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Conference quark::mennotes-v1

Title:Topics Pertaining to Men
Notice:Archived V1 - Current file is QUARK::MENNOTES
Moderator:QUARK::LIONEL
Created:Fri Nov 07 1986
Last Modified:Tue Jan 26 1993
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:867
Total number of notes:32923

838.0. "Fault or No-fault Divorce -- Does it matter?" by QUARK::MODERATOR () Mon Nov 02 1992 10:17

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				Steve






    I was discussing some issues concerning the divorce process with a
    friend of mine who is an attorney.  It seems that I have been very
    naive.  (Our discussion applied to Massachusetts, but I think it's
    relevant wherever no-fault divorces are an option).       

    We were discussing the case of a wife who has an affair, and the
    resulting direction that a divorce could take.  His assertion is that
    the husband might as well file with his wife for a no-fault divorce,
    splitting up their assets and all the rest, because the results if the
    husband filed with grounds (adultery) would likely be little different,
    and would only cause more aggravation.  He said that his experience
    shows that counter-claims and justifications, true or not, are easy to
    present to the court, and it just isn't worth it.

    He continued that with no-fault, the state basically looks at a
    marriage as a business.  Assets are split using a number of guidlines,
    including future earning potential.  A wife who has not held jobs which
    are as high paying as her husband could expect to leave the marriage
    with a higher percentage of their assets.  

    We also discussed children of the marriage, and he painted a very bleak
    financial picture for all concerned, even if the husband wanted
    custody.

    So it comes down to this:  It seems that the marriage commitment has
    little practical meaning in law.  Would it be sexist to ask if it works
    this way for husbands too?

    Just a little,
    Depressed        

T.RTitleUserPersonal
Name
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838.1Sorry about the bad newsCSC32::HADDOCKDon't Tell My Achy-Breaky BackTue Nov 03 1992 10:1718
    There should _not_ be no-fault divorce unless _both_ parties agree
    that there is no fault, but...

    In today's courts, there is almost no such thing other than "no-fault"
    divorce.  Basically no-fault means that the woman has no-fault no matter 
    what.  No matter what she's done, she'll likely get the kids, the house,
    the car, and most of the assets.  

    What does this mean for men?  It means that in most, if not all, 
    states, there is no legal protection whatsoever to protect you
    from being served papers as you leave work today, and you can't
    go home.  She can move her boyfriend in to sleep in your bed and
    drink your beer and there isn't diddley you can do about it.  The
    only thing you get to do is finance the situation for her via
    alimony and "child support".  

    fred()
    
838.2In advance ofTHIRD::HERRThese ARE the good ole daysMon Nov 09 1992 21:0680
    >> only thing you get to do is finance the situation for her via
    >> alimony and "child support".  

    This may be the only thing that can be done after the fact but I
    believe that anyone who suspects (even slightly) they are to be facing
    a divorce/separation consider some options earlier.  I offer the following
    as random thoughts intended to provoke consideration.  

    o Reduce the equity in any property to an absolute minimum (not hard
      today).

    o Borrow on or eliminate any retirement plan possible 401K etc. .

    o Insist that your wife work (full-time) if possible.

    o Place any liquid funds in :

    	Irrevocable trusts for the kids
    	Hands of relatives
    	Foreign accounts
    	etc.
    
    o Have a current power-of-attorney signed by your wife.

    o When paying or structuring debt (school loans, personal etc.) pay
      any attributable to you only first.  When you borrowed money from your
      parents to buy the first house -- guess who gets most of the equity
      and who keeps the personal debt.

      As a rule of thumb, net assets are subject to division (not equally
      to be sure) unattached debt is not.

    o Go to Radio Shack and obtain the necessary gear to tape your phone.
      I suggest this so you can get as much warning as possible -- The
      resultant tapes (and the knowledge of their existence) should be kept 
      private.

    o Borrow against any marital property (virtually everything cars,
      jewlery, etc.) and do everything possible to control the dispersed funds.

    o Move out of MA.

    o If you're considering returning to school or about to be granted an
      advanced degree -- wait.  Improved employment prospects obtained during
      the marriage are very detrimental regardless of the funding
      arrangement.

    o Self-employed males tend to make out better in terms of both alimony
      and child support awards.

    o Maintain strict access to as many personal finance records as
      possible.  In the event of the first sign of real trouble -- remove
      them or at the very least be sure you have equal access.

    o Minimize the available funds in any account accessible by only one
      party (checking, local savings etc.)

    o Keep records of any credit cards carried by your wife in the event
      immediate cancellation (report them as lost) is in order.  In addition,
      maintain at least one bank card (potentially a company card) on which
      you are the only holder.

    o Under almost no circumstance should you leave the marital house unless
      ordered to do so by the authorities.

    o File tax returns jointly even in the case where separately will save you 
      a few hundred bucks.

    o Consult an attorney with a track record BEFORE she moves. Most people
      are dumbfounded by the inequity involved, you need to hear first
      hand before it completely unfolds.

    o You can never be to paranoid with respect to the overwhelming legal
      bias against you.

    o The median middle class male has everything at risk in a divorce.


    regards