 Local Irish Humour
1433 AYOV25::FSPAIN 17-NOV-1994 3 Albert No More
1432 CTHQ::COADY 16-NOV-1994 6 DEC in Dublin ?
1431 POOKY::OROURKE 16-NOV-1994 10 Christmas 1994 Party note
1430 AYOV25::FSPAIN 15-NOV-1994 4 Time to go
* 1429 BELFST::MCCOMB 10-NOV-1994 63 CEASEFIRE ENDS???
* 1428 KOALA::HOLOHAN 27-OCT-1994 0 STATE OF EMERGENCY TO END IN SOUTH
1427 TALLIS::DARCY 18-OCT-1994 1 RTE on satellite...
* 1426 AYOV20::MRENNISON 13-OCT-1994 4 Imminent Loyalist Ceasefire
1425 TALLIS::DARCY 12-OCT-1994 0 Famine talk in Worcester
1424 TALLIS::DARCY 12-OCT-1994 0 Tallis down-time & net net address
1423 TALLIS::DARCY 10-OCT-1994 0 Irish-American on-line newspaper
1422 OPENED::LIBOVE 6-OCT-1994 0 Standards of Living (Ireland and Northern Ireland)
* 1421 BONKIN::BOYLE 6-OCT-1994 11 Republic govt. addressing loyalist fears?
1420 BONKIN::BOYLE 2-OCT-1994 9 Halloween games
1419 PH6VAX::AELAWLOR 30-SEP-1994 15 Morning Ireland and Nuacht on the internet
1418 TALLIS::DARCY 26-SEP-1994 1 Irish Resurgence?
1417 CUPMK::AHERN 22-SEP-1994 5 Evidence of confusion
1416 WREATH::AHERN 21-SEP-1994 0 I'm a Freeborn Man...
1415 ABACUS::MACDONALD_M 20-SEP-1994 3 Tattoos in Celtic History
1414 RUTILE::AUNGIER 15-SEP-1994 6 Adieu, El Gringo is downsized (even smaller)
1413 GAVEL::TREND 14-SEP-1994 1 Highland Games NH-USA 9/17
1412 CTHQ::ROGERS 13-SEP-1994 7 Converting PAL Videotape to NTSC Format
1411 RANGER::HORGAN 12-SEP-1994 0 1994 Comhaltas Concert of Champions
1410 AIMHI::SEIFERT 9-SEP-1994 13 Irish Pubs in NH?
1409 YUPPY::BLAKEB 9-SEP-1994 5 Strange question! Song name Translation
1408 TALLIS::DARCY 8-SEP-1994 3 Help with florist number...
1407 TRP109::Chris 7-SEP-1994 3 Travel tips please
1406 ADISSW::SMYTH 2-SEP-1994 6 The last post....
* 1405 KOALA::HOLOHAN 31-AUG-1994 228 British Ceasefire
* 1404 AYOV20::MRENNISON 31-AUG-1994 79 IRA Ceasefire
1403 TALLIS::DARCY 25-AUG-1994 2 Can someone post yesterdays lotto numbers?
1402 MROA::NADAMS 16-AUG-1994 4 Dublin -- theatre festival, etc.
* 1401 ESSB::PBUTLER 27-JUL-1994 21 Sinn Fein response
* 1400 KOALA::HOLOHAN 25-JUL-1994 76 Loyalist gangs step up mainland crime.
|
| 1490.10 | Minor Fix | TALLIS::DARCY | Alpha Migration Tools | Thu Aug 03 1995 11:21 | 5 |
| Actually, Eddie McInally has pointed out 1486 is about Scotland,
so the percentage is 18 out of 91 base notes.
Rgds,
/George
|
| 1490.11 | | CBHVAX::CBH | Lager Lout | Thu Aug 03 1995 13:44 | 5 |
| > so the percentage is 18 out of 91 base notes.
that's not a percentage. 19.8% is though. :)
Chris$pedant.
|
| 1490.12 | If only I had to hit next unseen 19.8% of the time.... | JURA::BURKE | Yes, we have no bananas! | Thu Aug 03 1995 14:38 | 132 |
| George,
Okay, so 18/91 notes on "The Troubles" may not be excessive
but as you rightly pointed out, anyone can do a dir/title="".
What is annoying is the traffic in replies to these base notes.
Of the sample you showed (notes 1400-1491), I calculate it's
roughly split this way:
The Troubles 600 replies
Regular topics... 400 replies.
Also, looking back to the previous 100 notes.... (1300-1400)
Topics Replies
The Troubles 30 1200
Regular topics 70 500
Any way you cut it up, postings about the NI conflict
dominate this conference.
If I only had to hit next unseen 19.8% of the time it wouldn't
be so bad, but that's not the case.
Just thought I'd help put things in perspective.
Cheers,
Kevin.
* 1300.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 18-DEC-1993 8 AI report on Diplock Co
1301.0 NYOS01::WALKER 19-DEC-1993 17 Irish Christmas Tradition
1302.0 ADISSW::SMYTH 20-DEC-1993 12 Ireland's World Cup group
1303.0 EICMFG::BINGER 20-DEC-1993 1 Looking for Au Pair.. for
* 1304.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 20-DEC-1993 14 Article from Guardian
1305.0 RUTILE::AUNGIER 21-DEC-1993 0 Summer English School in
* 1306.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 3-JAN-1994 0 Declaration no contribu
* 1307.0 TALLIS::DARCY 4-JAN-1994 30 Britain opposes a unite
* 1308.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 4-JAN-1994 0 Bernadette McAliskey o
1309.0 ACTHUB::BURNS 4-JAN-1994 3 Just the Facts ...
1310.0 ACTHUB::BURNS 4-JAN-1994 24 Limerick Bus Schedule :-
1311.0 VARESE::FRANZONI 5-JAN-1994 10 How much does it cost a h
* 1312.0 SUBURB::FRENCHS 6-JAN-1994 1 Arms shipments to Irela
1314.0 TALLIS::DARCY 7-JAN-1994 3 Raybo writes from Roma
1315.0 YUPPY::MILLARB 11-JAN-1994 2 Paddy Clarke Ha Ha Ha.
* 1316.0 TALLIS::DARCY 11-JAN-1994 38 Ireland to drop politic
* 1317.0 KURMA::SNEIL 13-JAN-1994 2 Security forces release
1318.0 JGODCL::BRUGMAN 17-JAN-1994 0 Diatonic melodeon course
* 1319.0 TALLIS::DARCY 31-JAN-1994 61 To Freedom of Speech
* 1320.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 31-JAN-1994 23 The North's Republicans
1321.0 VARESE::FRANZONI 2-FEB-1994 10 holiday house wanted for
1322.0 STOWOA::KIVLIGHAN 2-FEB-1994 8 Claddagh - Is There a Sto
1323.0 RUTILE::AUNGIER 3-FEB-1994 6 U: Claddagh gold ring nee
1324.0 RUTILE::AUNGIER 3-FEB-1994 2 Summer House & English Cl
* 1325.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 3-FEB-1994 15 Terrorist Ian Paisley s
1326.0 CTHQ::COADY 7-FEB-1994 4 Ireland via electronic ne
* 1327.0 DPCS09::RUSSELL 8-FEB-1994 8 Just my 2 cents worth
* 1328.0 TALLIS::DARCY 9-FEB-1994 52 Evidence of collusion
* 1329.0 KIRKTN::GMCKEE 11-FEB-1994 18 Justice at last for his
* 1330.0 PAKORA::SNEIL 11-FEB-1994 54 3 Evil bombers get 80 y
1331.0 ADISSW::SMYTH 15-FEB-1994 4 Celt World?
* 1332.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 18-FEB-1994 221 SINN FEIN'S QUEST FOR P
1333.0 CTHQ::COADY 18-FEB-1994 19 Irish Passport for US peo
1334.0 HILL16::BURNS 21-FEB-1994 18 Want to own a Pub ??
* 1335.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 21-FEB-1994 1 MI5/MI6 plot exposed by
* 1336.0 ACTHUB::BURNS 21-FEB-1994 256 Joint Declaration on Pe
* 1337.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 24-FEB-1994 17 British Withdrawal sign
* 1338.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 3-MAR-1994 16 Beginners guide to Sinn
1339.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 3-MAR-1994 27 When Ireland Starved
1340.0 SALEM::FLYNN 4-MAR-1994 7 Need a coat of arms
1341.0 RUTILE::AUNGIER 7-MAR-1994 7 St Patrick's Day, Events
* 1342.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 10-MAR-1994 50 Bernadette Devlin McAli
1344.0 TALLIS::DARCY 14-MAR-1994 26 What is reasonable these
* 1345.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 14-MAR-1994 111 British soldier attacks
1346.0 ABACUS::MACDONALD_M 15-MAR-1994 0 Cherish the Ladies ticket
1347.0 TINCUP::AGUE 16-MAR-1994 12 Achill
1348.0 CHEFS::HEELAN 17-MAR-1994 14 Happy St Patrick's Day !
1351.0 XSTACY::LIBOVE 18-MAR-1994 17 Sites to see in the north
* 1349.0 18-MAR-1994 4 Warrington;Slaughter of
1351.0 XSTACY::LIBOVE 18-MAR-1994 17 Sites to see in the north
1352.0 LANDO::ODONNELL 22-MAR-1994 4 Vacation/Family Tree Trip
* 1353.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 24-MAR-1994 12 From Inside a Glass Hou
1354.0 TALLIS::DARCY 24-MAR-1994 5 Galway Newspapers
1355.0 TALLIS::DARCY 24-MAR-1994 16 Irish WWW links
1356.0 TALLIS::DARCY 25-MAR-1994 18 Please gentlemen...
1357.0 ACTGSF::BURNS 25-MAR-1994 7 I smell somthing Fishy he
1358.0 VANGA::KERRELL 28-MAR-1994 7 Irish Cream?
* 1359.0 BELFST::MCCOMB 28-MAR-1994 92 Who has actually been i
1360.0 TALLIS::DARCY 29-MAR-1994 2 Interesting Unemployment
1361.0 NOVA::EASTLAND 29-MAR-1994 14 Suggestion - input wanted
1362.0 TALLIS::DARCY 29-MAR-1994 1 Ullans?
1363.0 ESSB::PBUTLER 30-MAR-1994 3 House Exchange to France
1364.0 TALLIS::DARCY 31-MAR-1994 12 Anyone ever heard of Ment
1365.0 RUTILE::AUNGIER 7-APR-1994 0 U: Computer Weekly et al
1366.0 CTHQ::COADY 7-APR-1994 4 Colleges and Universities
1367.0 ACTGSF::BURNS 14-APR-1994 0 Paddy Culbert via Interne
1368.0 SIOG::OSULLIVAN_D 14-APR-1994 4 Blasket Islands
1369.0 RUTILE::AUNGIER 15-APR-1994 20 VISA status for U.S.A.
1370.0 TALLIS::DARCY 15-APR-1994 4 Official CELT Black Frida
1371.0 ACTGSF::BURNS 21-APR-1994 22 Guinness IS good for you
1372.0 ACTGSF::BURNS 25-APR-1994 1 Dave Barry - Noted humori
* 1373.0 NASZKO::MACDONALD 29-APR-1994 21 John O'Murchu deported
1374.0 ESSB::PBUTLER 3-MAY-1994 0 Balanced Irish news
1375.0 ACTGSF::BURNS 3-MAY-1994 6 Mary Black & Sharon Shann
1376.0 ESSB::PBUTLER 4-MAY-1994 0 More balanced Irish News
1377.0 ESSB::PBUTLER 5-MAY-1994 0 Third day of whats News i
1378.0 TALLIS::DARCY 5-MAY-1994 3 Clari groups changed...
1379.0 BERN01::BYRNE 9-MAY-1994 2 An Post
1380.0 TALLIS::DARCY 9-MAY-1994 1 Clifden Archaeological Si
1381.0 CTHQ::COADY 14-MAY-1994 2 GAO business info needed
1382.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 16-MAY-1994 1 List server for Irish iss
1383.0 VARESE::FRANZONI 19-MAY-1994 12 binoculars prices / birdw
1384.0 AYOV10::KKEARY 23-MAY-1994 17 Tourist in Dublin
1385.0 TALLIS::DARCY 24-MAY-1994 5 Gateway 2000?
1386.0 ADISSW::SMYTH 5-JUN-1994 16 Gaelic Football & Hurling
1387.0 6-JUN-1994 16
1388.0 ACTGSF::BURNS 7-JUN-1994 44 I'm an Ordinary Man !!
1389.0 GIAMEM::FARLEY 10-JUN-1994 13 Ireland in May?
* 1390.0 ESSB::PBUTLER 10-JUN-1994 63 Proper order
1391.0 TALLIS::DARCY 10-JUN-1994 1 Rumor mill
1392.0 STOWOA::OROURKE 20-JUN-1994 20 WORLD CUP 1994
1393.0 KERNEL::BINGHAMK 21-JUN-1994 0 Any Celtic names out ther
1394.0 PERLE::glantz 28-JUN-1994 22 Irish citizenship by marr
* 1395.0 ESSB::PBUTLER 30-JUN-1994 3 Discrimination, weed it
1396.0 ESSB::PBUTLER 1-JUL-1994 3 Irish Refugee Bill
* 1397.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 14-JUL-1994 1 Stalker report suppress
* 1398.0 KOALA::HOLOHAN 18-JUL-1994 4 Interview with Fred Hol
1399.0 CTHQ::COADY 24-JUL-1994 12 Phones questions (US to I
|
| 1490.13 | | SUFRNG::REESE_K | tore down, I'm almost level with the ground | Thu Aug 03 1995 15:04 | 10 |
| George,
I wasn't criticizing the moderation, just asking that others try
to be a little more considerate.
.7 Mark
I rest my case.
|
| 1490.14 | | TALLIS::DARCY | Alpha Migration Tools | Thu Aug 03 1995 15:20 | 36 |
|
Kevin, when you hit the "NEXT UNSEEN" key, notes skips over
all the replies, so it's not as bad as you make it. It's
a heck of lot better than 1 or 2 years ago when there was
a new base note for every NI topic. At least people are
placing notes as replies in the existing base note.
What else can I do? Ban selective people from the conference?
Ban topics relating to NI? Make one big NI note? It just doesn't
work and it doesn't make sense. If there were no conflict in
NI, it would be some other issue - Scottish Independance or
the Sellafield Nuclear Plant e.g.
Concerning NI, my own opinion is that NI *is* a highly emotional
and political topic. I've tried to tread a fine line of allowing
debate without censoring anyone. Though I am completely in opposition
to any form of censorship. And believe that a full solution to the NI
problem will only come from open discussion, debate, negociation and
concessions on all sides. As we have seen from the conference there
are extreme positions on both sides of the issue. We should see them
exactly as that, and works toward understanding the grievances and
issues which make each side so polarized, however difficult that
may be. I truly believe there is a solution to NI - and that is open
communication and the development of trust and goodwill among
all parties.
But please...
- be a bit more sensitive to the other noters in this conference
- post replies to notes where appropriate
- take the mudslinging and name-calling elsewhere
- don't post libelous statements or foul language
- avoid posting long entries (authored elsewhere) where references to
FTP or HTML sites are more appropriate
- if you don't agree with someone - then at least agree to disagree,
end it there, and don't engage in tit-for-tat postings
|
| 1490.15 | | TALLIS::DARCY | Alpha Migration Tools | Thu Aug 03 1995 16:24 | 6 |
| RE: .13
No problem Karen. I'll "second" your statement about being
more considerate. :v)
/George
|
| 1490.16 | | CBHVAX::CBH | Lager Lout | Thu Aug 03 1995 19:08 | 5 |
| I have no problems with the moderation either (if anything, it's too
lenient toward me! :) I'm just the neighbourhood `gets wound up easily'
sort.
Chris.
|
| 1490.17 | | JURA::BURKE | Yes, we have no bananas! | Fri Aug 04 1995 07:17 | 37 |
|
George,
I'm not complaining about the moderation either, I guess what
I'm complaining about is, as usual, Mr. Holohan.
You see, there is nothing wrong with healthy debate, and we should
welcome debate on the Northern situation - we can all learn
and benefit from that.
The problem lies in Mark Holohan stirring it with his highly
objectionable views - anyone can see he supports the IRA.
He rarely lets a day go past without posting some propoganda,
airing his bigoted views or insulting someone.
Of course, people take issue and a never-ending bun-fight ensues.
The result of this is that people who come across this conference
are immediately turned off by the tone and content of much of the
traffic.
I think it's a pity, but we're stuck with him. It's a case of
one person ruining it for everone.
The odd thing is that he probably thinks he is keeping the debate
on NI alive and in the forefront of everyones consciousness.
If so I think it's back-firing on him. I'm not nearly as
anti-republican as I must appear, but I just don't condone violence
as a solution. However, I would never enter into a debate on NI
with Mark around, because there can be no reasoned debate with Mark
around. Just as there can be no reasoned debate with Ian Paisley
around.
Cheers,
Kevin.
|
| 1490.18 | Burke, your note is offensive and in bad taste | GYRO::HOLOHAN | | Fri Aug 04 1995 11:26 | 25 |
|
re.17
Mr. Burke,
I find your personal attack on me offensive. Debate my notes or my ideas
please. You pipe the same tune as the British government when you equate
anyone who is concerned with human rights violations in north east Ireland,
as a supporter of the IRA. I assure you the two are very different.
Human rights reports are not propoganda. Neither are news articles from
AP/RN. They offer another perspective on the situation in north east
Ireland, and can open the eyes of those who only read what the British
government would like them to read.
Mark
P.S.
I fear your association of anyone who speaks out against human rights
violations, as being a "supporter of the IRA" will limit intelligent
debate in this conference. You will scare away anyone who wishes to
discuss these crimes, for fear of being branded as an IRA supporter.
Is this your intention? If so, it's the same type of propoganda the
British government utilizes in it's war.
|
| 1490.19 | | SUFRNG::REESE_K | tore down, I'm almost level with the ground | Fri Aug 04 1995 14:59 | 14 |
| Mark,
Like it or not, Kevin Burke makes a valid point. You think you
are enlightening the rest of us ignorant masses; truth is, you're
turning many off who might otherwise try to follow the situation
and make an educated judgment as to what the REAL truth is.
I've said it before, there is enough blame to go around; nothing is
ever as one-sided as you try to present it. Just because you believe
every word in the lengthy tomes you post does not mean the rest of
us will accept it as gospel.
Sometimes the message does get lost due to the messenger.
|
| 1490.20 | | CBHVAX::CBH | Lager Lout | Fri Aug 04 1995 15:33 | 6 |
| Mr Holohan, I still believe that your claimed interest in human rights
is just another facet of your hate campaign against the British people
as a whole. Your often hypocritical and entirely biased remarks do little
for the credibility of your sources.
Chris.
|
| 1490.21 | Don't like the truth, then "tune out". | GYRO::HOLOHAN | | Mon Aug 07 1995 14:24 | 29 |
|
re. .19, .20.
So, which article did you disagree with? Is it the Amnesty International
reports you don't like? The Helsinki Watch human rights reports? Is it
the Irish Times reports? Is it the White House press releases? Is it
AP/RN? Is this what you call propoganda?
How do you make an "educated judgement"? Do you read? Do you visit and
learn more about a place? Are things like reading, visiting, "turn-offs"
for the "REAL truth" you'd like to learn?
re. .20
>your hate campaign against the British people
I don't hate the British people. How could I. I was born in London. I have
plenty of family members living in London still. Some of them even consider
themselves British. How could I hate them. The answer is of course, that
I don't.
But your and .19's attempt to label as propoganda, news articles from
respected papers, or Human Rights reports from respected organizations,
is transparent. It's folks like you that contribute to the problems in
this world. People who tow the status quo, or parrot the British
government's line.
Mark
|
| 1490.22 | | CBHVAX::CBH | Lager Lout | Mon Aug 07 1995 14:40 | 17 |
| re .21,
I assume you're an intelligent sort of fellow, so I suspect that it isn't
an accidental coincidence that you continually refer to `the British'
rather than `the British government.' As far as accusing you of propaganda,
no matter how reliable the sources are, if they are selected in such a
manner as to make a pointed statement, that is how they are likely to be
received. Being selective with the truth is more dishonest and misleading
than telling outright lies.
This isn't a slagging (okay, new one for me), just a picture of how you
may be misinterpreted assuming your primary aim isn't an anti-British
vendetta.
And as for `towing the party line' of HMG, get real.
Chris.
|
| 1490.23 | Truth=Lie, A Logic Course by a Lager Lout. | GYRO::HOLOHAN | | Mon Aug 07 1995 16:19 | 12 |
|
> Being selective with the truth is more dishonest and misleading
> than telling outright lies.
This has got to be the greatest twist I've ever seen. Now the truth
is more dishonest and misleading than a lie. How does your mind work?
Next you'll be telling me that being selective with a lie is more honest
and straightforward than telling the outright truth.
You really are unbelievable!
Mark
|
| 1490.24 | re .23: typical selectiveness. | CBHVAX::CBH | Lager Lout | Mon Aug 07 1995 18:33 | 11 |
| There's a difference between honesty and partial truth, and between being
misled and lied to. Sorry if you find that such a difficult concept
to grasp, but I'm surprised that you do since this is the basis of
propaganda.
It also seems that attempts to be reasonable with you are a complete
waste of time, which backs up the general feeling that your main purpose
is to stir up hate. What a waste of the resources you use to back yourself
up.
Chris.
|
| 1490.25 | | BAHTAT::DODD | | Tue Aug 08 1995 06:27 | 16 |
| Mark,
I have read the 1994 AI report which you refer to. It does indeed cover
killings by security forces, allegations of collusion between
Government and Loyalists. It also spends considerable time discussing
killings by armed political groups, punishment shootings and beatings
rights abuses by armed groups. It further asserts that over a period of
20 years over half the deaths were the responsibility of republican
groups, a quarter by loyalists and 11% by security forces.
The way in which you refer to this, independent, report it would seem
to be solely critical of government forces. It is not. I feel this to
be misrepresentation, and hence a lot of your postings loose some of
their credibility.
Andrew
|
| 1490.26 | Amen. Someone else who has read an Amnesty report on NI. | GYRO::HOLOHAN | | Tue Aug 08 1995 09:39 | 29 |
|
re. .25
Yes it does. That's why I found it so unbelievable that certain noters
would dispute AI reports, or even try to dismiss them.
You are absolutely correct when you refer to the responsibility also
shared by the Republican and Loyalist communities.
What is your impression though of what the British government is really
up to in north east Ireland? Do you still see them as the "peace-brokers"
separating the "warring Irish" as they have claimed for the past 20 years?
Perhaps this is why the AI report is such an eye-opener. I've heard for
years about the killings being done by Republican and Loyalists, but very
little about the British governments true role in all this. After reading
the reports it became abundantly clear who was pulling the strings in this
conflict, and forcing it to continue. That party is the British forces.
What did you think of the Stalker inquiry, Brian Nelson? What do you think
of the "political killings" by British forces? What do you think of the
British inquiry process when it comes to British government killings of
Irish Nationalists?
What do you think the message is with the Clegg release? Do you understand
why the Nationalist community can never accept the RUC? Would you?
Mark
|
| 1490.27 | No problems here.... | POLAR::LARKIN | | Tue Aug 08 1995 11:28 | 12 |
| While I don't always agree with Mark Holohans view points, or the
viewpoint expressed in his articles, I find his postings both
educational and informative. There has got to be a balance in
journalism for it to be useful, and here in Canada at least we don't
receive that balance in the local newspapers. Therefore I appreciate
being able to log in here and get the information through Marks and
others, postings.
Keep 'em coming Mark. I know where the 'Next Unseen' key is if I don't
like what I'm reading.
Gerry
|
| 1490.28 | | GYRO::HOLOHAN | | Tue Aug 08 1995 14:19 | 4 |
|
Thanks Gerry, and to the folks who have mailed me directly. I will
keep them coming.
Mark
|
| 1490.29 | Interesting | PLAYER::DOMS | Leo Doms SI Brussels | Fri Sep 08 1995 12:45 | 13 |
|
Did anyone notice that this topic was a complaint about NI political
affairs crushing almost every other subject on "Celtic" culture,
history etc...
Well after 16 replies this same topic has been crushed by a NI po-
litical slagging match. An identical repetition of the discussions
that are found in scores of topics here.
Just thought I'd mention it.
Bye from Belgium
Leo.
|
| 1490.30 | | CHEFS::TRAFFIC | Oranges anybody? | Mon Oct 09 1995 08:16 | 4 |
| And who's at the centre of it all?
Adolf Holohan.
|