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Conference rusure::math

Title:Mathematics at DEC
Moderator:RUSURE::EDP
Created:Mon Feb 03 1986
Last Modified:Fri Jun 06 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:2083
Total number of notes:14613

1202.0. "G/N == Cp" by HERON::BUCHANAN (combinatorial bomb squad) Mon Mar 05 1990 08:04

	For any prime p, and any group N, there obviously exists at least
one group G such that N is normal in G, and [G:N] = p.   Namely the direct
product:

	N x Cp

	But that's not very interesting.   

	(1) Given N, for what p can there exist more than one group such
that N is normal in G, and [G:N] = p?

	(2) What groups contain a normal subgroup of order 8 and index p?

Regards,
Andrew.
T.RTitleUserPersonal
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1202.1HPSTEK::XIAIn my beginning is my end.Mon Mar 05 1990 13:367
    re .0
                                                   
    1.  I guess it depends on the nature of N.
    
    2.  Z/8 + Z/p
    
    Eugene
1202.2HERON::BUCHANANcombinatorial bomb squadTue Mar 06 1990 06:0910
>    1.  I guess it depends on the nature of N.

	You surprise me :-).   But how does it depend?   Given a group N
and a prime p, how do you go about the process of finding the possible
groups of order np, with N normal?
    
>    2.  Z/8 + Z/p
    
	Yes, this direct product (although you use a different notation from
me) is the easiest one.   What about the others?
1202.3HPSTEK::XIAIn my beginning is my end.Tue Mar 06 1990 13:564
    1.  Well, one thing we know is that if |N| = q^m for some prime q, then
    there isn't any G that satisfies such condition.
    
    Eugene
1202.4why not give reasonsHERON::BUCHANANcombinatorial bomb squadWed Mar 07 1990 04:337
>    1.  Well, one thing we know is that if |N| = q^m for some prime q, then
>    there isn't any G that satisfies such condition.

	Eh?   What about C2xC2 normal in A4?   (presuming you mean q and p
to be distinct).

Andrew.
1202.5p | |N|*|Aut(N)|HERON::BUCHANANcombinatorial bomb squadWed Mar 07 1990 10:23101
	Given a finite group N and a prime p, what is a reasonable way to
enumerate all the groups G such that N is a normal subgroup of G,
and [G:N] = p.

	Let Aut(N) be the group of automorphisms of N, let Inn(N) be the
group of inner automorphisms of N (ie those which are induced by 
conjugation by some element of N).   Let Z(N) be the centre of N.   Then
let's remember that:
	Inn(N) is normal in Aut(N)
	Inn(N) is IM to N/Z(N)

	Pick � in Aut(N), � in N, such that:
		(1) �^p is the inner AM induced by conjugation by �
		(2) �(�) = �

	Then let P = {0,1,...p-1} have addition defined upon it, and let
'.' denote the group operation already defined on N, then we'll define an 
operation * on the set N x P, which we'll call G, such that;

	(a, i)*(b, j) = (a.�(b), i+j)			(if i+j < p)
		      = (a.�(b).� ,i+j-p)		(if i+j >= p)

	By consideration of the group axioms and the criterion for normality,
conditions (1) & (2) are necessary and sufficient for N to be IM to a
normal subgroup of G, evidently with index p.

	The question then is, how is it possible to simplify the search for
� & p, to avoid blind alleys and repetition.   Some immediate observations
use the orders of N, Aut(N) & Z(N) the centre of N.   Label them n,s & z
respectively.   z|n & n|zs, since Z(N) =< N & N/Z(N) == Inn(N) =< Aut(N).   
Let '$' denote 'does not divide'.

	(i) Wlog, � can be chosen to have order a power of p, by consideration
of the Sylow-p-subgroup of G.  So this gives us another constraint:
		(3) � has order a power of p.

	(ii) So by the above, if p$n, then �=1. (1) & (2) reduce to two
possibilities in this case
	EITHER: �=I, & G is the direct product N X Cp.
	OR: � has order p, and p|s.

	(iii) If � is a strictly outer AM, then since �^p is inner, have pn|zs.

	(iv) If � is an inner AM, afforded by an element a of N, say, then �^p
is induced by exactly the elements in the coset Za^p, which are fixed
elementwise upon conjugation by a.

	Other constraint come from considering symmetries:  after investigating
�, don't try any other AM which is in the same automorphism class (under 
Aut(Aut(N)).   Don't consider any AM which is a power of �.

	Where trying to determine all groups of a given order, different
candidate N may appear.   This also offers scope for (in)efficiency.

	Want also to pull out of the above the conclusion that (unless
we're dealing with N x Cp):

	p | ns

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

	Example: up to IM how many groups of what order have a normal subgroup 
of order 8 and index p?

The groups N up to IM of order 8 are C2^3, C2C4 C8, D4, Q.
Inn(N) respectively are I, I, I, C2^2, C2^2
Aut(N) respectively are GL3(2) (order 168), D4, C2^2, D4, S4 

	From the above, unless p|ns, G is a direct product N x Cp.
Other possibilities before considering p=2 are:

N == Q,    p = 3
N == C2^3, p = 3
N == C2^3, p = 7

	Note, for each of these � = 1, since p$8, so p is the *order* of �.
N == Q,    p = 3   � = (i j k)(-i -j -k) is a suitable representative of
the AM class of Aut(Q) in the standard notation.   So there's a nonabelian 
group of order 24, it's not S4, since S4 does not have 6 elements with the 
same square.

N == C2^3, p = 3   � = ( 0 1 0 ) is a suitable representative of the AM
		       ( 0 0 1 )
		       ( 1 0 0 )
class of Aut(Q) in the standard notation.   So, there's another nonabelian 
group of order 24, it's not S4, since S4 doesn't have 7 involutions.   Nor is it
the previous group, since in each group only 8 elements have order coprime to
3, and these two subgroups are not IM.

N = C2^3, p = 3	   � = ( 0 1 0 ) is a suitable representative of the AM
                       ( 0 0 1 )
		       ( 1 1 0 )
class of Aut(Q) in the standard notation.   So, there's a nonabelian group of
order 56.

	I'll leave the p = 2 case, which I haven't worked out, if someone
wants to play around with the theory above.   I seem to remember that 
there are 14 groups up to IM of order 16, if you want a check.

Regards,
Andrew.
1202.6HPSTEK::XIAIn my beginning is my end.Wed Mar 07 1990 17:234
    re .4, 
    Well, if C2xC2 is indeed normal in A4, then C2xC2 must be the only
    normal subgroup of order |C2xC2|.  This contradicts the assumption.
    Eugene
1202.7Our purposes uncrossedHERON::BUCHANANcombinatorial bomb squadThu Mar 08 1990 08:0121
	Ah!   I see the confusion.    My fault, for not expressing myself
in .0 unambiguously.

	What I was looking for was this:
(A)	Given group N, for what p is there more than one G such that
G/N = Cp?   [There will always be at least one such G, for any p.]

	What you interpreted was:
(B)	Given group N, for what p is there a G such that G/N = Cp, and
N is not the only normal subgroup of order n of the group G?

	So if we are talking about (B), you are right.   A normal
Sylow-q-subgroup is always unique in a group.   In A4, for instance, the
Sylow-2-subgroup is { I, (12)(34), (13)(24), (14)(23) }.

	To return to the original question, it crossed my mind that p =< n,
since the degree of any element of Aut(N) will be a product of orbit
lengths of N under Aut(N), and any such orbit must have length < n.

Regards,
Andrew.
1202.8&HERON::BUCHANANcombinatorial bomb squadThu Mar 08 1990 08:093
	And of course the number of subgroups of order p in G must be
plural to avoid the direct product.   Say there are c of these, then
p | c-1, c | n, etc, by Sylow.
1202.9see 2000.*JOBURG::BUCHANANFri Oct 20 1995 13:121
    
1202.10SPECXN::DERAMODan D&#039;EramoThu Apr 24 1997 13:145
        Re: -< see 2000.* >-
        
        Typo ... Actually, see 2005.*
        
        Dan