Conference quark::human_relations-v1

    Is this anything more than a test?  Science 86 (RIP) ran a good
    article on the various schools of therapy and counseling last
    year.  I strongly recommend it to anyone interested in stuff
    like this.  Sorry I don't know which month.  One of the article's
    exercises was to develop a profile of a ficticious patient, then
    bring it to counselors in each of the "schools" to see what their
    interpretations would be.  Makes for fascinating reading.
    
    				Steve

	I dont know the type of therapy the Green School (COgnative?).
Anyway only certain kinds of people and problems will responds to such therapy
within the set schedule. It seems very difficult to set such time frames
unless the problem was very well defined and the other problems, if any,
would not surface. As to waht therapist to pick out, you might use the
Employee Assistance Program. The counsellor here will pick out real professional
whom they know.

    Sounds like cognitive theory to me, i.e. a recognized problem
    and "learned" behavior to solve it. 

re: .1
	Nope, this is not a test.  If there is a real school of
therapy that comes close to the hypothetical Green School, I'd
sure like to know.  (I am not highly informed about the academic
descriptions of schools of therapists.  But I have been to a few
real live therapists.)
	Based on my experience, I'd say most of the therapists
I've encountered could be put into one of two other hypothetical
schools, which I will call the Blue and the Red schools.
	The hallmark of the Blue School therapist is that she/he:
wants you to make a firm commitment to very long-term (as in more
than one year) therapy very early on in the process; prefers to
talk about events that are relatively removed in time from your
concerns of today (e.g., childhood or early adolescence vs. adult);
tries to contribute the absolute minimum to any conversation (and
often tries playing "mind games" such as refusing to say anything
until you have gotten annoyed and forced the issue); shows an
unusually emphatic interest in sexual issues; and never offers any
definite commitments as to what will constitute "successful" therapy
or when that should be expected to happen.
	The Red School therapist, on the other hand, will sometimes
agree with you as to what the goals (or at least the topics of
discussion) of therapy should be, but seems to rapidly lose sight of
them.  She/he will contribute a significant amount to your conversations
(although much of it may seem like folk wisdom of the Ann Landers type),
but will frequently stray from the subjects that you initially wished to
discuss; she/he will lend a sympathetic ear, but will not focus the
therapy upon the problems you wished to solve unless you apply strong
pressure; and, she/he will rarely take notes, promise to (or actually) go
away and research a subject for you, prescribe exercises of any sort
for you, or otherwise try to accomplish measurable goals of your therapy.
	Sometimes you get the feeling that both types of therapists
would like nothing better than to maintain their respective styles and
go on charging you $50-$100/hour every week for as long as you live.
	So I would be interested to see if someone has encountered
therapists who are both more structured and less afraid of committing to
try to accomplish specific goals than most of the therapists that I have
met.  I feel bad for the people that go to a therapist based on the
advice of Ann Landers or Ask Beth and get hooked up with some of the not
very helpful (and sometimes even not very likeable) people out there.

re: .2,.3
	What is cognitive therapy?  Do people advertise themselves as
cognitive therapists?  (If not, how do you know who is one?)

    I strongly recommend you look up the Science '86 article.  It listed
    at least five "schools" and described the position of each.
    					Steve

re: .5

Actually, Steve, I think I might have seen that one (was it by Bernie
Zilbergeld (author of the Very Good book "Male Sexuality")?).  There
is still the question of how you, the relatively unsophisticated buyer
of this therapeutic service, can tell much of anything about the
practioner by either looking in the Yellow Pages or checking out any
similar guide.  It's not easy.

Why not call your local community mental health center, or social services 
agency?  I doubt very much that you will find exactly what you are looking for 
just by scanning the yellow pages -- it may require that you set up what I would
call "exploratory" interviews, which are usually free.  Or, call the Employee 
Assistance Program people -- if you tell them what you want they will find out 
if there are any therapists in your area who will provide you with the type of 
therapy you want.  I've used EAP before and though they are not fast, they will 
eventually get you the info you want.  I've had very good luck with my local
community mental health center.

CQ

    What you describe sounds very much like "Reality Therapy" from the
    book of the same name published in the 1960's by someone called
    Glaser.  I don't remember the author's first name, but you can request
    that your local Public Library search for a copy through inter-library
    loan.

    There are therapists in the Boston area who subscribe to Glaser's
    theorys.  I benefitted from several sessions with one in which I
    resolved some life issues that were troubling me at the time.  The
    practical and activist nature of this type of therapy accomplished
    more for me than the "Tell me why you feel that way" school.
    

    Had contact with one who might have been following a similar type
    of idea, although doesn't sound quite as structured.  He was a
    hypnotist and a clinical psychologist and practiced what was described
    to me as self-actualization therapy.
    
    He would work on any specific problem, i.e. smoking, weight loss
    etc. with either the hypnosis or from a clinical path, whichever
    you wanted.  I found that his method was to first pinpoint the problem,
    even if you yourself were confused as to what the issue was, then
    help YOU find the best way to deal with it.  There was very little
    searching the past for root causes, more behavior modification and
    ego boosting to help you overcome it.  Much more efficient than
    actual "therapy"

    Employee Assistance Program is a good source for reputable counseling
    services but like anything else "you buy", it may be necessary to
    "shop around".  The first L.I.C.W (Licensed in Social Work) I went
    to had such a "stone face" that I didn't feel comfortable talking
    to a wall.  And if I were upset, she would just stare at me and
    wait for me to finish (if ever I did).   She was getting paid so
    it didn't matter how much therapy "she gave me" but what "I" wanted
    out of my sessions.  Well, I stopped seeing her.
    
    But, I went back to EAP with another issue (relating alcoholism
    in my mother's life to my upbringing) and I was referred to a group
    called Adult Children of Alcoholics and then began "free" therapy
    through a student affiliated with Digital.  As soon as she became
    L.I.S.W. and titled Alcoholism Specialist, I began private sessions.
    They have worked marvelously for nearly a year now and our
    "relationship" so to speak, it is meaningful and helpful to my future
    dealings with anything relating to ACoA.

    This isn't very timely and I hope you have found help but a few
    thoughts come to mind reading your message and the reply's.
    
    First of all your blue school is clearly psychoanalysius based on
    Freud's theories, I'm not sure about the red school.  However yor
    green school I think should be named the Yuppy School because it
    smacks of "I want it now and I want a guarantee".  I think in dealing
    with problems as complex as the ones dealt wiht in therapy it would
    be very difficult to estimate how long it would take to resolve
    a problem (unless it was something standard like fear of flying
    etc.)  I think I would be suspicious of any Dr. that said if I can't
    cure you in x visits then you better see another doctor.  However
    I also think that if you are not comfortable with your therapist
    from the stand point of asking legitimate questions about procedures,
    theories, cure rates etc, you should find a new therapist. Of course
    I would say the same thing about an MD who can't or won't tell me
    everything I want to know about the medacine he/she prescribes.
    
    As far as your questions about cure rates of the various schools,
    and hard data in general in psychology, there are several problems here.
     First psychology is a very young science, about 100 years old.    
    Secondly, not all practitioners of psychology treat it as a science.
    If you read the papaers and books on the subject you will be astounded
    by the conclusions they draw from very limited data (most of freads
    findings were based on his own experience).  At least for me with
    a degree in biology, I was shocked at how little data was used to
    develop these theories.  Finallyt the human mind is very complex
    and human behavior very variable.  So develop good techniques, theories
    etc that really address the broad spectrum is difficult, regardless
    of how much data is gathered.