Conference tallis::celt

    The Bagpipes  Oh Really????
    
        Wow you selected a grand instrument to master......
    
        I think the most important pre-requesite is to insure an ample
    supply of HOT air.  The clear expert on that will be the infamous
    keVin. And if he is at a loss to help maybe Mr Topaz will help.
    
        On a more serious side Good Luck  I got a Bodhran and I am 
    just starting to realize how difficult it is for an "old and I repeat
    old dog to learn new tricks".  
     
        The price I imagine will be substantial but well worth it in
    the long haul.
    
    
    paddy
    

John,
 I can't tell you the price of bagpipes, but I can find out this weekend.  As 
far as lessons, I'm sure there are a few Pipe bands in your area and they
usually have a person who teaches or can put you in touch with a teacher.
You'll start out with a practice chanter and learn the scale, exercises using
gracenotes, and other intricacies of pipe music.  My father and sister both 
to played the pipes (my sister Piped my wife up the aisle) and I played the side
drum in a local band here in the Philly area.  Try and find a band that is
geared more towards competition than just a street band.  You'll be driven to
keep up with the good pipers.  It takes a lot of practice and if you noticed
the pipes don't have any place for a liar(sp?) to hold the music so it's all
from memory.  It also takes a lot of practice when you first get the pipes
because you have to coordinate when to blow, when to squeeze the bag etc.
Also, it'll feel like your eyeballs are going to pop out of your head when you
first blow them up.;->

  Good luck and I'll try and get prices on bagpipes, and practice chanters for
you

	Jack

P.S. My grandfather from Scotland once said, "Pipes sound real good out on a 
hill, so far out you can't hear them.":-))

    
    
    
    	re. .2   Your sister did WHAT to your wife  ???   :=)
    
    
    JO'R ... If you just want to practice, go out and by a large pig
    	     and a pair of scissors. Place the pig firmly under your
    	     arm and the repeatedly "apply" the scissors to the belly
             of the pig.
                                    
    
    
    Q.		Do ye know the definition of a Scottish Gentleman ??
      
    
    A.		One that can play the bagpipes .... but DOESN'T  !!!
    
                        
    
    
    keVin

       
       	RE: my sister Piped my wife up the aisle
       
       
       	Ummmmmmm, did WHAT where????
       
       						me_haul

RE: me_haul & keVin

	You guys ever think of taking your act to Vegas??;->

What I meant was, instead of the traditional organ music (go ahead you two,
run with that one (-:) my sister played the bagpipes while my wife walked
up the aisle at our wedding.

	Jack

    
    
    Hey Paddy,
    
    What's a Bodhran??  A brand of Bagpipes or type of bagpipes?
                                                                       
    If so, what are some of the other types/brands?  Any difference between
    bagpipes the Scottish would play as opposed to the Irish or others?
    
    Thanks,    
    JO'R   
    

    
    
    Re: .2
    
    Jack, Thanks for the info. and I'll be looking forward to hearing
    what the approximate cost is!
                               
    I'm sure the local Irish-American Society can tell me about some
    local Pipe bands, if there are any.          
                               
    It seems that I cannot ever remember a local band ever appearing.
    Every time I've seen one here (either at North Texas Irish Festival
    or St. Patrick's Day Parade) they've been imported.  (A year ago
    my wife and I walked just behind the Bagpipers from Dublin (we were
    with the Irish Wolfhounds) - it was fantastic)
                                                   
    Can anyone say anything about the more famous Bagpipe melodies,
    Scottish, Irish, etc.?                        
                                                  
    And, what's a practice chanter?  Just the "flute/whistle-like" part
    of it or the "pipes sticking out of the bag" part of it?  What are
    the proper names for the various parts?  Do some bagpipes have more
    pipes than others?
    
    How does one get "piped up the aisle".  Does it hurt??  Is it fun?? 
    
    Seriously, I need the basics here!
    
    My wife and I saw a television show (I believe it was BBC) on New
    Years eve (we were in Cavan at the time) that was being televised
    from Scotland.  Anyway, the host of the show was in one of those 
    "dresses" (sorry can't remember what those things are called). 
    Then the bagpipers came on-it was tremendous!  Any of you see that
    show?                    
                             
    Thanks, JO'R

    
    
    
    	RE. .5   Great Reply Jack   (-;)
    
    
    
    		The last ime Me_haul was in Vegas he lost $50 in the
    		parking meter ...   8=)
    
    
    
    	
    
    keVin

    re:.0  Always wondered if you were full of wind, John :-).....
    
    As a member of the reserves I end up at retirement ceremonies sometimes
    (mine soon, I hope) and one I was at a couple of years ago had a
    piper who was certainly impressive to me, though it may just have
    been the way it was done, I really (O'REILLY) liked it.

    Nope not a bagpipe but your close.
    
    It's a traditional Irish drum.
    
    But after a couple hours of my following C. Moore my wife calls
    it  "That Damn Drum".  It seems that my problem may be with
    the weight of the tripper.  Or my lack of any musical aptitude.
    
    One hint I would have for you JO'R is to make sure you spit the
    tobacco out before inflating the bag.  You see I lived in Shereveport
    La. for 6 years and know all about you Rednecks in Dallas. 
    
    paddy

             
             
    Oh no, they let it get out.  I instructed them not to say anything
    about it! (Redneck)  
                       
    Actually, Dallas is populated mostly by midwesterners or other
    transplants !  Esp. when you meet someone with a name like O'Reilly.
    This is evidenced by the fact that in '82 I was the only O'Reilly in
    the Dallas phone book, now there are 29 (+ 7 spelled "wrong" for 36 total).
                       
    I hate tobacco, chew or otherwise, and I dislike C&W music.  I never
    wear Cowboy boots...
                        
    But, I do pay the real estate taxes - so call me a Dallas Redneck!
                        
    As far as I know the tobacco might even help the sound of the
    Bagpipes!!
   
    One might even attach a "lid" of chew right on their Bagpipe for
    easy access!                                       
    
    JO'R
    
    P.S. What about my questions in .6,.7????????
    
    

RE: .7?

  Parts of the Bagpipe:

1- The bag - Made of some skin and coated on the inside with a resin. The smell
	     of the resin is enough to gag a maggot.  Probably why you can
	     never get a piper to stop playing.  The smell would back up the 
	     blow pipe and kill most of them.

2- The drones - There are tree drones. 1 bass drone 2 tenor drones. And they do
		drone and drone and drone and......

3- The chanter- This is where the most noise comes from.  8 holes - 7 in the 
		front one in the back.

4- The blow pipe - Essential for getting air in the bag.  The pipe has a leather
		   stopper at the bottom to keep the air in the bag from blowing
		   back into the pipers mouth, and not getting that resinated 
		   air back in thier lungs, thus keeping the EPA, and the 
		   surgeon general off thier backs for ruining the environment.

There are no sharps and flats in pipe music, thus it is in the key of C.

The practice chanter is a smaller instrument. A little larger than a tin whistle
with a reed.  Easier to blow than the pipes, also in the key of C.

If you happen to show my description of bagpipes to a piper, he/she will 
probably say a it sounds like a drummer's description. (Thank you very much);->

Personally I am going to try the tin whistle.  I just found my fathers' old tin
whistle and a learners book gy a man named McClelland.  Much sweeter sound and
it doesn't rattle the windows when you play.;=))

	Jack

       RE: KeVin & Vegas
       
       	Hey! I've never been to Vegas! (It was somewhere else I lost
       the $50 but we won't go into that...)
       
       RE:.12
       
       	Give it skin!  More Skin!  (Inside joke :-))
       
       						me_haul

    Uileann (sp? from the Irish for elbow) pipes are played by the Irish.
    Any time I have ever seen then played, the musician is seated with
    the 'bag' of the pipes under his elbow. The 'bag' is  pumped using
    the elbow and there is no mouth pipe (as with bagpipes).
    Dee  

    Re the base note.
    
    As far as noise goes I believe there is a variant on the bagpipes
    (using the same principle) which is quieter.  These are called the
    Northumbrian pipes, the tone is sweeter, but they are fairly rare
    (by comparison with the Scottish bagpipe).  
    
    Having only a few traces of Celtic blood (my mothers parents were
    Welsh, my father's great-grandfather Scottish), I still find the
    sound of bagpipes wonderful!  It's wild, stirring stuff!
    
    From the historical point of view the Scottish regiments must have
    put the fear of God into enemies who had never heard the sound before!
    

THE UILEANN PIPES ONLY REQUIRE  Y0U TO BE ABLE TO MAKE USE OF 8 FINGERS
    2 THUMBS 2 ELBOWS 1 KNEE AND ONE WRIST SIMULTANEOUSLY AND AT THE
    SAME TIME. THE ONLY SNAG IS THAT YOUR ELBOWS HAVE TO BE MOVED OUT
    OF SYNC WITH THE MUSIC AND EACH OTHER. THE CURRENT PRICE IS FOR
    A PRACTICE SET (BAG BELLOWS AND CHANTER) APROX �200 FOR A FULL SET
    EXPECT APROX �2000 AND A LONG WAIT (AND THAT IS IF YOU KNOW A MAKER).
    
    OTHER THAN THAT YOU CAN ACHIEVE TWO OCTAVES,PLAY TUNES ON THE
    REGULATORS AND PUT YOUR WIFE CAT AND THE NEIGHBOURS IN THE HOME
    FOR THE VERY VERY NERVOUS WHILST PRACTICING.
    
    DO NOT LET THIS PUT YOU OFF AS ALL PIPERS ARE NEEDED. 

John,
  Just got back from my favorite Scottish food store and asked the owner
how much a set of pipes would cost.  He is the Drum Major in the band I
used to play in, and although he didn't have a price list he guessed anywhere
in the range of $450 and up.  Practice chanters @ $15-$18.  He also suggested
looking around for people who might have bought a set of pipes and want to
get rid of them.  You might get a good deal.  Sorry I couldn't get any more
specific numbers for you, but I'll keep checking if you'd like.

  By the way, don't let my cynical description of pipes and pipers fool you.
I love the sound of a pipe band coming down the street. I also have some
Battlefield Band records which I play and play and play...  Even after playing
in a pipe band for 5 years the music still stirs something up. I can still
tell the difference between a good pipe band and a bad one, I guess you don't
lose your ears after all.;-)

	Good luck,
		Jack

    
    
    Thanks, Jack.
    
    Thanks for checking into the cost for me--appreciate it.
                                                            
    Don't bother with any further research on cost of Bagpipes.  All
    I was looking for was a rough range.  After that it's up to me when
    I'm truly serious.  I'll be looking up books at the library; checking
    into looking Pipe bands, etc.                           
    
    Too band we can't somehow post "sounds" as Replys instead of just
    characters.  Then you could listen to me practice, practice, practice
    the pipes.  You all could love me just as much as my neighbors!
    :-)    :-)     :-)
    
    P.S. Would enjoy hearing a little more on the differences between
    Scottish and Irish Bagpipes.  Obviously I would be more interested
    in learning the Irish version.  Mostly because my wife would leave
    me otherwise!!!  :-)   :-)    :-)          
                                                            
     

    
    	Its not so easy. I once had the misfortune of getting entangled
    with a set of Uileann pipes. I know a bit on the whistle and thought
    it would we fairly easy. After 1 hour I had managed to get one squeal
    which emptied the bag of air and considering it took me a while
    to fill the bag in the first place I gave up.
     
    Re. Northumbrian pipes, I heard a Morris dancer playing them once
    and thougth they were fantastic. Again the logistics of filling
    the bag and playing the tune were beyond me.
    

    Leaprechauns store wind.
    
    There are many forms throughout the world of the bagpipes.
    The Scottish and Irish are the most famous. Probably because thay
    had a purpose that was more than musical. For the belligerant Celts
    they were the wailing banshee of doom to their enemies. 
    In warlike application they both fired the blood of those who 
    followed them into battle, and they put the "frighteners" on the
    those about to be attacked. THey also served as a rallying call
    much like the drummer-boy in other less colourful military machines.
       The sound of the pipes does things to the sinew & marrow of the
    Irish & Scottish, that we could live on. To other sinews & marrows
    they grate.
       THey are one of the most purposeful instruments ever made, and
    the music comes in many forms. A funeral lament, a joyful wedding
    march, a solo piobrach at wind (abstract music played to ward off
    evil spirits :-) ), a battle march...... there is a tune for most
    occasions.
       The scottish bagpipes and the Irish piobra� m�r or warpipes are
    for the most part the same instrument, (no expert I). When warpipes
    were banned in Ireland (for obvious reasons), the music-makers 
    invented the Uillean pipes (Uile is the gaelic for elbow or angle).
    There are pipes in the strangest of places - Northumbria, Poland
    Mongolia etc. but all are different and I know of no extensive use
    as there is in the Celtic context.
       
    Oh! and the skirts are called KILTS. In Scotland they also wear
    a Sporran (gaelic for purse in both Irish and Scots).
    Scottish kilts are always of a tartan variety, and the Irish ones
    are usually of a single colour. The tartanisation of Scotland is
    a creation of the Industrial revolution (they did not have the 
    technology before that - but it is a receipe for variation and colour).
    Scottish pipe bands often wear white spats and some carry dirks
    (daggers) in their stockings. Irish bands wear knee length stockings
    in matching colour to the kilt, and the "brogues" with a big square
    silver buckle (shiny black shoes). A cloak is also worn which is
    usually fastened by an ornate brooch over the left shoulder. The
    cloak is the remnant of the "Felidhe m�r" garment which was a
    protective cloak sometimes an extension of the kilt worn over the
    shoulder. The "gallowglasses" (heavy infantry) are portrayed in
    historical documents wearing this item. (Haute couture of the day).
    
    Snake is open to some question on the above and I welcome any
    offers of enhancement.
    

    Uillean pipes are the most complex, and the most mellifluous of pipes.
    They consist of three drones, a chanter and a set of regulators. These
    are all pipes, but have different uses. The drones provide a constant
    background hum, at a fixed pitch. The chanter is keyed and holed, and
    carries the melody. The regulators are also keyed, but the keys
    are operated by the right wrist. They are used to provide a rhythmic
    counterpoint to the melody.
    
    These pipes are pumped by a set of bellows held under one arm, and
    an air bag held under the other, from which the constant flow of
    air is produced, the bellows put air into it when needed. They are
    always played sitting down, with the pipes laid across the knees.
    The chnater is stopped against the knee. I once heard a very accomplished musician say that it took him six
    months just to be able to tune the things, so do not rush out and
    buy a full set. Different areas of Ireland have lively traditions,
    and as with all traditional music different styles. Willie Clancy
    and Seamus Ennis would be good pipers to look for recordings by,
    or Paddy Keenan and Liam O'Flynn of the younger pipers. (Both Clancy
    and Ennis are now dead. Ennis had a strange set of pipes in a different
    key to that normally used, I heard a story that when he died, Liam
    O'Flynn hurried off to Ennis's caravan and claimed as his own! I've
    only ever seen him play the set he used with Planxty.)
    
    The latest Grove Dictionary of Music and Musicians gives some good
    information on different types of tunes, and the types of ornamentation
    used, such as cranning (I forget what that is now.) 
    
    Almost as sweet (some would say more) are the Northumbrian pipes.
    These are much smaller, can be played standing or sitting, and are
    also meant as "chamber pipes." The have the same bag and bellows
    as the Uillean pipes, but no regulators. The chanter is stopped,
    and this means it's possible to play two consecutive notes of the
    same pitch. They are very widely played, with a repertoire and
    tradition as extensive as the Scots and Irish ones, and are the
    only pipes still played traditionally in England, and with the Folk
    Revival in England they have become widely known outside their local
    farming and mining communities of the North East - Lancashire used
    to be another famous piping area, but that tradition died many years
    ago when the melodeon and concertina became popular. Excellent
    Northumbrian pipers include Alastair Anderson, Colin Ross and Katherine
    Tickell.
    
    The Great Highland Pipes are the ones you see people playing in
    bands, though the greatest music for them, the pibroch, is solo,
    and consists of a series of tunes and variations, this form was
    developed by the MacCrimmons at the pipe school on Skye, where they
    were pipers to the McLeods, although they were recent Irish immigrants.
    They are blown up via a pipe from the mouth, and have three drones
    and a chanter. The Irish version of this kind of pipe also has three
    drones - one, either the Scots or Irish (can't remember) has two
    of them at the same pitch, the other has three different ones.

    There is an interesting piper going rpound at the moment called
    Hamish Moore. I hear that he uses an old form of Scots pipes, chamber
    pipes again, similar to the Northumbrian, though probably with an
    open chanter. He has a couple of records out, where he arranges
    pieces for the pipees and a variety of other instruments, such as
    the saxophone. Roy Williamson of the Corries always claimed to play
    "Lowland pipes", though I suspect he was trying to avaoid admitting
    that he played an English instrument.
    
    Pipes from other parts of Europe, and elsewhere, tend to be even
    more strident than these basic Scots and Irish pipes. The mediterranean
    countries had lively traditons, and interest in them has been revived
    recently.
    
    There is an excellent book on the history and acoustics of pipes,
    by (I think) Francis Collinson, called simply The Bagpipes.

    See note 251 for some information on the introduction of tartanry
    to Scotland. 
    
    Phillip
    

    RE: .20, .21  "Irish vs. Scots warpipes"
    
    I was under the impression that the Irish warpipes had only two
    drones, as opposed to the Scots which have three.
    
    
    By the way, unless the author of the base note changes the title,
    nobody will find this topic in future by doing a DIR/TITLE=bagpipe.
    
    I would suggest that they do the following. 
    
    	Notes> 349.0
    
    	Notes> MODIFY NOTE/TITLE="The Bagpipes"
    

    hallo there,
    If you want to learn the irish pipes youll have to go to the Willie
    Clancy Summerschool in Milltown Malbay Co Clare. it lasts a week
    and you can take lessons in the pipes, concertina, flute, tin whistle,
    fiddle, and set dancing. Its true that the pipes are rather difficult;
    I can manage on the whistle and knock out one tune on the pipes,
    but then whats the big hurry ?  There are lots of youngsters who
    get on fine with them. I think the price quoted for a full set of
    pipes is a bit high: Tom White from Ballyvaughan, Co Wexford is
    a pleasant and reliable maker: he holds a repair workshop at the
    summer school every year. You can buy a full set for around 1100
    Irish pounds, but you will only need a practice set at first.
    Well, I must admit that the cat  does get up and leave when I start
    up, but she is like that anyway. I've got a book of tunes called
    SMASH THE WINDOWS and tolerant neighbours. Anyone else out there
    learning ?
    Kevin Mannerings

    
    
    Re: .22 suggestion taken
        
    Title modified to "The Bagpipes"
    
    Good Point,
    JO'R

    
    
    
    	re. 23   Ballyvaughan  ....  Co. Wexford  ???
                                        
    
    
    	Come On The Banner !!!!
                 
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    keVin
    

       
       
       	What on the banner??
       
       							me_haul

    I've been playing Uilleann Pipes for some years now, and agree that
    the most useful way to get started would be to have a weeks tuition
    at the Willie Clancy school, held every year in the first week of
    July. The classes are run by members of Na Piobairi Uilleann the
    Irish Pipers society 15 Henrietta Street Dublin 1. Membership of
    the society is open to anyone with an interest in Irish Pipes, and
    costs 7 punts per year. There is a quarterly magazine where pipemakers
    and members advertise pipes for sale. Also articles on pipers, tunes,
    technique, history etc. There is a North American branch of the
    society which holds an annual tionol - contact Alan Jones P.O. Box
    130 Rouses Point New York 12979. The Irish tionol is held the first
    week-end in May and this year is in Mullingar starting Fri 29-Apr.
    I don't have details with me today but can get them for anyone
    interested. I'll be there!. It's fierce crack with lots of black
    stuff and piping. Paddy Keenan usually attends and in the past I've
    met Seamus Ennis(now deceased), Dan O'dowd, Paddy Maloney, Finbar
    Furey, Davy Spillane, Liam O'Flynn and many other brilliant pipers.
    It' s worth the effort to learn the Irish Pipes. They are much more
    flexible and expressive than the War Pipes though a bit daunting
    in the early stages. The tin whistle is a good place to start as
    it uses similar fingering and ornamentation. I ususally pick up
    a tune on the whistle before trying it on the pipes.
      Good Luck
      John B.

    The famous piper Seamus Ennis said of the Uileann pipes that you
    spend 7 years learning them, 7 years practising them and 7 years
    playing them before you can call yourself a piper.
    
    - Joe

    Does anyone know if the fingering on an tin whistle (and thus bagpipes)
    is the same or similar to the recorder?  I play soprano and alto
    recorder (sopranino when I'm feeling cute, they're so small!), so
    I'd like to know how hard it would be to try whistling.
    
    Wook (A Korean with a taste for Ireland)

jO'r -

You can also get information on pipes in the ESPN::FOLK_MUSIC
notes conference.  I remember awhile back there being some
discussion and history on the subject.

Can't remember if I've ever seen Snake slither through that
conference but other Celtic noters have been active there to keep
things going ;-)

Alice

    The fingering of the whistle and the recorder are similar, in that
    they are both simple fipple flutes you just lift your fingers from
    to go up in pitch. The recorder has more cross fingering, as it
    is a more complex instrument.
    
    I haven't played the whistle in years - does it overblow in octaves?
    
    Phillip

    The whistle is a very simple instrument in that it plays one key
    only whereas the recorder is chromatic within its range. Its possible
    and usual to get other keys out of a whistle by cross fingering
    or halfing holes. The most common whistle used in Irish music is
    the D. Most dance tunes are in either D or G and you can get both
    keys on the D whistle. Simply flatten the C sharp for the key of
    G. Its also possible to play in E minor and B minor on the same
    instrument. The whistle plays two octaves in its basic key the second
    octave obtained by overblowing. For  example the D plays three D
    notes - low middle and high - three different air pressures. It
    is also possible to 'swell' a note by varying the air pressure or
    by sliding the finger off the hole - very effective in airs. To
    make the whistle sound Irish you need to master the ornamentation
    used - cuts, rolls, crans, trills etc. Try to find the record 'Tin
    Whistles' by Sean Potts and Paddy Maloney for a start. I can get
    copies of whistle and Uilleann pipe tutors if anyone is interested.
    Listen to a good whistle player on an air - they'll make your hair
    stand on end!
    John B

    Since there's been some mention of whistles, does anyone know a
    price range for them?
    					kathy
    (No, I don't think I'll take them up, I'm just wondering.)

    
    
    
    	re. 33  Whistles are very inexpensive $3 - $10 range.
    
    	        Plenty of local places to buy them ....
                 
    		Want to join our band ??   :=)
    
    
    
    
    keVin
    

    If anyone still cares, I have a source for Highland pipes. All I
    need to do is find the address.
    
    In a moment of weakness, about two years ago, I bought a half size
    set and a practice chanter from the man. The practice chanter cost
    ~$25 and the half size set ~$150. The explanation given was that
    the bag was smaller and the reeds were smaller thus reducing the
    volume of the resulting noise. As yet, I cannot generate enough
    wind to sound the chanter and the drones together. I think that
    I need to soften the chanter reed.
    
    The practice chanter has a bore of about 3/16" and is very quiet
    by comparison.
    
    I also have a practice set of Uillean pipes which is simply a bellows,
    a bag and a chanter. This has a useful range of two octaves and
    is fairly quiet. The maker commented that this was part of Liam
    Flynn's style in that using a very soft reed made it much easier
    to find the upper octave while keeping the volume down. On the down
    side, this is reputed to kill the reed.
    
    As to fingering, my Uilean pipe tutor claimed that the fingering
    matched that of a tin whistle. My highland pipes tutor uses a very
    different style, requiring no more than three holes open at a time.
    
    My wife has a set of northumbrian pipes which use yet another fingering
    style, in that only one hole is open at a time.
    
    
    As to tartans, the story I heard was that before the English conquered
    the highlands tartans were widespread. Each weaver had his own sett.
    A sett is best described as a ratio of colors in terms of threads,
    i.e. AAABBAAACCABBBBBBBBACCAAABBAAA. The colors used in a particular
    piece were constant and applied to both the warp and the weft. On
    the other hand, the next piece could use different colours. This
    meant that the pattern of broad and narrow stripes identified the
    weaver and the colors suited the the use or whim of the wearer.
    
    Eventually the English mills decided that a captive market was a
    wonderful thing and sold the Highlanders on the idea of Clan Tartans.
    Thus leading to the situation we have today.
    
    Since the Scots were one of Irelands first and most successful sets
    of emigrants ( apart from being beaten up by the English ), I would
    assume that the concept of tartan came from Ireland but did not
    survive there due to too many years of repression.
    

    hallo KeVin,
    
     re 23,25:
    
    sorry about that. Tom White the nice pipe maker lives in Newbawn,
    Co Wexford.
    Kevin M

    WITH REGARD TO THE FINGERING OF THE WHISTLE AND THE UILLEAN PIPES
    THE FINGERING IS NOT THE SAME.ALSO THERE IS DIFFERENT FINGERING
    FOR DIFFERENT SCALES IE STACCATO AND GLISANDO (CHECK THE SPELLING
    :-))
    
    EAMON

    There are at least three fingering regimes on the Uilleann pipes
    - staccato with chanter on the knee (end closed), legato with chanter
    on knee and legato with chanter off knee. As far as I can remember
    Leo Rowsome gives a fourth in his tutor. The fingering is similar
    to that of the whistle, in that the next note up the scale is given
    by opening the next highest hole. On the whistle it is usual to
    leave the notes uncovered as you move up the scale. On the Uilleann
    pipes it is important to leave the correct number of holes uncovered
    below the note being sounded, often 0 1 or 2  i.e. most notes are
    cross-fingered. I found it an easy transition from whistle to pipes
    once I had done my three month course in octupus wrestling to get the
    bellows, bag, pressure, fingers co-ordination right!
    
    good luck 
    John B
    .                  

    I amd really enjoying reading these notes.  I play the Great Highland
    Bagpipes.  They say it takes 7 years and 7 generations to become a
    piper.  One day I hope to be a piper instead of a player.  I am going
    to be competing at the various area Highland Games this year. My first
    competition on the Pipes themselves will be April 23.  I intend to
    place in Pibroch.  Wish me Luck, y'all.  Marge

    
    
    Go for it, Marge!!
    
    I'm sure you'll "blow them away"!!
    
    Best of luck and good lungs to you!!
    
    JO'R

    THERE IS ALSO A DOUBLE CHANTER THAT IS SOMETIMES USED. YOU CAN HEAR
    THIS ON THE RECORD "THE DRONES AND THE CHANTER" A MUST IF YOU LIKE
    THE MUSIC. THE CHANTERS CAN BE OBTAINED IN VARIOUS PITCHES FROM
    B FLAT UP. THE B FLAT IS A BIT LIKE TRYING TO PLAY A TELEGRAPH POLE
    :-)
    
    EAMON

    
    
                                                        
    On June 4th I will be attending the North Texas Highland Festival
    - part of the activitities are bagpipe competitions!
    
    This will continue my efforts at learning more about the bagpipes.
    Once I make a committment - I make a committment.  So, I want to
    be sure I know what I'm getting into, if I do.
    
    Who knows, I may just decide to become an informed Bagpipe listener.
                               
    
    I'll keep y'all informed.
    
    JO'R                   
                               

I am a piper, I have been learning for over a year on the Great Highland 
Bagpipe, and prior to that off and on for about 2+ years on the practice 
chanter.  Here are some facts to answer some of John's questions:

1.  Practice chanter -- do not I repeat do not go buy anything that is $18 
(unless it is used and you know the party).  If cheap, it is probably Pakistani
made of soft wood (sort of on the order of balsa) and will not last, the 
moisture will eat it away.  Get a real one from Scotland, you will know one, 
because any of the reputable makers will have his name and city carved into it.  
The same people who make the bagpipes also make the practice chanters.
The one to get is of African blackwood. There are also some that are made of  
hard rubber/plastic that can be acceptable. Practice chanters are around $50.00 
for hardwood.  You will spend all of your beginner time and most of the rest 
of your learning/practice time on the practice chanter.  It is a lifetime 
purchase.

2.  The chanter -- there are 8 notes in the bagpipe scale, from low G to high
A.  The key of bagpipes is actually B-flat.  What I like to think of as music 
is produced by a double reed (yep, like oboe).  The practice chanter reed
is plastic, the pipe chanter reed is cane.  Practice chanter reeds cost about
$1.50-2.50 and last a fairly long time. Pipe chanter reeds are about $4.00 each
and last a short time. (If you have ever played any woodwind instrument, you 
understand that.)

3.  The drones -- on the Great Highland Bagpipes (which is what you really 
want to know about), there are 3 -- 2 are tenor and 1 is bass.  Everything is 
tuned to the chanter's A -- you start with the chanter at low A, and an octave
lower are the 2 tenors and another octave lower is the bass.  Done reeds 
traditionally were made of cane, a set costs about $9.00.  Lately the trend
has been to the new plastic drone reeds, which I personally am using but
think stink, I am intending to go to cane reeds asap (that means when my
instructor has the time to help me set them up properly).  These plastics are 
about $35 a set.  

4.  The bag -- in this country you want elkhide, or elk tanned cowhide.  Lots 
of nasty dealers try to get by cheap, so they outfit it with sheep (which is 
fine if you are playing in Scotland), or they put a puny tiny little elk bag 
on it, and then it is too small (depending on your stature of course) to 
provide you with a reservoir of air.  A good replacement bag (L&M elkhide) is 
about $60.00 and some dealers charge you extra to tie it on.  (It is better to
learn how to tie it on yourself to fit your size and shape.  Otherwise, it is
sort of like buying mail order shoes, they approximately fit.)  It needs to be 
seasoned; that is -  moisture is the name of the game and blow pipe every day 
or the leather dries out, so you work this seasoning stuff in periodically to 
keep the leather airtight.  It costs 4.50 a can, I can do about 3 seasonings 
per can.  The bag supplies the reservoir of air used to keep the drones and 
chanter going while you breathe.

5.  The Great Highland Bagpipes -- A decent learner set will cost you from $475
but you will need to plan to buy a case, and wax, and hemp, and bag seasoning,
and reeds, and etc, and etc.  Look for Hardie, Naill, Grainger (but be sure
that Grainger is guaranteed, since they had recent problems with splitting wood
in the stocks), Gillander.  These all have the makers name carved in the 
chanter.  A more common price for a set is $600, without any extras thrown in.  
There is also a bagpipe maker in the USA (Gibson) and these are VERY nice, but
cost $1000.00 a set.  I have a old set from the 50's made by Lawrie, and I got 
them used from a kid who played because his folks wanted him to play, so they 
were anxious to sell cheap.  You won't find that kind of deal anymore, but 
might find a used set for $500-$550.  Once again, do not get any pipes that 
are Pakistani.  These will be light in weight and have black dye that rubs off
on your fingers (they are really brown crocus (sp?) wood that are dyed).
If someone offers you a used set, get someone knowledgable to look at them
for you to make sure there aren't cracks or other problems and that they are
not Pakistani.

6. You will start on the practice chanter, so you don't immediately need to 
worry about the great cost of pipes - as you see it is an expensive hobby even 
just to keep the things going.  Plan on $60 for the practice chanter and 
depending on your teacher, $8-40 for music books to start off.

7.  Lessons -- I think you will find it is pretty normal to pay $10 per hour.  
Some pipe majors donate this to their band funds, some keep it for their own 
wages.  Try to find someone who plays grade 2 or higher, since you want to form 
correct habits from the start.  It is hard to correct them after the fact.  
If you tell me where you are located I might be able to put you on to someone 
or another.  I am extremely lucky in my teacher, a world class piping champion.
He has played since age 7, was a sergeant in the Scottish army, in the Gordon 
Highlanders, and is a real pro and writes music as well.  There are also piping 
summer schools and workshops and clinics held all over the country at different 
times by different instructors and my experience has been that these are well 
worth the (usually trivial) cost.

8.  The kilt and etc -- don't worry about this at your stage. Later if you play 
with an established band, most will be furnished. If your are on your own, you 
are talking big bucks ($260 and up just for a kilt), but it will be at least a 
year before you will need to worry about the kilt and related garb (kilt hose, 
garter flashes, piping jacket, full or half plaid, sporran, kilt pin, dirk,
skeann dhu, belts, glengarry, etc etc etc).

9.  There is a saying -- it takes 7 years and 7 generations to make a piper.
I am grade 4, beginner, (novice in pibroch), and am looking forward to my 1st 
year of competition this summer.  There are lots of summer Highland games that 
you will someday want to compete in for the experience and the critiques from 
the judges, who will mostly be like my teacher - professional pipers.

10.  Irish pipe music is quite different from Scottish pipe music.  You will
mostly do Scottish music.  There is more of it around and that is what Pipebands
play.  Even "Irish" tunes like Wearing of the Green and the Irish Washer Woman 
are in Scottish music settings.  The classical form of the pipes is Pibroch 
(this is a bastardization of the correct spelling, Piobaireachd.  You can also 
sing pipe music in the Cantaireachd.)  Light music is what you hear in parades 
(marches, retreats, etc), in dance tunes, and popular tunes.  Everyone learns 
Scotland the Brave, The Green Hills of Tyrol, When the Battle's Over, Amazing
Grace and other tunes like that.  A lot of the tunes are battle tunes, but 
some have really interesting origins, like The Mucking of Geordie's Byre.  You 
start off with the scale, learn grace notes and other embellishments, then
easy marches. Later move into jigs, reels, hornpipes, strathspeys, and pibroch.
Get any tape or record of a champion pipe band at your favorite local record 
store and you will hear a sample of the light tunes.

11.  Where to buy -- In the end, everything comes from Scotland.  I have 
several catalog sources and depending on where you are located, you may have 
something close by. My favorite and cheapest and most willing to help place is
Rocky Mountain Highland Supply, Jim Fontaine, 1724 Hillcrest Dr, Lander, 
Wyoming 82520  (307)332-9611.  They are strictly mail order, except when they 
set up booths at the summer games.  They will talk to you absolutely for hours 
and won't steer you wrong.

12.  Dedication -- it takes lots of time and hard work to become a piper.
I attempt to practice 2 hours a day, between the practice chanter and the
pipes.  You MUST practice every day.  At the beginner practice chanter stage,
plan at least 1/2 hour daily if you can find the time, or more when you start 
to memorize tunes.  The hardest part for me has been memorization, followed by
playing while marching, followed by learning to tune the drones.  The first
problem that everyone has is learning to blow tone, ie, how to keep the
drones and chanter blowing steadily while trying to play the tune from 
memory and keep the pressure on the bag while blowing -- coordination helps,
especially when you have to start marching at the same time.

One payoff of piping is that you will be in the company of some of the
nicest people you will ever meet.  Adults take up the pipes because they
are crazy (oops, interested), because they will not have enough years to
make themselves into a world champion piper.  The best age for beginning
is about 16.  But kids with the time usually don't have the appreciation and 
discipline that the adult piper has.  So it is us crazies who will ultimately 
keep the tradition going.  And have fun with it as well. 

    I've heard it said that the Bagpipes were given as a gift to the Scottish 
    from the Irish............
    ......but that they still hadn't got the joke!
    
    

Hullo everybody,

I came a bit late to this note as I've only just discovered the conference.
I started learning the pipes (highland ones) at age 9 just after moving 
with the family to South Africa. The ex-patriate Caledonian community 
thrives in the gold field areas around Johannesburg and there were a number
of pipe bands and Highland games.
   I competed quite a lot throughout secondary school both individually and 
in bands then let it slide while at university. After university I played 
for one of the best competitive bands in the country and we actually 
scraped together the funding to come over to Scotland to play in the world 
champs only to be thrown out of the contest for the unforgivable crime of 
coming from the wrong country.
   Since returning to the UK I haven't played much at all but still retain 
a passing interest. Someone, in one of the earlier replies, mentioned that 
the pipes were designed with a purpose as well as music in mind. I've made 
something of a speciality of getting rid of unwanted neighbours simply by 
practicing nearby. My record from first tune to neighbours moving out is 24 
hours!!

   Good luck with the competitions Marge. I've found both in SA and 
Scotland that unless you're stunningly brilliant you often have to spend a 
season or two on the circuit before the judges really start to listen to 
you. So if at first you don't sweep the board ...

				- Graeme

    rep .45
    
    Hi Graeme, Welcome!  Thanks for the encouraging words, I did find
    myself getting very frustrated during and after competing in this
    summer's games, sometimes it takes me a couple of hours to get civil
    and halfway human again after I get badly trounced.  But this was
    only my 1st year and the experience was well worth the effort.  Just
    wait till next year! Pibroch is still my best thing, I did get one
    1st at a small Denver area game, I can  at least get thru an  entire
    pibroch including all the variations, whereas most of the pipers
    in Grade IV only competed with a ground. - Marge