Conference quark::human_relations-v1

    I used to be this way - critical of gifts that didn't meet my
    expectations.  It was part of a general selfish attitude that
    got me in trouble too many times.  Over the years, I learned
    to control it.  Now I understand about the spirit of giving, and
    don't worry if the gift isn't exactly right.  (Though gifts which
    are clearly inappropriate and the giver knows it - such as a case
    in one of the advice columns about a mother-in-law who gave an
    expensive mink coat to a woman whom she knew was strongly against
    such things - show either insensitivity or hostility on the part
    of the giver.)
    
    If the pattern continues, the usual advice is to simply stop
    giving gifts, or perhaps to make donations to a charity in their
    name.  If they ask, you can be quite blunt about telling them
    why.
    
    My favorite gifts to give and receive are those where the giver
    has put a bit of themselves into it, either in the selection or
    especially the making.  It's no fun to have someone ask me
    "What do you want for your birthday - please specify catalog
    number?"  I'd rather be surprised - it shows that they've
    taken the care to understand me a bit.
    
    					Steve

I don't mind receiving gifts, so, Louise, if you're ever tired of giving
to people who _do_ object, remember me!

Personally, I like giving and getting unexpected gifts; the "I saw it and
thought of you" gifts or the "Thanks for a great ....." gifts. It is a 
chance to show that you care!

However, I have a problem with the regime of formal and rigid gift exchanging
that goes on at Christmas and on Birthdays. It _is_ my problem, and I am
dealing with it, but the hypocrisy that goes along with some of the gift giving
spoils the whole deal for me. For example, buying someone an expensive present
solely because they bought you an expensive present is inexcusible. Or (as I
have seen done) buying someone you don't like a present because it is
"expected". 

Also (as I touched on in the "wedding" note), I see nothing wrong with giving
someone a sum of money and saying "Here's $100, go buy something you want". It
strikes me that it is more sensible than saying "here's an expensive present; I
hope you like it". But, I have been told, giving money is not considered good
taste. I wonder why? It's a variant, I guess, of the well-known breach of 
etiquette of 'leaving the price tag on a gift'; it defines very clearly what
you think the person is worth (-:

I know, I'm just a querulous old curmudgeon! Bah, Humbug!

		Nigel

    I like giving and recieving gifts, too.  I have a lot of fun shopping
    for and/or making something for someone I care about.  Just about
    anything I do for anyone at Christmas or their birthday is on time
    and something I've really thought about.  I like them to enjoy my
    gift, and think of me when they look at it.  That and recieving
    gifts are great.  The only part of the whole thing I don't like
    is NOT knowing if the person I sent a gift to got it.  I am referring
    to the oft-forgotten thank-you note.  (and if you had a mother like
    mine, you send thank-you notes to this day)  It isn't so much that
    I want to hear how wonderful my gift was (well, yes, I do), as much
    as I'd really like to know if they DID get it.
    
    Thank-yous are common courtesy, I think.  To the folks that become
    uncomfortable with a gift from you, I guess I feel sorry for them.
    It's hard when it's someone you care for--you want to do something
    nice for them and they "shoot it down" by being anything but happy
    about it.  I know when I was younger it embarressed me to have people
    watching me open gifts, but I caught on that they wanted to see
    me happy.                                                      
                              
    ..but I guess you can't judge from me--I'm the kind of idiot that
    won't return ANYthing a friend gives me for Christmas--the fact
    that they gave it to me makes it precious.
    
    Jane
                              
    

    That's just what I was getting at, Jane.  The fact that I saw this
    nifty thing in a store that I know the person likes to shop in,
    and thought of the person, and smiled and got the thing, and
    brought it to them thinking of them and hoping they'd see the
    funny side of it - well, it *was* done out of love.  When the
    person threw a cold wet blanket over my happiness in giving,
    it just made me feel awful!  The person could have let BOTH of
    us feel good - instead we both felt terrible.
    
    Nigel - maybe I'll take you up on your offer!
    
    --Louise

A great gift is a birdfeeder, and the first 20 pounds of sunflower
seeds.

Last month I visited a cousin in Syracuse.  I gave them a small suction
cup window feeder.

I couldn't resist calling a few weeks later to ask if they got any
birds yet.

WHAT ?  WHAT YOU DID TO US ?  Now we have to keep going out and buying
more birdseed!

/Eric

��    If you get none, you're probably a failure at human relations.
    
    	No, it just means they lost your address.  Gifts don't matter
    	one little bit. I have many friends with whom I rarely exchange 
    	gifts.  We exchange friendship.. It's more lasting than a McDonalds
    	Gift Certificate.(tm)
    
    							mike

Many people do not particularly like to give gifts and absolutely
despise receiving them. 

In one of those coctail parties one just has to go to, I was sitting
next to a fine looking lady who turned out to be a Psychologist; so
the conversation turned to this same subject. Her take was that
dislike of gifts --giving and/or getting-- reflects a person's
strong need to remain in control. 

Giving a gift is like saying 'I want you to like me' - a need many
people do not have (or maybe do not wish to acknowledge). Receiving a
gift is like allowing some other person to dictate what one owns
and/or uses; it also puts one in debt where one never planned on it. 
Again, many people object to that. 

I am not sure I agree with these ideas, but what do I know?

-- Ron 

    My mother was married to a man who went through a phase (he was
    an alcoholic) where he was strongly critical of gift-giving, refused
    to accept gifts, and even stood jeering and making nasty comments
    on the sidelines at Christmas and birthdays.  
    
    On the other hand, my husband's family is very conscious of the
    monetary value of gifts.  For example, for my mother-in-law's birthday
    my SO and I gave her a coffee grinder and fresh beans (she loved
    the fresh coffee when visiting us).  His sister gave her a $300.00
    gold bracelet and in private, *criticized* my SO about his choice
    of a gift.  
    
      

    re:10
    your mom's husband sounds like what my dad used to be like!  It
    sure makes for rough holidays.  I still rejoice every chance I get
    now that he doesn't drink anymore.
    
    vivian
    

    I think it *may* be a control issue, in this case.  There also
    may be a culture issue - I think that in Eastern cultures gifts
    are given to subordinates, and rarely if ever given to superiors.
    Sort of like a king granting favors to his subjects.  Does anyone
    know more about the giving of gifts in various cultures?
    
    In this culture, especially in the particular version in which
    I was brought up, gifts were almost more a gift granted by the
    recipient to the giver - allowing the giver to show affection
    (not necessarily monetary affection; $ value was not important)
    and unselfishness.  I'm not putting this well - I'm trying to
    put something that we never vocalized into words - but by
    allowing someone to give to you, you sort of let them receive
    all those good feelings of having done something good for
    someone else.  I guess it's sort of a mutual unselfishness
    trip, if you look at it that way.  The giver gets to give of
    their time, their possessions, their heart - the receiver
    gets to allow the giver to give.
    
    This doesn't work well for "required" giving.  Birthdays it
    works ok for - you have to know the person well to know when
    their birthday is.  But xmas and the various hallmark holidays
    don't make it these days.  In some families I guess xmas is
    still a warm loving time - in most I've seen it become a
    merchant holiday.  We never celebrated it, so we never ran
    into the "spend $500 per child" problem.
    
    Enough - I'm getting long winded.
    
    --Louise

    I have been given too many gifts, that they are hard to compare,
    but the gifts that have been given that I value most are:
    
    o  The gift of giving:     To be able to give of myself to someone
    		               else who may need an ear, or an extra set
    			       arms, a whole body to watch some kids so
    		               a single mom can get an afternoon away,
    			       and this list can go on and on..
    
    o The gift of love:        To be able to love someone, and be loved
	    		       in return is a gift I will always cherish.
    
    o The gift of friendship:  To be able to be a friend, and have a
	    		       friend that I can share with, cry with, 
    			       talk with, and even hate for a day, and
    			       know they will still be friends, or I
    			       will still be their friend, is a very
    			       dear gift.
    
    o The gift of my kids:     Each time I have to sit up all night
    			       with a little girl who has an ear ache,
    			       and know I have to work in the morning, and 
    			       I get angry, I thank the Lord he gave me what
    			       I have, because there are people in the
    			       world, that long to be able to sit up with 
    			       a sick child that they can't have, or no 
    			       longer have with them, and I thank him for 
    			       this gift each and every time.

    
    The gift of Wisdom:        ...and the ability to know the difference,
    			       especially since this is such a hard gift
    			       for me to comprehend sometimes.
    
    There are many other gifts I have been given, that become tarnished,
    get lost during a move, get dusty on a shelf, that I have liked,
    but the above gifts are the most precious.
    
    Gifts that I have been given that I disliked, or didn't care for?
    
    The gift of selfishness:   I wish I had never been given this gift,
    			       and I try to often throw it away, but
    			       it seems to every so often creep back into 
    			       my life.
    
    The gift of snobbishness:  This one seems to creep into my life
    			       also, and I wish it would run away and
    			       hide, sometimes I hate myself for wanting
    			       to have the very best in life (material
    			       wise), and trying to achieve that level,
    			       when it really isn't needed, but is nice
    			       to have.
    
    The gift of unforgiving:   When you get hurt so much, and someone
    			       makes you cry so many hours everyday,
    			       and you finally say no more, and turn away 
    			       from that person, and stop seeing the
    			       good in them, that becomes the gift of 
    			       unforgiving, and I wish I NEVER had that
    			       gift, because everyone is worth something,
    			       and I should not give up, they may need
    			       me one day, and what if I'm not there?
    
    
    
    There are more gifts, and I could write all day (literally!), but
    the above gifts are the ones most important, and the gifts I don't
    like are the most important ones I wish I had never been given.
    
    Gale

    RE; GIFT GIVING
    I TOO GREW UP ENJOYING GIVING GIFTS, IT WAS JUST A PART OF OUR 
    FAMILY, AS WELL AS SENDING CARDS, ETC.  THERE WAS ONE EVENT IN OUR
    FAMILY THAT I WILL NEVER FORGET.  WE ALL (MOMS, DADS, BROTHER,COUSINS
    AUNTS, UNCLES) HAD CHRISTMAS ON A BEACH AT CAPE CODE IN AUGUST!!!
    THAT WAS THE LAST TIME WE WOULD BE ABLE TO SEE EACH OTHER FOR A
    LONG TIME.  WELL, IT WAS QUITE INTERESTING.  THIS IS WHAT WE DID,
    WE DREW NAMES OUT OF A HAT TO SEE WHICH PERSON WE WOULD GIVE A 
    GIFT TO.  ALL GIFTS HAD TO BE MADE (NOT BOUGHT). EACH PERSON WAS
    IN CHARGE OF MAKING 2 CHRISTMAS ORNAMENTS.  WE BROUGHT A BAG OF
    MATERIALS TO HELP WITH THIS (CONSTRUCTION PAPER, GLUE, MATERIAL,
    THREAD, ETC.)  IT WAS ALSO A LEARNING EXPERIENCE FOR US ALL.
    WE HAD PEOPLE FROM 6 YEARS OLD TO 50 YEARS OLD, FROM ALL WALKS
    OF LIFE.  GIVING PEOPLE TO NON GIVING.  MATERIALISTIC TO NON.
    THE GROUP NOTICED, NATURALLY THAT THE PEOPLE WHO GOT MOST
    FRUSTRATED WITH THE PROJECT WERE THE ONES THAT WERE USED TO GETTING
    AND NOT GIVING.  THE REST OF US WERE QUITE PLEASED WITH THE OUTCOME.
    THE FINAL DAY ARRIVED WITH ANTICIPATION (FOR MOST).  DAD FOUND AN
    OLD DEAD CHRISTMAS TREE AND WE STUCK IT IN THE SAND, THEN DECORATED
    IT.  THE PRESENTS WERE UNDER THE TREE AND THE BON FIRE BLAZED
    CHRISTMAS DINNER CONSISTED OF HOTDOGS AND HAMBURGERS.  AND THE 
    SETTING WAS THE WAVES SPLASHIN ALONGG THE SHORE AND THE MOST
    BEAUTIFUL SUNSET WE'VE EVER EXPERIENCED!  IT WAS A WONDEROUS THING.
    AFTER AWHILE ONE OF THE YOUNGSTERS (ONE OF THE FRUSTRATED ONES)
    WANTED TO KNOW WHY WE DID THIS.  THE ONLY ANSWER I COULD GIVE WAS,
    SO WE COULD BE TOGETHER AND HAVE FUN AND ENJOY EACH OTHER BEFORE
    DISTANCE WAS TO SEPERATE US ALL AGAIN.  ANYWAY, MY POINT IS THAT
    SOME PEOPLE DON'T KNOW HOW TO GIVE (OF THEMSELVES), SOME DON'T
    KNOW HOW TO ENJOY (ESPECIALLY SIMPLE THINGS) AND SOME DON'T KNOW
    HOW TO TAKE A COMPLIMENT.  WHEN I GIVE SOMEONE SOMTHING ITS LIKE
    GIVING THEM A COMPLIMENT, IT SAYS I LIKE YOU OR I JUST HAPPENED
    TO BE THINKING OF YOU!  THE PEOPLE WHO DON'T APPRECIATE YOUR 
    THOUGHT, I WOULD BE IRRITATED WITH TOO AND NOT BOTHER WITH AGAIN.
    BUT DON'T STOP GGIVING PLEASE!!!  ITS A PART OF US THAT WE NEED
    FOR OURSELVES, EVEN IF NO ONE ELSE FEELS GOOD ABOUT IT YOU WILL!!!
    
    P.S. I'M TRYING CHRISTMAS IN THE MOUNTAINS THIS YEAR IN SEPTEMBER!!!
    
    

    
         I read once about a little girl who received a birthday gift
         of personalized stationary from her grandmother.  The girl
         was very happy with the gift until she looked at the
         stationary and discovered that all the envelopes were
         addressed to Grandma. 

    
    re.15
    
    every christmas mom and pop would send my brother and I stamped
    envelopes with their address on them and paper. I thought it was
    dumb at first, but turned out really liking it.  It saved me lots
    of time and kept the folks happy!