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Conference rusure::math

Title:Mathematics at DEC
Moderator:RUSURE::EDP
Created:Mon Feb 03 1986
Last Modified:Fri Jun 06 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:2083
Total number of notes:14613

1940.0. "Math Magazine 1464" by RUSURE::EDP (Always mount a scratch monkey.) Thu Feb 23 1995 12:46

    Proposed by Bill Correll, Jr., student, Denison University, Granville,
    Ohio.
    
    Find all positive rational numbers r != 1 such that r ^ [1/(r-1)] is
    rational.
    
    [Note:  I'm dropping some of my magazine subscriptions, so we may not
    get answers to problems I'm entering now.  I'm keeping Crux.  -- edp]
T.RTitleUserPersonal
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1940.1POLAR::WALSHMTue Feb 28 1995 14:0923
    To start with, define r = p/q, such that p and q are positive integers,
    and p!|q.  We are looking for all pairs (p,q) such that s = (p/q)^(q/(p-q))
    is rational.
    
    Since p/q is rational, obviously s will be rational when the exponent
    is an integer.  This occurs when (p-q)|q.
    
    The other possibility is that the exponent is rational but not
    integral.  Let us assume that this is the case for some (p,q).  Since
    the (p-q)th root of both p and q are integral (this might be an
    unfounded leap, I'm not sure), we can write p=a^n and q=b^n, such that
    (p-q)|n, or (a^n - b^n)|n.  Since a and b are integers, the smallest
    that |a^n - b^n| for any given n can be is 2^n - 1.  It is thus
    possible for s to be rational only when (2^n - 1) <= n.  This is
    impossible for any n>1, which gives us a contradiction.  Therefore
    there exists no such pair (p,q) which are powers greater than 1.
    
    So the only (p,q) that satisfy the condition are those for which
    (p-q)|q.  (Assuming, that is, my leap -- that the only way the (p-q)th
    root of p and q can be commensurate is if they are both integral. 
    True?)
    
    Matt
1940.2RUSURE::EDPAlways mount a scratch monkey.Thu Mar 02 1995 10:0415
    Re .1:
    
    If you add the condition that p and q are relatively prime (their
    greatest common divisor is 1), then it is true that the p-q root of p/q
    is rational iff p and q are both p-q powers.
    
    This condition also allows you to say that p-q divides q only if p-q is
    1 or -1.
    
    
    				-- edp
    
    
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1940.3rigour <> elegance but ...AUSSIE::GARSONachtentachtig kacheltjesThu Mar 02 1995 16:27140
re .1

>p!|q

I find this notation confusing since I read it as "p factorial divides q". I
worked out eventually that you mean p does not divide q.

re .0

    Answer: r must be of form (q+1)/q or q/(q+1).
    
    Proof:
    
Let r = p/q where (p,q) = 1

The expression is (p/q)^(q/(p-q)).

Consider first the case where p > q so that p-q > 0.

We want to find (p-q,q). Let (p-q,q) = t.

t|q and t|p-q => t|p

Since (p,q) = 1 this implies that t = 1 i.e. (p-q,q) = 1.

Consider then the two cases that p-q = 1 and p-q > 1.

If p-q = 1 (this is the "integer" case mentioned in .1) then

p = q+1 so r is of the form (q+1)/q.

Before considering the case that p-q > 1 we establish a few lemmas.

Lemma 1
-------

Where a and b are positive integers, a|b and b|a => a = b

Proof:

From a|b, let b = ak and from b|a, let a = bm

=> b/a = k and b/a = 1/m

=> k = 1/m

=> mk = 1

=> m = 1 (and k = 1)

=> a = b

Lemma 2
-------

For positive integers, a,b,d,x,y with (a,b) = 1 and (x,y) = 1

(a/b)^(1/d) = x/y => a = x^d and b = y^d

[This is the "leap" mentioned in .1.]

Proof:

(a/b)^(1/d) = x/y

=> a/b = (x/y)^d

=> ay^d = bx^d

=> a|x^d and b|y^d and x^d|a and y^d|b (using the gcd preconditions)

=> a = x^d and b = y^d (by Lemma 1)

Lemma 3
-------

For u a rational number and c, d such that (c,d) = 1,
    u^(c/d) is rational => u^(1/d) is rational

Proof:

Let u = g/h and u^(c/d) = j/k where (g,h) = 1 and (j,k) = 1

=> g^c k^d = h^c j^d

=> g^c = j^d and h^c = k^d (proceding as in Lemma 2)

Now let t be an arbitrary prime divisor of g (so clearly t | j).

Let n(z) denote the number of times that t divides z, then

n(g)*c = n(j)*d

Hence, since (c,d) = 1, d | n(g)

=> t^d | g

=> g = j'^d for some j'

(perhaps the case g = 1 should have been covered specially but the conclusion
is obviously true in that case)

Similarly for h, h = k'^d for some k', thus 

g/h = j'^d/k'^d

=> (g/h)^(1/d) = j'/k'

Hence u^(1/d) is rational


Now back to p-q > 1.

In that case, and given (p-q,q) = 1, we can see that

(p/q)^(q/(p-q)) is rational => (p/q)^(1/(p-q)) is rational, by Lemma 3.

Let d = p-q and apply Lemma 2 i.e. p = x^d and q = y^d.

Hence d = p-q = x^d - y^d

Noting that p-q > 1 => d >= 2 and x > y i.e. x-y >= 1,

we can see that

d = x^d - y^d

has no solutions by putting w = x-y i.e. x=y+w and expanding via the binomial
theorem giving

d = d*y^(d-1)*w + C(d,2)*y^(d-2)*w^2 + ...

Looking carefully at the terms shows that the first term is >= d and the second
term is >= 1 (in fact > 1). Consequently the RHS is strictly greater than d and
thus there can be no solutions to d = x^d - y^d.

Thus for p > q i.e. r > 1 the only solutions are of the form (q+1)/q.

Similarly considering the case p < q i.e. r < 1 gives that the only solutions
are of the form p/(p+1). [Did you see my hands wave?]