Conference rocks::weight_control

    Glenn,

    What are you basing your blood pressure numbers on?  I know the AMA
    recently revised the healthy range for cholesterol down, but I've
    always heard that 120/80 was considered normal, +/- 10 points on both
    numbers.  When I had a problem with BP several years ago (due to
    excessive stress, mostly), it was considered okay once it went back
    below 130/90.  These days it's uniformly below 120/80.

    Unfortunately, it's a lot harder to keep an eye on your cholesterol
    level than weight and BP.

    Beverly

    I don't know what my cholesterol count is but, I do know that my
    BP is 120/80 and my doctor keeps telling me that that is fantastic.
    Even with the 3 F strikes against me (fat, female and forty+), it
    has remained there for quite a few years now.
    My son, who is 20 yrs. younger than me and fit and trim, has a
    cholesterol and high BP problem.  So how do you explain it???
    
    Hugs,
    Fran

    Good morning Beverly.  Somehow I'm not surprised that you were the
    first one to reply to my note.  You and I always seem to have fun
    with these issues. (As evidenced in notes 198 and 200.)
    
    Long ago I learned that 110/70 was the benchmark for BP.  I guess
    that 120/80 is ok too, but I know that 180/110 is horrendous.  I
    don't believe that having a BP of below 120/80 is of any
    concern.  That's great.
    
    Fran, I've never heard of the 3F's.  That's great.  I love it. 
    Anyway, you're son who MAY APPEAR fit and trim, is certainly not
    healthy if he has a high cholesterol and BP problem.  Appearances
    are VERY deceiving.  My wife, who is 5'2" and 105 lbs has high
    cholesterol of 235, while mine is 160 and I'm still overweight.
    Another friend of mine jogs 5+ miles everyday at lunch and was
    devastated to find out that his cholesterol was 255, yet he LOOKS
    absolutely great.  If you think of someone being fit and trim, you
    would think of this guy, yet he has a potentially life threatening
    sickness.  Now he wants to know about diet!  So, while one may LOOK
    healthy, they may or may not be and that was the point of this note
    anyway.  You should know and monitor your cholesterol rating and
    blood pressure.  They provide you with GREAT insight into your 
    health.
    
    Glenn

       re .0:
       
       > don't get caught up in the nonsense about good and bad
       > cholesterol! 
       
       Glenn, I don't know what your credentials are, I don't know what
       studies you have personally undertaken.  Presumably, you've gotten
       your informatiuon from people who consider themselves to be
       knowledgeable; it's unfortunate, though, that you don't at least
       tell those people in this conference (who may have neither the
       means nor time to research the issue) that many of your opinions
       are not shared by a large portion of the medical community.
       
       Most of what I know, or think that I know, about cholesterol comes
       from my physician.  I trust his credentials: he's been on the
       faculty of Harvard Medical School for more than 15 years, he is a
       voracious reader of all sorts of medical journals (both
       traditional and non-traditional), and he does not shy away from
       sharing his knowledge or discussing alternative means of
       treatment.  
       
       He told me that the essential aspect of cholesterol is the ratio
       of the high-<mumble> cholesterol to low-<mumble>; the lower the
       ratio, the better off you are.  For most people, the ratio is
       about 1:5; for a person with that ratio, a cholesterol level not
       above the low 200s would be desireable.  However, someone with a
       higher proportion of the high-<mumble> cholesterol -- for example,
       1:3 -- could have a cholesterol level of 280 or 300 and still be
       considered to have an excellent cholesterol level.
       
       Now, Glenn, I'm sure that you really believe that what you are
       saying is true.  But the road to hell is paved with the best of
       intentions.  Can you tell us why it is adviseable, and not
       downright dangerous, for us to lend more credibility to you
       and the people from whom you get your information than to the
       mainstream medical opinions in the country today?
       
       --Mr Topaz

    Mr. Topaz,
    
    I do not presume to tell you who to listen to.  But one purpose
    of a notes conference is for the exchange of ideas and opinions,
    and I do that freely.  You may, of course, choose to consider what
    I say or not.  And I encourage you to make that choice. 
    
    I have no medical background.  I am a Software Specialist here in
    Colorado, but what I have done is taken responsibility for my own
    health and not leave that in the hands of the medical community.
    
    As you may already know, I don't hold America's "mainstream medical
    community" in real high regard.  I have a number of reasons why,
    but to name just a few, the "mainstream medical community" of the
    United States, tells arthritic individuals that diet has no effect
    on arthritis, when in fact it has been shown to be virtually a 100%
    cure.  They don't tell women that the causes of osteoporosis is
    an excess of protein.  Instead American women are buying calcium
    pills and throwing them down their throats.  WHY?  Because there's
    money for the calcium pill pushers in this deception.  And I have
    more, but to get to the "good cholesterol vs. bad cholesterol"
    question.....
    
    Cholesterol can be divided into fractions based roughly on their
    density.  People with higher levels of the high density cholesterol
    have been found to have less heart disease (when compared with other
    people with a high risk for heart disease - other Americans)  When
    compared with people who eat a healthier diet (people of less wealthy
    countries.), who also have little or no heart disease, this 
    HDL-cholesterol/heart disease relationship no longer holds.  Those 
    people with the least heart disease have the lowest TOTAL cholesterol
    and the lowest HDL-cholesterol (because HDL is the end product of
    cholesterol metabolism, when little cholesterol is eaten, little
    is made.)  Knowledge of HDL levels can harm a patient by false
    reassurance.  A doctor may say "Your total cholesterol is 278 mg%,
    but don't worry because your HDLs are high."  Wrong - this person
    is still in big trouble and should direct all efforts to lowering
    his cholesterol.  
    
    At the other extreme, a doctor may tell patients with total cholesterol
    below 150 mg% to eat more cholesterol because their HDL levels are
    low.  Silly!
    
    Rely on your total cholesterol level!  Don't get caught up in this 
    good cholesterol, bad cholesterol deception.
    
    This is my opinion Mr. Topaz.  What does your doctor say about this
    philosophy?  Will you take it to him for his opinion?  If you wish 
    have him contact my doctor:

		Dr. John McDougall
		PO Box 14039
		Santa Rosa, California  95402

    You want credentials on Dr. McDougall?
    Dr John McDougall graduated from the Michigan State Univeristy 
    Medical School, recieved certification from the American Board of
    Internal Medicine and the National Board of Medical Examiners and is 
    the Assistant Clinical Professor at the University of hawaii School
    of Medicine.  He is a practising physician who uses dietary 
    approaches to treat diseases.  He is working on a three-year study 
    funded by the Straub Foundation in which he is treating breast 
    cancer by diet.  And he is the Medical Directory of the St. Helena
    Hospital's dietary program in Napa Valley, California.
    
    Glenn

    re .0:
    
    I certainly can't disagree about the importance of keeping one's
    cholesterol and blood pressure at a healthy level.  
                                                   
    However, it's my understanding that the upper limit of what is
    considered a safe level is around 140/90 (at least that's what Health
    Services at ZKO has told me on a few occasions), rather than the
    110/70 level you cited in the base note.
    
    
    Paul (who checked in at 100/60 a few weeks ago)

    Another fun fact you should know about yourself is your pulse.
    This is a good number to keep track of since you can check it
    yourself.  The only instruments you need are a clock, your
    fingers, and your wrist or neck.  As you diet and exercise, you
    will find that your pulse will gradually lower.  Mine went from
    76 the day I started my diet, to 58 last week when I checked it.
    Ask any nurse or doctor or certified aerobics instructor how to
    do a pulse check - it's easier to explain person-to-person than
    in writing.
    
    --Louise

    I would like to point out that the normal state of the body is HEALTH,
    not illness.  The body has an innate ability to heal and maintain
    health once the factors causing the disease are removed.  And since
    I believe that dietary and lifestyle factors cause most chronic
    diseases, the key to regaining health is to correct these factors.
    
    People are intended to be healthy and fully functional throughout
    their normal lifespan, an average of about 85 years. 
    
    Diet and lifestyle are the causes of most of the deaths and
    disabilities that people suffer in the United States today.  In
    particular, they are the causes of most of the degenerative diseases,
    which include most cancers, osteoporosis, atherosclerosis and its
    complications such as heart disease and strokes, hypertension (high
    blood pressure), diabetes, arthritis, and kidney disease.  Knowing
    the cause is the first step toward prevention and treatment.
    
    Glenn

    Brace yourself, Glenn.  I agree!

    A friend I hadn't seen in a while told me this weekend that I'm looking
    better than he's seen me in a long time!  I told him I'd lost 20 lbs,
    and he said that was only part of it -- I was carrying myself better,
    and seemed happier.  I thought about that for a while, and realized
    that I feel healthy now, which I usually didn't before.  Looking in
    the mirror, I saw a much healthier and calmer person looking out at me.
    There are other things going on in my life which help this, but eating
    properly is the biggest.  

    Beverly

    I liked your first sentence..."Brace yourself, Glenn.  I agree!"
    
    I'm thrilled for you Beverly.  20 pounds is alot.  Do you want to
    lose more?  
    
    Glenn

    
       Thanks, Glenn.  Around 15 lbs is when I started to really feel
       different.  As you'd know if you payed attention to the Progress
       topic :-), I want to lose a total of (about) 50.
    
       
       Beverly
    

    
    In 1964, the Surgeon General came out with a report on Smoking and
    Health and it is now considered the final authority on the dangers
    of smoking.  It took more than 20 years after that report on tobacco,
    for smoking to become socially unacceptable and to enact legislation
    to prohibit smoking in public places.
    
    Now after many years and more than 360 doctor's involvement, there
    is the Surgeon General's Report on Nutrition and Health.  It deals
    with diet and; heart disease and cholesterol, high blood pressure, 
    cancer, diabetes, osteoporosis, kidney disease, food allergies and 
    more.
    
    To get a copy, write or call the national office:
    
    	Superintendent of Documents
    	US Government Printing Office
    	Washington DC 20402-9325
    	(202) 783-3238 (then push 16)
    
    They take credit cards.  The cost is $2.75 for the summary and
    $22.00 for the complete report (No postage or tax).
    
    I'm putting this note here, because I started this one on dieting
    and TOTAL HEALTH, and consequently the Surgeon General's Report
    on Nutrition and Health, I feel, fits here.   
    
    The gist of the report is to eat alot less meat and diary 
    products, and more whole grains, vegetables and fruits, which 
    means less fat, less cholesterol, less protein, less sodium, 
    and more carbohydrates and more fiber.
    
    Glenn.