| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 843.1 | Work a bit harder at home | NUHAVN::KUPTON | You can't get there from here | Mon Sep 11 1989 11:11 | 25 |
| Well....you don't say whether you love your wife or not. You don't
say whether you love your son or not.
It appears that you're not quite ready to fill in some of the
blanks, but I would say that you believe your marriage is worth saving
because you have both been trying to do something...EAP. Maybe you
should invest in another outside counsler through your community.
What you said is that your wife is overweight and doesn't arouse
your sexual desire. Is she willing to lose weight? Are you thin? Maybe
she should investigate Overeaters Annonomus.
If this new passion is worth so much of your effort, why not talk
to your wife about it?? Are you ready to lose everything in your
marriage for an affair??
As a side thought....who has your secret passion been with in her
past?? Anybody that may make you wish that you had never met her?? You
both going to practice safe sex?? Will she be committed to you only to
satify her physical needs?? What other demands will she make??
My advice........Tread carefully. You may be throwing away alot more
than you think.
Ken
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| 843.2 | | ICESK8::KLEINBERGER | It BE hard | Mon Sep 11 1989 12:07 | 95 |
| I thought I'd attempt a couch view answering of your question(s)...
First things first... lets deal with the four year old. S/he is the
innocent victim in all of this. Whatever you do, make sure s/he is loved and
knows s/he is loved over and above anything you may or may not decide to do.
.0> I'm currently in a marriage that is without passion. We've been
.0> married for 5 years and have a four year old child. Our early days
.0> (before marriage) were filled with passion, but over time we've let it
.0> slip away. To make things even more complicated, my wife is rather
.0> overweight (220 lbs), and I'm not really physically attracted to her
.0> right now.
I can relate very well to this. I was married for 13 years. Thats an
awfully long time, and well, when I was first married I weighted 145
pounds. When I divorced, I weighed 250 (+/-) pounds. I was not attractive,
I did not feel attractive, I had no self esteem, and I was in a depression
that I didn't even KNOW existed. No amount of anything was going to get me to
lose the weight.. by the way, my husband at the time had also gained more
than 100 pounds in the 13 years of marriage. I found that AFTER I got
divorced, I had to work on me... my self-esteem was so low, that anyone
around me got drug down also! As my self esteem (through professional
help) improved, so did wanting myself to look good improve... thats when I
went on a diet, and lost the weight I needed, and started exercising.. for
me, and only me!... The passion that was in my marriage was 0%, and had
been for about 9 of the 13 years of marriage... heck, I had to re-learn
what passion was (and still am learning :-)..)... The passion not being there
was a great help in lowering my self-esteem (I used to think that I could not
even be a wife correctly because my husband refused to be passionate with
me)...
.0> I've met someone who raises my passion level to the boiling point,
.0> and we are currently discussing and deciding whether or not to have an
.0> affair. So I know that I am capable of passion, and I definitely
.0> desire a passionate relationship.
well.. good for you in one sense.. you have now proven to yourself that you
are a red-blooded male... but what in the world do you think you are
doing? If you want to enter an affair, then straighten up your world first.
You need to decide just want you are going to do with your wife. If need be,
set out ultimatums. But be prepared to back them. And act on them!...
Decide first if you do indeed want your marraige. If you do, then how do
you want your marriage? Do you want a wife who is slim, and sexy looking to
you? Then act on it... Sit down with her, and decide what it will take, and
what your breaking point is. IE: If you want her to lose 75 pounds, look
at what it will take.. counseling on her part? provide the time, $$$, and
support.. a job for her, a new job for her? a hobby? sometime to herself
away from your son/daughter? Then give them to her... Be honest with her,
and set the breaking point(s) upfront. Parents do this with their children,
and it even works for adult too!... You can say: I want you to lose 75
pounds... this is what I think it will take, what is your input?... If you
don't lose the pounds.. here is what I am going to do... And then provide
the support you said you would give, and stick by her... Remember also that
75 pounds will take 9.5 months to lose! Also get her a doctor if she has
more than 20 pounds to lose. That is spoken from experience! Also, ditch
the female on the side.. if is not helping you, its not helping "the other
woman* and its not helping your wife (or child!)...
On the other hand.. if you have decided that *you really want this other
person* and it's not just in your jeans (yes, spelling is correct!!!!)...
then be honest and upfront with your wife. If that means an end to your
marriage, well a marriage without honesty wasn't really a marriage at all
anyway, now was it?
.0> My wife and I have used up our alloted EAP sessions so far this
.0> year working on our relationship. Our counselor said that the sexual
.0> relationship is one of the first things to go. We have gotten to the
.0> point where we need to work on ourselves before our relationship can
.0> improve further.
If you have used up all your EAP sessions, and you REALLY want this to
work, then I suggest you go outside and get the help to do it.. If $$$ is a
problem, there are *many* counselors who will adjust the payment scale to
fit yours... I have one that I used for over 3 years that I would gladly
put you in touch with.
.0> I'm looking for input in general, but also specifically if anyone
.0> out there has recaptured the passion in a marriage I'd be interested in
.0> hearing about it.
I did not try to recapture the passion. I set up ultimatums, and they were
exercised. At the time, I thought I was at the end of the world (you
can read some notes in this file written by me 3 years ago and *see* the
difference)
First off, decide WHAT you want, then decide what is right for the both of
you. If you both decide to work on the marriage, then... 1.) Ditch the other
female, and 2.) Give your all to working on the goals that you have
established. If you decide to not work on the marriage then 1.)
Concentrate on the child, making sure s/he is above all else, and 2.) work
on bringing your life back to normal, then 3.) add another relationship to
it.
Just my couch view...
|
| 843.3 | it comes and goes | TLE::RANDALL | living on another planet | Mon Sep 11 1989 12:38 | 46 |
| In ten years of marriage, we've had times when the passion was so
hot I'm surprised it didn't burn the house down, and when it was
so cold it nearly put out the fire in the fireplace. It comes and
goes.
What doesn't come and go is the love, the friendship, the honesty,
the years we've shared together, the kids and the family stuff,
and a whole lot of intangibles that bind hearts together through
difficult times as well as wonderful ones.
In times when the passion was low, we've generally found that lack
of passion itself wasn't the problem, only a symptom of other
troubles -- in our case, things like job stresses, unresolved
conflicts about my role as a parent. And sometimes it was just
that we were focussing our attention on other aspects of the
relationship or of our lives.
How did we get the passion back? Generally by acting passionate.
(We find that an evening of champagne and candlelight by the
fireplace works well.) Making sure to spend some time alone with
each other every week, without the kids, is important to keeping
our emotional intimacy at a level where we feel sexually
responsive as well. Do you have any activities that you do as a
couple or as a family? Bicycling together on the weekends helped
us; we wound up taking a three-day foliage tour from inn to inn a
couple of years ago and plan another one next year, AB (after
baby).
I'd be cautious about blaming your wife's weight problem for the
lack of passion in your marriage. Appearance is only a small
part of the sexual attraction in a marriage, and it's easy to make
that one aspect of the relationship the scapegoat for problems in
other areas. As .2 points out, most of sexuality is in the head,
so you can get in a vicious cycle easily: you don't think she's
attractive, so she feels unattractive, and because she feels less
attractive, you see her as less attractive, so she feels even less
attractive, etc. Many overweight women (including me) have plenty
of sexual appetite, so that by itself shouldn't preclude passion.
If her appearance really does mean so much to you that you can't
find her sexually appealing when she's not physically perfect, you
might want to stop to think what you'd do if she were maimed in a
traffic accident or some other way beyond your control. Would
that end the relationship?
--bonnie
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| 843.4 | | SNOC01::MYNOTT | I'll have what she's having | Mon Sep 11 1989 19:24 | 14 |
| Excess weight usually is a symptom of other problems. When you
look at each other with love you see only beauty - no faults. When
you look at each other with less feeling you see the faults. Perhaps
she looks at you and sees your balding hair, beer pot, your loss
of interest. Her weight is just a trigger reaction and protection.
A fellow worker has told me her husband often tells her how much he
loves her and how beautiful she is after arriving home from a rotten
day at DEC with makeup falling off her face, in her grottiest
tracksuit, all hot and sticky and hair in 500 directions. Now thats
what its all about - they've been married ten years.
...dale
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| 843.5 | affairs are distractions | YODA::BARANSKI | To Know is to Love | Mon Sep 11 1989 19:36 | 37 |
| If your wife has gained a lot of weight, it's a good bet the the damage isn't
soley in the weight, there's probably a lot in her mind. The weight is probably
just a symptom. Some important questions here: Is she aware of it? Is she
willing and able to work on it? Are you willing and able to work on it?
Don't count on being able to loose that weight without a lot of psychological
work. If you have John Hancock insurance they pay 80% for counseling, and a lot
of places won't ask you for the other 20% if you make it clear that you have a
problem with it. Ask her what *she* would like to do to improve her life. Make
sure she gives it some thought, and it is what she really wants, and that it is
a task that will help get her going in the right direction easily.
I wouldn't take the fact that a new person gets you raring to go too seriously.
At this point, it imight be that in comparison to your wife *anyone*/*anything*
would get you going, especially if you do want a change for the better.
You might want to have an affair. Do you feel that you *really* need to? If
not, don't. Be aware that the majority of the time, an outside relationship is
a distraction to your marriage. How will you be willing to work on your
marraige if you've got sweet honey on the side?
You might want to seperate or divorce. In that case, check your states laws
carefully with a men's/women's organization. DON'T ask a lawyer! If you live
in MA, consider moving to another state. Seriously.
My son's mother gained a lot of weight. I wanted more out of life. She did not
want to change. Years later... she's still overweight. But I can see that she
is not a bad person. I know a lot more now then I did then about how I might
have helped her. I don't know if it would have succeeded, but I now know that
there were more things I could have done. But I was not able to do it while I
was chained to her. Now I can't help her because it is not my place. In any
case, no one has the ability to change another person, only to help them change,
and you can only help so little.
Best of Luck.
Jim.
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| 843.6 | How sad. | CGVAX2::MICHAELS | | Tue Sep 12 1989 08:25 | 20 |
| Did you only marry this woman because she looked good to you? Is the
idea of cheating on her a recent idea or one that's been brewing in
your mind for a little while? Months? A couple of years? Since your
wife began to gain weight?
Perhaps her weight gain is due to her lack of courage. By that I mean:
Maybe she has stopped wanting *you* (for whatever reason(s)) and does
not have the courage to tell you to your face. So instead of being the
one to initiate a separation or divorce, she uses the weight gain to
become unattractive to you so *you're* the one who leaves.
What I found missing in your note was any sign of love for this woman
with whom you shared passion before your marriage or love, friendship
and/or affection now.
What do you hope to gain with an affair? Maybe you could invest some
time to try to discover what it is you're *really* searching for.
Susan
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| 843.7 | even overweight there is passion! | ASABET::EHNSTROM | | Tue Sep 12 1989 13:06 | 25 |
|
I don't usually write a whole lot in here; but htis time I got to!
When my wife and I were hitched 18 years ago she wieghed 160 and now
shes around 260. This hasn't stopped me from loving her or caring
about her. I have 3 wonderful, marvelous children. What keeps us
going is the love, passion and ability to communicate to each other
about what is really important- us and our family. Sure I look at
other females but that is all I do. I've never had the need or want to
go to someone else. Talk to your wife and find out where her head is
at. Passion is something that comes and goes in a relationship, just
like eating and sleeping. Sometimes your just not as passionate as
others. When I look at my wife I remember that she decided to spend
her life with me as I am and I did the same. There's more there than
just a heavy woman. I'd tend to think that she's trying to tell you
something that you're just not picking up on. Get rid of the "other
woman" and start turning that "passion" you have for her to your wife
and I think you will see a definate change in the way the both of you
look at each other and the world. The physical state only hides what
is really going on. Look behind that and I think you will see a lady
that really loves you for what you are. Accept her as she is and start
doing things together and before you know it that passion will come
back. You have to be able to change to help her change.
Thopm terriffic
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| 843.8 | My .o2 | MAMTS7::TTAYLOR | | Tue Sep 12 1989 16:30 | 47 |
| WHY HAVE AN AFFAIR????
I've never been married, but having dated someone for many years,
yes, the passion does die. I chose to end the relationship, rather
than drag things out when we couldn't work things out (for varied
reasons other than the passion dying, that does come and go, as
previous replies stated).
All I can say is you would be causing three nice people much heartache
and your child would probably be affected by your affair. I know
it's not a "cut and dry" situation, choosing to end the marriage
just because the passion has died, but you should give some serious
thought as to the ramifications that would come from your affair.
You certainly aren't doing your wife a favor, you would be living
a double life, and not being able to give of yourself wholly to
the one who arouses your passions.
Have you thought about the fact that maybe your wife is depressed
or unhappy in some way? Maybe you are cold to her, maybe she senses
you are turned off by her and to assauge the pain, she eats. I've
have problems with my weight before, have gained 10 to 20 pounds
over what I normally weigh just from sheer depression stemming from
situations I'm going through. The cheering on and understanding
of the men in my life have brought me the confidence and strength
to get over the depression AND also brought about the needed weight
loss.
... but then again, maybe she's bored and wants out of the marriage,
she just doesn't have the courage (due to the child or the so-called
"stigma" of divorce in society) to make the break. Only you can
make the decision as to your future. But you should think long
and hard before you allow another person to enter your life by
beginning an affair. If you can't make your wife happy now, can
you imagine how unhappy you'll make the "other woman"? She'll never
have you completely, though she'll probably WANT TO. None of you
deserve it.
Keep up the counseling, try and REALLY find out what's going on
in your wife's head. If she's truly happy being overweight, then
either accept the situation and remember: everyone's the same when
the lights are out! If she's unhappy about her weight gain, be
her biggest cheerleader!
Good luck and let us know how it works out ....
Just my .02 - Tammi
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| 843.9 | Dont jump ship yet..... | HITPS::SIGEL | Welcome to Your Life | Wed Sep 13 1989 10:35 | 23 |
| Hi!
I am recently married, matter of fact my first year anniversary is
coming up in October on the 9th! Please dont give up the ship,
especially for the sake of your son. Once you marry, a lot of people
let their physical appearence go to pot, because they figure they "got
thier catch", which is a big mistake. That is when the eyes start to
roam to other pastures. It is also easy to get attracted to someone
else while you are married, it is normal and everyone does it. If your
marriage is worth saving, dont act on your actions with this other
person, it will just make things harder and mess up your head more.
Try to do things together and have fun. Try to get to know each other
more. Dress up nice when you go out. Ask your wife to go on a diet,
if it will help you get the passion back. One important thing in *any*
marriage is not to let go of what attracted you two together in the
first place. I mean there was a time when you two were madly in love,
right?? For the sake of your son, please make an effort to work things
out with your wife. It will be worth it in the long run.
best of luck,
Lynne :-)
|
| 843.10 | What about anger? | WELBY::MURRAY | | Thu Sep 14 1989 13:34 | 17 |
| I'm surprised no one's brought up the subject of ANGER. My experience
is that positive strong feelings (like desire and passion) can easily
get drowned out by the threat of anger that you are afraid to
acknowledge. My absolutley biggest (and a lot of people's I know)
problem in relationships is anger. How to express it respectfully, how
not to just ignore it, how to separate the here-and-now anger from the
anger from childhood and previous losses not grieved to completion.
I have found in almost all cases that problems I have with other people
don't have a lot to do with that other person; they're really about
myself and my unresolved conflicts.
Intimacy isn't just about feeling "loving". FWIW I have found that
there's a pretty fine line between lust and rage.
Scott
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| 843.11 | re: .7 | FTMUDG::REINBOLD | | Fri Sep 15 1989 02:22 | 1 |
| re .7 What a nice note! Good for you!
|