Conference quark::human_relations-v1

	Pardon me, but I've been through alot of "incidents" lately,
    which incident might you be refering to?  SEXETERA?  Or something
    more recent?

						-davo

    I simply cannot stand people that are more intolerant than I.  No
    matter how hard I work at reducing my tolerance, some jerk will
    show up and prove that I am not yet the master of intolerance.
    The intolerant jerk offend me.  8^|

    re: .1 (davo)
    
    	I was refering to the incident with this file.  I was tempted
    to pose this question when the furor was raised over the erections
    note, but decided I might be accused of inciting flaming.  There
    have been some other (minor?) incidents lately as well.  I'm not
    trying to start a flame forum here.  I tend not to offend easily,
    at least as far as human anatomy/sexuality goes, and I haven't found
    this conference in the least offensive.  In view of that, I was
    wondering what people *do* find offensive...
    
    
    	...Survey says...
    
    					--Doug
    	{I will contribute my own list of offensive items soon}

    Guess I'll have to start this conference going. The following is
    a list of things I find offensive:
    
    * Walking past a bunch of men taking a coffee break and they all
      stop talking to stare. (I find this very intimidating and unecessary.
      I like to be treated equally)
                              
    * Someone who does not use deoderant
                              
    * A man who makes advances and knows you are faithfully married
                                                            
    * Women/men that collude
    
    * Being stereotyped
    
    This is all I can think of right now because I have to go.
    
    MSR
     

    
    persons who choose to show themselves as an authoritarian on any
    given subject just to hear themselves speak.. and then do in with
    the maximum amount of time/disk space/energy that they can exert!
                     
    later, gailann
    
    

Re -2. 	Sorry, I don't understand why not wearing deoderant should be 
	offensive, or perhaps that's where I've been going wrong......

Ritchie.
	

    
    When people who have no reason to lie....LIE 
    
    Not offensive,but more in the line of dis-likes  (depending on my
    mood)
    Strong perfume or colonge (not necessarily cheap stuff either)
    People who don't show up on time   
    Have to go ,but will add more later!!!
    Tony....

    People that make personal attacks on my life style or family.
    
    Jokes that are racist or grossly sexual.
    
    People who stare at or make rude remarks to/about handicapped 
    people.
    
    People who are so convinced they are right that they put down
    others ideas/opinions.
    
    Snobs

    	Individuals who make assumptions about me just because I was
    born and raised in California.   
    
    	I get sh*t like...."Oooooohh, you're from California?  You gotta
    be wicked wierd, or something"  "Like, totally!"  "Had any good 
    earthquakes lately?"
    
        Some folks are just plain ignorant!
    				
    						Phil
    

Not being asked beforehand...

Dave.

    People who feel that they are totally without fault, are better
    than anyone else.
    
    People who are pigheaded and ridged, you can only see things their
    way and they're willing to commit mayhem to get you on their side.
    
    People who are willing to ruin someone else's reputation to make
    themselves look good.
    
    Pushy people with big egos in general, I avoid'em like the plague.
    
    General scum that profit from someone else's misery and suffering.
    
    ARRRGGGHHHH!!!! I'm getting pissed just writing this!!!
    
    Ray

    Offend me?  Hmm.....
    
    Men....who assume that making a dinner date with you is going to provide
    more than dinner.....
    
    Just recently - Man spent ~~ $50. on Lobsters/shrimp for a dinner
    date - boy was he disappointed!
                                           
    I was more than offended - ooooooooo!
    
    

re .13 How quaint! The _man_ still pays where you live? Oh for equality.

Dave.

    
    Re 6. To clarify my statement about "People who don't wear deoderant
          are offensive".
          
    In my country, America, body odor (underarm, feet and personal places)
    is a complaint that a number of people have. I find it hard to work
    beside someone who smells badly from lack of bathing or use of
    deoderant. But I hear that in other countries this is not so.
    
    I'm sorry I'f I have offended anyone, but this is my opinion and
    that's what is asked of this notes file.

    The deodorant issue bothers me, too, but standards are different
    in other parts of the world, and probably were in the US also until
    pretty recently.  Not everyone can afford the water to shower every
    day, for example.  I felt guilty about "wasting water" that way
    when I was in Israel a few years ago, but I took my usual shower
    anyhow (though as fast as possible) because I felt "dirty" if I
    didn't, not to mention what my complexion does if I don't shampoo
    every morning (YCCH-O!).                         

    
    
    
    My turn.
    
    * Phonies! Even in some of the notes I've read they say one thing
    one place then something completly different elsewhere.
    
    * Slobs., forget the deodorant issue, slobs.
    
    * A political backstabber! 
    
    * Someone who tries to do your job, and has no idea what is going
    on!
    
    * Lazy people.
  
    * Know it alls!!
      
    * Dirty ashtrays, tight underwear!
    
    To name a few, and turnons that would take a book!
    
    Cal.
    

    
    
    ...having a bad day....
    
    GOG
    

    
    Pettiness.  People who attribute overwhelming importance to
    underewhelming things, and who will mess up other people's lives
    over them.
    
    Of course, just getting angry about it probably makes me petty,
    too.  Recursive offense....
    
    Dave W.

        Here's one I haven't seen yet.. FLAME ON!!!!
    
    People who don't listen !!!!!!!! half way through a conversation
    they'll say something like "Could you please repeat that?"
    Augggggg If you're going to take time to talk to me please listen
    also you might learn something.  Flame off.
    
                   REK
    
    OH, people who think their shit don't stink!!!! 

    Rick.....you mean the ones who think they fart ESTAY LAUDER (sp)???

    Re .21, .22:
    
    Let's keep the language a bit tamer, please!  I don't want to see
    this note degenerate into offensiveness itself.
    					Steve

    Just a thought and a small one at that.

    I find that things that bother me about other people 85% of
    the time, I have been, or am guilty of doing.

    Comments?

       Brian

    re: .24
    
    I can't stand people who are honest enough with themselves to 
    admit things like that.

    
    People telling me things I already know.

    Basically, anything people say

8-}

    re: 24 (I think)
    
    It is a common psychological practice for people to not like things
    about other people that they in fact know are facets of their own
    personality. above reply is very accurate about people in general.
    
    keep that in mind when you say that don't like something that you
    see in somebody else.
    
    al
    

re: .28,
    
>    It is a common psychological practice for people to not like things
>    about other people that they in fact know are facets of their own
>    personality. above reply is very accurate about people in general.

	Yes, I think the term here is "Projection".

							-davo

    Snobs who think the beautiful state of Alabama is Redneck-ville,
    U.S.A.
    
    						Pat Nelson
    						Alias PROSPECT

    This note is rapidly degenerating into a "can you top this" list
    of arbitrary dislikes.  I read the base note as asking what is it
    that you see/hear/smell/etc. that makes you cringe inside.  Yet
    I fear that if people really start relating things that offend them,
    this note will itself become offensive.  As an example, those of
    you who read SEXCETERA probably remember the single note that
    touched off quite a storm.  I found THAT note extremely offensive.
    So much so that I absolutely refuse to describe it to ANYONE.  But
    what if I decided to describe it here as something that offends
    me?  Get the picture?
    
    Unless someone has some good suggestions as to how to handle
    this topic, I think we should drop it.
    				Steve

    Oops!
    
    	I really wasn't trying to be controversial with this topic...
    
    	What I really had in mind was more like this...
    
    	I am very slow to offend on what some people find "sexually"
    offensive but there are several other things I find offensive...
    Here is one example:
    
    	o Missionary Religions --  I have no formal religious beliefs
    of my own, and I do support everyone's right to have and express
    their own beliefs, but I am *very* offended when people try to convert
    me.  I'm willing to have a rational discussion (as rational as a
    religious discussion can be) about beliefs with someone, but I will
    not actively try to convert anyone to my views, and I am offended
    if they try to convert me to theirs.  Coming to my door with their
    "message" is incredibly offensive!
    
    	I wasn't shooting for people to say "I think sexual acts between
    two adults and their pet elephant in public places" is offensive.
    I was looking for people to give classes of what they find offensive
    as opposed to down & dirty details...
    
    	Please, decorous responses only...
    
    					--Doug

    I find it difficult to understand why everyone gets so hot under
    the collar (see many of the previous notes).  
    
    Surely there are enough things to dislike about things/people in
    this world as it is.
    
    Yes I find it unneccessarily offensive when people run of at the
    mouth just for the sake of hearing(seeing) themselves talk.
    
    Why doesn't some bright spark open a conference entitled
    "What I like about me/others".  Lets get more positive about life.
    
    
    

    
    re: 34 -
    
    Bob, I was just thinking the same thing - why are there so many
    negative responses?  I agree with you that we should look for the
    "silver lining" instead.  There are so many good things out there
    like:  a full moon, a pat on the back, a kiss behind the ear, a
    hug, hot soup, cold beer.   YEAH.  That makes me feel better. Thnx.
    
    Toodles,
    	-Dotti.

    Re .34:
        Who needs another conference?  Just start a new note in this
    one!
    				Steve

    Re .36:
       I think that was Joan Early, not Bob.
    			Steve

    What offends me the most are benign drones who spread
    rumors about others in other notesfiles.

    

    I have at last succeeded (thanks to Steve) in changing my
    signature tune.  I am pleased that we have now got a note
    about what we like. 
    
    Guilty, Guilty, Blush  ......Yes I will add a note there
    also, I shall now GOTO and enter.
    
    Thanks for the support, it encourages me to write a few more.
    
    Some of you I have already built a mental picture of, its
    almost as though I have met you already.
    
    

    What offends me the most are women who swear alot. (you know, the
    ones who use the "F" word like an all purpose adjuctive).
    You want to ask these people where they learned to speak.
    
                                              Ray H.
    

    Hi:                             reply to .44
    
    	The question was "What offends ME?"
    Now in my case, being a man, (and in my own opinion) swearing by
    another man is not as offensive to me as hearing a woman swear.
    I'm not talking about the occasional swears that happens in the heat
    of anger or passion, but the women who are "F"ing this and "F"ing that
    three or four times a sentence.
    Sorry if this sounds like the ol' double standard but that's the
    way I feel.
                                                  Respectivly;
                                                  Ray H.
    

    re. 44-45  I am mostly disappointed when someone who
    cusses a lot shows no variety. f*** and d*** get worn
    out rather quickly. There are a lot of good bad words
    out there dying of neglect. Spanish has a lot to offer,
    also German. Be original, refer to hygiene ahd habits,
    sexual preferences and incompetence. Anything worth 
    cussing is worth insulting. :-)  :-)
    
    What offends me ?  Butt-breath in an otherwise attractive
    woman.

    
    Speaking strictly for myself as a member of DEC's gymps and blinks
    brigade,  the thing that offends me most are people who insist on
    helping me in the way that THEY want to help me regardless of my
    needs.
    
    LET ME EXPLAIN:
                   
    I appreciate *** ALL *** help I recieve, but there are ways that
    people can be more helpful.
     
    Don't just up and help me.  Please, if I have not asked for help, but
    you think that I may need some assistance, just ask if you can help, 
    don't just automatically do it for me. Since the time that I became 
    disabled, I have been striving for independence.  (It may take me A 
    LITTLE longer to do a task, but in the long run it is better for my feelings of self worth.)
    
    If I say yes, that I do indeed need help; please ask HOW you can
    help. 
    
    Most importantly DON'T be offended if I say "no thank you".
                                                                         
    Jim,
    
    P.S. Stay out of the handicapped parking spots if you don't have
    a permit.
    
    (I'm disabled: "Could someone please help me down off this soapbox?")

    reply to .47
    
    In reguards to handicapped parking, now I'm not handicapped, but
    I'm sure I'm not the only person who has seen some non-handicapped
    person park in a handicapped parking space just because it is
    closer to the building and they don't want to walk across the
    parking lot. [this insensativity burns me up]
    These lazy people should be glad that they are able to 
    across that parking lot instead of depriving someone who
    really has trouble getting around and has a need for
    these parking spaces. These people should be told off, but good.
    

	reply to 95.48 in reply to .47
    
>>>    In reguards to handicapped parking, now I'm not handicapped, but
>>>    I'm sure I'm not the only person who has seen some non-handicapped
>>>    person park in a handicapped parking space just because it is
>>>    closer to the building and they don't want to walk across the
>>>    parking lot. [this insensativity burns me up]

	Just say in a loud voice (so that they can hear you) - Boy
	those people in that handicapped space don't look handicapped
	to me - They must be RETARDED.


	/robin
    

    
    re: .48
    
    Ah, yes, the Steve Dallases of this world...
    
    It is our habit, in my circle of acquaintance, to summon the
    constabulary on observing such a violation.  In Worcester, at least,
    the police seem to particularly relish writing these people up...
    
    DFW

        Personally, rather than using a word like "retarded" which
        started as a term (or part of a term) to describe an actual
        handicap about which people can do nothing to an insult, I would
        use a non-term like "thinking impediment" or suggest that they
        were "morally handicapped", or maybe be blunt enough to just
        suggest that they were rude. 
        
        Of course with my Miss Manner's hat on I always try to correct
        by assuming that the fault is unintentional--"Excuse me, did you
        fail to notice the handicapped sign". This is not only more
        polite by less embarassing in the chance that they reply "No,
        I'm going in to pick up my quadropeligic grandmother."
        
        JimB. 

    Mea culpa. In a hurry, if four spaces are open, I use one.

    I used to have a [British] handicapped parking permit - since moving
    to America I have generally settled for a DEC handicap parking for my
    commute, and living with my (relatively minor) handicap when parking
    elsewhere. Even though I could get a NH handicap plate, I decline to
    do so as many, many people are far more handicapped than I am.
    
    However this parking thing burns me. Yesterday I parked next to a handicap
    space in an otherwise empty parking lot. In the handicap space was a
    Ford F250 truck with no handicap plates. The sign however was hardly
    visible over the hood as the suspension had been jacked up several inches
    (further proving that the driver was not handicapped - he/she would
    have been quite incapable of climbing into the cab if handicapped).
    I went to report the matter, but as I reached the pay phone I saw two
    very healthy looking (male) youths go to the truck and climb in, and
    then proceed to drive out forwards knocking down the sign. I needless
    to say phoned the Merrimack police and gave them the number and description
    of this truck.
    
    Incidentally in the old days when I drove a Land Rover, I would frequently
    simply double park behind offenders blocking them in. They were often
    sitting fuming when I returned...
    
    /. Ian .\

    One should remember, also, that not all handicaps are visible.
    
    One of my neighbors is a youngish woman who suffers from rheumatiod
    arthritis.  She can walk, does not appear handicapped, but cannot
    walk great distances or climb too many steps, etc.  
    
    She's constantly being harrassed for parking in handicapped spaces
    that she doesn't need.
    
    --bonnie

    a quick question here:
    do people who have sever asthma or heart conditions qualify for
    HP plates?
    i know at work they have just expanded the handicapped parking
    the signs now say medical permit parking only.
    
    sometimes not all is as it seems.
    
    					kelly

�    do people who have sever asthma or heart conditions qualify for
�    HP plates?

     I am a chronic asthmatic: I have been told by several people who I
     believe to know that in New Hampshire if a doctor certifies that the
     condition causes walking difficulties then you qualify.
                                                          
     I can certainly confirm that in England both qualify (I, as an asthmatic,
     and my father, as a cardiac patient, both have British disabled parking
     permits).     
     
     /. Ian .\

    re .56:
    
    Most places, yes. A friend of mine in Maryland has a dashboard handicap
    permit so he can use it the two or three weeks of the year he needs it. 
    
    	Jon

    re: .48
    
    I was told (when I was crippled for a short term) due to leg surgery,
    that the "HANDICAPPED" spaces are for the VEHICLES which have the
    "HANDICAPPED" plate/sticker; regardless if its being driven by a
    handicapped person or not. And , if you (I) do not HAVE a one of
    those plates/stickers, no matter how great your (mine) handicap; being
    on crutches; limping, sprains or what have you - you may NOT park
    in those spots.
    
    I get thoroughly "burned" when I see a very old person who must
    walk from  a remote parking spot; while some large, healthy, person
    hops from their brothers/fathers/whoevers vehicle with the "magic
    plate" in a handicapped spot.
    
    One must remember: It is the VEHICLE that is entitled to the HANDICAP
    courtesy, and not the person.
    
    I would like to see a change, where it is the person who gets the
    privilege, and NOT the vehicle itself, based on spot checks and
    local citizen reporting, with very stiff fines to abusers.
    
    .bob.

Not only that, but if you break your leg, or have a cast, or crutches, that does
not allow you to use a handicapped spot, or get a plate/sticker to use a
handicapped spot.  You are "injured", not handicapped....

I think that this is wrong...  Shouldn't people temporarily handicapped get the
same treatement? 

Jim.

                                                            
    No a person temp. injured should not get the same treatment as a
    handicapped person.. ie. the right to just park in a parking area
    that is meant for a handicapped person...  I agree they should be
    able to go down and get a temp. sticker which gives them a limited
    right to use a handicapped space but it should be issued for short
    periods of time and renewed if needed.                  
                                                            
    I like the next feel very sorry for a person that is very old, has a
    broken foot or even someone in advanced stages of pregnancy that has to
    walk a long distance.. but let us not confuse this with a life long
    condition of having to manage with wheel chairs, braces, crutches,
    oxygen or other equipment that makes getting around difficult and long
    distances painfull.  Maybe the answer for temporary conditions could be
    a few designated "medical" spaces that could be used by people with
    temp. permits. 
                                                            
    My grandmother is getting on and has problems with shortness of
    breath.. we (us in the family) always deposit her at the door and
    have her wait when leaving while we fetch the car.. she does not
    drive and we have not taken a space marked handicapped when she
    has able bodied people around her to see to her comfort. 
         

    gailann

re: .59, .60

Gee, I wasted a lot of walking the last couple of weeks.  While we were on 
vacation, we borrowed my father's car frequently; he has handicapped plates
(no, the plates weren't handicapped, but they indicated the person who 
registered the car was).  We never parked in a spot reserved for the 
handicapped.  In my opinion, any non-handicapped person who parks in such 
a spot IS handicapped -- morally.

I think the problem that .59 points out is a problem of enforcement; unless
a person is assigned to monitor the spots reserved for the handicapped, I 
don't see any way of enforcing the law other than to use the license plates.

Clay

    The need for a temporary permit of some kind is real.
    
    For many years my mother provided transportation for an elderly
    neighbor who suffered from emphysema, phlebitis, and degenerative
    arthritis.  The neighbor was completely qualified for a handicapped
    license, but he didn't own a car.  My mother had to pull up beside
    the hospital or doctor's office or whatever, help him out, leave
    him to wait while she parked the car and hurried back, then help
    him inside. (He wasn't capable of walking for more than a few feet
    without help, even with a walker.)
    
    Some kind of indication that the vehicle was only temporarily carrying
    a handicapped person would have been helpful to both her and the
    neighbor. 
    
    --bonnie

    RE:.59 .63
    
    I have a friend in New Hampshire who has a child with CP. She dosen't
    have HP plates, but she does have a state permit, which she displays
    while transporting the child in her special chair. 

    
    
    If you are anything short of a *PLATE* in Hampton, Seabrook, or
    Salisbury kiss your car goodbye. For starters you get a ticket upon
    which policemen make funny comments about possible brain damage
    from sun stroke. Then they wait five minutes. If you don't return
    to get chewed out they call in a tow truck (honest) for and I quote
    "for blocking emergencies arteries for special needs". Then on top
    of that you have to pay all the fines which goes with it. Starting
    with the ticket, tow truck, impounding fees, and everything else.
    Sometimes if you are a real jerk to them they walk around your car
    and find things wrong with it.
    
    We saw this happen to a guy who must have been brain damaged. But
    then again these are the same people who have your car towed for
    overheating on the main boulevard even if you leave for three
    minutes.....
    
    
    Debbi

    re .-several
    
    Why is it any better for a person who was injured who is temporarily
    (2-3 months) in a wheelchair or on crutches than it is for someone
    who has to use these for their entire life.  Note:  I am talking
    about walking *today* from an outlying spot to the door.
    
    Elizabeth
    

    $ set flame_on                                     
    
    1.  Pedantic snobbery in notesfiles:  For example, showing off a lot
    of formal training in music, and treating others as inferior if they
    are not as arrogant. (as described in 95.5). 
    
    2.  People who ask, "Where are you from?  Well, whhyyyyy did you come
    all the way hererrrre?" (as in 95.10!).  --usually in a syrupy voice! 
    
    3.  Accusers who attribute their *own* badness to others.
        
    4.  Nosy people who think it's their *duty* to mind others' business.
    
    5.  Pushy people who think they are so "GREAT" they can give themselves
    extra "rights" to take advantage of others. 
                                
    6.  False martyrs:  "Do-gooders" who always "know best" what's "good for
    you" and pretend their selfish actions are *altruistic*!
    
    7.  People who come from an attitude "THIS IS YOU" -  and *they* decide
    who that shall be! 
                                     
    8.  Power_plays               ! often disguised with dishonesty
    
    9.  Holier_than_thou          ! expects others to grovel 
                                      
    10. "Moralistic" hypocrites who make others look bad (see 95.12,
    ruining others' reputations), while they sin in secret. 

    $ end_flame              

    ONE THING THAT OFFENDS ME IS WHEN YOU BECOME GOOD
    FREINDS WITH SOMEONE....AND YOU GO ALL OUT OF YOUR WAY
    TO PLEASE THEM....THEY THEY TURN AROUND, AND DECIDE THEY
    DON'T WANT TO HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH YOU ANYMORE....
           ****CAN YOU FIGURE IT OUT?  I SURE CAN'T*******
    

Maybe it's the CAPSLOCK.

 8^) 8^) 8^)

Bob