Conference quark::mennotes-v1

    Perhaps it's the other way around...older women are snagging
    the young guys for obvious reasons! ;^)
    
    
                                  L.J.

    
    where exactly is this alleged oversupply of younger women .. ?

    Actually, demographically, Bob Holt is quite correct. Women over
    35 or so out number men, but under that age men out number women.
    
    So it makes logical sense for younger men to date older women,
    the supply as it were is in favor of both groups.
    
    I suspect some younger men date older women because the older
    women appreciate them more - especially the 'nice' guys who
    get spurned by younger women who are looking for mr wild rather
    than mr reliable.
    
    Just a guess, occasioned by a humor piece on men and women that
    went around the net today.
    
    Bonnie

    .0
    Because some younger women haven't matured enough to enjoy our company
    or a more obvious answer would be simply he was attracted to her and
    age wasen't a consideration. Of the older women I have dated all of
    them have known how to treat our relationship with respect and have
    been willing to contribute the neccessary time required to allow it
    to grow. Alot of younger women I have dated seem to think that it was
    my job to keep things going and theirs to play head games like acting
    too busy. Another personal observation is that the most fantastic,
    uninhibited, mind bending sex I've ever had has been with older women.
    
    They simply have a better insight thru experience on how men think
    and want to be treated. Women are like fine wines they better with age.
    
    -j
    

    It's sex, definitely, sex.
    
                              Capt. Scott ;-) 

     -1
       Ditto's :-)
    
    David

    
    A recent article, in one of the magazines littering my Doctor's
    waiting room, reported parts of a survey into `Sexual Drive'.
    
    Apparently men are supposed to be at their `peak' at the age of 
    17. Women, the article suggests, reach their `peak' at 35.
    
    Does this explain the 'Older-Younger' relationship, perhaps ?
    

    IMO, for those contemplating a lifetime together, its the actuarial
    tables...  I.e., men die before women, therefore, marrying older women
    reduces the years spent alone late in life (speaking in broad
    generalities of course)...
    
    But, I wouldn't discount mind-blowing sex with older women, either :-)
    :-)
    
    Dave

 Cuz the young girlies are bent on destructive relationships with "exciting"
losers...

    all of the above.
    
    fred( who sifted through a lot of sand to find a nugget 6 1/2 years
    his senior );

    Re:  .11
    
    Isn't a younger man/older woman relationship destructive for the woman?
    Think it's just a fling on the man's part.  He'd probably leave for a
    "younger older woman."   
    

    Re .13: Could be - but then, she might leave for a "younger younger
    man", too. ["Sorry, Biff, but you're showing signs of maturity..."]
    
    ;-)
    
    Semi-seriously: There are so many criteria that I find more significant
    than the relative ages of potential romantic partners that I really don't 
    see what the fuss is about. Heck, the how-important-is-it-to-remember-
    anniversaries debate has probably deep-sixed more relationships than 
    who's-older-and-by-how-much...
    
    In my, as always, exceedingly 'umble opinion,
    -b

    My wife is also 6.5 years older than I am (hi, Fred!). I was
    twenty-nine when we met, still hanging out with friends from graduate
    school, actually dating a 19-year-old (!) in a *desperate* attempt to
    deny that I was about to be 30.
    
    I fell in love with my wife for many reasons, probably all of which
    were life-long traits unrelated to age and level of maturity. I
    generally see the age difference as minor-to-irrelevant, it's main use
    being occasional, light teasing. I *do* like the fact that we have
    about the same remaining life expectancy. Her absolute age is an issue,
    however, in that I'd like to become a biological father and her clock
    is nearly too advanced :(. An advantage of our situation is that my
    wife is firmly established and completely committed to her career, so
    if little Hoyt / Hoytette comes along, *I* get to stay home and be
    primary child-care provider!
    
    - Hoyt
    
    

This was written by Ben Franklin in 1745 explaining to a younger
man why old mistresses are preferable to younger ones:


1. Because as they have more Knowledge of the World and their Minds
are better stor'd with Observations, their Conversation is more
improving and more lastingly agreeable.

2. Because when Women case to be handsome, they study to be good.
To maintain their Influence over Men, they supply the Diminuation of
Beauty by an Augmentation of Utility. They learn to do 1000 Services
small and great and are the most tender and useful of all Friends when you
are sick. Thus they continue amiable. And hence there is hardly such a thing
to be found as an old Woman who is not a good Woman.

3. Because there is no hazard of Children, which irregularly produc'd
may be attended with much Inconvenience.

4. Because thro' more Experience, they are more prudent and discreet
in conducting an Intrigue to prevent Suspicion. The commerce with them
is therefore safer with regard to your Reputation. And with regard to
others, if the Affair should happen to be known, considerate People
might be rather inclin'd to excuse an old Woman who would kindly
take care of a young Man, form his Manners by her good Counsels,
and prevent his ruining his Health and Fortune among mercenary 
Prostitutes.

5. Because in every Animal that walks upright, the Deficiency of the
Fluids that fill the Muscles appears first in the highest Part:
The Face first grows land and wrinkled; then the Neck, then the
Breast, and regarding only what is below the Girdle, it is impossible
of two Women to know an old from a young one. And as in the dark
all Cats are grey, the Pleasure of corporal Enjoyment with an old
Woman is at least equal and frequently superior, every Knack
being by Practice capable of Improvement.

6. Because the Sin is less. The debauching of a Virgin may be her
Ruin, and make for Life unhappy.

7. Because the Compunction is less. The having made a young Girl
*miserable* may give you frequent bitter Reflections; none of
which can attend making an old Woman *happy*.

8.[thly and Lastly] They are so *grateful*! Thus much for my
Paradox. But I still advise you to marry directly.

    -1
    
    Yea maybe. I think we burn out quicker...In our lifetime our bodies
    will produce billions and billions(sound like Carl Sagan) of sperm,
    whereas the female of the species makes around 500 eggs..They are
    just a mellower breed I suppose.:-)
    
    David

    I heard that too but puberty dosent make maturity to me maturity is
    alot more than being able to effect procreation. I feel it is alot of
    things compassion, honesty, a sense of doing the right thing,
    commitment, persistance, flexibility, congeniality, reliablity,
    acceptance and the list goes on.
    To me game playing is the ultimate example of immaturity and the
    younger women I have been been involved with recently seem consumed
    with it.
    
    
    -j
    

>    With all the young, available women around, why do younger men date
>    older women?   I'm referring to a difference of 8 - 13 years.  Would
>    like other men's opinions,  positive or negative. 

Could be the women are looking at the "other end" of the time continuum,
and would like some assurance that their mate will be with them closer to
the bitter end (assumes that the Avg female outlives the Avg male 10 years)?

Speaking form the sexual compatibility angle, I have heard it said that 
35 year  old women and 19 year old men are "ideally suited" for each other.

Many older women already have their carreers in gear, and their act together,
so the men need only to provide "close encounters" type of support.

(Some men think their dating women 8 - 13 years their senior. Its more likely
the women could be 12 - 20 years their senior.) 

Several long years ago, when my oldest son was 15 I dated a women
who also had a daughter near the same age. After several dates, I stopped
by unexpectedly and met her 34 year old son (I was 44 at the time ...)

I *knew* she was older .. just didn't realize how much older ..

On another occasion I meet *older* woman whow was really lookng for a
guy that was more of a "party animal". She even let me drive her
Camarro .... like it was supposed to be some kinda real deal .. driving
some elses car ...

In the case of the first lady, she lied (prevaricator) ..

The secon was simply acting out immaturity and introduced me to her
local aquaintences as her "nephew" ... lasted one whole date ..

To repeat the question:
>    With all the young, available women around, why do younger men date
>    older women?   I'm referring to a difference of 8 - 13 years.  Would
>    like other men's opinions,  positive or negative. 

Hey I like Choclate ice cream, my spouse likes Wine, my kids like KISS ..

-BobE

>    Yea maybe. I think we burn out quicker...In our lifetime our bodies
>    will produce billions and billions(sound like Carl Sagan) of sperm,
>    whereas the female of the species makes around 500 eggs..They are
>    just a mellower breed I suppose.:-)
    
    Not sure what this has to do with anything, but I believe your facts
    are wrong, here...  Women are born with millions and millions of eggs,
    they only FERTILIZE one (on rarer occasions, two, etc.) every cycle.
    
    (BTW, I wasn't pre-med, or anything, I just happened to have learned
    more than I ever cared to about the female reproductive system in my 
    now finished marriage.)
    
    Dave

    Dave
    
    I think you meant *ovulate* one or sometimes two a cycle, women
    do not conceive every cycle!
    
    and the statement about women being born with about 500 +/- eggs
    is Biologically factual.
    
    We are born with all the eggs we will ever have poised in the
    middle of meiosis, the special type of division that produces
    reproductive cells.
    
    Bonnie

    
    -1
      And thanks for your support Bonnie :-) 
    
    The Nurse

    It isn't age that is the problem it is maturity. You can be mature at
    an age which is not related to your physical age, and I think it
    depends on other criteria, whether or not you are attractive as an
    interesting person.  You can be 24 and be immature and 34 and be
    immature and 44 and be immature.
    
    Conversely you can be mature at 24.  Everyone is different.
    
    
    diana

    
    I agree with maturity as an aspect of the attraction toward older
    women.  In my single days, I remember a common thread that seemed to be
    true of most of the young, single women with whom I became involved. 
    It seemed that sex (for the young women) was the last prized treasure
    that they wished to "bestow" for fear that if they gave of themselves,
    there would be no more mystery, no enticement for me.  Like they were
    afraid that if I found out that "that's all there is to the circus?"
    I would get restless and look for someone new.  The games began in
    earnest!  With the older women, I felt quite differently.  I perceived 
    that sex for the mature woman was more an integral and comfortable part 
    of life.  They had developed their lives with enough depth that if I 
    (or another man for that matter) was not to be a permanent fixture, they 
    would survive just fine, and life would go on.  There was committment,  
    No games.  I liked that. 
    
    Gary  
    

    re .26
    
    What part don't you believe -- the part about the teenage boys or the
    part about the 35 year old women?
    
    I obviously can't speak for the boys, but since I am a woman in 
    my 30's (and have spoken with other 30-something women) I can vouch
    for that part (unless it's *really* reached in the 40's ;-)).
         
    Paula

    
    Berry,
    
      Which one have you experienced?? The younger boys or older
    woman??
    
     Paula,
           I have seen the same info you refer too..Masters and Johnson
    is hardly "National Enquirer" material..I think that the attraction
    for me personally far exceeds the "Mind blowing sex" aspect..The
    attraction can be emotional intertwined with all the rest..
    
    +David
           

    .27
    
    I had explained it better in my earlier note, but the mod hid it and
    made me re-write it.
    
    I was once married to a woman that took a nose dive after hitting 30.
    
    db

    re .27, it's really reached in the 40's, unless it's the 50's.  I can
    only vouch for the 40's so far.  (Hey, maybe it keeps getting
    *better*!)  :-)
    
    Lorna
    

    Lorna,
    
    I vote with you for the 40's
    
    ;-)
    
    Bonnie

    re.  .31
    
    Lorna,
    
    Right on!!  It just keeps on getting better...maybe we're just late
    bloomers!  (tee hee)
    
    -Dotti.

>>>>Apparently men are supposed to be at their `peak' at the age of  17. Women,
                       ^^^^^^^^
>>>>the article suggests, reach their `peak' at 35.
                ^^^^^^^^

These are old reports that belong in the National Enquirer.  Mostly women
about 35 and teenage boys probably believe it, or want to...

 I think that we ought to ask some 70 or 80 year old women to tell us when they
reached their sexual peak. It seems just a bit less likely to be tainted
evidence than the claims made by some women in their 40s that it's best "at my
age." :-) :-)

 The Doctah

    	There is a rather famous quotation that unfortunately I cannot lay
    my hands on at the moment, from a woman in her mid-80s.
    
    	Asked "At what age do women lose interest in sex?" she just
    answered
    
    	"I don't know".

    
    My grandpa got married when he was 98 to a woman just 22.  When asked
    
    why in the world he'd want to get married at 98 years, he replied,
    
    "Well, I didn't want to."
    

    I realize that this is MENNOTES,and I only intended on reading,but I
    had to put my two cents in on this one.I am 10 and a half years older
    than my husband and it is great.I really do not believe that the
    age difference is what makes it great.....it is us together.We started
    out as friends first.Without going into a lot of detail,my ex threw
    us together then was shocked that I wanted a divorce.Anyway,getting
    back to my "younger" husband....He was seperated from his wife,who was
    young and pretty.Young and pretty is not all that it is cracked up to
    be for some people.Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder,right?
    We have been together for 8 years now.We lived together for 4 years
    before we got married.I had the problem with the age difference,not
    him.I don't any more....age IS only a number.
      I have to agree with you guys.....the sex IS great!!But,then again,
    I really do not think that AGE has anything to do with great sex.Do
    you really think so?I was married for 17 years the first time and had
    no complaints in that department.
                                     Sharon

    Sharon I wish there were more woman like you, your response was great .
    I have found only the wrong type of older woman --:-)--   but I will
    continue to look.....