| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
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| 1246.1 | | KERNEL::GRAYJ | Jo Gray, Ultrix Support CSC UVO | Tue Mar 17 1992 06:14 | 16 |
|
I'd be very tempted to suggest to Mom that if she wanted to help the
people who were asking for help (Sister and her husband) that *she* offer to
put them up rather than put them off on someone else maybe - either it could
be a valid solution or she may find her arguaments against it have to be
accepted as applicable to her mothers situation too.
It sounds as if Grandmas only problem is the stairs and she's not too worried
about that herself.. I guess it's only whether it's doing her harm doing the
upstairs and down again trip so often or whether she risks falling anyone
could justify interfering with.... I hate seeing old people pushed around by
children or grandchildren, they may not earn the right to insist once we're
adults we continue behaving a certain way - but they certainly earn the right
not to be treated the same way by us (in revenge for having to do what they said
when we were kids, I wonder at times)
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| 1246.2 | Family should be by choice... | GECKOS::WARD_FR | Making life a mystical adventure | Tue Mar 17 1992 09:35 | 44 |
| re: .0
"Mom" sounds very dominating. Too bad for everyone else.
Too bad for everyone else, however, for capitulating to her.
I don't know how your mom can control her mother, but if I were
your grandmother I'd tell her to f**k off (actually, it should
have shown up many years ago and if my child acted that way he/she
would not likely have much interaction in my life---and no
legal recourse, either.) Your sibling is needy, and in that neediness
does not seem to be able or willing to be responsible (and therefore
is not taking their negative impact into account.) "Doing what's
best for them" usually means "doing what's best for *me.*" That's
primarily mom, here.
I've said it in here before, and I'll say it again. At some
point in early life (say, two decades) people need to cut their
ties with their parents---as children; parents need to cut their
ties to their offspring---as children. There is NO (as in NONE)
chance to ever be a fully-functional adult as long as the individual
insists on acting a child or adolescent role. Similarly, there
is NO (as in NONE) chance for a grown-up to be a fully-functional
adult as long as they are left in a critical parent mode. If
both sides cannot agree to break the umbilical cords, then at least
ONE side must insist on it. The contract MUST be broken. If the
individuals choose to remain bonded, as equal adults at this point,
then there is no reason to end the relationship...which then becomes
a different sort of relationship.
Situations such as .0 are not likely if this
separation/responsibility has happened. Your sibling would not be
relying on mom to bail her out. Your grandmother would not be
reversing roles and allowing her child to become her parent. And
you might just have separated yourself from the whole mess and
told them all to screw themselves. On the other hand, since you
do care and are choosing to involve yourself, perhaps you can talk
to your grandmother to see how she feels...and maybe have her get
some sort of legal advice on whether or not her daughter has the
"rights" to do what she's planned. If not, then take some sort of
deposition to help guarantee it. Tell your sister to grow up and
learn to take life more responsibly. Tell your mom to let those in
her life who are adult-aged take responsibility for themselves and
for her to butt out unless asked...and then only to offer opinions
or direct help on her own (which impacts no one else.)
Frederick
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| 1246.3 | no discussion! | MR4DEC::HAROUTIAN | | Tue Mar 17 1992 13:01 | 7 |
| If Granma is legally competent, there's no discussion - she can live
wherever and with whomever (or not) she choses, and no one else has a
say in the matter. How to deal with that within the context of "family"
is, of course, a different matter entirely, and it sounds as though
someone is going to have to confront Mom and tell her to back off.
(IMO) :)
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| 1246.4 | | GIAMEM::JLAMOTTE | Come next Monday | Tue Mar 17 1992 13:34 | 9 |
| .3 I would like to suggest that the elderly are usually legally
competent. The real issue is that they are extremely vulnerable
and it is very easy for loved ones to manipulate them into decisions
that are not necessarily based on the good of the elder.
I commend the author of .0 for stepping in and trying to prevent an
uncomfortable situation for their grandparent.
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| 1246.5 | | CAPITN::SCARBERRY_CI | | Tue Mar 17 1992 15:18 | 10 |
| Sounds like your grandmother is doing fine. If your Mom wants to be
helpful, she may offer her home instead of your grandmother's to your
little sister. Although personally, your sister and her husband ought
to have used their time at his Mom's for search for work in other
areas.
They may not like the work they find, but their relatives should not
have to carry the burden for longer than what is reasonable.
cindy
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| 1246.6 | | BREAKR::FLATMAN | | Tue Mar 17 1992 20:27 | 42 |
| More Info:
Yes, mom is a very domineering woman that wants to control her
children's lives. All four of her children are married and she has yet
to be invited to a wedding (I was the only one to tell her prior to the
wedding that I was getting married and followed that up with "and
you're not invited." My sisters got married to get out of the house;
both my brother and I were long out of the house before we got
married.)
Grandma is just the opposite and is a non-confrontationalist. Over the
years, Grandma has gained a lot of respect as a human by those who know
her. Some have suggested that my mom is envious.
RE: .2
I hear what you are saying with regards to the parent/needy child
strings needing to be cut. I doubt if anyone who knows me would say
that those ties still exist for me (in fact, I have been accused by
some of going to the other extreme). My siblings are a completely
different matter; they are still controlled by mom's purse strings.
My mom was an only child and my grandmother dotted on her. Both would
have benefited if there had been more kids in their family. Somewhere
along the line, the parent/child role began to reverse and mom began
treating Grandma more like a child than an adult.
I personally am getting involved because I don't believe Grandma should
be railroaded (she's too nice of a persona and doesn't deserve it), and
if someone was trying to take my home away from me, I would be ticked.
I'm also the only one in the family that isn't dependent upon mom
(except Grandma of course).
I'll fire off my current round of salvos ("Gee mom, Kathy's more YOUR
responsibility ... she should move in with YOU.") In the long run, I
don't picture this as helping my sister (or brother-in-law) to become
more of an adult, but that's not my problem.
I'll keep you posted, and thanks,
- Dave
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| 1246.7 | | REGENT::BROOMHEAD | Don't panic -- yet. | Wed Mar 18 1992 12:09 | 12 |
| Dave,
Yup. Your grandmother is entitled to continue to live alone in the
home where she is comfortable. Your mother should be invited to
entertain :-) the notion that her own home might be the place to
put her own daughter.
Out of idle curiosity, I'll ask: Why doesn't your grandmother
want the stair-chair (or whatever it's called)? It sounds like a
great solution, and she doesn't *have* to use it every time.
Ann B.
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| 1246.8 | | MCIS5::WOOLNER | Photographer is fuzzy, underdeveloped and dense | Thu Mar 19 1992 15:23 | 12 |
| I'd tell "Mom":
1. Grandma's FINE; leave her alone. If the stairs start getting to
her, maybe one of her friends or neighbors could drop by at agreed-
upon time(s) daily to accompany her.
2. If you feel you must help Kathy & Tony, help them:
a) Find a part of the country that DOES have jobs (as opposed to
their no-jobs part of NY, or Cincinnati), and
b) Finance their move to said location.
Leslie
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| 1246.9 | | BREAKR::FLATMAN | | Mon Mar 23 1992 20:43 | 15 |
| RE: .7
>Out of idle curiosity, I'll ask: Why doesn't your grandmother want
>the stair-chair (or whatever it's called)?
I thought it was a great solution too. I believe Grandma thinks that
installing it would indicate that she does see a problem and her
current defense is to say that there isn't one.
- Dave
P.S. The latest is that mom (& dad) were mulling over having Kathy &
Tony move in with them. My personal opinion (right or wrong) is that I
don't care what they do with Kathy, just don't mess with Grandma.
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| 1246.10 | Independence is what it's all about ... | AHIKER::EARLY | Bob Early, Digital Services | Tue Apr 28 1992 13:00 | 49 |
| re: 1246.7 & .9?
>Out of idle curiosity, I'll ask: Why doesn't your grandmother
>want the stair-chair (or whatever it's called)? It sounds like a
I have a clue why her GM may not want a chair lift installed. (Was
the daughter or granddaughter going to pay for it as a gift?).
The clue I can offer is in viewing may own mother (83 1/2. She
absolutely refused to leave her home (of 45 years) because it IS HER
home, and SHE makes the rules there. It is HERS !
Ok, back to the clue ..
People don't like to admit to the possibility of 'losing it' (losing
their health, their competence, their ability). My mother had a
stroke in January this year, and is virtually unable to use either
her left arm or leg .. but insists to the point of anger (if pushed
to it) that she is perfectly capable of walking on her own .. which
conflicts with the therapist view that she cannot even stand unaided
for more than a few moments on parallel bars.
Shortly after getting my mother to the hospital, I met her roommate of
two days, who was going home following stroke-recovery, with a
walker, living alone; who would need to negotiate stairs 2 - 4 times
a day ... but her home and stairs had been modified by therapists,
with changes help her get around her home. The lady is 89 years old !
For more information on Elder_care issues, check the Elder Care
Notesfile in: LBDUCK::CARING_FOR_ELDERS.
As any FYI .. speaking of jobs in Ohio, we had friends who left
Massachusetts and went to a college town (Oberlin) to find work, and
have been working there since last fall. This also coincides with a
recent 'where the jobs are report' which have identified the mid-west
as a hot (well, warmer) job growth area, along with the mid-eastern
states (N/S Carolina, Virginia).
Bob
(back again)
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