Conference quark::mennotes-v1

    I love marriage. I married someone smarter and better looking
    then me. What else could you want? I'm happily married and can't
    think of anything to change.
    
    			Alfred

    Becky:
    OK, I'll stick my neck out and offer my outlook. I'm single and
    would like to be married some day. I think I have a pretty realistic
    outlook on marriage, I know that nowadays it is nery difficult to
    survive on one income and don't feel threatened by a women that
    has her own career. This, I feel, will add extra stress to the 
    marriage unfortunately.(as compared with the days when most women
    stayed home and the man went to work) I believe a marriage should
    have  give and take and flexibility to keep up with the changes
    constantly goin on today.
    
    What kind of girl would I want to marry?
    
    I want to marry an intelligent, sensitive woman, with whom I can
    be myself. I also think she should be confident to be herself and
    comfortable with being that around me. Physical attractivenes is
    important, but I keep finding that beauty is more than just skin
    deep. Someone who is willing to grow and change and take chances
    is also a must. 
    
    How ... relationship to be?
    
    I would want it to be one based on honesty and trust. I would hope
    that we could be very good friends. I think it is very important
    to be able to work things out. Again, I fall back to the give and
    take theory, I hope it can work.
    
    Finally, let me say, I am also scared as h*** about getting married
    nowadays. Not due to AIDS or other disease, but because so many
    are just not working out. I'd like to think it is possible for a
    happy, growing marriage and hope there are women out there that
    do to. I don't profess to know why so many don't work out, just
    that there is a problem.
    Gotta go for now, it's 5:00pm on a Friday, and I'm itchin to
    go home!
    Jeff

    
    
    	Marriage is pissah (I've heard) when it's with the right person.
    	Finding the right person is the tough part.
    
    	I'd like to get married someday, have a family, etc... If the
    	person is someone I can talk to, someone who can talk to me,
    	shares, take care of me and likes being taken care of, then
    	her and I will get along pretty good. We all know there's
    	more to it than that but that's a good start.
    
    	BTW, if she looks like either Demi Moore or Ally Sheedy then
    	she's off to a great start. :-) :-) :-)
    
    							mike

    
         One more yes for marriage, here.  I desire it greatly, but
    am extremely cautious about it.  So cautious, that it may never
    happen.  Then again...
    
                                  Greg
    

    
    	Yeah.... I suppose I'd do it again.......
    
    	As long as I'd lived with her for twenty five years first and
    both her parents were dead !
    
    Steve

    	I firmly believe there is a future for marriage ... it will
    no go the way of the dodo bird.  Divorce statistics for the US which
    have been saying 20% or better of the marriages end in divorce have
    been proven to be false.  The failure rate for marriages (I chose
    the word failure) is less than 10%.
    
    	I enjoy marriage very much, though define it a bit differently
    than some in this file.  If we were to divorce I would marry again
    as soon as I found a woman with whom I made a good match but I doubt
    we will ever divorce (having been divorced twice before I believe
    the warning signals are somewhat clear now).
    
    Douglas

    Never been there - not scared, just a knack for finding the wrong
    women. 

    
    Re: .6
    
    
    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHHAHA!
    
    8^>
    
    

    
    	Ok, I'll be the first....
    
    	 No way. I did it once and thank god I got out of that
    	one. After seeing what I did in the first, I'll never
    	ever repeat that mistake.

        I think that marriage can be a wonderful thing if both parties
    involved believe in it.
    
        I do however think that marriage is an institution that
    doesn't work for everyone.  I think that there should be other ways
    to form a partnership between two or more people that should be
    acceptable to society.  I haven't really done much thinking about
    what sorts of arrangements could be made, but it would be nice if
    people had a choice about how they're going to live their lives
    with another person.  Everyone is different, and I don't see any
    reason for having only one type relationship agreement which is
    the only one accepted by society in general.
    
        I didn't marry a girl, and I wouldn't ever do so.  I married
    a woman and I would marry the same woman again.  She is intelligent,
    talented, interesting, and exciting to be around.
    
        I would like to have a relationship where interest in others
    outside the marriage is not frowned upon, and where each partner
    may get involved with someone outside the marriage.  But our society
    doesn't allow this, and my wife doesn't want that kind of relationship.
    I honor her feelings and value her enough to give up my ideal of
    a relationship and live within the confines of a standard marriage.
    
        I'd say I'm fairly happy in my marriage.  There are disagreements
    and friction from time to time, but that is what is to be expected
    as people change.
    
        I think that I would have talked more with Lesley before we
    got married so that we would have ironed out a few of the wrinkles
    in our lives before we got married.  I think we would have less
    friction early on.
    
    ASP

    OPEN enough to realize all people aren't the same.
    BRAVE enough to trust [again].
    CARE enough to want to share life and all it has to offer.
    GENEROUS enough to know that someone deserves them.

    To George and Gene:
    
    You'll be old and lonely and have no-one to take care of you.
    You know that, don't you?
    
    I love the "why bother?" comment.  We women just love to hear that.
    Don't you realize that many women become as involved as they are
    in their relationships because they feel it is an investment.
    I've told my SO, this is the deal.  It's like magazines:
    You can go into Store 24 and look over the magazines and see which
    one you want to buy.  You can even skim through a few.  If you are
    seriously considering buying one of the magazines, you may want
    to read a couple of the articles quickly before you lay down the
    money.  If you decide it's not for you, put it down and look at
    another one.  It's not polite to monopolize a magazine by reading
    it cover-to-cover while you're still standing in the store. If you
    want to read the whole magazine and keep it at your house, buy it.
    If not, put it back so someone else can.
    
    Stacie

    
    
    	Shit, do I LIKE THAT ANALOGY!
    
    	

    i'm beginning to get that "why bother" attitude myself...

    i see so many people "living in sin" and VERY happy doing so
    that a piece of paper wouldn't mean didly...  they look/act
    no different than any other couples that do have that piece of
    paper.  and incidentally, some of these couples have kids...
    no problem...it's the 80's.  

    i think it's just the changing times and some people can't/won't
    keep up with it for one reason or another.  to each his own!

    tlr    	

    can one reply at the base note here ?
    well i will try
    
    my dad died in '81
    my mom's husband (at that time) would not let her go to the funeral
    because the sick bastard was jealous of my then dead father
    
    get married you bet
    commit or get out
    people that can't are &*&^#&#^&#^&#*@!% 
    I already did once and I'd do it again

    Re: 17
    
    I can see where jealousy like that can come from.  I have a hard
    time dealing with the fact that my SO had someone before me.  I
    wonder a lot about it, hoping that I am "better than she was" or
    that what we have is "different."  Just insecurity, I guess.
    
    Heaven forbid I ever get a divorce.  (we're not even married yet!)
    But my Mom and Dad were excellent role models.  They have been divorced
    for almost 14 years now, since I was 5 or 6.  They have their arguments
    of course, but they decided to end their marriage as soon as they
    saw that it wasn't going to last.  They didn't let all of the
    resentment and bad feelings set in.  Talk about amicable divorces!
    They are still very close friends, and I don't think it's just because
    of my brother and I.  They still get together and are like best
    buddies.  If you ask them , they'll say "Why not?  We liked each
    other enough to get married, didn't we?  Why throw that all away
    just because we can't seem to live together."  They figure they
    still have a lot in common, and it makes them feel much better to
    still be good friends.  
    Let me tell you, it sure made the divorce a lot easier on me and
    my brother.  If you have to do it, *that's* the way.  I know that
    people get hurt and get bad feelings, but it was nice that they
    could put all that aside and just be friends.  Mature of them.
    
    Stacie

reg: .14

SUPER!

another who liked it!

ga

    
    RE: .14
    
    	I can't answer for Gene, but for myself I will grow old, yes.
    	Lonely, no way, I don't need another person to make me feel
    	complete as a person. I am also very capable to take care of
    	myself. Why is it everyone assumes that to be happy you must
    	have another person, am I the only one that can be happy being
    	on my own?
    
    	G_B

    After my divorce, like many others, I said never again....
    
    
    But I fell in love with a gorgeous blonde from New England...
    
    
    I asked her if she would mind marrying me very much....
    
    
    And she said, "YES!"  (well, what would YOU say?)
    
    
    LOVE AND MARRIAGE !!!  YEA!  THAT'S THE TICKET! !! !

    Re .20, I don't think it's that most people *can't* be happy on
    their own.  It's just that it's even more fun to have somebody special
    to share life with, as long as it is somebody special.
    

    Glad you all liked my analogy.  
    
    Funny, my SO didn't think it was so wonderful.
    
    Stacie

    RE:.23

    Did you ask him why Stacie?  Maybe he's a tad insecure about it?

    To Stacie:
    
    I don't want you to take this in any way other than the best.
    
    It's been a couple of months, now, since I first started noticing
    your entries in various Notes Conferences.
    
    Each time I finish reading something written by you, I find myself
    smiling, regardless of the subject.
    
    You have a way of expressing your feelings, your exuberance for
    life and your caring for people.
    
    Most importantly, you are not afraid of exposing yourself, of
    leaving yourself vulnerable, to share who you really are.
    
    Perhaps it's your relative youth. Maybe it's your own special gift
    to the world.
    
    But whatever it is, please try never to lose those qualities which
    make you, you.
    
    You strike the note that allows a cynic like me to almost start
    believing again.
    
      Alan

        RE .26,
        
        Nicely said,  and  I agree!  There are too many confrontational
        people around in  notes  these  days  and it's good to see some
        friendly, happy noters - the way it used to be. :*)
        
        Andy.
        

    
    	Marrying my wife is the best thing I ever did! 
    	I honestly cannot imagine not being with her. I wish
    	others tha same good fortune that I have discovered.

    
    	If we want to take the new "Hite report" to heart, then
    	it'd have to be a BIG NO to marriage.
    
    	After all, Ms. Hite claims over 70% of all women cheat on
    	their mates.......
    
    
    	:^)   :^)

    
    	I know what you mean George. My wife and often feel like
    	part of an incredibly small minority. It seems as if most people
    	cheat, they aren't happy, they don't communicate, etc.
    	It all depends upon what statistics from what study are being
    	offered. Maybe we need a new study entitled: Anyone happy, why?

    re: .0
    
    Well, I'm on #3 now. So far it looks good, 'cause its only been
    two months (as of Nov 3) now, so the 'Honeymoon' is still on.
    
    The prognosis is good, because we talk a lot about what's good and
    what isn't. We care for and about each other. We laugh a lot. We
    cry sometimes, too. We share. Most important, we are committed.
    We don't have rings yet, because they're not important. We have
    each other. That is important. We're not perfect. We know that.
    We make mistakes. We learn a lot, too. Sometimes  I forget things.
    She reminds me. She feels hurt. She tells me. I know whats important,
    because she tells me. I don't like to guess. SOmetimese we get comfused
    about what we "really mean" compared to what we say. We talk a lot.
    We laugh a lot. We love a lot. We work at being together. We care
    for and about each other. We share our dreams (lierally), shower
    everyday, and talk a lot. Looks like it'll last a along time, as
    long we keep talking, sharing, loving. We are committed !
    
    
    The word is :
    
    
    			C O M M I T T E D to each other.
    Bob et tois
    

      	
    	been married for six yrs and our life is great
    lived together before we wed and had our first son seven months
    before we married. Had everyone in our families telling us we should
    marry when we were pregnant and we agreed. Back at the ranch was
    different tho. We discussed every aspect of getting married right
    away or waiting til we wanted and could really afford to. We did
    it our way and we're glad we did. The only thing we should have
    done different was planning a greater financial foundation. Even
    two salaries isn't enuff. Those boys sure can wolf down some hefty
    meals!! Alot of stuff can be taken for granted occaisionally everyone
    knows that, but we know we'll always be together til death do us
    part. (corny huh?!)
                       
    see ya
    pisano

    Seems when I was younger, I would never dream that I would be 
    approaching 30 and not even have a "steady". I never even considered
    I would have less than 3.5 kids by now.
    
    And yet, time went on, men came and went with the weather, and
    I find a person has evolved that I never had a clue existed in me.
    Independent!  Learning to have a life without an SO.  Sitting back
    and examining my feelings toward marriage now...I see a stranger
    in me.  One who places no value on the institution anymore.  
    
    Maybe exposure to everyone else's infidelities, abuse, divorces,
    and other bad experiences have soured me. Maybe I'll get married,
    but I doubt I'll ever spend much more time "hoping" I do.  
    
    I think I'd be slow to trust my decision to marry.  I came too 
    close once to making what would have been a disasterous duo, and
    will not take the decision too lightly again.
    
                                        cj
    

    "I'll never spend much time "hoping" I do."
    
    I like that!!!

    "Wait, and hope."
    
    Edmond Dantes, Count of Monte Christo

    
    Marriage is what you both make it. It cannot be good unless both
    partners pull together.
    It's having someone to help when you need it,
    Someone to listen to your rotten day and your good days,
    A pal to hang around with,
    A lustful sex object to relieve your fustrations,
    A mother when your sick,
    A guard to keep watch over you.
    
    and so on. Marriage can be fun, but then again it can be hell! It's
    all what you make it! It's not 50/50 or 10/90 it's being fair, and
    consistant and most of all respectful.
    
    But like everything it's not meant for everyone. I need someone
    to be with. Can't stand to be alone for long periods of time. I
    enjoy companionship and people.
    
    But to each their own. Do what you feel right about!
    
    Cal.
     

    re .2 by GCANYN::WILBER-
    
    Right on the mark.  Your reply was the closest in the string to
    matching my thoughts, and upon rereading, I'd only like to emphasize
    one thing- men and women today are not trained by this society we
    live in for marriage, committment, responsibility for their own
    actions.  Those individuals who learn these get it from their parents
    or smaller cultural institutions (school, club, church, wherever)
    but far too many never really feel responsible for their own lives.
    These are the ones who shouldn't get married.  I'm gunshy about
    choosing one such.
    
    re .14 by Stacie-
    
    The magazine analogy is cute.  Insofar as it implies committment
    (taking it home with you) its a good analogy to describe relationships.
    
    Insofar as it suggests ownership also, I'm not real fond of it.
    Insofar as it neglects real concerns in a relationship (have you
    ever taken a magazine home, gotten comfortable with it, and had
    it leap from your hands and go running out the door?) I find it
    to be lacking as a model.  OK?  Maybe thats why your SO didn't like
    it, perhaps he felt it was a signal that you felt owned by him;
    I certainly might make such an error, of misinterpreting such a
    signal.
    
    Pax-
    
    DougO

    
    MARRIED ONCE ALREADY FOR FIVE LONG YEARS. I WAS SAD ABOUT THE BREAK-UP
    AT FIRST...ONCE I GOT TO TAKE A REMOVED LOOK AT MY EX, EVERYTHING
    WAS RECLARIFIED. I`M IN A RELATIONSHIP NOW THAT IS MUCH HEALTHIER,
    WE HAVE A CLEAR UNDERSTANDING ABOUT THE REASONS THAT WE`RE TOGETHER
    AND DON`T WANT TO LOOSE HOLD OF WHAT WE HAVE. THAT`S OUR REASON
    TO BE TOGETHER, NOT BECAUSE WE WENT THROUGH THE MARRIAGE ROUTINE
    SO WE`RE SUPPOSED TO BE TOGETHER. I GUESS MY ANSWER TO THE MARRIAGE
    QUESTION IS "WHY?"...
    
                          CHUCK