Conference quark::human_relations-v1

    I have little patience for men or women that are married and date
    someone on the side.  Open relationships are not and should not be part
    of marriage, and having an affair is just wrong in my book.  My sister
    just broke up a relationship with a man who was separated.  She wound up
    getting hurt upon realizing that despite numerous promises, this man had
    no intentions of divorcing his wife.
    
    If you'd like to stay friends with him, that's fine.  He could probably
    use a friend right now.  But I really think that it shouldn't go any
    further than that until he gets his life together.
    
       - Larry 
                                                

    re: 0
    
    "I have heard the story before about men who never leave their wives,
    does this sound like a typical case?"
    
    Yes.  Run ... the heartache won't be worth it.
    
    Tammi

>I found out from some comments he made that he is in a *troubled*
>marriage.

    Its hard to judge another persons intentions from where i sit.
    PERHAPS he just needs/wants somone to talk to ??    

>I have spent 6 months trying to help (I don't know if I have
>help/confused him further).
    
    I'm not sure what you've done, but in my own situation (in the past)
    I've talked to women in *troubled* marriages, but these were mostly
    peers in the workplace.
    

>I have asked him to stop calling me several times, which he continues
>to do.
    
    Of the  many  types of people in the world, there are two which come
    to mind: Clingers (won't let go after they know you'd like to help)
    and liars (cannot seem to discern truth from fiction).
    

>Can anyone help to tell me if they feel that I should put in anymore
>time with this person, as now I am feeling like I really want to be
>with him, and like him.  
    
    Run, don't walk  to  the nearest exit.  You've indicated a desire to
    separate yourself from this arrangement, now do so quickly. Each
    time he calls, just  tell  him  "...hey,  i tried and now i'm out of
    advice.  I don't want  to  hear/see you anymore.  I've got to get on
    with my own life".
    
    Note:
    Portions of my answers are from lessons learned by reading notes,
    talking to friends on both sides  of the equation, and reading books
    like: "Games People Play".

    My own personal learning experince has shown me "if there is nothing
    more to to added, why continue ?".
    
    I suspect your "like" for this man is clouding your decision
    to be more forceful in separting yourself from him. The quetions is
    "If his wife were to know about your relationsjip with him, will she
    be angry with you ?".
    
    Your answer to this should help provide part of the answer you need.
    
    -BobE
    
        
    

    If you are really attracted to him... but worried about his intentions.
    Save yourself some heartach.  
    
    Tell him straight out... "If done what I can for you, the rest is
    up to you, I can no  longer be a party to this.  IF you are attracted
    to me, then once you are divorced, call me and we'll see about going
    out.  If you just need a friend, say so and I'll listen/If you just
    need a friend, you'll have to go somewhere else. (I'm not to clear
    on your feelings about that).  
    
    Set a resonable time limit for him to get his act together and file
    for a divorce.  If he doesn't do it in a resonable amount of time
    but still keeps complaining about his marriage then he's only a
    cronic complainer and probably will continue to do nothing about
    it.  
    
    Be warey keep your eyes open an don't let him take advantage of
    your apparent good heart.  
    
    This is all my own outlook on the matter, but being male I can't
    claim to see the female side.  When I was going through my divorce,
    I didn't date other women because I was to wrapped up in what had
    happened and trying to figure out why.  
    
    Skip

    I would not want a relationship with someone , that 99.9 % of the time
    the topic of conversation is "my broken marriage". You dont need to
    hear that song and dance everytime you are together. Be his friend, but
    dont make the relationship go any further than that, if so it will only
    result in you getting burden with his problem too....and you don't want
    that.
    
    
    good luck
    
    Lynne

    Marriage is an instution that if you don't want someone outside messing
    up yours, stay out of theirs. I have this problem and am in the mist of
    the D word myself. I think folks who involve themselves with married
    people should be shot on sight. If the guy has a problem, doesn't love
    his wife anymore, or some such garbage. Tell him to either devorce her
    then call later or tell him to get lost. Tell him that marriage councle
    could help him if he is having trouble with marriage. Last thing his
    life needs is some side nookie. Last thing you want to be is the brunt
    of his childrens problems, if he has kids. Wanna know what mess's up
    the future of tomorrow minds, children, devorce? I pray that my future
    ex gets out of life what she is looking for. What ever it is. And I
    hope that the men in her life get what they want out of life too. I
    wish them no harm. But I will tell you what can make your day right as
    rain is when he tells you that he doen't love you anymore and walks out
    on you as he may do for his wife. Men and women who do this act of
    instability make it real tough for the rest of us.
    
    Good luck!

It's very easy to unintentionally drift from a "casual friend" role to a
"mutually attracted" role when dealing with someone who's unhappy in their 
relationship.  One of the most common factors in their original problem is 
likely to be that the partners can't - and/or won't - communicate effectively 
with one another.  And here *you* are, someone they can talk to who's actually 
sympathetic and supportive!

But notice that you're hearing only their side of the situation (which is likely 
to show them in a favorable light, and their partner, as the cause of all the 
problems :-}  They're now getting the support and comfort that's probably been 
lacking in the relationship lately; you're getting to feel that you're helping
them and becoming a bright point in their unhappiness.  Why is it surprising  
that there's a good chance you're going to become attracted to one another??

The problem is that this attraction isn't necessarily based on much more than 
their current situation.  And it's very likely to start contributing to the 
original problems in their relationship - why work on that one, when this feels 
so much better... though there's no guarantee that your budding relationship 
will outlast this period, either.  

You both seem to be recognizing that your "friendly advisory" situation is 
becoming less casual.  If you're just interested in helping this person, you 
should realize that you're no longer able to give them unbiased advice.  If 
you're interested in a relationship with them, well, please note that they 
aren't yet - and may never be - free to get involved.  Either way, now is a very
good time to back off until their troubled relationship is again stable - either
because it's over (and that's not till the divorce is final, btw) or because 
they've reconciled.  JMO,
		Helen

    Everyone here seems to  feel like I do here. Bail out, and don't count
    on anything more from him. Even if he thinks he wants out of his
    marriage, wanting and doing are two different things. He might really
    believe he'd get out, but you can't count on it. Let him work on his
    marriage, not on you.
    
    ....Bob
    

    
    
      I have to say that I feel sad when I here about these kinds of
    situations.  I having divorced my wife a few years back can tell
    you something I think you need to know.  People who are in love
    and married usually have a beautiful thing going for eachother
    until one of them causes too much stress on the other.  When this
    happens and is consistant the love that was once there dissolves.
    I feel that either the wife is playing around outside of the marriage
    or the Husband is just being too stressful on his wife.  He certainly
    doesn't want this to end, not from the way this story goes.
      I have to ask you not to interfere with their marriage any longer!
    I think the best thing you can do for him is stay away from him.
    And do something for all marriages, stay out of their personal
    relationships.  If the two partners have any love for eachother they
    will work out their problems on their own.  That doesn't mean
    however that you can't be invited to dinner on Thanksgiving or
    Christmas...
    
    Change your phone number and don't give it to him.
    
    Frank

    Most of the answers have one thing in common.  STAY AWAY FROM A MARRIED
    PERSON WHILE THE PERSON IS ALREADY MARRIED. Family is the base of
    society, we should not worsen what it is, at the moment, bad enough.

    I don't know, George, I think the married person should be shot on
    sight, not the other person.  Single people are free to do what they
    want.  Married people have made a public committment.  I don't know why
    everyone thinks the heartache always falls to the 'outsider'.  The
    married person is the one living a lie, living with someone they don't
    love, directly and intentionally hurting their own children if they
    have them and unable to ask for or insure fidelity from their "side 
    nookie".  The "side nookie" on the other hand can get what is wanted 
    from the married lover, can still date others, can still maintain a 
    calm and quiet homelife and has no real obligation to the married
    lover.  It seems to me the one on the outside gets to call all the shots.  
    And if the married lover does leave the spouse, (and they sometimes do!), 
    suddenly you've got a "pseudo marriage" on your hands as you come to 
    "replace" the spouse.  Personally, I prefer to have the freedom of and 
    be treated like a mistress.
    
    So my advice would be to cut the angst, it's boring, and either have a
    good time, and give your lover one, or get out.  Being wishy-washy is
    always worse than any concrete decision you can make.

    <- Gee, living a lie? Wow! If your living a lie your in deep trouble.
    What about marriage councle, what about working on the comitment that
    you made in public to make you life better. What about making your self
    better if you have a problem, like it is you who does not love the S.O.
    in your life. We all make choices and sometimes they are bad ones. But
    unless your S.O. is some sort of druggest-acoholic type who is very
    irresponsible I have no sympathy. You get what your looking for. And I
    hope that you get all that you deserve. We all get very tired of dealing
    with the irresponsible types, and this act is the ultimate.
    "Oh-me-oh-my! I am no longer in love with my S.O. so I will leave and
    someday when I find myself, after I have hitched to California, dropped
    acid, I will come home to a warm and loving home, bla, bla bla." Get
    real! Your on the potty or your off. If you love her/him do it. If your
    messing around with the side nookie, have fun, don't get cought, but
    your real slime. If you have children, think twice pal, hope they
    remember you when they grow up to say there goes mommy/daddy the
    king/queen of sleeze.
    
    George

    This reply is from the anonymous author of the base note.
    
    **************************************************************************
    
    I asked to have this note posted to say 'thanks' to the people who so
    long ago told me to run to the nearest exit (which I DIDN'T do)!!!!!

    I understand now why the note replies said what they did.  Those people
    were correct, and I hope this will help others who might run up against
    a similar situation.

    Without getting into the details, a lot of false promises were made to
    me, and it ended in destruction - a broken heart for me!

    As it has been said many times before, married people are married until
    proven otherwise (DIVORCED)!

RE .13

As long as the 'former' partners' actions effect one another it isn't over.