Conference quark::human_relations-v1

    Did you give her any indications when you saw each other every six
    weeks or so that you were still interested?  A subtle hint about
    getting back together?  Telling her you still cared?  Anything??
    
    If you truely accepted the fact that it was over and didn't act like
    you wanted it to start up again - well, then I really don't think you
    need to ask the questions if that's how she's acting.  If she doesn't
    want to get together, or stay friends, then I really don't think you
    need that type of friend, do you?  
    
    FWIW
    
    Lynne
    

    
    	It seems to me (based only on what I've gleened in the 100 or
    so lines of your base note entry) that you're pretty obsessed with
    this woman.
    
    	I've based that on the apparent amount, accuracy and analysis
    you've put into the information you have "on her".
    
    	For example, why do you care so much "(it hasnt been easy)"
    about the fact she is dating - *You've broken up*!!!
    
    	She "DRASTICALLY cut back" on returning your phone calls?
    So what - unless you're still pretty much taken by her...
    "hung up on her" as she put it. Again, *You've broken up*.
    Returning each and every phone call is not appropriate for two
    people who've just broken up - you're supposed to be *distancing*
    sort of by definition of the whole idea!
    
   >I'm confused, a little angry (she leaves messages on my machine,
   >but doesn't call me when she knows I'm there), and just...
   >gives me little indication as to what she wants to do about me. 
    
    	You're angry because she gives little indication as to what
    she wants to do about you?!? I'd think that she'd be angry because
    you did *not* give an accurate indication of what you want to do with
    yourself. You agreed to break up with her...but...not really. Sort
    of; you can still get all upset over her dating someone else, over
    the way she chooses to respond to you, over the choices she makes
    for herself which impact you. You can still look to her for support 
    when you're having a crisis. All inappropriate stuff, given the
    context of "breaking up".
    
    	You see, one reason why "breaking up but still remaining friends"
    is so difficult is because more often than not, the terms of the
    breakup were just never negotiated and are not understood. One party
    is acting within one set of terms; the other within a completely
    different set of terms. I also can say more often than not, this lack 
    of negotiating terms of the breakup is "diagnostic" of that same lack
    around what the terms of the *relationship* were; in fact which led
    to the breakup in the first place - but that's a whole 'nother story.
    I can only exemplify the obvious problem around the other "person
    from her past" and that "(we hadnt any fights)" as a clear indication
    of this lack of negotiation - any effort made to resolve that conflict.
    
    	It says on my screen here that you werent really sure that this
    man was part of the past - I guess or even what he was to her? Anyway...
    
    	I feel sorry in hearing the position you're in. What is being
    required of you - to keep an open heart to the possibility of something
    with her; all the while having no indication from her of any such
    possibility - is at the *masters* level of self-assurance and self
    actualization. I mean, you'd have to be *one with God* to be able...
    no wonder you're so clearly in a lot of emotional pain and discomfort 
    over this! About the only assurance I can give you is that when your 
    pain gets bad enough, you'll move to let go of the possibility of
    anything "more" with her; you'll drop your obsession with her and
    what she's doing because - it just wont be worth it anymore. I can
    suggest that you make an intelligent choice to do so now, before
    that happens.
    
    	Ironically, it's only when you do that - either as a choice
    or from the pain of it - that you'll even be able to be "just friends"...
    
    	Hope this helps,
    
    	Joe

    wouldn't you rather be with someone that has an active interest with
    you?
    
    

I can certainly understand how it can hurt to first have this woman leaving
messages on your machine expressing concern over how you're doing, and then
have her be irritated when you call her.

I would hope she could understand why this would be hurtful to you too.  Speak
to her.  Tell her you're hurt by that (don't tell her the anger part right
away, it's liable to push her away, share the anger with someone else).  If
she can understand the hurt, I bet you'll feel better.  If she can't understand
the hurt, ask that she not call you anymore until she can.

If this doesn't work, and you continue to feel your energy drained by this
problem, ask me about SLAA (Sex and Love Addicts Anonymous).  It's a 12-step
program of meetings that I attend at which we deal with these problems and
recovery from these problems *all* the time.

Thanks.

/Eric

   >> What should I do.
    
    Well, first call HER and say, look don't leave anymore messages on the 
    machine, if you can't talk to me directly, I'd rather not talk at all.
    
    Then, go get drunk, fall down, suffer a hangover, cry, write a poem 
    about the injustice of it all, send it to her.  Get angry about the 
    time you wasted on her.  Spend a night thinking of words to descripe
    what a B!+ch she has been, spend an evening remembering the wonderful
    time you shared together, write a letter to her telling her it was 
    great, but you need to move on now.
    
    Then go out, find another girl, take her out, have a good time, fall in 
    love again, and forget about the past.
    
    In other words, she's made it clear that she intends to 'move on' to 
    someone else, somthing else... you should do the same thing.  
    
    The sooner you realize that and let go of it, the sooner you can get 
    through the heart ache and go on with your life.
    
    Skip
    
    

    
    
    I think it's time for you to get on with your life!!  It's obvious she
    is trying to do the same.  It is not doing you any good to try and
    analyze this to death.  I am sure you keep hoping that you can be
    friends.  But it sounds like you want more than just a friendship. 
    Cut off communication with her completely.  It will get easier and
    easier as time goes by.  If she wants to see you or to talk to you, she
    will call. Time heals.....
    
    The important thing here is to take care of yourself first.  You are
    what's important and hopefully everything else will fall into place.

    i aslo subscribe to the theory of lesving her a message on her machine
    saying not to call you again.
    
    then move on...
    
    I reckon she's just keeping you hanging on in case this  current thing
    doesn't work out...
    
    
    Xtine

.0> She has told me that she feels I'm still "hung up on her,"
    
    Well, are you?
    
    ps: If you decide to cut off all communication, do yourself a favor...
        Meet with her in person and give her a verbal goodbye.  Make it
        formal and make it honest.
    
        I've cut off people without the goodbye or by giving them bogus
        reasons and it's one of those things I look upon in retrospect,
        wishing I'd done differently.  It really helps to tie up all the
        loose ends.

    Thanks for all of the responses. 
    
    "Am I hung up on her?" 
    
    Well, it's possible that part of me always will be. 
    
    I have not heard from her since Oct. 2, when I last called. And I
    haven't contacted her since then, either. 
    
    In my heart, I can't go along with the suggestions to "say goodbye." 
    There was a time when she and I had a pretty good friendship, and even
    while we were dating always used our friendship as a base for our
    relationship. So, I would like to *try* to keep the friendship, NOT in
    the hopes of ever rekindling anything, but because I value all of my
    friendships and make extra effort to preserve them. 
    
    I've thought about a way to approach this: 
    
    First, let her make the next move (call, or whatever). 
    
    In the meantime, I need to remind myself that our relationship ended,
    it ended because of differences, and it wasn't always so great all the
    time. There were problems. I need to remember these as I remember the
    good moments. 
    
    If I do this, move on in my mind and socially as well, when she does
    call I won't come across (maybe) as being so "needy" (which I'm sure
    is scaring her away). 
    
    It's funny, I've often thought that if she made overtures to me
    (however minor), I'd probably back off, too! This is another way of
    looking at my behavior. 
    
    I know two things: 
    
    1. I don't feel the need to call. My not calling says something: I'm
       giving myself time to get over you. 
    
    2. When we do get in contact, I feel I'll be a stronger person.  Of
       course, certain topics we won't be able to touch - like current loves
       in our lives - but, given time...and going slowly, we may even be able
       to talk about this. 
    
    I'm not waiting by the phone. I'm thinking more of the friendship we
    had, and how that's worth preserving. 
    
    I feel I will talk with her about the one-way communication. Tell her
    how I feel about the messages and the rude treatment. 
    
    In a while, I'll try to remember to reply to this note to report on
    the result of my "plan". (Not that I'm playing a game here, just
    having a plan to deal with a situation.)