Conference quokka::non_custodial_parents

    1) She has NO right to interfere with your visitation rights for
       any reason unless so ordered by the court.
    
    2) You do not have to pay medical expenses that are not in the 
       court orders.  
    
    3) She may well be liable for any expenses ( lawyer, travel, etc)
       that you incur when enforcing the court orders.
    
    fred();

    John,
    
    Sorry that I don't have any advice on how to deal with a "noop"
    (My husband's ex is horrible) but I just had to write and say
    CONGRATULATIONS on your upcoming wedding.  I remember your note
    about introducing your "friend" to your kids and how you said
    that you weren't planning on getting married or anything.  Well,
    looks like my response to that note was right on the money!  I
    *knew* you were going to be getting married!!!
    
    Take care and good luck dealing with your ex
    
    - Kathryn
    

    
    Re: .0
    
    If you didn't sign a financial responsibility form at the doctor's
    office and the the divorce decree doesn't specifically say you are
    responsible then I wouldn't worry about it.  Tell the doctors to
    take it up with "noop."
    
    Steve
    

       .0> [...] told her she does not have to pay *any* medical
       .0> expenses except a yearly checkup [...] What do I do about
       .0> these medical bills? 

       You may have to send them a letter.  My ex was fond of putting my
       name on the form as being financially responsible EVEN WHEN I
       WASN'T.  When the vendor sent me the bill, I had to send them a
       letter and remind them that I hadn't signed anything, and she was
       the service requester and therefor the "customer of record". 

       Some of them had to be told twice, but they all eventually got
       the message.


       Richard


       PS  This works for everything, even the things I am responsible
           for.  The bill goes to her.  She sends it to me and I send
           the money to the vendor.  The advantage is, when she slips
           something in that is not my responsibility, I don't have to
           get the vendor involved in the dispute.  I just don't pay it. 

    
       .0> [...] told her she does not have to pay *any* medical
       .0> expenses except a yearly checkup [...] What do I do about
       .0> these medical bills? 
    
    Depends on how your decree is worded. My decree stated that I would 
    pay "for insurance".  If it says that you must pay for "medical
    expenses" then you may have a problem.
    
    My ex kept putting me down as the responsible party for medical bills.
    When I'd get one of these bills, I'd call them or send a letter stating 
    that I was *not* the responsible party.  If I got a second bill, I'd 
    send thema letter stating that if I got another bill, then the next letter
    would be from my lawyer.
    
    Be careful,  the way that the Consumer Credit laws in some states
    are written, if you don't respond within 30 days, then they can
    legally assume that you *are* responsible for payment.  DON'T JUST
    IGNORE THE BILL.
    
    fred();

    Just want to say how happy I am that your new relationship is working
    out and you're getting married. One of the hardest things about
    divorce has got to be the feeling that you may never meet someone
    with whom things can be really different. I did, and my ex flipped
    and became very non-cooperative, even though she had originally
    left me for my (former) best friend! 
                                               
    It's important to defuse her desire for revenge, recognizing that
    it comes from a feeling of dependency. Those who don't feel they
    can get their own happiness turn to depriving others of theirs.
    You can't do much about her desire for revenge except to show her
    through your actions that it doesn't work on you, and that she can
    get her own happiness without depriving you. Also that her desire
    for revenge really rebounds on the kids most of all.
    
    But what I really want to know is, what does "noop" stand for? If
    you can't say it here, please send me an E-mail...
    
    Theo
    

Sorry I didn't get back sooner.  I was able to take my trip to Florida as I
wanted (but with a lot of interference by the noop) and got back late last 
night!  So this is the first time I have a chance to respond.  Thanks for 
all the responses!


Re .2  Thanks!  You pegged it on the money even before I was ready to admit it!
We were friends for quite a while and I'm not really sure when we fell in love,
other than to say while on a business trip we missed each other very much.  
During that trip, we were on the phone for a couple of hours each night.  By 
the time I got home, our relationship had changed and after some time one 
thing led to another... I know that sounds corny and all, but that's the 
way it happened!

Re .6 "NoOp" Stands for "No Operation".  A NoOp is an instruction in a
computer who's only purpose is to WASTE TIME!

Re. All.  Thanks for the advise!  I am sending my Ohio lawyer (the noop lives 
in WV and I live in NC, but the jurisdiction is still OH...until she changes 
it...I don't know why she hasn't yet...it's been more than a year, I hope it's
to my advantage to stick with Ohio...at least I understand their rules)
a list of questions pertaining to the details.  

My decree says that I will pay 
	"extrodinary medical, optical and dental."  
That's it (besides the insurance payments).  My lawyer told me last year 
what these meant, but now I am getting it in writing.  

I don't know if the above includes braces or not.  I'll post his reply 
when I get it.  Comments??????????????????????????????

The advise on what to do when I get a bill is very valuable.  I have signed 
nothing and will not until I get my lawyer involved.

Flame for a minute?  the noop pulled several stunts last week. My 2 oldest 
were up until 1:30am on the 1st night with their mother until I told her to get
off.  She has twisted everything I said to her and now has her present husband
pissed at me.  While on the phone he threatened me for the second time and
my daughter heard it.  I told him I reported the last incident and that
threats over a long distance call could involve the FBI... pretty much he
quit.  After it was over, the children were upset and I told them that I 
was not going to talk to their mom anymore and they agreed!  The noop had
been  trying to manipulate my daugther (age 15) into believing
I was a terrible person and that she had to come home immediately.  My 
daugther didn't let her get away with that, so my ex switched to my son 
(age 12).  I was surprised at his wisdom; he took a nuetral position and
wouldn't take sides.  As I said I called a halt to it (I wished I had earlier
but didn't know what was being said until too late).

It's all in the past and my oldest later in the week asked me questions about 
living with me... so I know what she is thinking and I told her she could
live with me for the right reasons (ie. a wrong reason would be to spite
her mom).  Who knows?  She's had problems for a year now and she may want 
to get out from her mom's manipulation.  She's 15 so a change would be fairly
easy.  Anyone done this?  Is there check made on the living conditions by 
the court?

I don't believe you can buy love and I haven't with my kids.  We simply 
spent a lot of time together.  When I dropped them off I expected to get 
it from my ex so I brought a tape recorder...figured I may want to
document what she said to me and more to the point shut her up.  The exchange
went without incident except my 2 daugters (ages 15 and 3) went in and came out
to show me their new dresses.  It didn't phase me because by this time I knew
where my love for my children was.  Yes I gave them some material things, but
not to win them over.  At least my ex is buying them something!  From what
the kids tell me, these are the first new clothes since the divorce.  

Ok, ok.  Flame off..............

I love my kids and the noop can't change that.  They told me how they
feel about me several times and the noop can't change that.

All I wanted was a good time with my children and we had that when they didn't
talk to their mom.  In fact, they really didn't want to go home.  It was 
funny.  My 3 year old said she wanted mommy all week (typical homesick, no 
problem there).  But by the last day she wanted to see mommy and come back 
with me.  Maybe she's had enough to?  :-)

Thanks for your support!  Comments and suggestions are appreciated!

Love to ya all!

			   John

    Bravo!
      
    >The noop had
    >been  trying to manipulate my daugther (age 15) into believing
    >I was a terrible person and that she had to come home immediately.  My 
    >daugther didn't let her get away with that, so my ex switched to my son 
    >(age 12).  I was surprised at his wisdom; he took a nuetral position and
    >wouldn't take sides.  As I said I called a halt to it (I wished I had earlier
    >but didn't know what was being said until too late).
    
    Hang in there. I've found that the best way to combat the
    ex's propaganda campaign against (generic) you is just to *be you*.
    The kids are bright enough to figure out what's *really* going on.
    Looks like some of them already have.  Don't let her harass you into
    giving up trying to maintain a relationship with the children.
    
>While on the phone he threatened me for the second time and
>my daughter heard it.  I told him I reported the last incident and that
>threats over a long distance call could involve the FBI... pretty much he
>quit.  After it was over, the children were upset...
    
    What I did about the phone abuse was to get a little gadget from 
    Radio Shack that allows me to hook my tape recorder into my phone.
    You may want to check into the state and federal laws on wire tapping
    again, but when I checked I could find nothing in Colorado.  Federal
    laws stated that it *is* legal to tap you own phone so long as at
    least one party knows that the conversation is being recorded.  I
    did tell her, though, that I was recording the phone converstations
    and *would* use them in court if I could.  The abuse came to an
    abrupt halt.
    
>I don't know if the above includes braces or not.  I'll post his reply 
>when I get it.  Comments??????????????????????????????
    
    Dental costs: Braces will probably be considered extrordinary expenses.
    John Hancock will pay *I believe* up to $1000.  After that, you're
    on your own.  My ex used up all the John Hancock, so now I'm on my
    own with my older daughter.
    
    Hang tough.
    fred();