Conference quark::human_relations-v1

    It is up to each site.Security and Safety have policies regarding
    this issue.Certain sites limit restrict children to the lobby or
    cafe.This is true in FSL.Check your your local Security/Safety 
    dept.A child of that age SHOULDN'T be left unattended.

    This topic was also brought up in HUMAN::DIGITAL, note 546.
    It might be better here to concentrate on the "human relations" aspect
    of the problem rather than the mechanics of policies (there seem to
    be none).
    
    				Steve

    re .2  You mean as in "How do we tell the manager that his
    actions are unprofessional, and place a burden on his 
    subordinates ?"
    
    That's the message that needs to be gotten across, I think.
    We're here to do a job *for the company*, not for the boss.

    So if you were put in this situation, how would you approach it
    in a professional way?  Incidently, the people in the neighboring
    offices of this manager don't report to him, we all report to a
    different manager on his level.
    
    And most importantly we don't want to stur up trouble for anyone,
    but we don't want to be thrust into this position again.
    
    Any suggestions?

    
    re: .4
    
    I would make it a point to let my manager know how disruptive this
    had been to my work and ask that he speak to the individual involved.
    It is management's responsibility to ensure you are not distracted
    from your work unneccessarily.
    

    Maybe a lesson.
    
    Some could have taken the child into another office and looked after
    him while he or she did some work, and not told the manager where
    his son was.  That would have been effective without confrontation.

    Re: .5
    
    I think it's also the 'socially correct' thing to do - using the
    management chain.  Your manager works issues with other groups;
    it's not your job.

    Why does everyone feel that they have to look after the child? 
    If the child is ignored and gets into trouble, let him!  If the
    child makes noise, tell him to be quiet in a serious way.  If the
    child either causes enough trouble unattended or is unhappy enough
    himself with having to be quiet so others can work - then he may
    fight againt coming into work with Dad.
    
    My 2 cents
    

    I agree with .7, at least partly -- assuming the child is not
    being truly disruptive and that the offices are in a safe area.
    
    When my daughter was 5, she was more than capable of entertaining
    herself in my office for a couple of hours while I was at a
    meeting -- and did do so in emergencies. 
    
    Only once did anyone take it on themselves to 'watch out for' Kat,
    and she told them to go away, she wanted to color.  
    
    But Kat's a fairly quiet, independent child.  My son isn't such a
    loner and would likely go looking for somebody to play with.  If
    this kid is the same way, you might want to return him gently but
    firmly to his father's office and tell him to shut up. 

    --bonnie 

	When you sign your child(ren) in at security, you are
	responsible. One does not simply go off to meetings
	leaving the child unattended no matter how good they
	are. You are supposed to be there or it is a violation.
	I remember sending my children to the bathroom. They were
	brought back; I had to accompany them. It seems that
	when you must go off that you must designate a responsible
	person ot be in charge. That of course, means that this
	person is somewhat hampered in his/her work. Unless
	there is an emergency, bring your child to work on a day
	in which you wont need to leave them (if possible).

    This varies according to the plant and how much trouble there
    has been.  
    
    --bonnie

    
    
    	Geez...we got some cold nasties out there!! One person wants
    to tell the poor kid to shut up; another wants to "hide" the kid
    in another office to shake up his dad and someone else wants to
    let the kid watch himself (hoping that he'll be enough trouble that
    the dad gets hell). 
    	It's bad enough that the guy is stupid enough to leave a five
    year old unattended. Then the meanies get on the kids case. Is your
    damn work so vital that you can't take a few minutes to interact
    with a child. I doubt it. Next time, try a little love and compassion
    for the kid's dilemma, and handle the adult with the heavy gloves.
    Manager or not, tell the jerk that it's inhumane to leave a five
    year old alone in a place where he can get hurt.period.
    
    	Boy , it must be tough growing up in the 80's.
    
    						Mike 

    re: .12
    
    >Is your damn work so vital that you can't take a few minutes to interact
    >with a child. I doubt it.
    
    This isn't the issue.  I interact with children quite a bit BY CHOICE.
    Not at Digital, though.
    
    DEC pays me to do "DEC" work.  DEC rates my performance on how well I
    perform that work.  DEC does not pay me to babysit somebody's kid. The
    fact that I babysat some kid at work will never appear on my
    performance review.  However, if babysitting some kid made me be late
    in delivering a project, *THAT* would appear on a performance review.
    
    
    Perhaps I'm taking a hard-nosed view on this because of a personal
    experience that happened around a month ago (mentioned in the DIGITAL
    notes file).  In short, somebody brought their child in on a weekend,
    and the child was *LOUD* (literally screaming).  After the noise was
    enough to disrupt my work significantly, I decided to walk over and ask
    the parents to try and quiet down their child.  Much to my surprise,
    the parents were *RUDE* (very rude, I think), even though I thought I
    was asking nicely (at least my voice tone was right and I included all
    the right words like "please" and "Thanks very much").
    
    I could have just called security and ask them to take care of the
    problem.  Perhaps I should have.
    

    In short, work is work.  We are paid by Digital to do WORK.  We are not
    paid by Digital to babysit, take three hour lunches, or otherwise be
    unproductive.  DEC has a very lax working environment, and I appreciate
    it very much - it helps to give me the freedom to do errands or take
    care of an emergency if it arises.  In return, I make sure to give DEC
    a good solid eight hours of work a day.  I owe it to Digital - that's
    what they pay me for.

    Re: .12
    
    >Then the meanies get on the kids case.
    
    Beg your pardon?  Where did you get this idea?
    
    >Is your damn work so vital that you can't take a few minutes to
    >interact with a child.
    
    I think the problem is that it's not "a few minutes" of "interaction,"
    but an extended period of supervision.  And while I might be able
    to spare a few minutes for interaction, being distracted for a few
    hours is usually more than I can spare.  Even if I weren't assuming
    responsibility for the child, the child's activities could easily
    distract my concentration.

    re .13:
    
    I don't even like children and I think you're being a bit harsh. There
    are times when someone has a choice between coming to work with the kid
    and staying home. Granted, if the kid's being disruptive, and they're
    rude to you for shushing them, that's a bit out of line. But a quick
    note to your supervisor should handle it. That's what your supervisor
    is for -- to be there when you want to complain about interferernce
    with your work. 
    
    If you like Digital's lax work environment, you're going to have
    to put up with the occasional laxities.
    
    	Jon

    re: .15
    
    If somebody can bring their child in to work, and that child isn't
    disruptive to coworkers, then I have no problem with that.  If the
    child is disruptive to the parent, I don't care much about that either
    (although I suppose the parent's supervisor would).
    
    My problem is with disruptive children.  If a coworker brings in a
    child, and that child is loud enough to disrupt others, then that child
    should not be at the workplace, period.  The workplace is just that:
    the place to work.
    
    A coworker has occasionally brought his daughter to work.  Even though
    I'm very close by, I don't even know unless I stop into his office to
    talk to him.  As far as I'm concerned, he is welcome to bring his child
    every day - the daughter does not disrupt him or other workers. If the
    daughter was disruptive, I'd feel quite different about it ...
    
    	-- Jeff