[Search for users] [Overall Top Noters] [List of all Conferences] [Download this site]

Conference tallis::celt

Title:Celt Notefile
Moderator:TALLIS::DARCY
Created:Wed Feb 19 1986
Last Modified:Tue Jun 03 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:1632
Total number of notes:20523

92.0. "Samhain" by GORT::QUIGLEY () Thu Oct 23 1986 18:30

                <<< 2B::NOTES1:[NOTES$LIBRARY]SOAPBOX.NOTE;1 >>>
                              -< The New SOAPBOX >-
================================================================================
Note 289.0                      Erin's Samhain                         3 replies
GORT::QUIGLEY                                        18 lines  22-OCT-1986 19:39
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    
    
       I was curious as to what sort of festivities are held during
    Samhain (sow-win) in Ireland. I figured since we have a few
    Box members from there and since most people love Halloween it
    might be a light but interesting topic!
    
       Being first generation American, I've missed out on some of
    the old traditions, some I hear like how bad the Brits were to
    my Grandmother's family, I can see why Ulster etc. is in turmoil.
    
    
       Anyways...Is it celerbrated with dressing up in costume and
    trick or treating? Is it the Irish new year? Do the people still
    hollow out potatoes and turnips instead of Jack-O-Lantern Pumpkins?
    
    
                                         
================================================================================
Note 289.1*                     Erin's Samhain                            1 of 3
SWSNOD::RPGDOC "Dennis the Menace"                   24 lines  23-OCT-1986 08:52
                                 -< Colcannon >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    
    I don't know whether your question belongs in the
    
    			TALLIS::NOTES$LIBRARY:CELT 

    notesfile, or my reply should be in the TLE::COOKS file, but I have
    a recipe for something called "colcannon" which is a dish traditionally
    served on hallowe'en in Ireland. It goes sort of like this:
    
    		cut up and boil (or steam) a cabbage
    		
    		peel and cook some mashed potatoes
    		
    		chop up some leeks and cook them in cream
    
    		add some butter to the whole thing and mash it all together
    
    Tradition has it that you put things like a ring, a button, a penny,
    etc. and it means different things depending on who gets what in
    their portion.  A button means a bachelor, a ring = marriage, or
    whatever.
    
    By the way, if you'd like to continue this in CELT, press KP7 or
    SELECT, but leave the Donnybrooks in the SOAPDISH.
================================================================================
Note 289.2                      Erin's Samhain                            2 of 3
MELODY::MCCLURE "Who Me???"                           7 lines  23-OCT-1986 12:24
                           -< only *event* I recall >-
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    When I temporarily resided in Galway, it was *beggar's night*. Someone
    tried to convince me that the participants were all tinker's kids.
    But I didn't have to deal with it, the front door was the landlord's
    responsibility.
    
    Bob Mc
    
================================================================================
Note 289.3                      Erin's Samhain                            3 of 3
INK::KALLIS                                           6 lines  23-OCT-1986 13:35
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Re .0:
    
    I understand it was rather livlier a thousand years ago...
    
    Steve Kallis, Jr.
    
T.RTitleUserPersonal
Name
DateLines
92.1METSYS::COCKBURNCraig CockburnThu Oct 31 1991 06:0040
Article 3471 of soc.culture.celtic:
From: [email protected] (Michael S Newton)
Newsgroups: soc.culture.celtic
Subject: Samhain (Halloween, etc)

Although I did make a brief mention of it yesterday, I take Sorcha's
comment to heart: there should be something mentioned, and hopefully
discussed, about Samhain (Q-Celtic term, pronounced roughly "sow-win"),
which is the Celtic New Year.

The Celts had deeply engrained in their belief system the concept of
the duality of nature, and this is well illustrated by their notions
of time and space.

The Celts basically saw time as having two halves, a dark and a light
half (the dark coming first).  The new day starts at sundown, and, likewise,
the new year starts in the winter (the dark half of the year).

Likewise, besides this world, the Celts believed in the Otherworld, a place
of magic and mystic power, where the "sidhe" lived.  The veil between the
worlds was not very solid, but fairly thin: gods or goddesses might enter
this world, perhaps changing into animal form, or luring men or women into
the Otherworld.

The opposing feasts of Samhain and Beltaine (May 1st) were the divisions
between times of the year, and this division was reflected in the opening
of space between the worlds as well: the doors to the Otherworld were
opened, and mischievous spirits would come through into this world to
wreak havoc, or just have a little fun.

Today Halloween is the folk-remembrance of this celebration.  Our dressing
up (at least in America) as ghosts and ghouls reflects the haunting of
spirits in this world.

The jack o'lantern is a faint echo of the Celtic cult of the severed
head, and apple-bobbing is an old Celtic divination rite (apples were
strongly associated with the Otherworld: Welsh for "apple" is "aval",
producing the name for "Avalon").

For more info, refer to my Celtic HyperCard presentation!!
92.2Samhain---Mischief timeYUPPY::BLAKEBBrendan Blake@hhlThu Oct 31 1991 10:3729
    
    Custom has changed alot down the years, especially the way Samhain is
    celebrated.	I remember when I was much younger some of the tricks that
    the local young boys used to get up to.... some I will not mention.
    
    
    On the Samhain night the boys used to gather together and terrorise the
    neighbours in some of the following fashion.
    
    	Get a large bucket of water and place it at an angle against some
    ones front door. Now knock loudly and run off.....not a very nice one I
    know but it sure got the neighbours upset. Another was tying a piece of
    very fine thread to the door knocker and then giving it a quick tug or
    two while hiding behind a tree. Imagine the surprise on someones face
    when this happens a few times and there is nobody there, it must be the
    Faries calling again. One prank that was not popular with the victim 
    was hurling either a large turnip or head of cabbage against a front
    door and then scampering before you were caught.
    
    For the younger generation there was and still is the party. This
    usually involved playing Dallog ( not sure if I have spelt it properly,
    but to some it is called Blind-Mans-Chase ), Dunking for fruit and
    listening to tall stories. One thing we were all warned against was
    never eat the sloes after Samhain because the local Bean_she will have
    peed on them all.
    
    regards
    
    	Brendan 
92.3This seasonal mischief is a pain.MACNAS::JDOOLEYRed-neck,and proud of itMon Nov 04 1991 08:0411
    I live with 2 elderly parents in a recently built up area,Our house
    stood on its own for 20 years before the rest were built.
    Naturally they got used to a certain level of peace and quiet before
    this.
    Now every hollowe'en they are very upset by the mischief that the kids
    get up to in the neighbourhood.
    I'm afraid for the kids if they get caught as my parents take this sort
    of thing very seriously indeed.
    I don't see the humour of it when kids disturb the peace that old
    people are entitled to.
    
92.4why not in oz?TOLKIN::OROURKEwait &#039;til midniteWed Nov 06 1991 18:1913
    
    
    Hi Everybody,
    
    I've got a question.  My recently-made Australian friends tell me that
    Halloween isn't celebrated in their country.  I find this kind of odd
    since rumor has it that a lot of Irish folks emigrated to Oz (by choice
    and otherwise :^)
    
    So, what's the deal?  Why wouldn't the tradition of Samhain been
    brought along with them???
    
    /Jen 
92.5It's too hotALICAT::BOYLEPersonal name set hiddenWed Nov 06 1991 21:2419
    Halloween is celebrated here in Australia only it's pretty low-key.
    Some kids dressed up and came around on the night but not too many.
    There are probably a few reasons why it isn't.
    
    1. A lot of the people here are [decended from] English/British
    migrants. The Brits don't really celebrate Halloween, they prefer to
    wait until Guy Fawkes night (nov. 5th).
    
    2. There are a lot of Aisan peoples here who wouldn't have a clue what
    it was all about.
    
    3. We're on daylight saving time, it doesn't get dark until 9pm so
    there's not much point in the kids dressing up as witches to go out
    frightening people in broad daylight.
    
    4. It's 31�C and it just doesn't 'feel' like halloween.
    
    
    Tony.
92.6Topsy turvy upside down.MACNAS::JDOOLEYGreedy? Me? Gimme that!!!Fri Nov 08 1991 05:445
    It would have to be celebrated on the 30th of April to have the right
    seasonal connotations.
    Looking at my map I see only Tasmania and New Zealand would be South
    enough to be dark early enough to make it authentic...........