Conference tallis::celt

    Some people may consider what I am about to write petty but I feel
    that I should make the point.
    The Guildford four were not tried and convicted under a British
    judicial system but by an English Judicial system.
    The Director of Public Prosecutions is an English official the Scottish
    equivalent is the Procurator Fiscal.
    The press referred to is not British but English and is jingoistic,
    chauvanistic and blatantly biased against anyone who is not
    white,Anglo-Saxon and Protestant.
    We Scots have enough faults and failings of our own without being
    stuck with the faults of our neighbour's judicial system and press.
    Please remember,despite what the English would have you believe,that
    Scotland is a different country with a culture and system of law
    that is unique to it.
    We have never been English,we are only nominally British but we
    will always be Scots.

    Its great news for all involved. The problem will still remain as long
    as the mass press hysteria which accompanys bombings on the mainland
    continues.
    
    Heres hoping the Birmingham Six are also released.
    It seems a strange one when you consider that the only evidence was
    their own "confessions".
    It is really funny to hear the establishment talking about how great
    British justice. It seems that to lock up an innocent person for
    fifteen years and to fight to have their convictions upheld for that
    period of time as well is not the sign of a fair justice system. One
    has only to look at the number of people held under the prevention of
    terrorism act for the full seven days without access to a lawyer and
    then released without charge, usually because of their accent and
    someone elses paranoia.
    
    rgds
    Kieran
    

    
    
    	I am not trying to discourage any activity in this notesfile but
    	just to let others know this topic is also being discussed in 
        the Euro_Forum Notesfile TRUCKS::EF89	Note # 252.108 +

                                          
    
    
    	keVin
    

    
    
      I, for one am very excited and apprehensive about will happen
    tomorrow.  It's not over till it's over so to speak.  
    
      If this happens and they are released it will be the starting
    of a new era in the English judicial system that has been used for
    so many years.  I sincerily hope the Birmingham Six case is next
    and the hundreds of individual cases go under the most scrutinizing
    review possible.  
    
      Now is the time for letters and action.  We should send letters
    to the appropriate ( does any one know Who? Where?) agency and praise
    this forward step and encourage its continuance.  
    
    World support for this action and more like it are most needed NOW. 
    
    paddy
    
    ps
    
     keVin maybe we should give the EFr's a pointer to Celt.  8*)
                                                                 

    I agree.
    However sending letters to whom.
    The British Government. The will not listen to their own people let
    alone us. Maybe there will be some changes but having heard Hurd (sic)
    on the TV last night saying that the Birmingham Six had had their
    chance at the appeal last year I don't think so.
    A point that maybe a lot of noters might be missing is that the
    Birmingham Six were interviewed/interogated by members of the West
    Midlands Serious Crimes Squad. The entire squad was disbanded in recent
    months because of the number of false confessions they were producing.
    There must be hundreds of people locked away on the evidence of their
    own confessions im England and Wales not least the Birmingham Six. 
    
    One interesting thing is will the Police officers involved be the only
    ones to be investigated or will the investigation cover the senior
    officers at the time one of which is deputy commissioner of (I think)
    the Metropolitan police now. I personally think that if the senior
    officers had been doing their job then they too must have known that
    there was something seriously amiss.
    On the other hand maybe thats just the way Justice is if you are Irish
    and living in England.
    
    Certainly since the Deal bombing when several commentators said that
    the people to watch out for these days are young, educated and from the
    south. Since these statements have been made in the small print of
    several newspapers I hjave seen things like "Six Irishmen Arrested
    under PTA". Then about five or six days later "Last man Released".
    It seems as if the PTA is designed to give the police 7 days to
    interogate until you confess to something even if it is only to not
    having a TV license.
    
    Kieran

    Kieran,
    
    From listening to Douglas Hurd and reading the accounts of the
    proceedings(in the UK) from the Appeal Court, it would seem that
    all but the police officers from the Surrey force have been exonerated
    at the present time. In fact the counsel representing the prosecution
    last week specifically excluded the Met. force from any involvment,even
    though officers from the then Bomb Squad at Scotland Yard, the now
    Anti-Terrorist squad, were involved in the interrogation of some
    of the Guildford four.(One of whom is the Commissioner of the Met.)
    This exclusion also involved what were called 'other officers of the
    law' namely laywers to the prosecution.
    Hopefully the judicial inquiry that has been initiated will be allowed
    to ask the right questions to the right people, without political
    interference from interested parties, but we'll just have to wait
    and see!
    
    It would take too long to give you all of the details that have
    surfaced since last week but you should try to get someone at home
    to send you some of the newspaper reports as some very good articles
    have been written, especially in the 'decent' English papers.

        
    Donal

    
    
      Is there any way the papers could be sent to me or a regular basis?
    
    I could then pass them out to the folks around here.  The press
    in the U.S. does a grand job of keeping us in the dark about everything
    except the sensational items.  The reporting of the G4 was almost
    non-existent here. But then we are used to the US/GB news media
    and how it relates to the goings on of the judicial system or lack
    of one.  We do have the ECHO and VOICE to supplement the Emigrant.
    So if anyone on the other side of the pond is willing, I am ready.
    
    I am in Salem  NIO/ F2
    
    thanks 
    
    paddy
    

    I get the Irish Times sent over almost every week. If it is possible to
    send it through Internal Mail I will try and send some copies.
    
    kieran

      
    
       Kieran,
    
          That would be great,  I'll pass it on, after I read it 
    
    I'll let you tkow if I get it..
    
    paddy

    
    Paddy,
    
    About writing to someone, well you you try to the Catholic Archbishop
    of Brum(Birmingham) ... Maurice Coeve deMurville...now theres a good
    Catholic name for you! Anyway the ArchBishop and his Anglican and
    Free? Church colleagues are trying to get the B"ham 6 case re-opened
    following on from the Guildford 4....In my own opinion theres one 
    glaring difference with B6 and G4...there was an English girl involved
    �n the Guildford case!
    
    I work here in the Birmingham office and remember well that horrific
    night and the after effects....marches through the streets demanding
    the re-patriation of the Irish etc... Through the course of the years
    so much "evidence" has been produced that makes British justice
    laughable that all but the most fervent supporters of the B6 have
    probably given up hope....until now! 
    
    My own feelings are that I think their case is pretty hopeless,at least
    while this present Gov is there but the more pressure that can be
    brought to bear, the better. There is also another case here which is
    tainted with the "miscarriage of justice" tag, that of the Carl
    Bridgewater murder, and while thats not political or Celtic related, 
    should that one break, then I feel that just about every case the West
    Midlands Police were involved in, in the last 15 years or so, will be
    brought into question... 
    
    What overshadows these cases is whether you believe that people
    willingly volunteered information to intricate themselves in some
    crime or whether maybe being "interviewed" for about a week may have
    been helpful in acquiring this information...
    
    Se�n..
    
    P.S.  Chris Mullen , a English MP has also had an ongoing campaign
    going to try to clear the 6"s names....Best of luck.
     
    	

    
    
    Sean,
    
      Thanks for the information.  I'll drop a line to the parties tonight
    
    
    I will keep you all posted on the progress.
    
    paddy