| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 19.1 | The US Navy's rank/grade structure | ABE::STARIN | When all else fails, read the manual! | Mon Nov 20 1989 15:03 | 37 |
| Re .0:
Ok, here's the route for a USN/USNR sailor....
Seaman Recruit E-1
Seaman Apprentice E-2
Seaman E-3
Petty Officer 3rd Class E-4
Petty Officer 2nd Class E-5 (reputedly the best rank in the
USN/USNR)
Petty Officer 1st Class E-6
Chief Petty Officer E-7
Senior Chief Petty Officer E-8
Master Chief Petty Officer E-9
Warrant Officer W-1
Chief Warrant Officer W-2
Chief Warrant Officer W-3
Chief Warrant Officer W-4
Ensign O-1 (Chiefs get more respect than Ensigns)
Lieutenant Junior Grade O-2
Lieutenant O-3
Lieutenant Commander O-4
Commander O-5
Captain O-6
Rear Admiral O-7
Vice Admiral O-8
(I'm drawing a blank on the proper titles for the next two admirals
grades - I'll check on them tonight).
Typically, most enlisted US Navy Reservists retire as PO1's or Chiefs
while most officers retire as Commander.
Mark
RMC USNR
|
| 19.2 | | LANDO::DENNING | | Mon Nov 20 1989 15:07 | 7 |
| Re: 19.1
Most people retire as E-6s and E-7s???
I am planning on retiring as an E-9.
Don
|
| 19.3 | Depends on your rate | ABE::STARIN | When all else fails, read the manual! | Mon Nov 20 1989 15:12 | 11 |
| Re .2:
Are you in the Navy Reserve? If so, you're to be commended for your
drive and determination because unless you're in a critical rate
you're gonna need it!
For example, don't expect to make E-9 if you're an ET (Electronics
Technician) or an Draftsman.
Mark
RMC USNR
|
| 19.4 | No ARMY | LANDO::DENNING | | Mon Nov 20 1989 15:31 | 3 |
| No Army Reserve...
Have I got a deal for you...
|
| 19.5 | No more gravel agitation for me, thanks | ABE::STARIN | When all else fails, read the manual! | Mon Nov 20 1989 16:05 | 7 |
| Re .4:
Army? Why do you think I switched to the Navy Reserve :)
:) :)
Mark
RMC USNR
|
| 19.6 | Army is the fastest | MPGS::MCCLURE | Why Me??? | Mon Nov 20 1989 18:40 | 8 |
| re last few,
Guys that are only familiar with the Army, don't know how tough it is
to make rank in the other services. The Army has a wide variety of
positions and a high turn-over rate. For instance, I once recruited
an ex-navy corpsman. He got off active duty as an E3. I could take
him into the Army Reserve as an E3 and get him promoted to E4 in a
month with only the time in grade keeping him from E5.
|
| 19.7 | created earlier | MPGS::MCCLURE | Why Me??? | Mon Nov 20 1989 18:44 | 50 |
| The armed forces usually have different titles for the different ranks.
The US armed forces are no exception. The US has established a uniform
pay structure, which does allow you to cross reference rank by asking
what pay grade the other guy is. There are 9 enlisted, 4 warrant and 10
officer pay grades. Due to lack of room to do a table and some lack of
familiarity, I'll enter the Army.
Grd Rank Insignia
--- ------- --------
E1 Private (PV1) None
E2 Private (PV2) Single Chevron, point up
E3 Pvt First Cl (PFC) Single Chevron w/rocker
E4 Specialist (SPC) Inverted shield patch w/'army' Eagle
Corporal (CPL) Two Chevrons (considered an NCO)
E5 Sargeant (SGT) Three Chevrons
E6 Staff Sgt (SSG) Three Chevrons, one Rocker
E7 Sgt First Cl (SFC) Three Chevrons, two Rockers
Platoon Sgt (PSG) Same insignia
E8 Master Sgt (MSG) Three Chevrons, three Rockers
First Sgt (1SG) Three and three w/Diamond in center
E9 Sgt Major (SGM) Three and three w/Star in center
Command Sgt Maj (CSM) Three and three w/Wreath around Star
In addition, there is the Command Sergeant Major of the Army (CSMA), that
has two stars in the middle of the chevron. This is a temporary post and
is still an E9. The First Sergeant exists only at the company level and is
the senior NCO leadership position, even if the company has E9 positions.
The Command Sergeant Major is found at Battalion, Brigade, Division, Corps
or Army level.
W1 Warrant Officer (WO1) Gold bar w/one black square
W2 Chief Warrant 2 (CW2) Silver bar w/two squares
W3 (CW3) Silver bar w/three squares
W4 (CW4) Silver bar w/four squares
O1 2nd Lieutenant (2LT) Gold Bar
O2 1st Lieutenant (1LT) Silver Bar
O3 Captain (CPT) Two Silver Bars
O4 Major (MAJ) Gold Oak Leaf
O5 Lt Colonel (LTC) Silver Oak Leaf
O6 Colonel (COL) Silver US Eagle
O7 Brigadier General (BG) One Star
O8 Major General (MG) Two Stars
O9 Lt General (LTG) Three Stars
O10 General (GEN) Four Stars
In addition, General of the Army (five stars arranged in a circle). This
is an honorary promotion that has only been given to a select few generals
upon retirement.
|
| 19.8 | GOA not an honorary rank | LANDO::DENNING | | Mon Nov 20 1989 18:50 | 10 |
| RE:.-1
I think that you will find that the rank of "General of the Armies"
is a real rank. I can name 2 that held that rank during their time
on Active Duty.
John Pershing
Douglas MacArthur
|
| 19.9 | Fleet Admiral | ABE::STARIN | When all else fails, read the manual! | Mon Nov 20 1989 19:00 | 8 |
| Re .8:
The Navy's counterpart I believe was Fleet Admiral Chester Nimitz
and the rank went away when he joined the Big Canoe Club In The
Sky.
Mark
RMC USNR
|
| 19.10 | Shades of Major Major | SAC::PHILPOTT_I | Col I F 'Tsingtao Dhum' Philpott | Tue Nov 21 1989 08:26 | 12 |
|
Trivia time: why is it "General of the Army" rather than "Field Marshal"?
Answer (quite genuine - check the Senate/House of Representatives minutes) is
that the candidate for whom the rank was introduced was General Marshal (sp?)
and they didn't want to have to call him 'Marshal Marshal'.
The 'five star' ranks are real enough but are not consistantly filled - you
really need to increase the numbers in the armed forces to war time levels
before you need a 5*
/. Ian .\
|
| 19.11 | No 5 star commands | MPGS::MCCLURE | Why Me??? | Tue Nov 21 1989 12:59 | 12 |
| re GOA
Yes, it is true that some were "still on active duty" when they
attained 5* rank. Technically speaking, they all were. You don't
get post-retirement promotions, only posthumous. MacArthur was
promoted AFTER being removed from command and after returning
state side.
Even if Marshall wasn't the first one considered, I believe that
sentiment would have been against the title Field Marshal. After
all, it was a European invention.8-)
Bob Mc
|
| 19.12 | clear as mud | MPGS::MCCLURE | Why Me??? | Tue Nov 21 1989 13:23 | 17 |
| re .0, WO
It should be noted that Warrant Officers in the US forces are not
NCOs. Their rank WAS in between enlisted and officer, had all of
the priviledges of an officer, but could not hold command positions.
Warrants are specialists in their field and can stay in the same
position for their entire career. Recently, the rules were changed
somewhat. Warrant Officers can now be commisioned. A commisioned
Warrant Officer can now hold command positions. So now, the maint-
enance WO is actually in command of the Maintenance Platoon and
could become the commander of a Maintenance Detachment. Previously,
they would have to assign a Lieutenant. This also resolved the
incongruity of an aviation Warrant being the aircraft commander,
but Warrants couldn't hold command positions.
Bob Mc
|
| 19.13 | Warrants as OIC's | ABE::STARIN | When all else fails, read the manual! | Wed Nov 22 1989 16:25 | 15 |
| Re .12:
Roger that....it is very common in the Navy Communications community
for Warrants to be OIC's (Officers in Charge) of dets. or whatever.
Incidentally, Chief Petty Officers can also be assigned as OIC's
but only to dets. where the "horsepower" associated with a Warrant
Officer is not required.
I don't think the same is true for US Army and Marine Corps E-7's
and above (I may be wrong though). I think they can only be NCOIC's
(NCOs In Charge).
Mark
RMC USNR
|
| 19.14 | ? | MPGS::MCCLURE | Why Me??? | Wed Nov 22 1989 17:18 | 6 |
| I think that the differance, is in semantics. Detachment commanders
can be E7 and up, but I think the Army would still refer to an enlisted
Detachment Commander as the NCOIC. It raises some very interesting
legal questions concerning UCMJ.
Bob Mc
|
| 19.15 | One more Warrant position | CTOAVX::GONSALVES | Serv - Escaped from NY! | Wed Nov 22 1989 17:54 | 8 |
| I remember reading about a new W5 position a few months back in
Reserve Magazine. The title was to be Master Warrant Officer.
Did anyone else see that?
I'll try to find the article.
Serv
|
| 19.16 | | KAOA04::KLEIN | Nulli Secundus | Fri Nov 24 1989 21:48 | 32 |
|
The Canadian Armed Forces has the same rank structure for all branches, however,
the Navy does use different names. The first list covers all Non Commissioned
Officers (NCO). The second all Commissioned Officers.
Army and Air Force Rank Navy Rank Insignia
----------------------- --------- --------
Private Recruit Seaman Recruit None
Private Seaman Single Chevron, point down
Corporal Leading Seaman Two Chevrons (considered an NCO)
Master Corporal Master Seaman Two Chevrons with Maple Leaf
Sergeant Petty Officer Three Chevrons with Maple Leaf
Warrant Officer Petty Officer 2 One Crown
Master Warrant Officer Petty Officer 1 One Crown with wreath
Chief Warrant Officer Chief Petty Officer Canadian Coat of Arms
2nd Lieutenant Ensign 1 thin stripe
Lieutenant Sub-lieutenant 1 thin with 1 thick stripe
Captain Lieutenant 2 thick stripes
Major Lieutenant Commander 1 thin between 2 thick stripes
Lt Colonel Commander 3 thick stripes
Colonel Captain 4 thick stripes
Brigadier General Commodore 1 maple leaf
Major General ?? 2 maple leaf
Lt General ?? 3 maple leaf
General Admiral 4 maple leaf
I am not totally sure about the navy ranks, I know there is a Vice Admiral in
there but not sure what it is equivalent to. If anyone knows, please post here.
Unlike the US Armed Forces, our Warrant Officers are not considered officers
and are not saluted.
|
| 19.17 | I have a first name - it's Chief | ABE::STARIN | It didn't happen on my watch, Chief. | Sat Nov 25 1989 21:00 | 13 |
| Re .16:
About 17 years ago, I was on a radio relay site not far from Heilbronn,
FRG with several of my Royal Canadian Signals counterparts, one
of whom included a Warrant Officer. I couldn't understand why the
Warrant kept giving me baffled looks when I addressed him as "Sir"
or "Mr. Smith".
Later I found out that he was equivalent to a US Army platoon sergeant
- no wonder he was baffled!
Mark
RMC USNR
|
| 19.18 | Confusion about US Navy Rear Admirals/Commodores | LCDR::REITER | I'm the NRA | Mon Nov 27 1989 13:26 | 28 |
| Grade Rank Army, etc.= Insignia
O6 Captain Colonel Silver Eagle
(not a Flag rank, but included for continuity sake)
O7 Rear Admiral, Brigadier One Star for Army, Marines, Air Force
Lower Half General Two Stars for Navy*
O8 Rear Admiral, Major
Upper Half General Two Stars for all services
O9 Vice Admiral Lieutenant
General Three Stars (all)
O10 Fleet Admiral whatever Four Stars
* The O-7 rank is the source of much confusion. The wartime rank of Commodore
is sometimes bestowed upon Captains who are promoted as squadron commanders to
flag rank. The Navy only likes to use this during wartime. In peacetime,
newly-promoted Admirals and O-8s both are referred to as Rear Admiral, with
the difference noted only for purposes of pay and perks... the uniforms are the
same. This upsets the other services.
On 15 Sep 1981, the Defense Officer Personnel Mnamagement Act (DOPMA) attempted
to align the services and created the official grade of Commodore at O-7. The
Navy played ball for a few years but is now back to the informal system in
open defiance of DOPMA.
\Gary
|
| 19.19 | Warrent Officers. | PEKING::NASHD | | Mon Nov 27 1989 13:46 | 9 |
| The Warrent Officer, as far as I know, is only found in the RAF
over here. The Commissioned Officers address him as Mr. whereas
the other NCO's or lower address him as sir. A WO is not saluted
as he does not hold a commission.
I can't remember reading this anywhere but I have noted some confusion,
so this is how it's done in the RAF.
Dave
|
| 19.20 | | SAC::PHILPOTT_I | Col I F 'Tsingtao Dhum' Philpott | Mon Nov 27 1989 13:58 | 19 |
| In the British Army, Warrant Officers exist (both W.O.I & W.O.II), but they
are Sergeant Majors (or Corporal Majors in the cavalry), and that title
is used.
Indeed since they have a lot of experience, should they be promoted to
commisioned rank, there is a special route for them: they can become
Quarter-Master Lieutenants ( and the Q.M. Captains...) bypassing the need to
pass through the much despised 2nd Lieutenant rank
[My cousin passed that way a couple of years back - he is a glutton for
volunteering: having started as a boy soldier, he volunteered for the
every-ready reserve, parachute training, military police and bomb disposal,
leading the family to assume he has a death wish coupled to a strong desire to
be disliked :-) Still he met his wife when an Irish sub-teenager hit him on
the head with a house brick whilst defusing a 500 lb car bomb in Northern
Ireland (she was an army nurse). He's now in Abu Dhabi teaching the locals how
to defuse (and set) booby traps]
/. Ian .\
|
| 19.21 | Rank/Grade | ASABET::HICKMAN | | Fri Jan 26 1990 18:45 | 49 |
| 19.1 RE:
I belived you miss a few ranks:
Fleet Admiral 0-10
Admiral 0-9
Vice Admiral 0-8
Rear Admiral 0-7
Commodore 0-6
Captain 0-5
Commander 0-4
Lt. Commander 0-3
Lt. 0-2
Ensign 0-1
Enlisted Commissions:
Lt. Commander 0-3E
Lt. 0-2E
Ensign 0-1E
Warrant W-4
Warrant W-3
Warrant W-2
Warrant W-1
Master Chief Petty Officer Of The Navy - Three Stars E-10
Master Chief Petty Oficer Two Stars E-9
Senior Chief petty Officer one Star E-8
Chief Petty Officer E-7
First Class Petty Officer E-6
Second Class Petty Officer E-5
Third Class Petty Officer E-4
Seaman/Fireman Three Slanted Stripes E-3
Seaman/Fireman Apprentice Two Slanted Stripes E-2
Seaman/Fireman Boot Camp Obne Slanted Stripe E-1
This Information Taken From The 1987 Pay Scale.
Fleet Admiral Can never retire,always on active duty til death. A war
time rank made by the president and oked by congress.
Commodore is a war time rank.
|
| 19.22 | O-_E?????????? | PHENIX::TARMEY | | Fri Jan 26 1990 19:15 | 19 |
| RE: .21
O-1,2,3E?????
These are new to me - what are they? What's the difference between
an O-3 and an O-3E? I remember the term "Mustang", but to the best
of my knowledge, other than longevity, there was absolutely no
difference between a Mustang or a 'Canoe U' Grad or an OCS Grad,
etc.
A case might be made that Mustangs, because of their significant
experience and longevity, are smarter. However, I think Lloyd
Bucher blew that case!
Have never heard of "Commissioned Enlisted".
Thanks,
Bill Tarmey
|
| 19.23 | Enlisted Commission | ASABET::HICKMAN | | Fri Jan 26 1990 19:55 | 12 |
| RE:22
The 0-3E,0-2E,0-1E, Are the highest ranks that can be had by an
enlisted man thru the ranks, He either has to be an E-6 or above, be
recommended by his skipper, go before the promotion board to be
interveiwed. This is differance from OCS (90 day Wonders) or The Naval
College. Its just an enlisted man making officer status, He can not go
above 0-3. Lt Commander. I understand Its very hard to get by the
Promotion board, you have to be 4.0 sailor with the years in. You could
call them mustangs. I have known a few who has been commissioned this
way. When they're ready to retire they have to convert back to the
hightest enlisted rank they held before being commissioned.
|
| 19.24 | new data..... | PHENIX::TARMEY | | Fri Jan 26 1990 20:07 | 12 |
| RE: .23
Thanks for the info. This sounds different from what I remember of
"Mustangs". There was no 'ceiling', except perhaps one arbitrarily
placed by a Promotion Board. Bucher, the Skipper of the Pueblo was a
full Commander, I think.
I won't debate your information, it's just that it's new to me. By the
way, O-3 is a LT, a LCDR is O-4. Seems they would keep these
designations consistent.
Bill Tarmey
|
| 19.25 | 0-1E,0-2E,0-3E =L.D.O. | ASABET::HICKMAN | | Mon Jan 29 1990 10:53 | 18 |
| RE:.24
This week end i refreshed my mind and got more info for you on the
0-1E,0-2E 0-3E Pay scale.
These are what they call L.D.O. (Limited Duty Officers) They can
advance to the rank of Lt. Commander and are limited in the tectnical
fields associated with their specialties, Only Warrant Officers and the
top 4 enlisted grades can apply,They have to consistently demonstrated
outstanding ability in the performance of his dutys, also has to have a
High School Education,(required).
He submitts his request to his C.O., And if he approves the C.O.
request made to the Naval Examining Center for the Officer Selection
Battery Test,Result of the test is sent to the Examining Center for
grading and submission to the Chief Of Naval Personnel. The candidate
is required to forward a detail application which with the results of
the Officer Selection Battery Forms which are the basis of selection.
Actual selection is made by the Secretary Of The Navy, Selections are
then sent to the President for appointment.
|
| 19.26 | FLEET ADMIRALS | ASABET::HICKMAN | | Mon Jan 29 1990 11:05 | 13 |
| RE:.9
Fleet Admirals rank was established December 1944, and was effective
unitl 6 months after the W.W.II, but a later act of Congress 23 March
1946 made it a permanent grade. below are the Fleet Admirals in the
order of promotions:
Fleet Admiral William D. Leahy
Fleet Admiral Ernest J. King
Fleet Admiral Chester W. Nimitz
Fleet Admiral William F. Halsey Jr.
This and Note on 0-1E,0-2E,0-3E was from the Navy training course Book
"Naval Orientations" Navpers 16138-D 1961.
|
| 19.27 | A clarification | DOCSRV::STARIN | Navy Radiomen Do It With Frequency | Mon Jan 29 1990 13:55 | 22 |
| Re all:
O1E, O2E, and O3E do not, as far as I know, have anything to do
with limiting the career path of a former raghat or Chief who has
accepted a commission. They are PAYGRADES only - former enlisted
people in those officer paygrades receive more money than their
counterparts who don't have enlisted service. Once a raghat or a
Chief makes 0-4 (and most of the younger ones do) then they are
paid the same as any other O-4 with a similar number of years service.
Here are the current sources the Navy has for commissioned officers:
OCS
Naval Academy
LDO
Direct Commissions
ROTC
Hope that clarifies things.
Mark
RMC USNR
|
| 19.28 | Let's not get into old ranks | MPGS::MCCLURE | Why Me??? | Mon Jan 29 1990 16:50 | 14 |
| re .21
E10????
That threw me for a loop, until I saw the the date of your reference
(1961). There have been a number of attempts by the various services
to work out who does what. The result was a cross-leveling. At the
present time, E9 is the highest enlisted (pay)grade in all services.
The top post (one per service) is an appointed post and is limited to
a certain number of years tenure. The pay grade is still E9, even
though they have their own insignia of rank and, in the case of the
Army, a unigue branch insignia.
Bob Mc
|
| 19.29 | WHOA!! MANY MISTAKES!! | LCDR::REITER | I'm the NRA | Mon Jan 29 1990 21:02 | 58 |
| I can't believe no one has caught these yet! Before you go correcting others...
I apologize if this sounds preachy, but after seven replies someone should have
caught these OBVIOUS errors...
MY CORRECTIONS ARE IN THIS TAB STOP
|
|
>> 19.1 RE:
>> I belived you miss a few ranks:
Fleet Admiral 0-10 ?
Admiral 0-9 VICE ADMIRAL (THREE STAR ADMIRAL)
Vice Admiral 0-8 REAR ADMIRAL UPPER HALF
Rear Admiral 0-7 REAR ADMIRAL LOWER HALF or COMMODORE
Commodore 0-6 CAPTAIN (NOT FLAG RANK)
Captain 0-5 COMMANDER
Commander 0-4 LIEUTENANT COMMANDER
Lt. Commander 0-3 LIEUTENANT
Lt. 0-2 LIEUTENANT JUNIOR GRADE
Ensign 0-1 SO FAR SO GOOD :7)
Enlisted Commissions: <--- NEVER HEARD THE TERM USED
THESE ARE "SAVED PAY" PAYGRADES
Lt. Commander 0-3E LIEUTENANT
Lt. 0-2E LIEUTENANT JUNIOR GRADE
Ensign 0-1E correct
Warrant W-4 CWO4
Warrant W-3 CWO3
Warrant W-2 CWO2
Warrant W-1 THE NAVY DOESN'T HAVE CWO-1's!!!
Master Chief Petty Officer Of The Navy - Three Stars E-10
Master Chief Petty Oficer Two Stars E-9
Senior Chief petty Officer one Star E-8
Chief Petty Officer E-7
First Class Petty Officer E-6
Second Class Petty Officer E-5
Third Class Petty Officer E-4
Seaman/Fireman Three Slanted Stripes E-3
Seaman/Fireman Apprentice Two Slanted Stripes E-2
Seaman/Fireman Boot Camp Obne Slanted Stripe E-1 SEAMAN RECRUIT
> This Information Taken From The 1987 Pay Scale.
> Fleet Admiral Can never retire,always on active duty til death. A war
> time rank made by the president and oked by congress.
I trust that some typing errors were made.
> Commodore is a war time rank.
Actually, it was reinstated by the Defense Officer Personnel Manpower Act of
1981 (DOPMA) as a replacement for Rear Admiral Lower Half.
\Gary Disbursing Officer, USS PRAIRIE (AD-15) DSSN X7490 1977-1979
Disbursing Instructor, NSCS Athens GA 1977-1982
|
| 19.30 | need some clarity | MSBTEM::TARMEY | | Tue Jan 30 1990 12:43 | 14 |
| RE: .27
Mark,
You mentioned that former enlisted receive a higher pay the their
counterparts. Is this because of longevity? My guess is that an
Ensign with more than five years is rare.
Also, in your listing of Commission sources you did not mention
Pensacola. Is that covered in 'OCS', of don't they do that anymore?
Thanks,
Bill Tarmey
|
| 19.31 | | SSGVAX::LEONHARDT | DDs Bs & GG1s | Tue Jan 30 1990 20:01 | 16 |
| O-1 ENSIGN
O-2 LTJG
O-3 LT
O-4 LCDR
O-5 CDR
O-6 CAPT
O-7 REAR ADMIRAL (LOWER HALF) (COMMODORE)
O-8 REAR ADMIRAL
O-9 VICE ADMIRAL
O-10 ADMIRAL
GOD FLEET ADMIRAL
O-1E - 3E refers, I believe, to the ex enlisted status and
differentiated from regular O-1 to O-3 in pay scales. There
never has been any restriction on ex-enlisted rising to Fleet Admiral
if they could get there.
|
| 19.32 | Longevity | DOCSRV::STARIN | Navy Radiomen Do It With Frequency | Wed Jan 31 1990 13:57 | 11 |
| Re .30:
I believe it is based on longevity - sort of a reward for going
from E-6 to O-1, although some people would argue that's a *demotion*
not a promotion! :-)
When I mentioned OCS, I should have added AOCS as well. It is still
in existence as far as I know.
Mark
RMC USNR
|
| 19.33 | | MPGS::MCCLURE | Why Me??? | Tue Feb 06 1990 18:34 | 9 |
| Here's what he official US DoD pay scale has to say about O1-O3E.
"Commissioned Officers With More Than 4 Years of Active Duty As An
Enlisted Member Or Warrant Officer".
There's another new(recent) wrinkle. E1s with more than 4 months
service get a pay increase. Could it be that more folks are
'returning' to E1 and they want to ease the pain? 8-)
Bob Mc
|
| 19.34 | USMC Ranks | LEDS::HORSEY | | Wed Feb 07 1990 23:15 | 45 |
| Maybe you would like to see the USMC rank structure -
Private E-1 no insignia often addressed as "maggot"
Private First Class E-2 single chevron
Lance Corporal E-3 chevron & crossed rifles
Corporal E-4 2 chevrons & " "
Sergeant E-5 3 chevrons & " "
Staff Sergeant E-6 3 chevrons, 1 rocker & crossed rifles
Gunnery Sergeant E-7 3 " , 2 rockers & " " called "gunny"
Master Sergeant E-8 3 " , 3 " & " "
First Sergeant E-8 3 " , 3 " & diamond called "top"
Master Gunnery Sergeant E-9 3 chev, 4 rockers & flaming bomb - called
"guns"
Sergeant Major E-9 3 chevrons, 4 rockers & Star called "sergeant
major"
All First sergeants outrank all master sergeants.
All Sergeants major outrank all master gunnery sergeants.
The difference at that level is that of specialty vs. command MOS's.
Warrant Officer W-1
Chief Warrant Officer W-2
Chief Warrant Officer W-3
Chief Warrant Officer W-4 All warrant officers called "Gunner"
There was a special designation (maybe still is) called "Marine Gunner"
for certain warrant officers, which in addition to the warrant officer
bar (cant remember color, etc. for the different grades) was recognized
by a flaming bomb insignia.
Second Lieutenant O-1 gold bar
First Lieutenant O-2 silver bar
Captain O-3 two silver bars called "skipper"
Major O-4 gold oak leaf
Lieutenant Colonel O-5 silver oak leaf
Colonel O-6 silver eagle
Brigadier General O-7 1 Silver star
Major General O-8 2 stars
Lieutenant General O-9 3 stars usually only about 6 officers
General O-10 4 stars usually only the Commandant and
Assistant Commandant are full generals.
Warrant officers and lieutenants are customarily addressed as "Mister
(name)" by all ranks, and captains who are in charge of ship's Marine
detachments are politely addressed as "major" to avoid confusion with
the ship's captain, by the naval folks.
|
| 19.35 | '89 update | MPGS::MCCLURE | Why Me??? | Fri Feb 09 1990 14:05 | 25 |
| My unit just received the latest 'Insignia of Rank' poster.
Its 'Official Issue', including revisions from 1989. I wrote
down the AF enlisted and will enter that later. Other things
of note:
The only change to the Army structure, from what I described earlier,
is that the position of Master Warrant Officer, apparently, was
authorized, but is the same pay grade as CW4. The insignia of rank
is a gold bar w/4 *open* squares as opposed to the 4 solid squares
for the CW4.
The Marine Corps appears to match the entered description.
The Navy and Coast Guard show a split in the E9 Insignia/title.
Along with Mastter Chief Petty Officer, the Navy shows a Fleet/
Command MCPO (a star instead of specialty symbol), but the CG
calls it Command Enlisted Advisor.
No W1 insignia or entry is shown for the MC, Navy or CG.
Commodore is definitely gone from the Navy & CG. RAdm U/L are the
only ones shown, followed by VAdm & ADM. The Navy has FAdm, but
the MC & CG do not have a five star rank.
Bob Mc
|
| 19.36 | a nit | MPGS::MCCLURE | Why Me??? | Fri Feb 09 1990 17:00 | 6 |
| re .34
I just looked over the MC descriptions and noted that you left out
the SgtMaj of the MC. The insignia is 3 up, 3 down with the ball
and anchor in the middle.
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| 19.37 | USAF structure | MPGS::MCCLURE | Why Me??? | Fri Feb 09 1990 17:43 | 33 |
| I'll only list the enilsted ranks here. The officer rank titles and
insignia (weel, the logo anyway) are identical to the Army's.
The Air Force 'chevron' has a circle in the center with either a subdued
or bright star and the 'wings' coming off at a 30 degree up angle. The
maximum of these is six and then they use an 'over the top' rocker. The
AF is very straight forward, if you want to know the person's pay grade
you simply add one to the number of stripes.
Airman Basic No stripe
Airman 1 stripe w/subdued star
Airman 1st Cl 2 stripes "
Sr Airman 3 stripes "
Sergeant 3 stripes, Bright star
Staff Sgt 4 stripes "
Technical Sgt 5 stripes "
*Master Sgt 6 stripes "
*Sr Master Sgt 6 w/ 1 over "
*Chief Master Sgt 6 w/ 2 over "
ChMsg of AF 6 w/2 over, wreath around star
* The AF recognizes 3 grades of First Sergeant. I believe it has to do with
the size of the command (wing, squadron, group). For all three pay
grades, the title is First Sergeant and a sidewise diamond is added to
the insignia.
One of my pet peeves with the Army rank structure/insignia, is that there
is no provision to denote an E7 as a First Sergeant. Some units (detachments)
have First Sergeants designated as E7. Those and any E7 filling an E8 -1SG
position recieve no recognition for that position outside of their own unit.
Its like wetting your pants in a dark suit. You get a warm feeling but no one
notices!
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| 19.38 | Back in the Old Army | DOCSRV::STARIN | Navy Radiomen Do It With Frequency | Fri Feb 09 1990 19:15 | 9 |
| Re .37:
Aren't they called "Field Firsts" or similar?
At least they were that in the Old Army.
Mark
RMC USNR
ex-SSG CTARNG
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| 19.39 | | MPGS::MCCLURE | Why Me??? | Mon Feb 12 1990 13:47 | 17 |
| The old Army used to designate a/the Sr Plt Sgt as the 'Field
First'. This is no longer allowed, but, if the 1SG isn't going
to be there, the Sr NCO will be designated the NCOIC. What I
was referring to was to be an SFC and BE the 1SG. Everyone in
your company knows it, but outside the company you appear to
be just another SFC. I would think being the CoB in the Navy
could have some of the same drawbacks. No special insignia
to denote the added responsibility.
Oh yes, a nit on myself. The Command Enlisted Advisor insignia
in the Coast Guard does not have a 'star' in place of the
specialty designator. It has the CG 'shield'.
Bob Mc
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| 19.40 | part 1 | MPGS::MCCLURE | Why Me??? | Wed Jun 13 1990 14:42 | 20 |
| In 71.27, I was asked about the current promotion system in the
USAR. This process is governed by its own AR and the various
chapters address the differences between Active, Active Guard/
Reserve and Reserve. It is further broken down to Sgt/SSG, SFC,
MSG, SGM and CSM. These, by the way, are *selection* boards, not
*promotion* boards. This regulation created promotion standing
lists in the reserves. AR140-158 contains the details and is
updated periodically. I will, only, try to summarize the regulation.
All eligible SPC/CPLs, and up, can submit their file for consideration
without regard to position availability (there are some gotcha's for
Sr NCOs) and be placed on a permanent promotion standing list, if
qualified. In order to be promoted, there must be a vacancy and you
must occupy that position on promotion (can occur simultaneously).
If you meet the eligibility requirements and there is no reason why
your commander will not recommend you, your file goes before the board.
If the commander chooses not to recommend you, you must be counseled
by the commander, in writing. Local criteria such as time in unit is
specifically prohibited and position on the list is transferrable
between commands.
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| 19.41 | SGT/SSG | MPGS::MCCLURE | Why Me??? | Thu Jun 14 1990 14:22 | 18 |
| Although the permanent promotion standing list is consolidated
at ARCOM (2 star) level, position management for Sgt/SSG is
delegated to the LTC command level.
Eligibility criteria for Sgt/SSG differs only in the level of
NCOES required and the total number of promotion points necessary.
To be eligible, you must have the proper amount of Time-In-Grade
and Time-In-Service. You have to have passed(or waivered) the Army
Physical Readiness Test in the last year and qualified with your
assigned weapon at least once. You must hold a valid MOS. After
meeting that criteria, a promotion point worksheet is filled out
with points being awarded in the following categories; Commander's
evaluation, Skill Qualification or alternate method, Awards & Decor-
ations, Military Education, Civilian Education, APFT/Wpns Qual.
Review boards can grant up to 150 promotion points, so the admini-
strative point total must be within 150 points of the total required
for promotion or you aren't eligible for board consideration.
|
| 19.42 | CUVL & SFC/MSG | MPGS::MCCLURE | Why Me??? | Tue Jun 19 1990 21:45 | 39 |
| All position vancancies are consolidated on a list at the 2 star command
level. Promotion to SGT/SSG is handled at O5 command level, but there
must be a vacancy shown on the consolidated list. Any SPC or SGT, that
makes the permanent standing list, can request promotion in any vacancy
listed, for their MOS. If a transfer is required, it will be done in paralell.
If more than one person is available to fill a slot, the person with the
highest point total will get the position.
For the purposes of the consolidated list, a position is considered vacant
if it is a)empty, b)occupied by a person of a lower grade or c)occupied by
a person that isn't MOS qualified.
For SSGs or SFCs looking to be promoted to SFC & MSG, the CUVL is very
important. If there are no position vacancies, on the list, in one of your
MOSs and you pass the board, you will simply remain on the standing list
until a position opens up in your MOS. If, however, there are positions
on the list, you may be offered one. If it is outside of 50Mi from your
home, you may refuse it without penalty. If it is within 50Mi and you
refuse it, you are sidelined for 1yr. For SFC positions, this is not
too bad and it is advantageous to be on the standing list. For MSG/1SG
positions, this can be detrimental. You could be looking for a 1SG slot
in an infantry company, but the 1st vacancy could be an OpSgt or NCOES
Instructor. This has lead to people looking very critically at when to
submit their file for the board.
There is no point system for SFC/MSG selection. If you meet the eligibility
requirements (TIG, TIS, NCOES, Ht/Wght standard) and there is a vacancy in
your MOS, then you submit for the board. If you are selected, you are placed
on the list, ranked by TIG first, TIS second and age third. This means that
the person that has held the previous rank the longest, gets the first shot
at the vacancy. When there is a tie in promotion date, the person that has
been in the service longest, wins. If both areas are the same, the oldest
person wins and if all three are the same, the Social Security Number breaks
the tie. This selection method also means that even though you are in a
position and doing the job and get selected for promotion, you might get
bumped out of the position by someone that was promoted to the previous
grade one day earlier than you. Commanders have no voice in the selection
process.
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| 19.43 | SGM/CSM | MPGS::MCCLURE | Why Me??? | Wed Jun 20 1990 14:41 | 18 |
| The vacancy list for SGM/CSM positions has been consolidated, in the
Northeast, between the two 2-star commands in the area. These are the
94th ARCOM and the 76th Div (Tng). When a vacancy occurs for a SGM/CSM
position, it is announced within both commands. A joint selection
board is held for *for the announced* position(s). There is no standing
list for promotion to SGM. You can only submit to the board for one of
the vacancies listed.
If you are a SGM in a command position, you must apply to a special
board (DA level, I believe) to become a CSM. CSM has its own MOS and
once you become a CSM, you remain a CSM and can only occupy CSM
positions. If you decide to relinquish the CSM wreath, you can not
get it back. CSM positions are tenured and managed. The last time
that they did this, they promoted to fill a vacancy and the rotated
all the positions whose tenure had expired. If you want to be a CSM,
you not only have to give up 3-4 weekends per months and some week-
nights as well, you have to be willing to travel a long distance to
your duty assignment.
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| 19.44 | A "Longcut" | USCTR1::RTRUEBLOOD | Rollyn Trueblood DTN 297-6553 | Mon Jul 02 1990 02:00 | 16 |
|
There is another way to the top but it takes much longer. One
may have their records reside inactively at the St Louis repository & continue
to show participation by taking correspondence courses and schools or
summer camps.
The individual is then considered in a much larger pool and the
slots being filled are based upon contingency plans that may never
come into being, we hope.
The time between ranks lengthens and one does not receive compensation
except for a promise of retirement pay at age 60. But this alternative
is still available.
Regards,
Rollyn
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| 19.45 | Where did the symbols come from? | AIMHI::SOBOCIENSKI | Blue Blazer Regular | Fri Apr 01 1994 02:39 | 38 |
| Just an interesting side note--
I don't remeber where, but I read once why the services (particularly
the United States) uses some of the insignia they do.
Chevron: In the middle ages, a man who was enlisted (into the army of
choice by force) who owned a house (or hut) was given a chevron to
denote the pointed thatched roof. A man with more than one chevron
was one who owned or ruled over more than one hut.
Bars (Lieutenants): The bar indicated a barrier. So, if you ruled over
a town with a barrier, you had a bar. A man with two bars had a town
with two barriers.
Oak Leaves (Majors and LTC's): The man who wore a leaf took charge over
all the men he could see from the top of a tall oak tree.
Eagle (Colonels): This man was in charge of all the men you could see
from an eagle's view.
Stars: This man was in command over everyone (on his side) that you
could see from the stars.
Gold vs Silver: The reason that the lower officer ranks are gold is
that during those times, gold was easier to get than silver and
therefore less valuable.
BTW- for non-military types: O is for officer ranks, E is for enlisted,
and W is for warrants.
FYI- the CW5 is in use.
Ted
2LT, TC
MAARNG
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