| T.R | Title | User | Personal
Name | Date | Lines |
|---|
| 309.1 | | GIAENG::PULSIFER | Doug Pulsifer 235-3332, BPO1 | Wed Jan 24 1990 12:05 | 22 |
| Sorry to hear about you bad experience.
As far as the vet taking the bird into another room this should never
happen unless it was surgery where there could be a chance of you
contaminating the patient. When I take my human children to the
Doctor I stay with them and would insist on the same with my non-human
children(birds,cats,dogs).
Your evaluation of this vet is correct, "DUMP HIM" ! Myself I
would make this known to everyone I know verbally, but not in print.
As far as getting him back to normal, you may need to start all
over with him and be patient. Next time you want to clip him maybe
you can get someone that does house calls. There is a lady that
works here in Marlboro, that does it reasonably. Also some vets
let you bring gram stains into them to do away with the stress of
bringing in the bird.
Good luck, and keep us updated.
Doug
|
| 309.2 | | FRSBEE::LOMME | | Wed Jan 24 1990 12:33 | 29 |
| HI
Now I wish I would have stayed with my bird (Buddy) when he was
getting his wings cut.
My bird is ok when I play with him, he will say hello and the normal
things when I talk to him. But all the chatter and noise he makes
when he is by himself has stoped. when I am not talking or playing
with him, he will sleep. All the playful ness is gone. he just sleeps
all day.
I have been hand feeding him and he seems to love it and eats everthing
I give him.. the problem is that he is eating 1/2 as much as he
use to on his own.
Some people have told me that I should bring him to another Vet
to make sure he is ok. But I do not want to scare him again so soon.
I hope all he needs is rest, some loving care and a little time.
I bought Buddy a little over 2 years ago and since I am single and
have lived alone, Buddy has become a one person bird. he enjoys
my brother and Girlfriends attention,(feeding,making sounds at each
other) but being handled by someone besides me is a no no right
now, Now that his wings are cut he will go from my finger to my
girlfriends finger with a careful step. What I am trying to say
is that I think the handling by the Vet scared the Hell out of
him.
Gary
|
| 309.3 | radio ? | GIAENG::PULSIFER | Doug Pulsifer 235-3332, BPO1 | Wed Jan 24 1990 14:46 | 17 |
|
In the wild birds are always on the lookout for danger, but when
there are other birds around the are more at ease as they all look
out for each other. Buddy may feel that you are another bird and
be more secure when you are around, hence him behaving normal when
you are there.
You might be able to make him more secure in your absense by leaving
the radio or T.V. going,as the noise could make him feel he is not
alone. As far as him eating you could increase his hand feeding
or just keep him near to you with his food dish when you eat. He
will see you( the other bird) eating, and feel it is safe for him
to eat also.
Hope some of this could help,
Doug
|
| 309.4 | SUGGESTIONS FOR THE FUTURE | SVCRUS::BUCCIERI | | Wed Jan 24 1990 14:54 | 49 |
| This is truly an unfortunate situation ....... I do think that Buddy
will adjust in time. I don't know which vet you had gone to, but
I only bring mine to a vet that is an avian vet. Bird handling
is truly an Art. The vet I go to will examine my birds in an examining
room while I am present. They do however perform many of the
procedures in another room. I have never been denied access and
they always have had them out of the cage and in a towel before
they leave the room. There are many owners that can't handle the
sight of their birds being worked on. Much the same as some parents
when their children are worked on.
I would like to offer some suggestions for future situations. Have
somebody teach you how to clip your birds wings. It is a simple
procedure and should only have to be done once or twice a year.
Have your birds beak and nails trimmmed at about the same frequency
if needed. The longer you wait the further into the beak and nails
grows the vein that supplies the needed blood. This usually causes
bleeding when you do have these procedures done. You may spend
a little more overall but the mental anquish won't be as bad.
As for wing clipping, there are many schools of thought here. Some
will clip only one wing. This is supposed to prevent the bird from
being able to fly straight and level thus enabling you to control
their movements. Others will clip both wings, but only selected
flight feathers. The outside flight feathers are usually left for
looks. There are others that butcher the wings and cut almost all
of the feathers. Each bird is different in my opinion. I feel
that what you want to achieve is to trim each wing just enough to
impede any sustained flight and not so much that the bird can't
fluuter softly to the ground. You don't want to have you feathered
friend drop like a rock. They could really get hurt if they should
fall off a perch or your shoulder. Some birds are obviously heavier
than others and will require less of a clipping.
Lastly, a birds personality can and often does change after a clipping.
I clip the wings of my birds only as long as it takes me to tame
them. Once I have achieved my objective I let the wings grow back.
I have seen birds go from aggressive biters to one that can be handled
just by clipping their wings. They depend on you now for their
mobility. Their attitude can change as their feathers grow back
if they are not worked with however.
I do hope this helps ....... I also hope that we don't go to the
same vet. From the sound of it we don't. Good luck and let me
know if I can help you in any way.
Regards,
Jim Buccieri
|
| 309.5 | Me Too | VAXUUM::COMPTON | Linda DTN 232-2441 ACO/E47 | Wed Jan 24 1990 18:43 | 74 |
| Gary,
I had a similar experience to yours. The vet took one of our conures
out of the room in a towel, came back with the bird looking very
stressed (I also heard screeches from the other room but this conure
was in the habit of making a lot of noise for very little cause, so I
wasn't too worried until I saw the bird). I put the little guy on my
shoulder, as usual, as the vet was making the final notes on the bird's
record. I noticed blood on my jacket and took the bird off to inspect
him. He was bleeding, definitely, from one of the toes. I also
checked the wings, which weren't bleeding, but were cut in a very
ragged and sloppy way. The vet took the bird away again, telling me he
would cauterize the wound. More screeches. The bird came back even
more stressed. I paid good money for this abuse because I believed the
vet when he said that there is almost always some bleeding.
The bird was very subdued for many days, and walked very gingerly on
that foot. I went to the vet in the first place to see how it was done
properly (dumn assumption that vets can do this better than a lay
person who uses patience and gentleness)! This vet claims to know
about birds, by the way. I go to a different vet now.
I have seen two bird breeders clip wings and toenails since then and
yes, there was bleeding, but they were ready for it and were calm and
quick in stopping the bleeding. The wings were even and cut in
proportion to the bird's body type and size. And the clipping was for
free.
Three related comments:
1) A friend suggested corn starch or flour rather than Quick Stop or
any of the over-the-counter anti-bleeding agents. I tried cornstarch
and the reaction of the bird was very mild in comparison to the
commercial products, which are similar to a stiptic pencil (sp?) that
is used, for instance, by people who cut themselves shaving. Also, no
ingestion of chemicals this way....
2) In the 'for whatever it's worth' department, I didn't like seeing the
birds spiral out of control to the ground and knocking into things even
when they tried to fly out of the way when I only clipped one wing, so
I started clipping both wings. First I clipped the inner flight
feathers only. Then I had a cockatiel snap a blood feather when it got
caught in the cage bars, so I now clip the first six or seven long
outer feathers, including the primaries that many keep for looks only,
because I am more worried about birds catching their wings in the cage
bars than the looks while I am training the birds. Maybe it was just
because of the thrashing that cockatiels do, but I don't want to take
the chance. Depending on how much I want to restrict the flying
ability, I cut the feathers anywhere from slightly longer than to
roughly even with the inner flight feathers (the ones closest to the
body).
After the training period, it is a real thrill to see a fully flighted
bird lift off and fly from cage to perch to me and so on. But I do keep
the birds in a 'bird room' when they are free-flying (that has been
'bird-proofed), and limit their chances for flying around other areas
of the house, and only with supervision. If you do not have a separate
free-fly area for the birds, my guess is you might be better off
trimming the wings just a little for the bird's safety.
3) If you are going to show the bird, be aware that many judges will
take points off for clipped birds, so yet another thing to keep in mind.
(I have asked about this...the reply from three different judges was
that it is difficult to fairly assess the bird without the full
plumage. Since poor condition can affect the wing feathers, they don't
know if the wings were trimmed to eliminate feathers in poor condition
or for safety. In breeds where crossed wings will lose points, birds
with clipped wings could also be an attempt to make the fault less
obvious, so, again, points can be lost anyway. Bird Talk responded
to a letter on this sometime in the past year or so, which said
basically what the judges said to me when I asked last fall at the
local shows.
Linda
|
| 309.6 | Wing Clipping | USHS05::WALZ | | Fri Jan 26 1990 14:08 | 27 |
| Some of the theory around clipping only one wing is this:
It is beneficial to clip one wing of a very strong flyer such as
a macaw. This way, there is some reduction of the bird's control
of flight and the one wing need not be clipped very short. The
advantage is the bird still has some lift and will not fall hard
and break bones in his breast areas. Again, this method best
works with strong flyers. KoKo, my blue and gold macaw, is clipped
this way. If we were to clip both wings, they would have to both
be clipped shorter than this one wing is now to achieve the same
effect.
African greys fly like rocks anyway, and have less of an advantage
with this method. My yellow naped Amazon, Rico, has both wings
clipped.
I, personally, do not groom my own birds. I do not want to be the
BAD GUY, nor do I want to be associated with this person. I have
my birds groomed at a Houston pet store where the personnel really
know birds. I leave the room while they are being groomed, but
know that they are in expert care. I come in when they are finished
to the "rescue" and to comfort my pets.
Greys are so high strung. I am sorry your pet got so traumatized.
I, too, would dump the vet.
Pat
|
| 309.7 | Lots Of Love And Attention...... | SWEETP::EAGER | | Tue Feb 06 1990 19:10 | 26 |
|
I think you are right in saying he was scared by that vet. I never
leave any of my greys alone with a stranger. In fact my Vet has agreed
to make house calls for preventive checkups twice a year at my house.
Your bird probably just needs time to get over what happened. Give
him all the attention you can and he will probaly come around. Make
sure you watch very carefully for any signs of sickness, but don't
bring him to another vet very soon.
I make a point to share all my food with my Grey, Jonsey, to
make him feel as if I was his mate or best friend. I am carefull
not to give him things like chocolate, and limit his soda intake
to a few sips once in a while. He was totally wild and an abused
bird when I got him. When I bring him into the bird room where my
other greys are, he doesn't pay any attention to them at all and
would rather be on my shoulder than on his perch.
If you are planning on keeping his wings cut, you might think
about having someone show you how to do it yourself. Your bird
will take it alot better if you do the work rather then some nasty
old stranger. Good Luck!
Living On The Grey Coast,
Mark
|
| 309.8 | Thanks for the advice. | FRSBEE::LOMME | | Fri Feb 09 1990 07:18 | 20 |
| HI
I am glad to say that my Gray is almost back to normal. For the
first week after the Vet visit he slept most of the time and did
not make a noise. It seemed like all the trust he had in strangers
was gone. He would growl again at everybody but me. I started to
see some improvement the second week. Buddy was still not eating
that much so I started to hand feed him one seed at a time. he loves
the attention and he ate everything I gave him. My girlfriend also
gave him some love and care and a lot of patience to gain his trust
in people. He is now back to talking and making sounds. He is not
sleeping all the time anymore. And he is again eating all his fruits,
vegetables and seeds.
Next time his wings are ready to be cut I am going to the Bird Vet
in Littleton and I will learn to cut them myself.
Thank you for all you help and advice.
Gary & Buddy
|