Conference quark::mennotes-v1

       If Morton Downey is serous about Men's Issues he would do
    well to tone down his act and define what Men's Issues are all about.
    
       He should focus more clearly on values and those things that
    constitute masculine affirmations.  
    
       His chain smoking on the air is not a good example and his
    "get him outta here" bounces appeal only to the uneducated.
    
                                                    Russ P.

    
    	One of my brothers, my fiancee, and I have been watching off
    and on for months, mostly on the N.Y. channel until the show's recent
    debut on 38...
    
    	He is billed, and bills himself, as a conservative, however
    on some issues he tends to swing to the liberal viewpoint; one recent
    example being a show he did on Northern Ireland, where he repeatedly
    backed the IRA position and engaged in heated Brit-bashing.  (But,
    please, let's not get into that here; it's covered elsewhere, much
    the same way, I might add).  
    
    	He tends to present some of the same people repeatedly, such
    as various ACLU lawyers, some left-, right-, and feminist obvious
    cranks; and the issues are usually geared to be emotionally-charged
    and of great interest to the working-class and college crowds (notice
    the large number of high school and college students in the audience,
    mainly from Rutgers).  He also seems to have his own cheering section
    of large, athletic males to the rear of the audience, who, when
    a point is made that they appreciate, make a loud sound in unison,
    something like:  "OOOOOOH, OOOOOOH, OOOOOOOH, OOOOOOH!", repeatedly.
    
    	Mort has an aggressive, confrontational style that we find often
    lapses into bad taste and rudeness, but the audience laps it up.
    Once in a while, certain guests appear and a real discussion ensues,
    with valid points and counterpoints by all parties, and it is a
    welcome change from certain other daytime talk shows where the liberal
    and radical left political agendas, and just-plain weird issues
    are relentlessly pushed, over and over again. (and where, in relation
    to the just-previous Note, male-bashing goes on continuously for
    a predominately female audience).  
    
    	All in all, I'd rate his show as just a couple of cuts above
    professional wrestling as occasional entertainment and a few laughs.
    If I were a guest on his show, however, and he blew that cigarette
    smoke into my face, like he sometimes does to guests he confronts,
    I'd have to slap it right out of his mouth.  
    
    	And then run like hell---have you seen the two gigantic security
    dudes loitering on the periphery?
    
    			Dave

    >All in all, I'd rate his show as just a couple of cuts above
    >professional wrestling as occasional entertainment and a few laughs. 
    
    I would rate his show several cuts *below* professional wrestling.
    I don't find him entertaining at all; I find him scary.  He promotes
    a mob mentality that is the opposite of reasoned discussion.
    
    -- Mike

    
    Morton has got something few men possess today.  BALLS!  He doesn't
    pussy-foot around.  He is entertaining to many, and cuts right
    through the fat and get's down to where the rubber meets the road.
    
    The people that find fault with him have probably heard him shoot
    up some of their own philosophies and can't handle his aggressiveness
    due to their own, "thin-skins."
    
    

    It is not his opinions per se that I find so scary; rather, it is
    the way he deals with issues and people who dare to disagree with
    him.  I am sorry, but I do not find fascism entertaining.  His brown
    shirt cheering section, with their chants of "Ooh Ooh Ooh", is a
    perfect example of the kind of mob mentality he stirs up.  He does
    not "shoot up" philosophies with reason, he does it by stirring
    up the mob in the audience to gang up on people who dare to have
    a different opinion than he does.
    
    Part of believing in freedom of speech is respecting the rights of
    people to have opposing views.  Morton Downey, Jr. does not subscribe
    to this theory.  His show is an example of Nazi television at its
    worst.
    
    -- Mike

I watched his first show - on pronography. He badgered 2 of 3 guests off the 
stage. I called WWOR the next day, and told them I'd never watch again.

I lied.

I usually tune in to see what the issue is. If it's interesting, I listen
to the speakers and *the content* of Mort's questions, not the tone. The 
audience is pretty frightening, I agree - especially when it becomes a lynching
party.

The guests, for the most part, aren't much better than the host. You really
realize how biased these people are - they pay lip-service, at best, to the
other side of the issue.

Actually, he had a *good* show a week or so ago on ethnic humor. People
argued about psychological damage and stereotypes in a relatively thoughtful
manner. I actually watched the whole show. I was very surprised.

eric

    I saw a show while on business travel without the rental
    car - stuck in a motel room  (a real captive audience).  I was
    intrigued by the subject; DWI.   It turned out to be an extremely
    informative and interesting show if you could ignore the shouting
    and pay close attention to the content.  They had two NJ state 
    troopers "walk through" a field sobriety (sp?) test on a volunteer
    who had been chugging the 1/2 hr. before the show.  A lawyer famous
    for defending DWI clients monitored the process and then delivered
    the arguments he would have used to defend the volunteer.  The 
    troopers were extremely professional (ie. not loud and opinionated)
    which kept the show on a level.  What bothered me was, at times,
    valid points were being raised by the guest but if Downey disagreed,
    he would interrupt (rudely!) and dismiss them as conjecture and
    cut the guest off.                   
    
    Then again, I could have used a guy like him at some of the DEC
    meetings I've attended  -  (a real good rat-hole detector)  ; )
    

    
    
        He sure has white teeth (dentures!) for someone who chain smokes!
    
                                                                 
                                                                  MATT
    
    
    
    

    .re .a couple back there
    
    I can't believe this!  
    
    What are you all going to do?  Sit around and whine that someone
    has an opinion different than yours, and get offended when he tells
    you what that opinion is?  Christ, that probably means you'll be
    offended at this _note_ too, eh?
    
    If you don't like his style or his guests, why not have the guts
    to say, "He may have some valid points, but he's not for me.  I
    just won't watch."  No, he's a fascist because he needs security
    to keep rowdy (and potentially violent) "guests" from getting out
    of hand.  
    
    It sound to _me_ that he's pretty much in touch with the real world.
    
    How about you?
    
                            John
    

    
    I watched the show earlier this week, for the first time.  The subject
    was gambling.  I found Morton to be arrogant and obnoxious, but
    I could deal with that ... however, I also thought his style was
    pretty ineffective, random and pointless ... he seemed to spend
    a good deal of effort mostly on antagonizing those with whom he
    disagreed.
    
    BUT, those are my observations from viewing one show only, so I'll
    reserve further judgement until I've seen more ....

    I turn on Mort every evening.  If the subject matter sounds
    interesting, then I watch, If not, then I don't.  I, just as Mort,
    consider myself a conservative.  This does not mean I agree with
    him on everything.  I've seen him do things which I considered to
    be somewhat obnoxious, however, it is SO NICE to see a talk show
    without these "pablum puking liberals" getting all of the air time.
    I refer to all of the morning and evening talk shows.  They are
    the real sickening programs.  I think Mort asks questions that alot
    of people are interested in hearing the answer but were afraid to
    ask.  I like the show.  It's about time that someone presented the
    other side of the story.  NOW ZIP IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
                                                       Mike

    >What are you all going to do?  Sit around and whine that someone
    >has an opinion different than yours, and get offended when he tells
    >you what that opinion is?  Christ, that probably means you'll be
    >offended at this _note_ too, eh?
    
    As I stated earlier, it is not his opinions that makes him a fascist,
    it is the Gestapo style that he runs his show with. The world is full
    of people who say things that I disagree with, but I don't therefore
    advocate mob behavior directed against them, which is the essence of
    this show.  If you cannot debate someone with reason, then you have
    to resort to shouting them down; it is the only tool at your disposal.
    
    >It sound to _me_ that he's pretty much in touch with the real world.
    
    >How about you?
    
    I happen to believe that the only way to be in touch with the real
    world is to deal with it in a reasoned fashion.  Deliberately
    confrontational argument is the opposite of this approach.  The
    inability to tolerate different points of view is, in my book, fascist,
    and it makes it difficult to be in touch with the real world.
    
    -- Mike

    
    You don't have to be polite or meek or humble or soft spoken to
    be in "touch with the real world."  And, in many cases, being
    "rational" won't get you any where.  
    
    There is an old saying that one good fist is worth a thousand words.
    Mort is the "one good fist."  I too am sick and tired, (and bored),
    with all the other wimpy talk show host.  Mort uses the words that
    many of us want to say, so he becomes our spoke person.
    
    It's a matter of style.  Some people don't like to watch Eddie Murphy
    either.  Hey, if you don't like these guys, turn them off.
    
    What's this "mob like" stuff anyway?  Boxing and all-star-wrestling
    can produce that type of atmosphere as well.  So can the NBA playoffs!
    Christ!  Maybe Mort hit some sensitive areas with people that complain
    about him.  That's usually the case, isn't it?
    
    Sick'em Mort!

    
    I couldn't agree more with .15. It is not going to bother an open
    minded person to see and listen to opposing views.  It seems at times
    that Mort is zipping the other side but what he is doing is putting up
    up resistance that any salient point would be able to ride over.
    
    The other way these matters have been handled is shown in a promo 
    announcement for the Fil Donahue Show.  He finally got a man who 
    would stand up in the audience who made the mistake of saying that
    men can be like men and woman can be like woman.  Phil uses this
    in his promo as the guy gets ridiculed for his statement.  What
    the hell is Phil trying to tell me that men and woman are alike?
    Does anyone believe that?  
    
    When Mort gives it out it could be on the side of the radical
    feminist or the consrvative or the far right side.  he tries       
    to give flair to the discussion.  That is my point that it
    does not matter where the ideology is you can learn from it.
    I find myself learning and agreeing with points on each side.
    

    RE .16  Phil is saying that a person who makes such statements had
           better be able to defend his views.
    
            Unlike the days of the JFK press Conf's, age during which
           reporters had class, todays reporters, and show hosts press
           interviewees in an often prosecutorial way. 
    
            I've never seen how it can possibly be justifiable to cause
           or create discomfort in a guest.  Respect should be a given.
           
            Anyhow Phil's promo insinuates that the man is a bigot.
           
            Considering the strange characters that dominate his show,
           the bigotry in question may simply reflect his own.
    
    
                                                    Russ P.

    I would first like to say that I am new to this conference. Secondly,
    I feel that Morton Downey Jr. is obnoxious, arrogant, and THE best
    talk show host around. True he does put down his guests and tries
    his best to embarrass them, but the people he usually does it to
    really deserve that kind of treatment, in my book. 
    
    A lot of people might say, and probably do, that Mort is nothing
    but a loud mouth. But he is thought provoking and probing when it
    comes to his interviewing. I remember a show where they had a number
    of the leading feminist leaders on his show. They deserved every
    jab they got from Downey. At one point in the show one of the pablum
    puking feminist stated that practically all divorced men didn't
    take care of their children properly or didn't pay the child support
    regularly. Now she didn't SOME men, but she said practically ALL
    men did this. Well if anyone caught the show, Downey was not very
    pleased by that remark, and niether was I. Every man should have
    been offended by that statement. To label the whole male population
    by the example of a FEW slimeballs is totally unacceptable. But
    that's the problem with these radical feminist, one of them lies
    and the others swear by it, well that type of thinking just doesn't
    hold water with me.
    
    Another point to be made about Morton Downey is that he gets things
    done. One of his shows dealt with how agencies and the so called
    authorities could come into your home and take your children away
    from you only on the suspicion from an anonymous phone call that
    your children are being beaten. On the show a man in the audience
    started ranting and raving that that is exactly what happen to him
    and his wife. In fact, they even took their 1 day old child from them
    while the child was with the mother nursing. The gentleman stated
    that he has been to over 500 lawyers, and not one of them would
    take his case. Morton was totally flabergasted by this and said that
    he would get his lawyers to take their case for free. I don't know
    of too many other talk show hosts that would go out on a limb like
    that. An interesting point in this case is that the children were
    sexally assaulted by the foster parents that the agencie had assigned
    them to. To quote Mort on this case "WHAT IS THIS CRAP!".
    
    So you better watch out all you pablum puking liberals, Morton Downey
    Jr.(mighty mouth) is out to get you.       
    
                                          Now ZIPP it!       ;-)
                                                     
                                                     Tony S.

    I remember a show from about a year ago that, to me, epitomized
    what is wrong with Morton Downey, Jr.
    
    There was a guest who was expressing a point of view that is not
    particularly popular in the U.S., and both Downey and the
    audience as a whole were strongly opposed to what the man was saying.
    At one point Downey began interrupting the man and repeatedly made
    a suggestion as to what the man should do.  The audience chimed
    in and began chanting at the man as well.  The guest was attempting
    to explain his position, but neither Downey nor the audience would
    let him get his point across.
    
    This sort of behavior is juvenile at best, and to me thoroughly
    repugnant.  The idea that some guests "deserve" to be treated this way
    merely because they dare to subscribe to a minority or unpopular
    viewpoint is, to me, the antithesis of legitimate discussion. According
    to this view, it is okay to be obnoxious to people if they don't have
    *your* opinion.  Downey and his friends in the audience "won" that
    debate because they could out-shout the guest.  It is one thing
    to argue against a point with which you strongly disagree; it is
    another to engage in mob-hysteria and one-upmanship.
    
    Okay, so Ted Koppel he is not.  Worse still, he has his guards (should
    I say goons?) who are ready to rough up anyone who Downey decides
    to throw out of the studio.  One guest was injured in this way,
    and filed a lawsuit against Downey.  I don't know the current status
    of the lawsuit, but this is an example of how Downey operates.
    
    He is not the only conservative on television, either, so it is not
    like the right-wing viewing audience is starved for a hero. There are
    such notables as Buckley, Will, and Novak, who (with the possible
    exception of the snide and whiny Novak) generally take a much higher
    road than Downey does (although that would not be hard).  In the case
    of Will, his right-wing ideology serves as "objective" analysis for a
    major network--you can't get much more big time than that.
    
    In any case, Downey does *not* speak for all men.
    
    -- Mike

    What is this mob-hysteria?  Just because the majority of the audience
    is in favor of what was said and expressing their affirmation, this
    constitutes mob-hysteria?  Also, I would venture to guess that 99% of
    his guests have seen his show and know what to expect.  If they
    didn't want to be on the show they wouldn't.  As I said in my previous
    note, I don't agree with everything which Mort says (most, but not
    all), however, I have seen Mort stick up for the liberal guests when 
    they were being mistreated by the audience or other conservative guests. 
    Mort usually gets on people when they start spouting off stupid things
    which don't make any sense or pertain to the discussion.  Also,
    I've seen him cut people off when they try to bring prejudice of
    some kind into a discussion which had nothing to do with
    discrimination..  This brings the discussion to a point where people 
    feel as though they have to start minding their P's & Q's and very
    well could detract from the discussion.  As Mort says, if you can't 
    handle it, turn the channel.  He must be doing something right seeing
    as his show nationally (I'm not sure about internationally) televised.
                                                                         
                                           Mike
    

    Re .21

    >What is this mob-hysteria?  Just because the majority of the audience
    >is in favor of what was said and expressing their affirmation, this
    >constitutes mob-hysteria?
    
    No, but harassing a guest with chants and refusing to let him have
    his say merely because he expressed an unpopular opinion *is* mob
    hysteria.
    
    >Also, I would venture to guess that 99% of his guests have seen his
    >show and know what to expect. 
    
    You have a point there.  The fact that anyone would willingly participate
    in such a spectacle only shows how desperate for money some people
    are.  Of course, the fact that guests are voluntary participants
    in the spectacle makes it no less of a spectacle.
    
    >He must be doing something right seeing as his show nationally (I'm not
    >sure about internationally) televised. 
    
    So was the Gong Show.  I don't consider popularity a valid gauge of
    good taste.  In fact, it is the popularity of this show that I consider
    so scary; if this is what the American public likes, then I am afraid
    of what it says about the American public, and the way Americans
    deal with complex issues.
    
    >As Mort says, if you can't handle it, turn the channel.
    
    Which is exactly what I have done.  I am not questioning anyone's
    right to watch the show; of course people are perfectly free to
    watch the Morton Downey circus, just as they are free to watch equally
    intellectually stimulating shows as professional wrestling, "Real
    People", or "The Gong Show".  Meanwhile, if I am interested in a
    serious discussion of the issues, I will continue to watch Nightline.

    -- Mike

    
    One thing I like is his self effacing humor.  Like no one will be back
    to this boring show after this break or I'll be hitting my station
    up for more $ before this is over.  I find his bold ballsy behavior
    quite refreshing compared to Sally Jesse Rafael .  She's a party line.
    Her producer tells her what to do and she jumps.  Mort is not told 
    what to do he goes by the skin of his pants and takes risks.  No matter
    which side he's on he makes it thought provoking.  if he violates a
    person on the shows' rights I think he should be sued.  He is not 
    above the law.  But you tend to make alot of enemies when you go
    against the grain. Last night I saw ASK THE MANAGER on TV38. The
    inevitable letter was read: How could yu put Mort on the air I will
    never watch the station again etc.  The reply was that the show tends
    to polarize people you either like it  or don't.  The stations 
    manager and assistant were afraid to say that they liked it for fear 
    of reprisals from the audience.  There is a parellel to mens issues in
    general in our society(not saying Mort represents it). It is hard
    to come out front for the mens side.  85% of the woman will rebuke
    you and 50% of men who are brainwashed will turn on you and you'll
    get blown out of the water.
    
                                  Enough air out of the balloon
    
    
                                     KP.

    Morton J. Downey is a certifiable asshole. High Times reports that
    his credentails are the byproducts of a diploma mill.
    
    I read part of the transcript where he interrogated the editoral
    staff of "High Times". After some non-cooperation by the staff a
    couple members of the staff were forcefully removed by Downeys thugs
    (between commercials of course).
    
    I've seen better stuff in childrens sandboxes... 

Morton Downey isn't my idea of an answer to the Phil Donahues of the airways.

Morton, is at best, all we got at the moment to help fight the over-whelming
influence the liberal media has over the news rooms and talk shows. The only
reason he is on the air is because his show is entertaining regardless of the
message. The producers know which side their bread is buttered on. I wish 
some independent channel had the guts to put him opposite the Donahue show.
I bet he would murder Donahue.  If not figuratively, for real ;-).
You can bet your boots it wouldn't be one of the 3 major networks. 

The Donahue type audience, given a choice, isn't about to sit down and listen to
William F. Buckley or George Will on a regular basis. For the most part, it's 
a different audience. I think the producers recognized this and smartly filled 
the void. 

Morton Downey has no corner on the arrogant/rude market. Phil Donahue does more
then his share. Donahue's strategy/tactics are simple. I've seen him use it a 
hundred times. A common practice by liberal talk show hosts TV or Radio.

- If you are a liberal and you can communicate or support your point 
  intelligently and he agrees with it, you can have your say.

- If you are a liberal and you can't communicate your point or support it
  intelligently, he will put words in your mouth and make you look good.

- If you are a conservative and you can't communicate or support your point 
  intelligently, watch out, you are about to be made into a fascist, bigot or
  at best an ass.

- If you are a conservative and you can communicate or support your point 
  intelligently, he will simply cut you off at a statement that is to his 
  advantage and move on. You will never be heard from again.

Morton Downey isn't William F. Buckley or George Will but at least he gets 
to air *some* conservative views and opinions to an audience that may never
have gotten the chance to hear them.
  
Frankly, it is a refreshing, entertaining show that supports conservative 
views. I am up to here with all that liberal dribble we have been listening 
to for decades.  At this point in my life, I'll take it even if it is the 
Hard Hat model.
  
Bob 

    RE -.1
    
                            Amen brother!!!

You know what the worst thing about Mort's show is?


It makes the "McLaughlin Group" look like intelligent, reasoned discussion!

eric

    re .18   "I remember a show where they had a number of the leading
           feminist leaders on his show ... one of the feminist(s)
           stated that practically all divorced men didn't ( do this
           or that )."
    
            Feminist leaders don't say such things. Authors of
           works such as 'Mothers on Trial' unfortunately do.
    
             "But that's the problem with these radical feminists,
           one of them lies and the others swear by it."
    
            Put away your stereotypes.  Feminists collect data and
           share information. And experiences. That many feminists
           agree with one another means that they've reached the same
           conclusions about certain issues.
    
            The process is simple: 
    
            a) You get an idea.
            b) You gather information.
            c) Put the info together.
            d) Analyse it. 
            e) Make conclusions.
    
            What have you researched?  What have you concluded?
    
    
                                                    Russ P.

    RE:28 Spoken like a true liberal (said with tongue in cheek);')
    
    Did anyone see the show last night? (6-15-88)  It involved AIDS
    and had Morts brother on it.  Tony Downey is a homosexual who has
    AIDS.  It truly showed a side of Morton Downey which I imagine not
    many people have seen.  It showed a person who was torn between
    his beliefs and a reality which goes against those beliefs involving
    one of his own.  He was, at times, emotionally moved to tears. 
    I think people have to give him credit on this one.  I wouldn't
    want to have to be interviewing my brother on national television
    about something which I had problems understanding which eventually
    will result in the death of my brother.  I think it also showed
    how a person changes their attitudes on something when it hits home.
    
                                              Mike

    re: .0
    
    The only Mort Downey, Jr. show I managed to watch (TV is low priority)
    is the one with Tony Downey.
    
    One could have a whole note on this one ... I came away observing
     that Mort  doesnt realy smoke; he just sucks on the cigarette and
    blows out the smoke.
    
    His guests seemed questionable .. as if they were selected for
    either their stupidity or lack of competency. The whole subject of
    AIDS is fraught with so much "unknowns";  but the one "key poont"
    seemed to be that a two week bottle of AZT (or is it ACT) costs
    $1500 dollars ... and was researched using tax dollars as a possible
    cure for cancer.
    
    Yet, for all the guests worth, each seemd to have a tiny handle
    on "a cure" for "some AIDS manifestations".
    
    In one sense, I felt as if Mort were an actor, portraying a hard
    line moralist for the 'audience'  they've targetted for this show;
    in another I saw a man struggling with a reality he did not choose,
    but cannot swerve from no matter how diametrically opposed he is
    to it .. his own brother dying from AIDS, because he is gay .. because
    he did do anal sex, drugs, and alchohol.
    
    That is my opinion on this one show ...
    
    //rwe

    re: .29
    
    � Did anyone see the show last night? (6-15-88)  It involved AIDS
    � and had Morts brother on it.  Tony Downey is a homosexual who has
    � AIDS.  
    
    Urk - I have that twilight zone feeling again. . .I happened to
    tune in last night and they were talking about the A.M.A. and
    it's policing (or lack thereof) of doctors. . .
    
    But that's not really what prompted me to reply.  Regardless of
    when it aired, I have no doubt that the show about AIDS/Tony
    Downey,
    
    � . . .showed a person who was torn between his beliefs and a 
    � reality which goes against those beliefs involving one of his own.  
    � He was, at times, emotionally moved to tears. 
    
    The man is, obviously capable of caring and compassion but, what
    bothers me is that, too often, if it isn't "one of his own", he
    is quite content to heap derision upon, unfairly interrupt, and 
    generally not allow full expression of opposing views.  That 
    bothers me because the show claims to present fair (albeit, um,
    energetic) discussions of various issues.
    
    Energetic it is, "fair" it is very often not; and the decision about
    when to allow or not allow discussion is Downey's.  Also, Mike,
    you describe Downey as ". . .torn between his beliefs and a reality
    that goes against those beliefs. . ."  To often, I find that Downey
    is altogether too willing to play to the various beliefs people
    have *without* exploring the reality; it takes "one of his own" to
    be involved before he will challenge those beliefs.  This willingness
    to allow belief to go unchallenged is one of the necessary ingredients
    for bigottry.  
    
    This is the essence of what troubles me about Downey, which is not
    to say I'm am totally anti-Downey.  I'm not, and I'll go further
    and say that I think it's good that he helps open up and air the
    emotionality of "hot" issues.  But exploring emotionality alone is 
    not the only way to examine controversial issues; if it were,
    we would have blown ourselves away long ago.  It seems to me that
    to best explore the human condition, we need use both our emotions
    *and* our reasoning abilities.  Among other things, rationality
    presents us with a way of challenging beliefs, something that I
    think we all agree is necessary to achieve progress.
    
    Also (I believe in his favor) I think I've seen some change in his 
    style over the last year.  For instance, the show (coulda sworn it 
    was last night) about the A.M.A. had it's fair share of highly charged 
    emotion, but a couple of times Downey overrode his cheering section to 
    allow people to finish what they were saying, something he did less of
    in the past.  I get the sense that he was a little uncomfortable
    with his audience's willingness to not even allow the "opposition"
    to say anything; I even have a hunch that he is, from time to time,
    a little concerned about this thing he's created.  It's one thing
    to have created a spirited, energetic, even heated discussion show.
    It's something else again to have created an atmosphere where the
    audience wants to heap scorn (or worse) on the opposition *without
    allowing any discussion whatsoever*.  
    
    One thing seems certain to me:  whether we like him, hate him, or
    just don't care, he's gonna be with us for a while.  Good, bad,
    or indifferent, the show sells and that just about guarantees
    life in TV-land.
    
    Steve
    
    P.S.  About the comment "One good fist is worth a thousand words":
    	  does that mean that one good nuclear armageddon is worth all
          the words we could ever speak?
    

    I agree to some extent with virtually every observation that has been
    made about Downey so far in this conference.  Sometimes he is a
    pigheaded, intolerant asshole, yet at times he insists on each side
    getting its fair say.  Most of the time he is somewhere in between.
    
    I applaud the author of .32, who acknowledges that Morton Downey,
    Jr. is not a one-dimensional charicature.  He is a human being.
    With all his theatrics and excesses, with all the people who interpret
    his words and manner as a way of justifying their mob mentality,
    he seems to make people really think about the issues and question
    their beliefs.
    
    I tune in from time to time.  I tune out when he is into his intolerant
    mode and not allowing people to reasonably speak their peace.
    Sometimes he lets open discussion turn into a shouting match, and
    the 'liberal' side shouts down the 'conservative' or vice versa,
    or everyone is shouting at once.  When this happens I find it difficult
    to follow *anyone's* argument, and usually tune out.  But from time
    to time, there is actually some semblance of open discussion.  I
    have seen him shut up the "ooh ooh" gorilla section on many occasions.
    
    Why do people find it so necessary to take sides and see everything
    as good or bad? Sometimes we learn the most from people we want
    to hate.
    
    Steve L.

	Morton and Phil ought to have it out in a List.
	And MAY they both lose and a result we win. Maybe
	we can get a real TV format that can discuss issues
	w/o all this theatrical hype Bullsh*t.

    
        re .34:
	>> Morton and Phil ought to have it out in a List.

    'Scuze my ignorance - what do you mean by a 'List'?
    
    Steve L.

    
    I don't really know what a confrontation between two hosts would prove.
    I would like to see a talk show host that is civilized, main streem,
    prime time or so and handles both sides of every issue.  It is tough
    to take every show has a radical left domination afraid to go near the
    right at all.  While Mort touchs on the left and even has some forum
    he doesn't show respect.  Therefore he'll never make the mainstream.
    The people that are right are boring. The left are woman mongers.
    
    Let me ask a questian: Does this mean that men are more right oriented
    and woman are more left?  Issues effect everyone.  I am liberal in
    some issues(not many i'll admit) and conservative on others.
    

re: .33 
>    Why do people find it so necessary to take sides and see everything
>    as good or bad?

What else would you have them do?

Kip

    re .37:
>   What else would you have them do?
    
    I think we often lose out when we label things as simply good or
    bad; nothing is entirely good or bad.  Some things are so negative
    to us that it entirely outweighs the positive.  But often if we're
    willing to be a bit more open minded and not focus on the negative
    we can see a lot of positive and benefit from that positive.
    
    Of course, it can be fun to play the devil's advocate or argue just
    for the sake of argument, but it's easy to forget the point and
    get emotionally involved.  Before you know it you're all worked
    up and, really, what for?
    
    So there! :^)
    
    Steve

    
    Did anyone see  that show on pro wrestling.  This made me respect MD's
    show and format much more than ever.  He was able to corral the main
    men of wrestling and get them to answer biting questions.  At one 
    point a fist fight was about to break out and MD handled it better than
    anyone could.  His show has the potential to get into some of the most 
    difficults issues never brought into such a format.  The raucus and
    jeering cheering are getting 'zipped' and he's cutting to the heart.
    Some might think that this is ironic and prowrestling belongs here.
    good for you.  But for those who enjoy bighting fact finding and
    thinks it is good entertainment "IT'S IN THERE"
    
                                     KP

    
    
    I didn't know there were any biting facts about prowrestling.
    

    Yeah, the fact is that when they get too close together, they
    bite . . .
    
   --bonnie

    
    
    And I bet Phil Donahue is your idol Bonnie?  He doesn't bite he gums.
    
    
    
          Ken P.

    I don't like any of these biting, or gumming, commentators;
    I like men who -- oops, can't say that here . . . 
        
    --bonnie

    
    Last night Phil Donahue was on the M. D show.  It was quite interesting
    Maybe if people would keep an open mind they would learn about some
    things.  I don't like many show hosts but I keep an eye on them and
    once in a while learn something.  Freedom of the airways was important
    when Phil and MD got together. Let's think about what we can learn even
    though we may not like everything they stand for.
    
    
                                  Ken P...

    
   
    Last night (Jul 27) MDJ's show centered around a discussion of
    whether convicted murderer Edgar Smith should be released on
    parole.  During discussion about the heinous crimes he committed,
    a reference was made about MDJ's brother and implied that he had
    also committed heinous crimes.  Can anybody enlighten me as to the
    nature of the crimes he committed ?  Is this the same guy who has
    AIDS ?
    
    Larry

    
    .45> Larry I'm shooting in the dark but I heard the same thing on
         that show and I thought about it assuming that they were
         referring to the fact that sodomy was an illegal act.  That
         sounded like a cheap shot to me. No matter what it means I 
         don't really know why it was brought up at that point.  but
         MD handled it as good as he could.
    
    
                                  Ken P....

    Well each night it is a battle, My Dad says he is great, and my
    Mom says he's an obnoxious *ss, but they both watch it but I think
    it is mainly entertainment.  Sometimes I have caught them arguing
    over the theme of the show though, and they are almost as funny
    as Mort himself.
    
    TammyG

    RE: .47
    
    > Well each night it is a battle, My Dad says he is great, and my
    > Mom says he's an obnoxious *ss, but they both watch it but I think
                                 ^^^
    
    Tammy, it's okay with me if you want to say "ass" here. I wasn't
    even offended when you talked about the possibility, in Note #
    80.40 in Womannotes, of referring to your SO as "that old prick". :-)
    
      Alan

re: .48
    
    Well ALan I was repreating something that was already in the file,
    nobody complained so I figured it was alright to use it again (Re:
    my notes in womannotes).....Guess I can say ass, I was just trying
    to be courteous......
    
    TammyG

    Reading all of these notes about Morton Downey Jr, his show, his
    attitudes, his techniques, audience appeal, success, and all the
    other comments...has anybody else been reminded of his resemblance
    to the fictional character named Jack Barron?  MDJ seems to be
    conservatively-oriented whereas Jack was a flaming liberal (the
    book, *Bug Jack Barron*, was written in the 60s by Norman Spinrad, 
    when liberalism was trendier), but their techniques and success
    seem to be very similar.
    
    DougO

    RE: .45  Yes, they were referring to the brother who has AIDS. 
    The crime they were referring to was having intercourse when he
    knew he had the AIDS antibody.  I agree that was a heinous crime.
    The thing which I wondered about was what it had to do with the
    topic at hand.  The guy was just looking for a cheap shot to throw
    at Morton.  I think Morton was real close to losing it and decking
    the guy.
                                                   Mike

	As a side note Morton Downey, Jr is supposed to be
	at the club casino, hampton beach New Hampshire on
	August 21 (or there abouts)

	/Robin

    Just off the press
    
    Last night ata taping of MD Roy Innis decks Rev Al Sharpton ,Downey
    steps in as refferee

    
    RE:-.1
    
    	Give us more facts!  (Background, resolution, etc.)
    
    
    	GCA/
    
    

    
    Sounds like a televised circus...

    didn't read article, but the half facts were that Al had his say,and
    when it was innis' turn he(Al) wouldn't let him talk. all I got

    RE: -1 at's basically what happened.  Fat Al got his say and then
    Innis tried to respond.  Al cut him off, saying something kind of
    derogatory about Innis not being for blacks.  Innis stood up and
    got in Als face.  Al tried to stand up and that's when Innis pushed
    him back in his chair and he fell backwards.  Then Morton stood
    in between the two.  The rest of the show was done with each of
    the participants getting 5 minutes to talk.  That worked out fairly
    well.  As a result, Innis and Sharpton are going to put on the gloves
    and get into the ring.  I think they said it was going to be sometime
    in September.  The sad part about the issue they were discussing
    (Twanda Brawley) is that the picture is getting so clouded and muddled
    that it almost seems as though a just resolution is becoming
    improbable.
                                                   Mike