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Conference nyoss1::market_investing

Title:Market Investing
Moderator:2155::michaud
Created:Thu Jan 23 1992
Last Modified:Thu Jun 05 1997
Last Successful Update:Fri Jun 06 1997
Number of topics:1060
Total number of notes:10477

1045.0. "1997: Where to invest" by LJSRV2::JC (I'm the Pox Mon, yeeeah the Pox Mon) Mon Dec 23 1996 09:44

T.RTitleUserPersonal
Name
DateLines
1045.1Best of Luck in '97NCMAIL::YANUSCMon Dec 23 1996 14:5733
1045.2PADC::KOLLINGKarenMon Dec 23 1996 18:535
1045.3LJSRV2::JCI'm the Pox Mon, yeeeah the Pox MonThu Dec 26 1996 14:386
1045.4LJSRV2::JCI'm the Pox Mon, yeeeah the Pox MonFri Dec 27 1996 09:4614
1045.5Free Advice can be Worth SomethingNCMAIL::YANUSCFri Dec 27 1996 14:236
1045.6LJSRV2::JCI'm the Pox Mon, yeeeah the Pox MonFri Dec 27 1996 14:4113
1045.7PATE::CLAPPThu Jan 02 1997 15:1410
1045.82155::michaudJeff Michaud - ObjectBrokerThu Jan 02 1997 15:536
1045.9www.vanguard.comALFSS2::BEKELE_DWhen indoubt THINK!Thu Jan 02 1997 17:013
1045.10DECWET::ONOSoftware doesn't break-it comes brokenThu Jan 02 1997 19:003
1045.11LJSRV2::JCI'm the Pox Mon, yeeeah the Pox MonMon Jan 06 1997 08:449
1045.12DECWET::ONOSoftware doesn't break-it comes brokenMon Jan 06 1997 13:523
1045.13here is URLALFSS2::BEKELE_DWhen indoubt THINK!Mon Jan 06 1997 14:039
1045.14Gold2155::michaudJeff Michaud - ObjectBrokerMon Jan 06 1997 19:4441
1045.15A German view ...RTOEU::KPLUSZYNSKIArrived...Tue Jan 07 1997 04:2133
1045.16Puts some $ in REITsGLRMAI::WILKESTue Jan 07 1997 13:005
1045.17PATE::CLAPPTue Jan 07 1997 13:3011
1045.18REIT (Real Estate Investment Trust)2155::michaudJeff Michaud - ObjectBrokerTue Jan 07 1997 15:4925
1045.19GLRMAI::WILKESTue Jan 07 1997 16:564
1045.20Picking ReitsMSBCS::BMORRISONWed Jan 08 1997 11:338
1045.21REITs have a spotty history if memory serves UNXA::ZASLAWWed Jan 08 1997 13:456
1045.22A blurb on Gold in Todays paper2155::michaudJeff Michaud - ObjectBrokerWed Jan 08 1997 16:169
1045.233 REITS stocks doing wellIROCZ::SPIELMANJerry dtn 226-5588Wed Jan 08 1997 20:1955
1045.24LJSRV2::JCWhere's the snow?Thu Jan 09 1997 10:5311
1045.25LJSRV2::JCWhere's the snow?Thu Jan 09 1997 10:5514
1045.26LJSRV2::JCWhere's the snow?Thu Jan 09 1997 10:577
1045.27LJSRV2::JCWhere's the snow?Thu Jan 09 1997 11:032
1045.28Up 30.1 % not 9 %GLRMAI::WILKESThu Jan 09 1997 13:047
1045.29LJSRV2::JCWhere's the snow?Fri Jan 10 1997 10:585
1045.30SUBPAC::MISTRYMon Jan 13 1997 12:4413
1045.31japan in 97?PATE::CLAPPMon Jan 13 1997 14:599
1045.32BEGIN::ROTITHORMon Jan 13 1997 15:405
1045.33The dean of Int. investing agreesALFSS2::BEKELE_DWhen indoubt THINK!Mon Jan 13 1997 17:256
1045.34Buy low ...RTOEU::KPLUSZYNSKIArrived...Tue Jan 14 1997 03:4812
1045.35When Riding the REIT Wave...NCMAIL::YANUSCTue Jan 14 1997 09:2023
1045.36ALFSS2::BEKELE_DWhen indoubt THINK!Tue Jan 14 1997 10:159
1045.37When it comes to the type of real estate a REIT owns, take your pick2155::michaudJeff Michaud - ObjectBrokerTue Jan 14 1997 10:5517
1045.38DECCXL::OUELLETTETue Jan 14 1997 18:529
1045.39PATE::CLAPPWed Jan 15 1997 08:0516
1045.40Yes, but...NCMAIL::YANUSCWed Jan 15 1997 08:4828
1045.412155::michaudJeff Michaud - ObjectBrokerWed Jan 15 1997 10:169
1045.42Just trying to helpNCMAIL::YANUSCWed Jan 15 1997 11:0114
1045.43Barron's on REITs: http://www.barrons.com/UNXA::ZASLAWThu Jan 16 1997 19:43102
1045.44Some REIT info (and in particular for CWN)2155::michaudJeff Michaud - ObjectBrokerThu Jan 23 1997 19:0056
1045.45PATE::CLAPPThu Mar 20 1997 07:316
    
    opinions sought on the high tech "sell off"
    
    Is it time to buy yet?  Or will it keep falling?
    
    
1045.46drop another 10%, I predictRUMOR::FALEKex-TU58 KingMon Mar 24 1997 11:434
    Fall for awhile, I think. Eventually it will go back up.
    
    I think it was Andrew Carnigie who once said, when asked what the stock
    market will do in the future -  "it will fluctuate"  
1045.47I'd wait a little longer...ASDG::WATSONDiscover AmericaMon Mar 24 1997 13:057
    Reminds me of another saying, forgot who:
    
    	"Never catch a falling sword." 
    
    Let it hit the ground and bounce a few times before you pick it up.
    
    Of course, where is the bottom...(Iomega and DEC come to mind)
1045.48Barron's on REITSUNXA::ZASLAWSteve ZaslawWed Mar 26 1997 18:22370
http://www.barrons.com/bie/articles/current/toc.html

  March 25, 1997

  Looking for the REIT Stuff

  Howard R. Gold

  Performance Snapshot | Cohen's Picks

  REAL ESTATE'S COMEBACK
  OFFICES AND REGIONAL MALLS LEAD THE WAY
  FAVORITE STOCKS IN THE OFFICE SECTOR
  CHOICE REGIONAL MALLS

  An interview with Martin Cohen. After a spectacular  [Image]
  year in 1996, real estate investment trusts have
  gotten the attention of many investors, from yield-hungry
  value players to noted technicians like Ralph Acampora.
  Investing in REITs, which usually don't move in tandem with
  the overall market, is now seen as a good way to diversify
  stock portfolios, especially in light of the stock market's
  huge run. But what's ahead for REITs and how to play it?
  Barron's Online turned to Marty Cohen, president of Cohen &
  Steers Realty Shares, for his insights into the real estate
  market and REIT stocks. The fund, which Cohen launched in
  July 1991 with his partner Robert Steers, has grown into the
  largest mutual fund specializing in REITs, with $2.8 billion
  in assets, has consistently topped the S&P 500 since its
  inception.

  Barron's Online: Last year was a banner year for REITs. Your
  fund rose by almost 39%, vs. about a 35% total return for
  equity REITs, beating the S&P 500 dramatically. What worked
  so well last year?
  Cohen: First, you had a strong economy that kept the real
  estate recovery moving forward. And in fact, last year you
  started to see very significant declines in vacancy rates in
  most major property classes--industrial, office and
  apartments. So the real estate recovery had a full head of
  steam, and still does. The effect of that was material on
  REIT earnings--across the board, you had about a 10 percent
  rise in earnings of REITs and about a 6% growth in
  dividends.

  Q: Are you measuring earnings by net income?
  A: No, funds from operations, FFO, which is essentially net
  income plus depreciation, with a few minor adjustments. It
  is basically a measure of cash flow of the company.

  Third, REITs had not done as well as stocks as a whole, so
  on a relative basis REITs looked very undervalued. I think a
  big change took place last July, when REITs went up and
  stocks went down--further evidence that REITs do lead a life
  of their own, provide portfolio diversification. That turned
  psychology even more positive.

  Q: So basically people started investing more funds in the
  industry.
  A: Yes, capitalization of REITs is now reaching close to
  $100 billion, so they are able to accommodate very large
  investors--pension funds and mutual funds.

  REAL ESTATE'S COMEBACK

  Q: Not so long ago, back in the early 1990s, we had a
  horrible real estate economy. Yet right now, we are clearly
  doing very well. Can you trace how that happened?
  A: In the early 1990s you had a liquidity crisis. The
  savings and loans were legislated out of business. The banks
  were forced to lower their real estate investment. The tax
  laws were changed so that individuals could no longer get
  tax benefits. There was no money for real estate. And then
  you had this recession during 1990-1991. As a result, you
  had a dramatic decline in property value.

  Q: That was around the time you and Bob Steers formed Cohen
  & Steers Realty Shares.
  A: July 1991.

  Q: Was that at the very bottom of the market?
  A: It was probably the very bottom of the real estate
  market, although there was still going to be some pain in
  the next year or two. REITs bottomed in October-November of
  1990. It is always gloomiest at the bottom. But in any case,
  we did get that fund off the ground and it has enjoyed
  nothing but good returns and good growth.

  REITs were the only group that hadn't fallen prey to the
  excesses of the 1980s, because they didn't have access to
  capital from banks; there were no tax benefits in owning
  REITs in terms of write-offs. Institutions didn't put money
  into REITs. So they were pretty much left standing, and when
  there was a liquidity crisis in real estate, they picked up
  the pieces.


   Cohen's Picks

   Company                          Ticker    Price

   Cali Realty                          CLI  34 3/8

   Crescent Real Estate Equities        CEI  59 7/8

   General Growth Properties            GGP  30 3/4

   Highwoods Properties                 HIW  34 3/8

   Public Storage                       PSA  28 7/8

   Rouse Co.                            RSE  29 7/8

   Vornado Realty Trust                 VNO    69 �

  Q: They were probably some of the only vehicles available
  for financing.
  A: Yes.

  Q: Obviously a lot of things are coming together--a strong
  economy, reasonably low inflation and interest rates and
  very little new building over the last few years--and REITs
  had a terrific year last year. In fact, in the fourth
  quarter of 1996, I believe 19 out of the 20 best-performing
  mutual funds were REIT funds. Isn't that performance too
  good to continue?
  A: I hope not. I have four kids I want to send to college.

  Q: I don't mean gloom and doom. I am just saying, obviously
  you did so well, it is hard to repeat a performance like
  that.
  A: If you look back in history, you find that even when
  REITs have had great years like last year, they have still
  managed to do well. They are off to a pretty good start this
  year. I don't think we'll have another 40% year, but I think
  you can have a mid-teens total return, which is a reversion
  to their mean performance over the course of the years. It
  looks like we will finish this quarter up about 4%-5%, and I
  am not unhappy with that. Some people are calling and
  saying, what is wrong with REITs? I don't know. What is
  wrong with REITs? I am not going to make any excuses. There
  are none to be made.

  Q: So, you feel this may be a nice 15% or so year. You say
  that in your annual report "this year may be somewhat more
  challenging than the last."
  A: I am trying to reduce expectations.

  OFFICES AND REGIONAL MALLS LEAD THE WAY

  Q: Yet you feel that a couple of the major sectors of the
  industry have very strong fundamentals--the office sector
  and the regional mall sector, both of which were lagging
  pretty badly a couple of years ago. What do you find so
  appealing about those sectors?
  A: The office sector is the most exciting today, because we
  have now seen a decline in vacancy rates. There is very
  little new construction, there had been overbuilding and
  there's not a lot of money available for speculative office
  development. But that is changing. There are also a
  tremendous number of office buildings for sale by large
  institutions and pension funds. And REITs are the ones with
  the capital and the know-how to make those acquisitions.
  Plus, with the declining vacancy rate, you are starting to
  see a very healthy increase in rents. Landlords are getting
  their power back.

  Q: That is certainly happening here in Manhattan--in midtown
  at least.
  A: It really is. I think over the next several years, if you
  own an office building you are going to see steadily
  improving profits as your occupancy rate goes up and your
  rental rates go up.

  In the regional mall sector you have a similar picture,
  although it is somewhat earlier than in the office cycle.
  Regional malls were not terribly overbuilt and there are
  today only a handful a year being built, but with sluggish
  retail sales, consolidation of the department stores, and
  until recently, a pretty good number of bankruptcies of
  tenants. Over the past year, a couple of things have
  happened. One is that the department stores have done
  extremely well--the shakeout of the small tenants has ended.
  And this year, I think for the first time in some time you
  are going to see an increase in occupancy rates--that is,
  you are going to see a diminution of bankruptcies.

  Q: I remember actually writing stories in which
  knowledgeable people said the regional mall was dead. A lot
  of them were really having problems in the late 1980s, early
  1990s.
  A: They were dead for a good number of years. But in the
  last year or two they have started to come to life. We are
  seeing better fundamentals there. And as long as the economy
  stays strong, I think that is going to continue.

  FAVORITE STOCKS IN THE OFFICE SECTOR

  Q: If those are your two favorite sectors in the industry
  right now, which are your favorite stocks?
  A: In the office sector, Crescent Real Estate Equities.

                             [Image]

  Q: That is Richard Rainwater's vehicle.
  A: Yes. Then Cali Realty, which is a major office owner in
  Northern New Jersey and now Westchester. They bought the
  Robert Martin Co., which has a very strong hold in
  Westchester County. What they are doing, interestingly, is
  they are not just buying property, they are also buying the
  management with them. They are building their management
  organization. And the third one there is Highwoods
  Properties, which is in the Raleigh-Durham, NC area. It has
  started to diversify by radiating out of Raleigh-Durham into
  Charlotte and Nashville and Richmond, into Southwest
  Florida. So they are diversifying away from being a company
  in one metropolitan area to being much more diversified.

  Q: That mid-South area in particular is very strong
  economically and has been remarkably recession-resistant.
  A: There is growth in population, growth in jobs.

  Q: Would you talk a little bit about Crescent? Obviously
  that company gets a lot of coverage.
  A: Crescent is what I would characterize as more of an
  entrepreneurial company. With regard to the Rainwater
  strategy, a major thrust of the company is the office
  sector. But they just bought some psychiatric facilities
  from Magellan on what I think were favorable terms. They
  also own some luxury hotels. So they are a little more
  entrepreneurial. The earnings are growing at a dramatic
  rate.

  Q: Aren't they trading at a high valuation?
  A: They are, but I think it depends on what measure of value
  you use, whether you believe they will be able to continue
  to grow. I believe they will be, based on the management.
  The properties they have in place are going to grow because
  of those factors I mentioned--the higher occupancies and
  higher rental rates.

  CHOICE REGIONAL MALLS

  Q: In the regional mall area it seems your biggest position
  is in Rouse Co., which is kind of an unusual regional mall.
  They operate the South Street Seaport and Bayside in Miami
  and some other "festival marketplaces," as they used to call
  them.
  A: They also have the Staten Island mall, and they also own
  traditional regional malls.

                             [Image]

  Q: Wasn't that specialty mall concept kind of a fad a few
  years ago? Isn't it a little bit less popular now?
  A: The promise was greater than the actuality.

  Q: But you are still positive on the prospects for Rouse.
  A: We are very positive, and what really got this company
  and the stock moving was their acquisition of the Howard
  Hughes portfolio of Nevada. It includes Summerland, which is
  a large residential community, and also properties in and
  around Las Vegas.

  Q: That has been the fastest-growing large city in the
  country for a number of years. Any others in the regional
  mall area that you particularly like?
  A: I like General Growth Properties, which is our second
  largest holding in this sector. General Growth is an
  extremely well-managed company. They have made some
  significant acquisitions over the last year or two. Some
  thought they overpaid. But when they took over, they applied
  their management technique to make them financially more
  profitable. I call them one of the best property management
  companies.

  Q: There is also something called Public Storage in which
  you have a large stake.
  A: Public Storage is one of our largest holdings, period.
  And it is a company that, of course, owns or controls 11,000
  of those ugly orange signs. It also has the largest chain of
  storage facilities, which are in very strong demand
  nationwide. They have made an operating business out of
  this, which is different from a real estate business. They
  have an 800 number, which is like a reservation system, and
  it has helped increase the occupancies at all their
  properties. For instance, if you call and you say, I need a
  place in the Bronx, they will say, "We don't have anything
  available in the Bronx, but we have something in southern
  Westchester. Does that work for you?"

                             [Image]

  They have also gotten into retail. They sell goods now at
  these storage facilities. You can buy packing equipment and
  things that you need when you store things. They will rent
  you trucks at some of their facilities. They have a pick- up
  and delivery service now, which is very innovative.

  Q: They have managed to leverage their facilities very
  smartly.
  A: Yes. As a result, they are enjoying absolutely dramatic
  growth.

  Q: One more that I wanted to ask you about has been in the
  news an awful lot. You have a large position in it--Vornado
  Realty Trust.
  A: Vornado is poised today to become one of the largest real
  estate owners in the country, and they have always had a
  very strong entrepreneurial management team. They have added
  Michael Fascitelli, formerly at Goldman Sachs. In their
  first major transaction, they have acquired the Mendik Co.,
  which is a large owner of Manhattan office buildings. They
  also are in negotiations with several other very large real
  estate enterprises.

  Q: So you think they are just really getting started in this
  area.
  A: They are just getting started.

  Q: What is your view of the potential of REITs over the next
  few years?
  A: There is a massive transfer of ownership taking place
  from private to public finance. And as this continues, REITs
  will only grow, and I think they will grow in size only if
  they can do so profitably, because being in a public market,
  they are under the microscope of analysts and investors. As
  long as there is discipline on the construction side--which
  we believe there will be--you won't have the volatility in
  the cycle that you had in the past, so I think the outlook
  is good for the next several years. Eventually this cycle
  will come to an end, and there will be a time when real
  estate is out of favor. We don't know when that will happen,
  but I don't think it will be in the next couple of years.

  Q: Just to wrap things up, you see a lot of opportunities in
  this sector. You don't think 1997 will be as spectacular as
  last year, but certainly a very good year going forward.
  Thanks a lot, Marty.


   Performance Snapshot

                                                   Since
                     1996 Three-year  Five-year Inception
                                                2-Jul-91

   Cohen & Steers
   Realty Shares    38.5%       18.6%    18.9%      18.7%

   S&P 500 (Total
   return)          23.1%       19.7%     15.2%    16.5%

   S&P 500 (without
   dividends        20.3%       16.7%     12.2%     N.A.
   reinvested)

   Fund results reflect compound annual return
   N.A. = Not Available
   Source: Lipper Analytical Services, Ibbotson
   Associates; Cohen & Steers


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