Conference quark::mennotes-v1

    The only dates that I've had came before I became a friend with
    the woman were arranged through correspondence originating from
    a Singles ad in a paper.  None of them led anywhere.
    
    I really don't have much belief in the "dating game" as it is usually
    viewed.  I really prefer to becomes friends with someone first.
    Unfortunately, sometimes that means that we will only be friends.
    
    Rich

    
    
�    *   Why do you ask women out on first dates?
        
	If they are a stranger then because I find them physically
    	attractive initially. (that could change after they speak a
    	few words though.. :-))
    
     	If I "know" them then it's cuz I find them attractive in other ways 
    	and I'm curious.  
    
    	If I really know them it's cuz they are comfortable to be around
    	and I want to spend more time with them.
    
    
�    *   If you knew that the "dating game" was not that thrilling
�            for the women you were interested in, would you be willing
�            to try some alternative ways to initiate dating relationships?
        

    	I'm not sure I understand the question.. If you mean do I know
    	that their dating success has been like mine lately [:-)] then
    	I'd probably say something like "Hey, waddya say we say the
    	hell with this "dating" crap and just go out and have a good
   	time"  That's worked sometimes.. Breaks the ice too.. GETTING
    	to that point is the tough part.
    
� *   If you were going to try alternative ways to initiate
�        relationships, what would you want to try?

    	I'm about out of "alternative ideas" and have said the
    	hell with it and taken myself off the market.  I'm like that
    	Teddy Bear you saw at Jordan Marsh last week. I'm in the back
    	room but still for sale if the right buyer comes along. Until
    	then I'm having an ok time with the back room flunkies..
    
    						mike

    
    	I tend to be very shy and very dense when it comes to
    	reading signals. For this reason I (like Mike) have
    	been off the "market" for quite some time. I don't
    	feel comfortable asking someone out on a date, mainly
    	due to the few times I did try to read the signals and
    	ended up getting them wrong. One of the most common
    	responses I hear is "you're a nice guy, BUT I just don't
    	think of you in that light". Guess it's true about the
    	old saying, that nice always finish last......
    
    	G_B

    
        
    >*	Why do you ask women out on first dates?
    
    It has been my experience that it's the only way I'm likely to get
    them.  I'm not pointing a finger here -- that's just been my
    experience.
    
    >*	If you knew that the "dating game" was not that thrilling
    >	for the women you were interested in, would you be willing
    >	to try some alternative ways to initiate dating relationships?
    
    An awful lot of women seem to be dissatisfied with the way the
    whole thing works.  Alternatives, however, do not spring immediately
    to mind.  Even something like a dating service or answering an ad
    is really employing the same basic mechanism.
        
    >*	If you were going to try alternative ways to initiate
    >	relationships, what would you want to try?
    
    I'd never really thought about alternatives.  Imagine if some outfit
    like Sears decided to get into matchmaking....
    
    DFW

    

    re: 5
    
    > ...Imagine if some outfit like Sears decided to get into
    > matchmaking...
      
    Imagine maybe...
    
       ... only $12 a month, 3 years installment plan?
    
       ... maintainence contracts?
    
       ...satisfaction guaranteed?
    
    :-)
    Sandie

    because they are so much more fun than ocelots.

    I have to agree with the .7  
    
    Why the hell do you think men ask women out???  It's called sexual
    attraction.  There's a certain companionship and feeling that you
    get from a woman that your best buddy can't give you.
    
    I don't know what the "dating game" is, but I know of no way other
    to get to know a woman "intimately" other than an actual date
    (aka courtship).
    
    tim 

    re: .8
    
    Your remarks apply to this culture, but not in general.  What about
    arranged marriages?  Is Mike Mahler or someone else with an experience
    of Japanese culture around?  Are they still doing it the old-fashioned
    way -- with matchmakers?
                                                    
    We certainly do seem to be stuck with ref. to American society,
    however.
    
    DFW

I'd like to ask a woman out to find out more about her and to give
her an opportunity to find out more about me. I'd like to do this
on a friends basis at first so that at least we would have a chance
for friendship if nothing further would happen.

Since most people assume that more than friendship is being asked
for, its usually awkward and I think I may have even lost an
opportunity for friendship recently by asking someone if they would
like to do something sometime. Well, I'd certainly like more than
friendship with someone I may be interested in, but I wouldn't even
want to think in that direction until I knew more about them.

It seems to me that it is difficult to become friends with
people, male or female. I would prefer to be friends with someone
before asking for a first date, however, this appears to me difficult
to do at work. At work, if you say Hi to someone you don't know,
you may get a hello in return, but invariably you get a blank stare
even among people you see regularly. Lunch ought to be a convenient place
to meet new people, however, it appears distinctly difficult to show up
at a "foreign" lunch table. Then, there are the people who disturb woman
during their work day. I should say alot on that subject but, in brief
I think this has disillusioned woman about being open to men at work.

Circumstances like these make a shy person like myself feel like the dating
game is painfully difficult and would prefer meeting people as friends first
but even that is difficult. I don't think I'll give up, but I am certainly
at a loss as to how to proceed on this stuff.

Tom

    re: .2
    
           I have never seen you, but from the responses that I have
    seen from other woman in notes I can't imagine you having to spend
    time in the "back room with the flunkies!"

    Why does there have to be a big distinction between a "Date" and
    going and having a good time with someone?  I'm still a na�ve and
    idealistic college student I suppose, but I've found that the only
    difference is...in your mind.  I don't think I could enjoy a "Date"
    with someone I didn't know -- so in college I've tried to just ask
    people (okay, WOMEN) if they wanted to do something, and... get
    close enough to the person that the "line" between "friendship"
    and "romance" gets a chance to grow a little fuzzy.  I still haven't
    figured out how to "cross the line", though -- it always seems to
    just happen, or not happen.  Maybe that's the best way, as long
    as you're prepared to accept either outcome...
    
    BTW, I HAVE experienced a greater frustration in meeting women during
    the summer (when I'm in Geneva and working) than during the rest
    of the year (when I'm a student at the University of Michigan).
    It really spoils you, to be an environment with 20,000 people your
    own age, many of whom are available and experimenting by having
    relationships with different kinds of people.  I suppose it doesn't
    help that even if I do meet someone here, I'll have to leave at the end
    of the summer anyway.  But...I am trying to pursue interests outside of
    work which would involve spending time with members of the opposite
    sex. We'll see how it goes.
    					-Keith